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European Commission Publishes Decision Concerning Intel's Abuse of Dominant Position

TheMailMan78

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You know Benet you need to back the hell off and quit getting so mad man, take it easy. Some people blindly follow things and companies (here here, I do with AMD Ill admit) but no reason to go on calling someone arrogant, stupid, etc (thats just a blanket statement, not saying you called someone stupid). Also, per your question, the US does have laws and measurements in place that prevent(s) one branch(es) from overstepping their authority. It is called the system of Checks and Balances. We can go on and on about this, but you get the idea. No government is perfect and we know this.

Fact is, Intel got caught by "means" and found guilty. OF course they are not happy with it and their supporters are not happy with it. Now I agree the huge fine is outrageous, but it was even more outrageous to prevent OEMs from buying or in delaying products that had AMD parts in them. That is the real crime. I don't know if that prevented AMD from gaining a bigger market share, but it did prevent others from trying them out. I also fault AMD for no advertising and not trying to one up Intel after they spanked them with the K8.
He got banned before for this kinda crap.
 

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That I didnt know and I apologize for my insolent tone. I just hate seeing folks get so mad and going at each other like that. I get all kinds of pissy too but I don't go on a rant and tell folks they are stupid. sheesh, cant we all just get along and agree to disagree?
 

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That I didnt know and I apologize for my insolent tone. I just hate seeing folks get so mad and going at each other like that. I get all kinds of pissy too but I don't go on a rant and tell folks they are stupid. sheesh, cant we all just get along and agree to disagree?

"Benet" isn't new here. He got banned before for these kinda comments. I'm sure if he keeps it up a ban stick will come down on him yet again.

@Benet the mods know who you are man. If you want to stay I would clam down.
 

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I See. yeah, they banned my thanks stick, but it did look like I was going around thanking everyone and their moms. :roll:

What I see happening here is an appeal happening. This will likely be tied up for awhile. Also, does the fine mean the companies have to pay? If not I suppose they wont be able to sell in that country(ies). Im more interested in seeing the the U.S. and the FTC find out and how they proceed.
 

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What I see happening here is an appeal happening. This will likely be tied up for awhile. Also, does the fine mean the companies have to pay? If not I suppose they wont be able to sell in that country(ies). Im more interested in seeing the the U.S. and the FTC find out and how they proceed.
I doubt Intel will appeal. The EC won on such weak grounds the first time, there's no chance they could overturn it unless it is in a different court.

Yes, I too would be interested to know what means of enforcement the EU is capable of.

4:1 odds say the FTC will find little or no guilt on behalf of Intel. The rebates were that of normal business conduct and do not allude to anything that falls under anti-trust law. The FTC may advise monopoly holders to refrain from using rebates, however.
 

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yeah I agree there. Besides, the US is pro economy and pro business, big or small. Obama would definitely not want to hurt anyone. Also, I didnt think Intel was a US company...are they?
 

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Yes, as is AMD. Both were founded by former employees of Fairchild Semiconductor (also US based).
 

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Wow, I didn't know that. Awesome. Thanks man, Id thank ya, but the button be gone.
 

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The irony made my laugh. :roll:
 

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You know Benet you need to back the hell off and quit getting so mad man, take it easy. Some people blindly follow things and companies (here here, I do with AMD Ill admit) but no reason to go on calling someone arrogant, stupid, etc (thats just a blanket statement, not saying you called someone stupid). Also, per your question, the US does have laws and measurements in place that prevent(s) one branch(es) from overstepping their authority. It is called the system of Checks and Balances. We can go on and on about this, but you get the idea. No government is perfect and we know this.

Fact is, Intel got caught by "means" and found guilty. OF course they are not happy with it and their supporters are not happy with it. Now I agree the huge fine is outrageous, but it was even more outrageous to prevent OEMs from buying or in delaying products that had AMD parts in them. That is the real crime. I don't know if that prevented AMD from gaining a bigger market share, but it did prevent others from trying them out. I also fault AMD for no advertising and not trying to one up Intel after they spanked them with the K8.

I didn't insult him, I have not even suggested arrogance, stupidness (however it's said). I just said it is clear he is confused, because from what I see, that's what happens, that's a reality. At one minute he is saying the govt doesn't have to intervene and a second later he laments that the govmt does nothing to help american companies...

And how does it feel when your government is put to question, hey? How if you step back a bit too, read the thread again and target all those wise (because they are wise) comments at the people that really needed them from the beginning? At no moment I have insulted a member of this forum, I have "insulted" your government however, with the sole idea of prvoking a response like the one you made, because you can't understand my point of view, unless you feel the same. Ford's and Themailman's ONLY argument in all the thread has been that the EU government is corrupt and has done this to steal money from Intel.

"Benet" isn't new here. He got banned before for these kinda comments. I'm sure if he keeps it up a ban stick will come down on him yet again.

@Benet the mods know who you are man. If you want to stay I would clam down.

I'm grown up, so don't worry for me, but let's be open about this. It's been more than 1 week since I contacted the mods and told them the reason why I registerd (long story made short: an experiment). I decided to stay as long as they wanted. They are suposedly evaluating the situation. I didn't say anything because I wanted to let in their hands the decision to make it public (not directly, but giving me green flag). If they were going to ban me, they might not want it to go public, but at this point I'm more concerned about being open with the TPU community, than with the mods.

That being said, I'm DarkMatter.

I'm open to suggestions as to how you have to express it when you think that someone is confused and making false claims because of that, being that what I said is apparently an insult. Just in case it has not been done yet, I'm going to report my own post to the mods. I have nothing to hide.
 
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yeah I agree there. Besides, the US is pro economy and pro business, big or small. Obama would definitely not want to hurt anyone. Also, I didnt think Intel was a US company...are they?

No one ever thinks these tech companies are US companies -- it's sad. :shadedshu Though Asia is where you go to get cool tech stuff today, pretty much everything originated in the US.
 

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Listen Dark. If you were to be banned you would have been. You are just being put under probation by them. You may not have meant to insult people but you did. Someone in your position should walk on eggshells. You say you are grown up then act like it. Otherwise you're headed to ban town again.

Just some friendly advice.

Also just to let you know I have NOTHING against Europeans or any culture for that matter. What I hate is our current governments. Mine included. Ever heard the term "I love my country but hate my government"? So I'm not sorry if insulted the EU. However you should hear the crap I talk about the US government. To be honest I HATE the EU. I think its robbing a lot of countries of their solitude.
 
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First of all. Why did you have to come up with this in the news thread?

Second, I didn't insult anyone. Be clear about where and how otherwise. Calling BS is not insulting in my book, not according what BS is in this context.

According to the wiki:

Bullshit is commonly used to describe statements made by people more concerned with the response of the audience than in truth and accuracy, such as goal-oriented statements made in the field of politics or advertising.

I have always considered that meaning when speaking about news, facts, etc...

Let's continue anything off-topic, through PMs.

@FordGT90

I still think that everything you have been saying is BS. The BS described above. And that's my opinion.
 
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Also just to let you know I have NOTHING against Europeans or any culture for that matter. What I hate is our current governments. Mine included. Ever heard the term "I love my country but hate my government"? So I'm not sorry if insulted the EU. However you should hear the crap I talk about the US government. To be honest I HATE the EU. I think its robbing a lot of countries of their solitude.

Solitude is counterproductive to civilization. The EU has helped collect the multitude of little European countries and has turned them collectively into an economic powerhouse.

I think you're just an anti-Eurite, to be honest. Perhaps you had a bad experience with a croissant as a child.
 

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Solitude is counterproductive to civilization. The EU has helped collect the multitude of little European countries and has turned them collectively into an economic powerhouse.

I think you're just an anti-Eurite, to be honest. Perhaps you had a bad experience with a croissant as a child.

Eurite is a type of rock. WTF are you going on about?
 
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first off, intel is not a monopoly. AMD is their competition. second off, amd is an inferior company in all respects, that is not intel's fault. thirdly, companies are not forced to buy intel products simply because intel offers a rebate or threatens to stop selling or any other number of savvy business tactics. the third party vendors could have still gone with AMD. in fact, had they organized themselves properly, AMD and their vendors could have beaten back intel. but as i said, AMD is an inferior company that must rely on the govt to protect its business.
well how do you react when your friend says you cant buy intel
btw

AMD is their competition. second off, amd is an inferior company in all respects
how inferior?

AMD Opteron beat the Intel Xeon (2003)
AMD Athlon 64 beat the Intel Pentium 4 (2004)
AMD 780G Chipset beats the crap out of Intel G45 Chipset (2008)

AMD has superior graphics, Intel has craptics

ALL current Intel CPUs have AMD64 microcode also known as EMT64, Intel 64 or x86-64
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X86-64
thats why you can have more than 3GB memory

AMD's HyperTransport from 2003 is far ahead of its time, intel copied it with their QuickPath, and HT is still used TODAY!

kinda fun for you to say AMD is inferior when CLEARY your blind, if it wasnt for Intel blocking AMD out of the market, AMD would have had atleast 40-50% market share by now
 

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Yeah but I think the whole thing with the 64 bit instruction set is what the cross licensing stuff was all about when it go renewed.

Benet, I dont remember Dark Matter off the top of my head so you will have to excuse me. Thanks for saying my words were wise, not sure if they were but thanks none the less. Yes you did insult, maybe not in the words I said but you did. My government is anything but perfect but still my government, so I see why you responded the way you did.

Back to the topic, there is certain to be backlash at all of this, and I do feel like this is nerd rage, even though I am not one :Rofl:
 
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companys should NOT limit another company, heck what intel did is outrageing
its like coca-cola limiting pepsi to 5% etc
 
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companys should NOT limit another company, heck what intel did is outrageing
its like coca-cola limiting pepsi to 5% etc

"Free market" advocates should be particularly outraged at what Intel did -- I don't understand the mindset of people that are against this. :ohwell:

What Intel did is manipulate the free market, which is wrong.
 

WarEagleAU

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You know, interesting thing about Coke vs Pepsi....
....You know when Coca Cola made Coke? or new Coke as it was often called (which I loved by the way, compared to the original before they went back to Classic. I remember this in the 80s and I was a little Jason, ha ha) was that when Pepsi started over taking them, based on taste tests (remember those taste test commercials) Coke had to reformulate and rethink. So they went to the drawing board (which companies should do) and tried to reinvent Coke. Pepsi had the taste, sweetness, etc that Coke was lacking and Consumers started choosing it. Coke tried to immitate that, but apparently, it was poorly received (I have no idea why because Coke and Coke 2 were/are awesome) and Coke went back to the Classic formula (which is delicious and a nice break from PEpsi, which I do love). Anywho, I just had to throw that in there and semi-hijack the thread. I apologize.
 

Benetanegia

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1. Yeah you need evidence of a murder. In this case all you have is a bunch of witnesses who stand to benefit if a "murderer" is fined. As you can see the point I am trying to make is there are no rules in love, war, or business. I do not know if Intel broke the law. All I am saying is this whole thing seems very fishy and the size of the fine and its circumstances solidify that. You guys are so thirsty to assume guilt on Intels part you do not question the accusations or its benefactors. This sounds to me like abuse of a judicial system for profit.

2. If they benefit then its not blackmail. Its a contract. OEM's made good money off of this. They are just as much at guilt. To use the murder analogy that you guys are so fond of the OEM's were accessories to the murder. Why are they not fined? What do they get out of this deal? If the EU wanted to they could charge the OEM's with industrial espionage. After all they knew it was against the law and they went along with it to get a good deal then flipped on Intel to get an ever better long term deal. They played Intel and the EU. WHY ARE THEY NOT CHARGED?! There is more proof of this than of any Intel wrong doing yet you still paint them as the victims.

3. I'm sorry but I have no clue what you mean by this. :laugh:

Uh, I dind't see this one. Let's try to explain it in a civic way:

1. It's not fishy to me at all. First of all there are lot's of evidences here, plus many many others that are never going to be public, because those are the testimonies of the executives involved. Just because a bunch of e-mails is everything we got, I don't know how you assume there's nothing more. They can't tell who gave their testimony, because Intel and even their respective companies could retaliate. Also the fine is small, very small in comparison to what the law permits and considering the charges it could very well have been greater. The law says a maximum of 10% of annual revenue AFAIK. That would have been around $4 billion max and more than $2 billion considering the charges. Also that law has not been invented for Intel, many companies have been convicted under this law and all of them paid and probably proportionally much more than Intel. Intel crearly obtained a better treatment on this one, because they are big.

2. They didn't benefit in comparison to the prices that Intel would have needed to offer them in a free market situation. They just didn't. It's the example of the gun on your head all over again. Of course you benefit from giving all your money and keeping your life instead, but nothing hides the fact that they never gave you the better deal you could have: keep your life and your money.

3. Means that a thief thinks that everyone is a thief, I said this not calling you a thief, but as a reference that what you have seen on your gevernment doesn't happen everywhere. Your government might be a thief, and sure as hell that mine is too, but that doesn't happen in such high levels, and you wouldn't involve US companies like HP, Dell. If they wanted 1 billion they don't need to do anything special like that. They can just charge us a 0,5% more and that's it, they would get that billion and then some. No one would complain about a 0,5% when the budget has been increased a >>>5% every year, I think now stands at about 150 billion euros. They could increase foreign company's operation costs... There's a lot of things they could do to get a billion, other than fining Intel, because they spend more than that billion every year, looking for anti-competitive cases and proofs. Also take into account that Intel will pay that billion by installments, so it's a very small amount of money compared to what they could get in a less public maneuvre.

PD Maybe I'm wrong, but I remember reading that 40% of the fine was going to AMD for damages and some more to other affected companies.
 
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TheMailMan78

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Exactly.

Perhaps there was eurite in your croissant.

After this conversation mdm-adph I have come to the indisputable conclusion that you my friend are mildly retarded.
 
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