KaynarThe true fail of AMD is that their best single-GPU in their new generation series is just 15-20% faster than nVidia's previous gen cards, which means that HD7950 will perform the same as GTX580 for the same price also and then nVidia will have their new cards 2 months later which will step all over AMD... yet I choose to buy HD7970 for some reason...

I don't see a fail at all with what AMD has released. What do you have out right now game wise that will even use the cards potential? It wont be for another 1 or 2 till the next gen consoles are released till we will be closer to see what these new cards are going to be able to really do. Right now we are stuck with console ports at 120fps.

nvidiaintelftwI don't see a fail at all with what AMD has released. What do you have out right now game wise that will even use the cards potential? It wont be for another 1 or 2 till the next gen consoles are released till we will be closer to see what these new cards are going to be able to really do. Right now we are stuck with console ports at 120fps.

Right, so we might as well play them using the least possible amount of power? I think that's how your answer needs to end for it to be a compelling argument.

KaynarThe true fail of AMD is that their best single-GPU in their new generation series is just 15-20% faster than nVidia's previous gen cards, which means that HD7950 will perform the same as GTX580 for the same price also and then nVidia will have their new cards 2 months later which will step all over AMD... yet I choose to buy HD7970 for some reason...

A little more explanation here... It’s not as doom and gloom... I see it as trying to persevere, persist working with TSCM on their cutting edge. (In that it cuts both ways)
www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2521343#post2521343

7950 should beat the 580... the 6950 wasnt close to 20% slower than the 6970.

entropy13ATI's already dead. Killed by...AMD. :laugh:

It's not the end of AMD yet, but we can see it from here

Na the GTX 580 and 7900 series are not that far apart and since they have been around a while the jump from GTX 580 to these new performance levels seem very doable. The 7900 series are monster cards but truly do you guy think that the GTX 580 is a bad deal at around 400.00 and do you really believe they cannot improve it 20- 40 percent on a design that is nearly 2 years old.

trt740but truly do you guy think that the GTX 580 is a bad deal at around 400.00 and do you really believe they cannot improve it 20- 40 percent on a design that is nearly 2 years old.

If it were $400 it would be a great deal, but it currently is around $500, with the 7970 in low supply running around $560-580.

xenocideIf it were $400 it would be a great deal, but it currently is around $500, with the 7970 in low supply running around $560-580.

Okay never mind they upped the price they were down to 429.00 but not anymore. This is a great deal still Galaxy 58NLH5HS3PXZ GeForce GTX 580 (Fermi) 1536MB... because of the 70.00 cooler but there is a rebate. The 7900 card is better if you can live with the noise but thats the best I have. Also finding a 7970 that hasn't had the price jacked is like finding Bigfoot. Tiger Direct should be ashamed

EastCoasthandleDon't get caught up in the marketing. The 560 ti (GF104), a 40nm part, has a tdp of just 170w. What they are suggesting for the GK104 is a tdp of 225w for a 28nm part! Something is not right with that, to say the least. Even if it's implied they are trying to overclock a 560ti replacement for a mid/high part.

The GF104 is the 460. The 114 is the 560.

trt740No check again they are as low as 429.00-539.00 and the 7970s are 500.00 to 599.00.

Checking Egg the best is $440 -AR$50 for an "ucky" ECS or a PNY for $478 shipped (right)... there's a few Asus, EVGA or Gigabytes for $470-480 after rebates ($20-30), so that's the range for quality offerings. IF Egg had 7970 stock you'd need to ad 15-20% to those final prices. (and that has No rebates)
Summary:
@ 2560x 15% > GTX580
@ 1920x 10% > GTX580
(though with titles like Skyrim, STALKER COP, A&P, CRYSIS the 7970 shows it's legs)

Now, in about 2 weeks, when more of the AIB Customs hit market we might get a better feel of the GTX580 market, so far in limited supply there's no reason for Nvidia to run scared as I hypothesize.

NC37The GF104 is the 460. The 114 is the 560.

It's still based on the GF104 which is what I'm referencing. Remember, the transistor count didn't change between the gf104 to gf114.

Showing up late and not adding anything to the argument, but I always hate when people state you can't compare two cards since one of them is 2 yr. old tech.... blah, blah, blah.

Right now the fastest single GPU offering you can buy from nVidia = 580
Right now the fastest single GPU offering you can buy from ATI = 7970

Seems pretty damn comparable to me, of course you need to be able to find the 7970 to buy it.

And that compare is absolutely fine, it's just when you start to go into details like the 40nm vs 28nm, transistors counts and the general age of the architecture that things look less rosy for AMD.

Can nV topple the 7970? You'd have to be pretty naive to think otherwise.

Might be right and of course then you're comparing nV's current gen vs. AMD's which has been out for months already as well. I don't care if they are made out of magic fairy dust, the fastest currently out versus the fastest currently out is where the competition should lie.

kinda reminds me of the G94 9600GT, first 9 series that came out, a midrange part (tho not from a new architecture)

BeertintedgogglesMight be right and of course then you're comparing nV's current gen vs. AMD's which has been out for months already as well. I don't care if they are made out of magic fairy dust, the fastest currently out versus the fastest currently out is where the competition should lie.

Of course, and equally I couldn't give a toss if AMD's card is out now and nV's is out 6 months down the line. SI on 28nm vs Kepler on 28nm floats my boat more than getting excited over it currently beating an ageing rock star that is the GTX 580.

What gets me excited isn't the stock speeds - it's the overclocking headroom we're seeing from a hi end card regardless of current or prev gen.

Maybe Nvidia will have the same kind of oc'ing headroom in their top end cards but I doubt it. If anything Nvidia won't be content with just regaining the performance crown - they want to obliterate the competition so expect max clocks.

That said it almost seems as if AMD is holding back the 7970 on purpose. Expect them to have something up their sleeves too.

Big Green

Well I'm sure Nvidia will have to have the fastest flagship card again this coming generation. Of course they will charge whatever they want, and performance/ watt will suck compared to ATi. Same pattern as always. Hopefully the GTX 660 will be more reasonable/efficient again and keep the HD 79xx prices down.

20% performance improvement over the gtx 580 is excellent considering that power used. Image if ATi made a card that used the same power draw as the GTX 580!

Also, nobody avoids a card because it has low performance/transisistor count :rolleyes:

This looks like a rushed out part.

I hope it beats the 7970 by a significant margin and they sell it with the same price... :)

I think that the TDP is 225 only because of the 2 six pins connectors on the card, which means anything considering that the HD6870 has two of them too, and it doesn't need 225W at all. This is a new architecture and we don't know if it will have the same perf/watt or it will be better considering the slides nvidia showed some time ago about tesla, fermi, kepler and maxwell. I'm an Nvidia fan but what i can say is that amd is better in power consumption since 5xxx series and it would be time for nvidia to solve the problem somehow. I would never choose a gts 450 over an ati 5750 becouse of the their power requirements, but i also know that they will give me the same performance and nvidia has PhyX and it maybe can give me some good effect in some games that i like and it will cost me not more than 2-3 euros/dollars every year (different power consumption), so i could also choose the nvidia one. I believe it's good for us that they try to improve everything of this cards but someone who wants the best performance and spends 200-500 $ to obtain it, will not be interested in 20 watts difference if he doesn't play games day and night without interruptions (idle differences are really smaller). It all depends on the point of view. I only hope for competition to help lower prices

256-bit? Is this nVidia's mid-range card competing with AMD's High-End? NOT GOOD! A thousand $ price tag GPU for nVidia's flagship... :p

Chappy256-bit? Is this nVidia's mid-range card competing with AMD's High-End? NOT GOOD! A thousand $ price tag GPU for nVidia's flagship... :p

maybe the use special gddr5 memory :D probably polished by the tears of fanboys.

Only 256 bit and GDDR5 memory could be a bandwidth limit ???

valio. I believe it's good for us that they try to improve everything of this cards but someone who wants the best performance and spends 400-500 $ to obtain it, will not be interested in 20 watts difference if he doesn't play games day and night without interruptions (idle differences are really smaller). It all depends on the point of view. I only hope for competition to help lower prices

fixed...

i think your estimated range is too far apart...

this is from a germany based perspective, as energy prices are pretty high here...