News Section Feedback Goes Here

btarunr · Aug 23, 2008

There's been an increasing need for such a discussion thread on our news team, with some feedback being provided on discussion threads of the news threads (which are not meant to be there).

In the discussion thread of a news article, you are expected to comment on the article. Your comments make it to the home page, which our thousands of guests /day apart from our community members read. So let's leave those threads to commenting on the news and discussing about it. I really admire the tech-temperament of some of our readers that some extremely interesting and informative discussions are brought about in those news threads, sometimes those discussions even make us alter / add to the original news articles as updates/factual changes, etc. Such discussions are strongly encouraged within the news threads. On the other hand, the technical aspects of news posting are also added to discussion threads, some are unfair and uncalled for, others are constructive and help us improve. Since it's only our community members that bring those comments, let's keep those sub-discussions within the community.

You can appreciate, voice concern, or provide constructive feedback on our news team in this thread, please don't treat some other (more popular) threads in the comments & feedback forum as "complaint books", as every thread in in the comments & feedback forum deals with a specific department of the TPU staff and its activities. This sticks to the news. Don't treat this as a "this member trolls a lot in < insert company > news threads" discussion either. For member-specific feedback, the moderators are all ears.

Should you want to suggest changes to a news article, contact its author first, if the author is not around, contact an editor.

The following is a list of people you can approach after trying to get in touch with an author:

malware (Head of Staff, News dept.)
btarunr
DanTheBanjoman (busy !, approach malware/btarunr first)
Darksaber (busy !, contact only when absolutely nobody else concerned is around, approach malware/btarunr first)
W1zzard (SiteOP, busy ! contact only when absolutely nobody else concerned is around)

You're more than welcome to appreciate our work if you feel like

Here's wishing this thread an auspicious start...

lemonadesoda · Aug 23, 2008

1./ btarunr and the TPU newsteam have IMO really improved the quality of what they are posting over the last months. You are doing a great job!

2./ As a general comment I have noticed that many news posts are "cascaded" from one site to another, ie. newsposter quotes a "source" that isnt actually a true source, just another site that themselves links to another to another to another in a chain. Unfortunately, with this approach, news tends to at risk of corruption: info gets lost due to trimming, editing, personal comments (from OTHER sites, TPU comments are fine), chinese whispers, noise, etc. etc. To get to the "true source" and "original specs" one has to click through many different sites to go back up the chain. Sometimes it even requires google to find the original source. If TPU newsposting could get it's source "higher up the chain" that would be great.

3./ Is TPU registered with the main PR agencies in the Tech Industries, so that you get the news releases earlier and from their original sources? Very rarely have I seen a source being from the product manuf themselves, but just links to another tech site.

4./ Is this "community linking", ie quoting another website rather than the true source, due to important criteria for diggs, search engines, and advertising revenues? Because if this is the case, the true source could still be written TOGETHER with an "also seen at" link. That keeps your links up. But gives us access to real sources.

btarunr · Aug 23, 2008

Thank you lemonadesoda.

I'll answer the second question first, yes we are registered and subscribed to PR agencies, they send us news, releases to our address (news@techpowerup.com), each staff member has additionally, independently subscribed to PR items being sent to their mailboxes (TPU mailboxes, eg mine is btarunr@techpowerup.com). W1zzard has contacts with several sources in the industry and he stays in touch with his counterparts from other sites, we exchange news, though we're directed to stay out of posting from some sites (such as F'zilla etc., unless they have something concrete to show). So we don't quite cascade. To them we're known as the people behind ATI Tool, GPU-Z, diverse hardware reviews. We constantly exchange news about our reviews, articles with them as they do with us. That should kind of answer your third question as well. I'm not into the administrative affairs, and so isn't this thread so that's all I can answer.

To answer your first question, cascading news is not what we intend to do, we've to report from the primary source. It's in our guidelines. Sometimes it's with manufacturers not hosting news in their press rooms in time that we've to look for sources. If a manufacturer sends something in we host it quoting them as source. As for community linking, the true source is always the manufacturer, sometimes he doesn't give out news so sources with the manufacturer (staff leaks to websites) serve as the points that websites pick up and we quote those websites. They then become the 'true source'.

The news team is expanding (qualitatively) just like this website and like every organisation ever made, we do have our dreams and ambitions, on lighter note,"world domination plans". With the expansion of our community and viewer-base (quantitatively) we're heading towards that.

xfire · Aug 23, 2008

Daily tech's system of new's comments is efficient to some extent, it doesn't display the low rated comment's until the user asks it to.
Overall news items have started coming early since bta started.

W1zzard · Aug 23, 2008

lemonadesoda said:
2./ As a general comment I have noticed that many news posts are "cascaded" from one site to another [...] If TPU newsposting could get it's [sic] source "higher up the chain" that would be great.

since day one the rules here at tpu were: "link the original source"

Is this "community linking", ie quoting another website rather than the true source, due to important criteria for diggs, search engines, and advertising revenues?

if a site takes one post as source and adds a substantial amount of information to it on its own then it could certainly be added as a secondary source. but just rewriting some content doesnt deserve that imo.

btarunr · Aug 23, 2008

xfire said:
Daily tech's system of new's comments is efficient to some extent, it doesn't display the low rated comment's until the user asks it to.
Overall news items have started coming early since bta started.

They use post approvals to regulate what comments make it. Some websites' forums use a feature with which, the staff have to approve your posts before they become visible in a thread. This however is a put-off. Imagine you spending 10 minutes typing something and it doesn't get approved, you wouldn't want to post anymore after your posts get repeatedly unapproved, right? All your posts instantly display on TPU forums. However, fights / spam / garbage are subject to being deleted stating a reasonable argument for its deletion sent to you as a PM.

We don't have a post rating system either. That's very discriminatory in some cases.

lemonadesoda · Aug 23, 2008

W1zzard said:

Ah, crap. Sorry.

LOL

btarunr · Aug 23, 2008

If:
Source 1: ABC
Source 2: ABCDEFG
Source 3: ABCHIJKL

TPU: ABCDEFGHIJKL ; acknowledge sources.

Source 1 is always the newsmaker.

Source 1: Silent
Source 2: "ZOMG Intel made 25 GHz Netburst possible"
Source 3: "That processor needs you to operate it on Pluto, winter preferred."

TPU (bta): Source 2 + 3 + an honest view "Pluto looks too much"
Community: You can't add 2 cents!!! You can't go to Pluto!!!
bta: but look at the sources, they're all facts
Community: No!
bta....:

let's type whatever crap sources give me

How do I go up the cascade? From now on, you'll see more content in my posts, let's see how many appreciate it. The last time I spent 2 hours researching and posting on Nehalem turbo mode, all I got back was <15 replies. I do make it a point to go to the original source at all times, using google / crappy translators, whatever.

alexp999 · Aug 23, 2008

btarunr said:
If:
Source 1: ABC
Source 2: ABCDEFG
Source 3: ABCHIJKL

TPU: ABCDEFGHIJKL ; acknowledge sources.

Source 1 is always the newsmaker.

Source 1: Silent
Source 2: "ZOMG Intel made 25 GHz Netburst possible"
Source 3: "That processor needs you to operate it on Pluto, winter preferred."

TPU (bta): Source 1 + 2 + an honest view "Pluto looks too much"
Community: You can't add 2 cents!!! You can't go to Pluto!!!
bta: but look at the sources, they're all facts
Community: No!
bta....: let's type whatever crap sources give me

How do I go up the cascade? From now on, you'll see more content in my posts, let's see how many appreciate it. The last time I spent 2 hours researching and posting on Nehalem turbo mode, all I got back was <15 replies.

Dont write too much in the news posts bta. Tbh, I find a bit of a hardship when I open the story and see a whole page in front of me. Thats why all my news posts are short and sweet. then I save any extra info and opinions for the replies section.

:toast:

btarunr · Aug 23, 2008

When I try to do that, a section of the community says: more content looks better. When I don't, another part picks on me. It's not like long posts don't get back anything, I've done several elaborate articles mixing several sources into the concoction and many of them got great response from the community.

alexp999 · Aug 23, 2008

btarunr said:
When I try to do that, a section of the community says: more content looks better. When I don't, another part picks on me. It's not like long posts don't get back anything, I've done several elaborate articles mixing several sources into the concoction and many of them got great response from the community.

Its either that or they need to be sectioned a bit more. I know a couple of malwares have been like essays IMO, and it just makes them feel like a chore to read. I know it looks professional, but....

have you got a link to the one you said you spent ages on?

btarunr · Aug 23, 2008

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=69106

on the other hand,

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?p=869310#post869310

There are many more. Anyway, the issue isn't "elaborate news", it's "covering more". Sum ppl wunts moar.

alexp999 · Aug 23, 2008

btarunr said:
http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=69106

on the other hand,

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?p=869310#post869310

There are many more.

See now that first one is good, but the second one just looks like a chore to read (even though the first one probably has more words)

Thats what I was angling at, trying to break it up into manageable chunks

But I appreciate it can be difficult to break it up if there is nothing to break it up with other than the return key.

btarunr · Aug 23, 2008

alexp999 said:
See now that first one is good, but the second one just looks like a chore to read (even though the first one probably has more words)

Thats what I was angling at, trying to break it up into manageable chunks
But I appreciate it can be difficult to break it up if there is nothing to break it up with other than the return key.

That chore to read is what I was asked to make (cover everything), following which I was privately thanked.

Now comes a case where I keep things short, someone tells me, "go beyond the source", I add details, a specs sheet, solved it, but that's not how it's meant to be, effort has to be put in.

alexp999 · Aug 23, 2008

btarunr said:
That chore to read is what I was asked to make (cover everything), following which I was privately thanked.

Now comes a case where I keep things short, someone tells me, "go beyond the source", I add details, a specs sheet, solved it, but that's not how it's meant to be, effort has to be put in.

Suppose its impossible to please everyone. Not saying you shouldnt include all the info, but the first link is broken up by the pics and makes it much easier to read. Either that or are you allowed to leave two or three lines between paragraphs?

btarunr · Aug 23, 2008

You're getting into "break the whale into more bits than you already did". Point is, it's the same quantity of whale that remains. Paragraph spacing was ok. I even made others do its editing / approving.

alexp999 · Aug 23, 2008

btarunr said:
You're getting into "break the whale into more bits than you already did". Point is, it's the same quantity of whale that remains. Paragraph spacing was ok. I even made others do its editing / approving.

okay, but dont think you quite get my point, when I click on the second link, I see a great big wad of text. When i click the first link, i see little snippets of text and IMo it just makes it so much more enjoyable, and easier to read.

btarunr · Aug 23, 2008

alexp999 said:
okay, but dont think you quite get my point, when I click on the second link, I see a great big wad of text. When i click the first link, i see little snippets of text and IMo it just makes it so much more enjoyable, and easier to read.

Well, I couldn't have added Eran Badit's baby pictures, could I? That news was based on W1zzard's conversation with NGOHQ (maybe Eran himself), after which I get a PM asking me to cover everything. So there was no way I could break spaces using anything, certainly not spacing paragraphs with 2+ lines. The fact that that thread got more reactions than the one that's "properly spaced" only validates it. Spacing isn't a concern, the matter matters, the content matters.

lemonadesoda · Aug 23, 2008

bta... we all think you are doing a great job. Remember, you have EARNED the expectation of great newsposting. You cant expect everyone to "thank" you for each post, because now we expect great stuff from you. It's not that we are hard to please... only that we challenge you to become ever better at your job.

Whatever way you look at it, there is a breadth-depth-time tradeoff. No-one is expecting you to spend more than the Wizzard-guideline on a newspost. No one expects you to be 100% comprehensive. Just that, in the example today, you quoted one source... but that very source quoted their source, which was "more primary" and with a lot more info. So, in the space of 1 second (I know you are a quick typer and have a fast net), you could have found the better source, and quoted from there.

Anyway, it was only a suggestion, not a demand. I really dont want you to think we dont appreciate your hard work... and you are pulling your hair out thinking your audience is difficult to please. Just do whatever you think best...we are still happy with what you are doing.

alexp999 · Aug 23, 2008

btarunr said:
Well, I couldn't have added Eran Badit's baby pictures, could I? That news was based on W1zzard's conversation with NGOHQ (maybe Eran himself), after which I get a PM asking me to cover everything. So there was no way I could break spaces using anything, certainly not spacing paragraphs with 2+ lines. The fact that that thread got more reactions than the one that's "properly spaced" only validates it. Spacing isn't a concern, the matter matters, the content matters.

okay thats fine sorry. But title was your views, so I wanted to give mine. :ohwell:

btarunr · Aug 23, 2008

lemonadesoda said:
bta... we all think you are doing a great job. Remember, you have EARNED the expectation of great newsposting. You cant expect everyone to "thank" you for each post, because now we expect great stuff from you. It's not that we are hard to please... only that we challenge you to become ever better at your job.

Whatever way you look at it, there is a breadth-depth-time tradeoff. No-one is expecting you to spend more than the Wizzard-guideline on a newspost. No one expects you to be 100% comprehensive. Just that, in the example today, you quoted one source... but that very source quoted their source, which was "more primary" and with a lot more info. So, in the space of 1 second (I know you are a quick typer and have a fast net), you could have found the better source, and quoted from there.

Anyway, it was only a suggestion, not a demand. I really dont want you to think we dont appreciate your hard work... and you are pulling your hair out thinking your audience is difficult to please. Just do whatever you think best...we are still happy with what you are doing.

No, please, I'm not asking for thanks, :eek:

just saying that it's a very tough balancing act, managing content of the news posts. I went sloppy with handling sources, it won't happen again.

alexp999 said:
okay thats fine sorry. But title was your views, so I wanted to give mine.

Much appreciated.

candle_86 · Aug 23, 2008

btarunr said:
They use post approvals to regulate what comments make it. Some websites' forums use a feature with which, the staff have to approve your posts before they become visible in a thread. This however is a put-off. Imagine you spending 10 minutes typing something and it doesn't get approved, you wouldn't want to post anymore after your posts get repeatedly unapproved, right? All your posts instantly display on TPU forums. However, fights / spam / garbage are subject to being deleted stating a reasonable argument for its deletion sent to you as a PM.

We don't have a post rating system either. That's very discriminatory in some cases.

agreed, i got banned from a site from one of those, i made a single post that made some people mad and 100 neg post rep its auto ban, they all neg repped it and i got banned. I agree with BTA, its discrimitory and very easy to abuse

WhiteLotus · Aug 23, 2008

To be perfectly honest with you I am very surprised this thread even exists.

The news is something that I am here for. I love this news section of the site. I have tried to find other (dedicated) news site and compared to here they are below the par that TPU has set for me.

If I was to rank each news poster on how well I think they do the job, Btarunr is in first place. Purely because in my opinion Malware's news it often just too long-winded, but at the same time covers EVERYTHING you need to know. Maybe Btarunr is just more suited to my level of experience? I don't know.
Also I haven't seen Jimmy2004 for some time. Does he still contribute to the news in any way?

I also would like to add a response to Btarunr comment about the Intel turbo news. I read it, four times - and still it made no sense to me. That isn't me not understanding what you wrote, that's me not understanding every single piece of technological jargon. I like to see myself as an experience amateur. So in some news articles I do not post purposefully at risk of making myself look like a complete idiot, and I believe others (although most likely wouldn't admit it) do the same.

About some comments being unfit for the front page - maybe give the author and all mods to "hide" such comments - unless such a thing already exists.

Another thing I have seen is that many comments repeat the one before it because time delay when both users posting at the same time. On terrorizer.com (metal forum) they allow you to preview any new comments that may have been posted between the time you clicked reply and submit. Maybe such a thing could be implemented here?

OrbitzXT · Aug 24, 2008

Can you give an example of people getting off topic on talking about news? Yes those comments get seen, but usually its an interesting discussion that stems out of the news that you post.

News
Post 1: Comment about news.
Post 2: Comment about news, comment on post 1.
Post 3: Response to previous posts.
Post 4: Response to previous posts.
Post 5: Response to previous posts.
Post 6: BABA BOOEY BABA BOOEY HOWARD STERN'S PENIS

Posts 1-5 seem fine to me, 6 has it's problems. The discussions that stem out of the news can be just as interesting to read as the news itself.

Its like you're asking everyone to ignore everyone else's posts and pretend they're all first posters. This is humanity we're dealing with, if people see something interesting someone prior to them said they'll want to comment on that. I think the way things are now are fine and you shouldn't worry about the discussions on the news page.

As for the length of news, I like every article to be long and full of details. I obviously don't want to read it all, but when I see a headline about something that catches my interests I want to know as much as possible. For example, I saw an article the other day about how overclocking Nehalem (sp?) will be different and more in depth, and I really enjoyed reading all of it. It was a long, detailed filled article. Sometimes I see headlines that interest me a lot, but they hardly have any information and leave me wanting more.

candle_86 · Aug 24, 2008

WhiteLotus said:
To be perfectly honest with you I am very surprised this thread even exists.

The news is something that I am here for. I love this news section of the site. I have tried to find other (dedicated) news site and compared to here they are below the par that TPU has set for me.

If I was to rank each news poster on how well I think they do the job, Btarunr is in first place. Purely because in my opinion Malware's news it often just too long-winded, but at the same time covers EVERYTHING you need to know. Maybe Btarunr is just more suited to my level of experience? I don't know.
Also I haven't seen Jimmy2004 for some time. Does he still contribute to the news in any way?

I also would like to add a response to Btarunr comment about the Intel turbo news. I read it, four times - and still it made no sense to me. That isn't me not understanding what you wrote, that's me not understanding every single piece of technological jargon. I like to see myself as an experience amateur. So in some news articles I do not post purposefully at risk of making myself look like a complete idiot, and I believe others (although most likely wouldn't admit it) do the same.

About some comments being unfit for the front page - maybe give the author and all mods to "hide" such comments - unless such a thing already exists.

Another thing I have seen is that many comments repeat the one before it because time delay when both users posting at the same time. On terrorizer.com (metal forum) they allow you to preview any new comments that may have been posted between the time you clicked reply and submit. Maybe such a thing could be implemented here?

hey if you want to understand this stuff, do what i do, go read anything you can on it. I didnt understand shaders for about 3 years and finally made myself learn them. Thats my advice to you

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Video Card(s)	Palit GeForce RTX 2080 SUPER GameRock
Storage	Western Digital Black NVMe 512GB
Display(s)	BenQ 1440p 60 Hz 27-inch
Case	Corsair Carbide 100R
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