RyZen 3000 Boost Issue: What's your take?

xkm1948 · Aug 28, 2019

So apparently RyZen 3000 CPUs are not hitting their advertised boost clocks. As amazing as the performance of these processors are it left some sour taste for some RyZen3000 owners.

Ryzen 3000: AMD deliberately limited Boost behavior in favor of longevity, says Asus staff

An Asus employee gas mentioned that AMD has reduced the boost behavior of the Ryzen 3000 processors to a more moderate level as it was too aggressive and now is a bit more limited in favor of longevit...

www.guru3d.com

https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/cusn2t
So what do you think?

TheLostSwede · Aug 28, 2019

It seems to be UEFI related, I've posted I think a 100 posts here about it by now, but with the latest UEFI from Gigabyte, my CPU finally boosts to 4,525MHz, whereas before that, it would not get 1MHz past 4,000.25MHz.

The fact shamino hasn't seen a fix, doesn't really concern me, as clearly Gigabyte has solved it, so it seems fixable.

oxrufiioxo · Aug 28, 2019

My 3900X seems to boost just fine.

Overall performance is amazing and right in line with what I paid for.

I almost went 3800X but figured 100$ was worth the 4 extra cores if I had went 3800X I probably would have been bummed post reviews over how similar it is to the 3700X.

I think AMD should have done a better job with the 3600X and 3800X with binning they both seem rushed.

TheLostSwede · Aug 28, 2019

oxrufiioxo said:
My 3900X seems to boost just fine.

Overall performance is amazing and right in line with what I paid for.

I almost went 3800X but figured 100$ was worth the 4 extra cores if I had went 3800X I probably would have been bummed post reviews over how similar it is to the 3700X.

I think AMD should have done a better job with the 3600X and 3800X with binning they both seem rushed.

Which is a separate matter to the boosting issue, but I fully agree on your point about the SKUs being way too close this time around.

tabascosauz · Aug 28, 2019

3700X. I actually don't mind the reduction of the boost. I never hit 4400MHz, but get pretty close at about 4360-70MHz. Irrelevant, because my potato seems to need a billion volts for anything over 4GHz, making boost clocks over 4.2GHz nothing more than transient anyways.

AMD needs to address the fact that it's all or nothing; either you go balls to the wall to max boost despite your silicon quality, or base speed only.

kartoffelotto · Aug 28, 2019

actually, prices here have become as similar as the cpus for 3700x and 3800x. 3800x is now 368€, i lol at my impatience

Chomiq · Aug 28, 2019

They should get their facts right. Or do they believe that settling out of court 10 years from now is cheaper than risking stock price drop now?

FinneousPJ · Aug 28, 2019

Really bad poll. Super biased options.

phanbuey · Aug 28, 2019

Option 3 - It's fine. I DONT CARE AND I HATE SMALL CHILDREN.

Pretty sure that whole department is about to get cleared out anyways...

AMD agrees to cough up $35-a-chip payout over eight-core Bulldozer advertising fiasco

A great deal or were consumers Bulldozed by the chip giant?

www.theregister.co.uk

Lisa is about to go in there with a hatchet.

Tomgang · Aug 28, 2019

Not gonna vote, but it seems boost has just as much to do with motherboards. Same cpu boost different on different boards.

biffzinker · Aug 28, 2019

I'm sticking with a manual overclock of 4.175 GHz across all cores as long as I don't require the red voltage (1.45+) options for stability.

R-T-B · Aug 28, 2019

I hate all forms of "boost" with a vengance. So, let me just say that I won't be saying this is an AMD exclusive issue. It's even present in the GPU scene. Heck, it practically started there.

trparky · Aug 29, 2019

R-T-B said:
I hate all forms of "boost" with a vengance. So, let me just say that I won't be saying this is an AMD exclusive issue. It's even present in the GPU scene. Heck, it practically started there.

It’s worse on the Intel side, unless you have really good cooling forget about consistent boost clocks unless of course you enable All-Core Boost.

lexluthermiester · Aug 29, 2019

xkm1948 said:
So apparently RyZen 3000 CPUs are not hitting their advertised boost clocks. As amazing as the performance of these processors are it left some sour taste for some RyZen3000 owners.

Ryzen 3000: AMD deliberately limited Boost behavior in favor of longevity, says Asus staff

An Asus employee gas mentioned that AMD has reduced the boost behavior of the Ryzen 3000 processors to a more moderate level as it was too aggressive and now is a bit more limited in favor of longevit...

www.guru3d.com

https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/cusn2t
So what do you think?

I've done many upgrades to existing systems and built a bunch of systems based on the Ryzen 3xxx CPU's and have not seen even one instance where the CPU failed to hit it's rated specs or boost clocks. I've seen a bunch of boards overvolting them by default, causing heat issues and thus throttling. Dropping the voltages to what they are supposed to be solves this issue instantly. Maybe this is the problem people are having? Just a guess though.

Nordic · Aug 29, 2019

It is a bad poll but I do think amd messed up.

Divide Overflow · Aug 29, 2019

Poll is full of troll.

lexluthermiester · Aug 29, 2019

Divide Overflow said:
Poll is full of troll.

While it seems biased, can't really call it a troll of a poll because it's addressing a very real issue people are having..

TheLostSwede · Aug 29, 2019

lexluthermiester said:
While it seems biased, can't really call it a troll of a poll because it's addressing a very real issue people are having..

The poll is full of troll, however, the question is legitimate.

Divide Overflow · Aug 29, 2019

lexluthermiester said:
While it seems biased, can't really call it a troll of a poll because it's addressing a very real issue people are having..

My 3900X seems to boost just fine. Poll sure came across as trolling to me.

lexluthermiester · Aug 29, 2019

Divide Overflow said:
My 3900X seems to boost just fine. Poll sure came across as trolling to me.

I think you might be confusing the term "trolling" with "biased", with it very much seems to be.

eidairaman1 · Aug 29, 2019

lexluthermiester said:
I've done many upgrades to existing system and built a bunch of systems based on the Ryzen 3xxx CPU's and have not seen even one instance where the CPU failed to hit it's rated specs or boost clocks. I've seen a bunch of boards overvolting them by default, causing heat issues and thus throttling. Dropping the voltages to what they are supposed to be solves this issue instantly. Maybe this is the problem people are having? Just a guess though.

The og is biased.

Divide Overflow said:
My 3900X seems to boost just fine. Poll sure came across as trolling to me.

lexluthermiester said:
I think you might be confusing the term "trolling" with "biased", with it very much seems to be.

Octopuss · Aug 29, 2019

Can anyone explain this longevity nonsense AMD claims to me? It sounds like utter nonsense to me. It's not like a CPU is overvolting itself while boosting (and even if it did, it doesn't matter, because it would last years anyway), so this feels like completely pointless change.

londiste · Aug 29, 2019

Octopuss said:
Can anyone explain this longevity nonsense AMD claims to me? It sounds like utter nonsense to me. It's not like a CPU is overvolting itself while boosting (and even if it did, it doesn't matter, because it would last years anyway), so this feels like completely pointless change.

It depends on what would be considered overvolting. Ryzen 3000 CPUs do run cores at 1.4-1.5V when boosting.

Vario · Aug 29, 2019

This is my take:

They could have sold these as 3.5GHz processors with unlocked overclocking and a potential +800 MHz overclock.

The processor would then be poorly reviewed by hardware websites that cater to gamers, compared to Intel.

So instead, they found a way to make it beat or tie with Intel in nearly every possible circumstance: gaming, single thread workloads, and multithread workloads; with no remaining overclock headroom, and on some examples, strange voltages, high temperatures, and inconsistent turbos.

It seems a bit bait and switch and deceptive, as the earlier AMD statements to early adopter redditors on /r/amd were "your new Ryzen 3000 series processor is perfectly fine with high voltage transients and high temperatures because its a new architecture and popular hw monitoring tools are too sensitive at recording data"
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/cbls9g

silkstone · Aug 29, 2019

xkm1948 said:
So apparently RyZen 3000 CPUs are not hitting their advertised boost clocks. As amazing as the performance of these processors are it left some sour taste for some RyZen3000 owners.

Ryzen 3000: AMD deliberately limited Boost behavior in favor of longevity, says Asus staff

An Asus employee gas mentioned that AMD has reduced the boost behavior of the Ryzen 3000 processors to a more moderate level as it was too aggressive and now is a bit more limited in favor of longevit...

www.guru3d.com

https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/cusn2t
So what do you think?

I have every issue listed in that video. It's not really a deal breaker for me as I don't need the clocks, but obviously I want it to be fixed!

System Name	Virtual Reality / Bioinformatics
Processor	Undead CPU
Motherboard	Undead TUF X99
Cooling	Noctua NH-D15
Memory	GSkill 128GB DDR4-3000
Video Card(s)	EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra
Storage	Samsung 960 Pro 1TB + 860 EVO 2TB + WD Black 5TB
Display(s)	32'' 4K Dell
Case	Fractal Design R5
Audio Device(s)	BOSE 2.0
Power Supply	Seasonic 850watt
Mouse	Logitech Master MX
Keyboard	Corsair K70 Cherry MX Blue
VR HMD	HTC Vive + Oculus Quest 2
Software	Windows 10 P

System Name	Overlord Mk MLI
Processor	AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D
Motherboard	Gigabyte X670E Aorus Master
Cooling	Noctua NH-D15 SE with offsets
Memory	32GB Team T-Create Expert DDR5 6000 MHz @ CL30-34-34-68
Video Card(s)	Gainward GeForce RTX 4080 Phantom GS
Storage	1TB Solidigm P44 Pro, 2 TB Corsair MP600 Pro, 2TB Kingston KC3000
Display(s)	Acer XV272K LVbmiipruzx 4K@160Hz
Case	Fractal Design Torrent Compact
Audio Device(s)	Corsair Virtuoso SE
Power Supply	be quiet! Pure Power 12 M 850 W
Mouse	Logitech G502 Lightspeed
Keyboard	Corsair K70 Max
Software	Windows 10 Pro
Benchmark Scores	https://valid.x86.fr/yfsd9w

System Name	His & Hers
Processor	R7 5800X/ R7 7950X3D Stock
Motherboard	X670E Aorus Pro X/ROG Crosshair VIII Hero
Cooling	Corsair h150 elite/ Corsair h115i Platinum
Memory	Trident Z5 Neo 6000/ 32 GB 3200 CL14 @3800 CL16 Team T Force Nighthawk
Video Card(s)	Evga FTW 3 Ultra 3080ti/ Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090
Storage	lots of SSD.
Display(s)	A whole bunch OLED, VA, IPS.....
Case	011 Dynamic XL/ Phanteks Evolv X
Audio Device(s)	Arctis Pro + gaming Dac/ Corsair sp 2500/ Logitech G560/Samsung Q990B
Power Supply	Seasonic Ultra Prime Titanium 1000w/850w
Mouse	Logitech G502 Lightspeed/ Logitech G Pro Hero.
Keyboard	Logitech - G915 LIGHTSPEED / Logitech G Pro

System Name	Overlord Mk MLI
Processor	AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D
Motherboard	Gigabyte X670E Aorus Master
Cooling	Noctua NH-D15 SE with offsets
Memory	32GB Team T-Create Expert DDR5 6000 MHz @ CL30-34-34-68
Video Card(s)	Gainward GeForce RTX 4080 Phantom GS
Storage	1TB Solidigm P44 Pro, 2 TB Corsair MP600 Pro, 2TB Kingston KC3000
Display(s)	Acer XV272K LVbmiipruzx 4K@160Hz
Case	Fractal Design Torrent Compact
Audio Device(s)	Corsair Virtuoso SE
Power Supply	be quiet! Pure Power 12 M 850 W
Mouse	Logitech G502 Lightspeed
Keyboard	Corsair K70 Max
Software	Windows 10 Pro
Benchmark Scores	https://valid.x86.fr/yfsd9w

System Name	ab┃ob
Processor	7800X3D┃5800X3D
Motherboard	B650E PG-ITX┃X570 Impact
Cooling	NH-U12A + T30┃AXP120-x67
Memory	64GB 6400CL32┃32GB 3600CL14
Video Card(s)	RTX 4070 Ti Eagle┃RTX A2000
Storage	8TB of SSDs┃1TB SN550
Case	Caselabs S3┃Lazer3D HT5

Processor	Ryzen 7 5800X3D
Motherboard	Gigabyte X570 Aorus Elite
Cooling	Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE
Memory	2x16 GB Crucial Ballistix 3600 CL16 Rev E @ 3600 CL14
Video Card(s)	RTX3080 Ti FE
Storage	SX8200 Pro 1 TB, Plextor M6Pro 256 GB, WD Blue 2TB
Display(s)	LG 34GN850P-B
Case	SilverStone Primera PM01 RGB
Audio Device(s)	SoundBlaster G6 \| Fidelio X2 \| Sennheiser 6XX
Power Supply	SeaSonic Focus Plus Gold 750W
Mouse	Endgame Gear XM1R
Keyboard	Wooting Two HE

Processor	R5 5600X
Motherboard	Asus TUF Gaming X570-Plus
Memory	32 GB 3600 MT/s CL16
Video Card(s)	Sapphire Vega 64
Storage	2x 500 GB SSD, 2x 3 TB HDD
Case	Phanteks P300A
Software	Manjaro Linux, W10 if I have to

System Name	stress-less
Processor	9800X3D @ 5.42GHZ
Motherboard	MSI PRO B650M-A Wifi
Cooling	Thermalright Phantom Spirit EVO
Memory	64GB DDR5 6600 1:2 CL36, FCLK 2200
Video Card(s)	RTX 4090 FE
Storage	2TB WD SN850, 4TB WD SN850X
Display(s)	Alienware 32" 4k 240hz OLED
Case	Jonsbo Z20
Audio Device(s)	Yes
Power Supply	Corsair SF750
Mouse	DeathadderV2 X Hyperspeed
Keyboard	65% HE Keyboard
Software	Windows 11
Benchmark Scores	They're pretty good, nothing crazy.

System Name	The beast and the little runt.
Processor	Ryzen 5 5600X - Ryzen 9 5950X
Motherboard	ASUS ROG STRIX B550-I GAMING - ASUS ROG Crosshair VIII Dark Hero X570
Cooling	Noctua NH-L9x65 SE-AM4a - NH-D15 chromax.black with IPPC Industrial 3000 RPM 120/140 MM fans.
Memory	G.SKILL TRIDENT Z ROYAL GOLD/SILVER 32 GB (2 x 16 GB and 4 x 8 GB) 3600 MHz CL14-15-15-35 1.45 volts
Video Card(s)	GIGABYTE RTX 4060 OC LOW PROFILE - GIGABYTE RTX 4090 GAMING OC
Storage	Samsung 980 PRO 1 TB + 2 TB - Samsung 870 EVO 4 TB - 2 x WD RED PRO 16 GB + WD ULTRASTAR 22 TB
Display(s)	Asus 27" TUF VG27AQL1A and a Dell 24" for dual setup
Case	Phanteks Enthoo 719/LUXE 2 BLACK
Audio Device(s)	Onboard on both boards
Power Supply	Phanteks Revolt X 1200W
Mouse	Logitech G903 Lightspeed Wireless Gaming Mouse
Keyboard	Logitech G910 Orion Spectrum
Software	WINDOWS 10 PRO 64 BITS on both systems
Benchmark Scores	Se more about my 2 in 1 system here: kortlink.dk/2ca4x

Processor	Core i7-13700
Motherboard	MSI Z790 Gaming Plus WiFi
Cooling	Cooler Master RGB Tower cooler
Memory	Crucial Pro 5600 32GB kit OCed to 6600
Video Card(s)	XFX Speedster SWFT309 AMD Radeon RX 6700 XT CORE Gaming
Storage	970 EVO NVMe M.2 500GB,,WD850N 2TB
Display(s)	Samsung 28” 4K monitor
Case	Phantek Eclipse P400S
Audio Device(s)	EVGA NU Audio, Edifier Bookshelf Speakers R1280
Power Supply	EVGA 850 BQ
Mouse	Logitech G502 Hero
Keyboard	Logitech G G413 Silver
Software	Windows 11 Professional v24H2

System Name	Pioneer
Processor	Ryzen 9 9950X
Motherboard	MSI MAG X670E Tomahawk Wifi
Cooling	Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon, Phanteks and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory	128GB (4x 32GB) G.Skill Flare X5 @ DDR5-4000(Running 1:1:1 w/ FCLK)
Video Card(s)	XFX RX 7900 XTX Speedster Merc 310
Storage	Intel 5800X Optane 800GB boot, +2x Crucial P5 Plus 2TB PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs, 1x 2TB Seagate Exos 3.5"
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Case	Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s)	TOSLINK->Schiit Modi MB->Asgard 2 DAC Amp->AKG Pro K712 Headphones or HDMI->B9 OLED
Power Supply	FSP Hydro Ti Pro 850W
Mouse	Logitech G305 Lightspeed Wireless
Keyboard	WASD Code v3 with Cherry Green keyswitches + PBT DS keycaps
Software	Gentoo Linux x64

System Name	My Ryzen 7 7700X Super Computer
Processor	AMD Ryzen 7 7700X
Motherboard	Gigabyte B650 Aorus Elite AX
Cooling	DeepCool AK620 with Arctic Silver 5
Memory	2x16GB G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO DDR5 EXPO (CL30)
Video Card(s)	XFX AMD Radeon RX 7900 GRE
Storage	Samsung 980 EVO 1 TB NVMe SSD (System Drive), Samsung 970 EVO 500 GB NVMe SSD (Game Drive)
Display(s)	Acer Nitro XV272U (DisplayPort) and Acer Nitro XV270U (DisplayPort)
Case	Lian Li LANCOOL II MESH C
Audio Device(s)	On-Board Sound / Sony WH-XB910N Bluetooth Headphones
Power Supply	MSI A850GF
Mouse	Logitech M705
Keyboard	Steelseries
Software	Windows 11 Pro 64-bit
Benchmark Scores	https://valid.x86.fr/liwjs3

Processor	7800x3d
Motherboard	Gigabyte B650 Auros Elite AX
Cooling	Custom Water
Memory	GSKILL 2x16gb 6000mhz Cas 30 with custom timings
Video Card(s)	MSI RX 6750 XT MECH 2X 12G OC
Storage	Adata SX8200 1tb with Windows, Samsung 990 Pro 2tb with games
Display(s)	HP Omen 27q QHD 165hz
Case	ThermalTake P3
Power Supply	SuperFlower Leadex Titanium
Software	Windows 11 64 Bit
Benchmark Scores	CB23: 1811 / 19424 CB24: 1136 / 7687

Processor	Ryzen 9 5900X
Motherboard	Gigabyte X570 Aorus Master
Cooling	ARCTIC Liquid Freezer III 360 A-RGB
Memory	32 GB Ballistix Elite DDR4-3600 CL16
Video Card(s)	XFX 6800 XT Speedster Merc 319 Black
Storage	Sabrent Rocket NVMe 4.0 1TB
Display(s)	LG 27GL850B x 2 / ASUS MG278Q
Case	be quiet! Silent Base 802
Audio Device(s)	Sound Blaster AE-7 / Sennheiser HD 660S
Power Supply	Seasonic Vertex PX-1200
Software	Windows 11 Pro 64

System Name	PCGOD
Processor	AMD FX 8350@ 5.0GHz
Motherboard	Asus TUF 990FX Sabertooth R2 2901 Bios
Cooling	Scythe Ashura, 2×BitFenix 230mm Spectre Pro LED (Blue,Green), 2x BitFenix 140mm Spectre Pro LED
Memory	16 GB Gskill Ripjaws X 2133 (2400 OC, 10-10-12-20-20, 1T, 1.65V)
Video Card(s)	AMD Radeon 290 Sapphire Vapor-X
Storage	Samsung 840 Pro 256GB, WD Velociraptor 1TB
Display(s)	NEC Multisync LCD 1700V (Display Port Adapter)
Case	AeroCool Xpredator Evil Blue Edition
Audio Device(s)	Creative Labs Sound Blaster ZxR
Power Supply	Seasonic 1250 XM2 Series (XP3)
Mouse	Roccat Kone XTD
Keyboard	Roccat Ryos MK Pro
Software	Windows 7 Pro 64

System Name	Computer of Theseus
Processor	Intel i9-12900KS: 50x Pcore multi @ 1.18Vcore (target 1.275V -100mv offset)
Motherboard	EVGA Z690 Classified
Cooling	Noctua NH-D15S, 2xSF MegaCool SF-PF14, 4xNoctua NF-A12x25, 3xNF-A12x15, AquaComputer Splitty9Active
Memory	G-Skill Trident Z5 (32GB) DDR5-6000 C36 F5-6000J3636F16GX2-TZ5RK
Video Card(s)	ASUS PROART RTX 4070 Ti-Super OC 16GB, 2670MHz, 0.93V
Storage	1x Samsung 990 Pro 1TB NVMe (OS), 2x Samsung 970 Evo Plus 2TB (data), ASUS BW-16D1HT (BluRay)
Display(s)	Dell S3220DGF 32" 2560x1440 165Hz Primary, Dell P2017H 19.5" 1600x900 Secondary, Ergotron LX arms.
Case	Lian Li O11 Air Mini
Audio Device(s)	Audiotechnica ATR2100X-USB, El Gato Wave XLR Mic Preamp, ATH M50X Headphones, Behringer 302USB Mixer
Power Supply	Super Flower Leadex Platinum SE 1000W 80+ Platinum White, MODDIY 12VHPWR Cable
Mouse	Zowie EC3-C
Keyboard	Vortex Multix 87 Winter TKL (Gateron G Pro Yellow)
Software	Win 10 LTSC 21H2

Processor	Ryzen 5800X
Motherboard	Asus TUF-Gaming B550-Plus
Cooling	Noctua NH-U14S
Memory	32GB G.Skill Trident Z Neo F4-3600C16D-32GTZNC
Video Card(s)	Sapphire AMD Radeon RX 7900 XTX Nitro+
Storage	HP EX950 512GB + Samsung 970 PRO 1TB
Display(s)	Cooler Master GP27Q
Case	Fractal Design Define R6 Black
Audio Device(s)	Creative Sound Blaster AE-5
Power Supply	Seasonic PRIME Ultra 650W Gold
Mouse	Roccat Kone AIMO Remastered
Software	Windows 10 x64

Processor	Ryzen 7800X3D
Motherboard	ROG STRIX B650E-F GAMING WIFI
Memory	2x16GB G.Skill Flare X5 DDR5-6000 CL36 (F5-6000J3636F16GX2-FX5)
Video Card(s)	INNO3D GeForce RTX™ 4070 Ti SUPER TWIN X2
Storage	2TB Samsung 980 PRO, 4TB WD Black SN850X
Display(s)	42" LG C2 OLED, 27" ASUS PG279Q
Case	Thermaltake Core P5
Power Supply	Fractal Design Ion+ Platinum 760W
Mouse	Corsair Dark Core RGB Pro SE
Keyboard	Corsair K100 RGB
VR HMD	HTC Vive Cosmos

System Name	Gaming System / HTPC-Server
Processor	i7 8700K (@4.8 Ghz All-Core) / R7 5900X
Motherboard	Z370 Aorus Ultra Gaming / MSI B450 Mortar Max
Cooling	CM ML360 / CM ML240L
Memory	16Gb Hynix @3200 MHz / 16Gb Hynix @3000Mhz
Video Card(s)	Zotac 3080 / Colorful 1060
Storage	750G MX300 + 2x500G NVMe / 40Tb Reds + 1Tb WD Blue NVMe
Display(s)	LG 27GN800-B 27'' 2K 144Hz / Sony TV
Case	Xigmatek Aquarius Plus / Corsair Air 240
Audio Device(s)	On Board Realtek
Power Supply	Super Flower Leadex III Gold 750W / Andyson TX-700 Platinum
Mouse	Logitech G502 Hero / K400+
Keyboard	Wooting Two / K400+
Software	Windows 10 x64
Benchmark Scores	Cinebench R15 = 1542 3D Mark Timespy = 9758

RyZen 3000 Boost Issue: What's your take?

RyZen 3000 Boost Issue: What's your take?

AMD bad marketing at it again, false advertising and lies should not be tolerated.

AMD bad marketing alright, they need to inform consumer/media/reviewersbetter

It is fine, this is fine. I am OK with AMD advertising like that because I DON'T CARE

There should be MORE Advertising like this. Necessary evil is needed to beat Intel

MY BLOOD IS RED! SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY AMD

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