Purchased an AX1200i PSU as part of some forward planning, what tier is this PSU?

[freeagent]

If you happen to max out one of your 12v rails, then yeah it could crash, depending on how the rest of your system is configured.

 

[Desktopstu]

Yes, your PC will explode, take your house and you with it and your relatives will weep over your exploded body before being gunned down by black ops from the CIA for allowing such a threat to national security as connecting a AX1200i to a modern GPU to even occur.

I feel the need to plug a 4090 or 7900XTX into my pc.... and keep an eye open for circling helicopters.

 

[Dragam1337]

If you happen to max out one of your 12v rails, then yeah it could crash, depending on how the rest of your system is configured.

It can do 1200w on a single 12v rail though, so short of very extreme overclocking, i would say it's an issue that you would never encounter.

Assimilator, you stated the following:

"The answer is simple: there's a reason why the unit was only 100 quid, and that reason is that it is not ATX 3.0 compliant. The latter doesn't just mean that it can support an ATX12VHPR cable (either 12- or 16-pin), it also means that such a unit has proper support for the high transient power spikes that modern GPUs cause. The AX1200i doesn't and that means one of two things will happen if you try to use such a GPU with it: either it'll shut down because its OCP is triggered, or it won't be able to supply the GPU sufficiently - causing the latter to experience its own crashes. Neither is a recipe for fun."

So you are saying that if I connect a modern high end GPU to the AX1200i it will cause the PC to shut down or wont be able to supply enough juice? Have I got that right?

Yeah, when i ran this, the computer just shut off and crashed immidiately... or maybe it ran just fine, with no issues what so ever...

 

[Assimilator]

So you are saying that if I connect a modern high end GPU to the AX1200i it will cause the PC to shut down or wont be able to supply enough juice? Have I got that right?

Yeah I should've been more clear, there is a chance this will happen it increases with the amount of power the GPU draws. So for high-end GPUs like the 3090/4090 or 7900 it is more likely than, say, for a 4060. But there isn't really any guarantee - for example the 7800 XT has a relatively modest draw, but many members here experienced similar stability issues with it until they switched to an ATX 3.0 PSU.

The reason is due to high power transients, which have become normal for newer GPUs but were never a thing back when the AX1200i was designed. The most logical thing for an ATX 2.31 PSU to do when confronted with such transient demands, is to either refuse to provide that power (thus starving the GPU of the power it needs, causing crashes), or more likely that PSU's OCP will be tripped and the unit will automatically shut down.

And the reason this is relevant is because I'm pretty sure you didn't buy a 1200W PSU to run a 4060.

 

[Dragam1337]

Yeah I should've been more clear, there is a chance this will happen it increases with the amount of power the GPU draws. So for high-end GPUs like the 3090/4090 or 7900 it is more likely than, say, for a 4060. But there isn't really any guarantee - for example the 7800 XT has a relatively modest draw, but many members here experienced similar stability issues with it until they switched to an ATX 3.0 PSU.

The reason is due to high power transients, which have become normal for newer GPUs but were never a thing back when the AX1200i was designed. The most logical thing for an ATX 2.31 PSU to do when confronted with such transient demands, is to either refuse to provide that power (thus starving the GPU of the power it needs, causing crashes), or more likely that PSU's OCP will be tripped and the unit will automatically shut down.

And the reason this is relevant is because I'm pretty sure you didn't buy a 1200W PSU to run a 4060.

/facepalm

An ax1200i can do 1200w on a single 12v np... 4090 aint getting anywhere near 1200 watts even with transients...

The people who had issues with non-atx 3.0 psu's didn't have the highest end units...

But i'm sure you're gonna continue this bs, eventhough i've used my ax1200i with both 3090 and 4090 with power limits removed without any issues what so ever...

 

[Toothless]

/facepalm

An ax1200i can do 1200w on a single 12v np... 4090 aint getting anywhere near 1200 watts even with transients...

The people who had issues with non-atx 3.0 psu's didn't have the highest end units...

But i'm sure you're gonna continue this bs, eventhough i've used my ax1200i with both 3090 and 4090 with power limits removed without any issues what so ever...

It's not the amount of the spike, but the suddenness of it that trips units. We've been over this.

 

[freeagent]

I thought that PSU had dual 12v rails, my bad.

But i'm sure you're gonna continue this bs,

Chill dude. This is not a competition.

 

[Dragam1337]

It's not the amount of the spike, but the suddenness of it that trips units. We've been over this.

Clearly not an issue with this unit.

I thought that PSU had dual 12v rails, my bad.


Chill dude. This is not a competition.

It's deffo not a competition - however, the dude just keeps spitting stuff that is simply incorrect. What he says is true for cheap psu's, but not the AX series - but he obviously doesn't have any first hand experience with it...

 

[Desktopstu]

Clearly not an issue with this unit.



It's deffo not a competition - however, the dude just keeps spitting stuff that is simply incorrect. What he says is true for cheap psu's, but not the AX series - but he obviously doesn't have any first hand experience with it...

As I understand it the AX1200i has some sort of software defined simulated multi rail which can be switched on or off. Have you any experience of this?

 

[Waldorf]

ignoring plugs/atx specs for a moment, my real problem is with folks claiming an older unit is "automatically" bad to use, while it comes with a double digit warranty.
no part is going to decided it will cease to work, because its over its warranty, and if i expect a unit to be getting as old as its mfg coverage, i sure will assume the AX is one of them.
the only thing psu wise that died on me within warranty was a superflower back in mid 2000s, a 750w TX used a lot on battery power, and 2 CX 5xxw units i used for friends,
but none of the quality gold/plat stuff i used since then, usually swapping psu (fan noise/watts/plugs) almost every year, so quite a few units over the years,
all still running, even those at/over warranty time.

funny tho, ppl have no problems doing the same thing (buying used) with much more expensive stuff like houses/cars, while having zero info if it was "stressed"

@Assimilator
never said anything about sealed stuff showing anything, but how clean a used unit is inside, usually tells a bit of a story.

 

[Desktopstu]

ignoring plugs/atx specs for a moment, my real problem is with folks claiming an older unit is "automatically" bad to use, while it comes with a double digit warranty.
no part is going to decided it will cease to work, because its over its warranty, and if i expect a unit to be getting as old as its mfg coverage, i sure will assume the AX is one of them.
the only thing psu wise that died on me within warranty was a superflower back in mid 2000s, a 750w TX used a lot on battery power, and 2 CX 5xxw units i used for friends,
but none of the quality gold/plat stuff i used since then, usually swapping psu (fan noise/watts/plugs) almost every year, so quiet a few units over the years,
all still running, even those at/over warranty time.

funny tho, ppl have no problems doing the same thing (buying used) with much more expensive stuff like houses/cars, while having zero info if it was "stressed"

@Assimilator
never said anything about sealed stuff showing anything, but how clean a used unit is inside, usually tells a bit of a story.

I did take a good look inside the AX through the vents to see what sort of dust build up there was, it was clean. Even the underside of the fan were clean. Tamper tags were in place so it’s not been dismantled.

I get it’s not ATX 3 and that’s it’s old, but it seems like a decent unit. I wish I hadn’t started this thread to be fair!
All I was after was some thoughts on how it would sit in the tier list that so many people seem to think is the mutts nuts.
If I had bought let’s say a spotless GTX 780ti I might have asked the same question as to where it would sit in a tier list- moot point because Techpowerup has such a list for graphics cards. I thought, in my ignorance, someone here would have said something like ‘ the AX was once tier 1 but nowadays would be more likely regarded as tier xx because of ATX 2.3’ or some such.

 

[Onasi]

I thought, in my ignorance, someone here would have said something like ‘ the AX was once tier 1 but nowadays would be more likely regarded as tier xx because of ATX 2.3’ or some such.

…but that was literally a second post in the thread where I told you that such a PSU is under the F tier in the Cultist list precisely because it is considered outdated. Not because it’s a BAD PSU, just outdated and said list is focused on providing buying advice by considering the current market and current offerings.

To take your 780Ti analogy - nobody sane would “rate” it today as anything since it is straight up an outdated piece of hardware that is architecturally obsolete (as in - it literally cannot do a lot of features that are a staple of today’s games). The weakest current gen GPUs are several times faster than it. It literally is a worthless buy for anything but collecting or a weird retro rig and still I wouldn’t pay above double digit price for it. PSUs are actually better in this regard since they don’t hit the wall AS hard.

tl:dr Tier lists and recommendations in general are based on current state of the market and tech development. It’s just what it is

 

[Waldorf]

i think for most, its because of how much you spend, which would have been enough for a new RM750e,
and the fact that the psu is one of the most important parts in a pc, without it nothing works...

but like with other things, i prefer to buy used (outside of cars) only from folks i "know", so i have a sense of how they treat their stuff.

 

[Dragam1337]

As I understand it the AX1200i has some sort of software defined simulated multi rail which can be switched on or off. Have you any experience of this?

Oh yeah, it can do a few things through the link software, but i honestly never messed with anything on it, just used it plug and play.

 

[Assimilator]

It's deffo not a competition - however, the dude just keeps spitting stuff that is simply incorrect. What he says is true for cheap psu's, but not the AX series - but he obviously doesn't have any first hand experience with it...

You're the one who doesn't seem to understand the basic concept that an ATX 2.31-compliant PSU, should treat high transient power spikes as a violation of the spec by the component making that delivery. And guess what, one would expect higher-quality units like the AX1200i to more closely conform with the spec.

Now, the fact that you have an AX1200i and a 4090, and they are presumably working together just fine, suggests that the AX1200i is not fully compliant with ATX 2.31. And that is fine for you but there is still no guarantee that it will be fine for others - the only way to be certain is to use an ATX 3.0-compliant PSU. That's all I'm trying to get across.

 

[cvaldes]

Sorry I'm late to the party and I didn't read all three pages of replies.

I need some help with math.

Let me get this straight: OP has purchased a used PSU of an old ATX 2.31 design -- possibly 10-12 years old -- to be installed in a 10-year build that might not get assembled until 2025. When his computer reaches "maturity" in 2035, wouldn't this used PSU be knocking on the door of a quarter century?

Worse, he might be planning on using a graphics card with one of the newer power connectors. That would seem to beg for a newer ATX 3.1 PSU with the revised 12V-2x6 plug (with shorter sense pins) for better safety.

Does that make sense to anyone? Is my math wrong?

 

[freeagent]

A quarter century did cross my mind once or twice

 

[dirtyferret]

the AX was once tier 1 but nowadays would be more likely regarded as tier xx because of ATX 2.3’ or some such.

once again the tier things is pointless, the actual question you should be asking is "is this PSU cable of proving the performance I need for my demands and timeline"

Let me get this straight: OP has purchased a used PSU of an old ATX 2.31 design -- possibly 10-12 years old -- to be installed in a 10-year build that might not get assembled until 2025. When his computer reaches "maturity" in 2035, wouldn't this used PSU be knocking on the door of a quarter century?

Possibly, the entire thread is a bit confusing but at certain points that was the gist

Worse, he might be planning on using a graphics card with one of the newer power connectors. That would seem to beg for a newer ATX 3.1 PSU with the revised 12V-2x6 plug (with shorter sense pins) for better safety.

once again possibly, I don't recall any specific GPU mentioned but I could be wrong

Does that make sense to anyone? Is my math wrong?

none of this makes sense

Now, the fact that you have an AX1200i and a 4090, and they are presumably working together just fine, suggests that the AX1200i is not fully compliant with ATX 2.31. And that is fine for you but there is still no guarantee that it will be fine for others - the only way to be certain is to use an ATX 3.0-compliant PSU. That's all I'm trying to get across.

I personally would have no problems using this combo, off the top of my head I did not hear of many issues with the AX1200i and modern top tier GPUs, "if" I already owned the PSU or "if" it was a stop gap and I new the PSU history (bought if off a friend who wasn't pushing it to the limits)

I would not use an ATX 2.31 for ten years from today knowing I was going to upgrade the GPU over that time. At best its a stop gap at this time as you await the ATX 3.0 PSU market to offer more competition and better prices
I would not buy any used PSU that I did not know its history

 

[Waldorf]

many here are missing the point:
as stated, this is going to be used for about 1y, and possibly resold prior to 10y build.

 

[cvaldes]

many here are missing the point:
as stated, this is going to be used for about 1y, and possibly resold prior to 10y build.

You know, not everyone here has the time nor inclination to read half a dozen followup posts to glean essential details that should have been included in the original inquiry. It's not like we're paid to be hear to answer people's questions.

Read the thread title and the original post.

If you are correct, it almost sounds like the OP changed whatever original hare-brained plans he had when people started asking questions.

If he's really going to dump this used PSU with an unknown provenance in about a year, how important does it make where it lands on the PSU tier list? There's still individual unit variance involved. Maybe it's a golden sample. Maybe it's trash and will die tomorrow after a long distinguished career in a mining rig before it got a makeover. Who knows? We certainly don't because OP has never divulged the provenance of this particular item.

Anyhow best of luck with OP in using this component however he plans.

Enjoy your PSU!

 

[phill]

many here are missing the point:
as stated, this is going to be used for about 1y, and possibly resold prior to 10y build.

If using something like this one a good system for a year, I'd ask myself a question of "Why not just buy a better PSU with the newer hardware?"??

I've had a few of these units 1200i's years ago, it didn't end well... But ironically, I had the original 1200w AX units which are still going now in my X58 rigs... The difference is amazing and aside from the gimmicky software that the 1200i supports, I'd just recommend buying a different unit.

I've recently binned some EVGA G+ PSUs that was out of warranty and were not working as they should. I went out and bought 6 Seasonic FX PSU units to replace them. The PSU for a PC in my opinion is one of these most important pieces of kit.

Recommendations - Seasonic A Tier products, Super Flower A Tier products. Yes they are expensive but they are some of the best PSUs about. I'd like to think my 1600w EVGA T2 is up there so long as the OEM was Super Flower but if not, I'm going to have to replace it... Everything is proportional. If you have a cheaper £200 rig, your not going to put in a £500 PSU, likewise your not going to put a £100 PSU in a £3000 system... Its really just not a good idea...

Whatever you do, if you value your system, whatever the spec, make sure you look after it with a decent PSU for the hardware you have. Don't run the risk of trying to be cheap. It's just not worth it. As everyone else has said.

 

[Waldorf]

except even an RMe 750 would have been another 50E, the OP doesnt have right now,
so sure, get something better, but we arent the ones providing the funds for it..

 

[dgianstefani]

except even an RMe 750 would have been another 50E, the OP doesnt have right now,
so sure, get something better, but we arent the ones providing the funds for it..

Or, hear me out.

Don't spend £100 on a 10+ year old PSU.

It's a waste of £100 regardless of how long he's planning on using it.

A literal 1050 W ATX 3.1 rated PSU is £121.

Excellent 850 W ATX 3.0/3.1 rated options exist for cheaper or slightly more expensive than £100.

Every single one of these options has at least one 16 pin native connector.

The entry price is: £90-121.

£100 is not a "saving" of £40, or £20, it's £100 down the drain.

This might sound harsh but this is an excellent example of trying to make use of a "deal" that actually results in money down the drain. The tier of the PSU when it was new is completely irrelevant, it's a 10 year old PSU. That is the stat that is relevant.

For something like, IDK, maybe £40, you could argue "OK, this is probably better than a £40 new PSU", which also won't be ATX 3.0/3.1 certified, but it's still a risk, as it's a 10 year old used PSU.

But £100?

 

[Dr. Dro]

tier lists are done by fan boys trying to pass off other peoples work as theirs and often biased and flawed. Go read a review on the PSU on TPU, Toms, anandtech kitguru, etc.,

That's a bit extreme, that list is quite reliable and backed by research. Same goes for @Onasi calling it tier F, I'll take an AX1200i with up to ~4 years of use on it over practically any midrange unit today, especially if it had been mine from the get go.

That said, the AX1200i is a solid and very high end digitally controlled power supply. It's an older model but unless the OP's unit is run down by years of heavy use, it's a great model to have.

 

[#22]

Or, hear me out.

Don't spend £100 on a 10+ year old PSU.

It's a waste of £100 regardless of how long he's planning on using it.

A literal 1050 W ATX 3.1 rated PSU is £121.

I wouldn't even compare this 100 pounds "deal" to new 1000W PSUs. Hard to say how much of it's nominal wattage it's able to deliver today. And in general buying 1000W unit for computer with one GPU has never been needed, so it's overkilling Watts for some more or less fancy reason. SLI is not likely to come back, I wouldn't suspect even OP to power with this mushroom some multi-GPU workstation, so for sure one costing and making money. For ~100 pounds - or even lower if hunting promos - man can get new 850W units like Pure Power 12 or XPG Core Reactor II. ATX 3.0, very good performers, quiet, modular and somehow compromised, but with 10-year warranty to cover it. Not having 10, 20 or even 100 pounds is not serious answer if we talk things guaranteed to serve ten years or ones not even needed now.