AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT

[B-Real]

So what we have learned from the 5000 series CPU and the 6000 series GPU launch is that

-FHD results in CPU benchmarks are not relevant any more (in fact they really weren't earlier too, but for some reason it was important for the blue team)
-NV cards can be UVd to get better power consumption
-NV fans hold on to the very last point they can (RT with only a few games available), when a rival generation supporting RT for the first time is able to match the last gen (first gen RT) flagship green card

Love it, really.

 

[regs]

Could be software scheduler affecting Nvidia performance in DX12 and Vulkan in 1080p? Is if software or hardware being tested?

 

[Fluffmeister]

Certainly an impressive effort from AMD, shame stock levels with these seem to be non-existent too.

 

[Fleurious]

Actually impressed with what AMD has managed to pull off with these cards. Performance is where I expected them to land. I fully expect nvidia to respond with their Ti cards on a better node.

 

[Colddecked]

Do you ?

AMD is doing away with a narrower bus and slower memory, they can always bump those up and gain a considerable chunk of performance just by doing that and nothing more. Also caches scale really well with newer nodes in terms of power, there is a very good chance AMD will trash Nvidia in performance/watt even harder when both get to the next node.

Also, you do realize AMD is probably already working on a future 5nm design by now. Meanwhile I am led to believe Nvidia is figuring out how to bring Ampere to 7nm ? Do I have to explain how things aren't exactly going too well for them if that's the case ?

Seems like Nvidia has just done an Intel style upsy-daisy by screwing up their node situation.

Intel style is a bit harsh, but ya not paying up for TSMC 7nm might have been a mistake... We'll see if Big Navi stock can improve, which has been predicted once AIB cards start rolling in..

 

[anachron]

So what we have learned from the 5000 series CPU and the 6000 series GPU launch is that

-FHD results in CPU benchmarks are not relevant any more (in fact they really weren't earlier too, but for some reason it was important for the blue team)
-NV cards can be UVd to get better power consumption
-NV fans hold on to the very last point they can (RT with only a few games available), when a rival generation supporting RT for the first time is able to match the last gen (first gen RT) flagship green card

Love it, really.

Or you know, regarding the last part, some people just like RT for what it is. A lot of people in this thread have praised AMD for the achievement with this card even if they prefer an nvidia card because of RT. I can't understand why it always end in an AMD vs Nvidia war. I was disappointed with the nvidia choice to go with 8gb of ram on the 3070 just as much as i'm disapointed with the RT performance of the new AMD card.

Edit : for the record, i will quite probably recommend an AMD card for people in my entourage that are not interested in RT.

 

[Gan77]

You have an error in the "AMD description is using Alpha & Omega Semiconductor DrMOS components throughout the VRM".

In fact TDA21472 - Infineon Technologies

 

[Colddecked]

Or you know, regarding the last part, some people just like RT for what it is. A lot of people in this thread have praised AMD for the achievement with this card even if they prefer an nvidia card because of RT. I can't understand why it always end in an AMD vs Nvidia war. I was disappointed with the nvidia choice to go with 8gb of ram on the 3070 just as much as i'm disapointed with the RT performance of the new AMD card.

The difference is, 8gb will always be 8gb while RT performance will likely improve and AMD does have their DLSS like solution in the works which will also help.

 

[horsemama1956]

Even if it's called "RTX" in games in reality it's D3D12 DXR - there's no such thing as "nVidia standards right now on PC though". It's like saying that there are two different DirectX'es for AMD and NVIDIA.

Good lord.

Even if it's called "RTX" in games in reality it's D3D12 DXR - there's no such thing as "nVidia standards right now on PC though". It's like saying that there are two different DirectX'es for AMD and NVIDIA.

Slow down.

You're too focused on a single word. It was called RTX in games because nVidia paid the developers money and helped to implement it so they could market their hardware for this purpose. Like they do with all of their tech, right?

What my initial post was saying is that nVidia themselves rushed RT onto the 20 series so they could pretty much become synonymous with Ray Tracing(which they have) even though they themselves are the only ones implementing it, usually with incentives. Still with me?

As of right now, RTX is what people associate as a standard on PC. Not THE standard, but how nVidia thinks it should work.

A lower setting for cheaper hardware, a medium setting for higher end stuff and finally the ultra setting for their enthusiast market.

In the future, now that RDNA2 is here and new consoles have arrived, we will likely just have a simple setting to enable or disable BUT there will be an RTX setting in specific games(just like PhysX) where buying an nVidia card gets you "better" effects.

Do you understand? The scope of RT we will see on consoles is what PC is going to get since no one makes huge, graphics heavy PC games any more.

RTX will still be a thing. Just a premium thing. I can totally see nVidia releasing GTX cards that do the simpler RT that consoles will target and selling RTX cards that handle a heavier load in nVidia sponsored games(again, like PhysX).

 

[z1n0x]

I fully expect nvidia to respond with their Ti cards on a better node.

That's not how that works. Maybe new stepping with abit better yields and perf/w but it wont be anything major.

 

[Vya Domus]

I can't understand why it always end in an AMD vs Nvidia war. I was disappointed with the nvidia choice to go with 8gb of ram on the 3070 just as much as i'm disapointed with the RT performance of the new AMD card.

I tell you why, because some insist a 50% performance hit so much better than a 60% hit.

No, they're both crap. RT is still not ready for prime time.

 

[anachron]

The difference is, 8gb will always be 8gb while RT performance will likely improve and AMD does have their DLSS like solution in the works which will also help.

Indeed. I do not intend to change my graphic card right now, so if RT performance do improve and the AMD equivalent of DLSS do prove to be worth it when i do, i would most certainly be interested by an AMD graphic card.

 

[kings]

Performance is as expected, in rasterization slightly below 3080 (on average), in RT it loses a lot, but in compensation it´s a little cheaper, has more VRAM and consumes significantly less power.

Overall, it´s a very solid product from AMD, as has not been seen in years. This was long overdue after several disappointments.

In another note, Nvidia definitely messed up going with Samsung. It is not surprising that Nvidia is already placing orders for TSMC 5nm.

 

[N3M3515]

You can overclock a 3080 too...

6800XT OC: +9.1%
RTX 3080 OC: +3.9%

+5% for the radeon, now add a ryzen 5 and a x570 or b550 mobo...

 

[Charcharo]

"Much has been talked about VRAM size during NVIDIA's Ampere launch. The GeForce RTX 3080 offers 10 GB VRAM, which I still think is plenty for today and the near future. Planning many years ahead with hardware purchases makes no sense, especially when it comes to VRAM—you'll run out of shading power long before memory becomes a problem. GTX 1060 will not drive 4K, no matter if it has 3 GB or 6 GB. Game developers will certainly make use of the added memory capacity on the new consoles, we're talking 8 GB here, as a large portion of the console's total memory is used for the OS, game and game data. I think I'd definitely be interested in a RX 6700 Series with just 8 GB VRAM, at more affordable pricing. On the other hand, AMD's card is cheaper than NVIDIA's product, and has twice the VRAM at the same time, so really no reason to complain."

Wizzard, no offence, but this part is wrong.
There is already a different between 8 GB and 10/11/12 GB in DOOM Eternal at 4K and Wolfenstein 2 with manually enabled maximum settings (above Mein Leben) at 1440p.

For people who mod, the actual PCMR users, not just the ones who think opening an ini file every 5 years makes them hardcore, this does matter too.

More VRAM is always good. Personally, 8GB is obsolete for me for 1440p and 4K. 10GB is not but its close since I can break it if I want to. But not obsolete. Still, just because you never used something does not mean that it isnt important.

 

[W1zzard]

Split them up and have RT Off only and RT On only?

Or if not, have some color scheme that allows to easily grasp when RT is on and when not.

Definitely preferred, might be good enough so graphs do not have to be split.

It's immediately noticeable.

and RT charts updated once again. I like, thanks for the feedback

 

[B-Real]

Or you know, regarding the last part, some people just like RT for what it is. A lot of people in this thread have praised AMD for the achievement with this card even if they prefer an nvidia card because of RT. I can't understand why it always end in an AMD vs Nvidia war. I was disappointed with the nvidia choice to go with 8gb of ram on the 3070 just as much as i'm disapointed with the RT performance of the new AMD card.

Edit : for the record, i will quite probably recommend an AMD card for people in my entourage that are not interested in RT.

There is no problem when someone says he is disappointed with the RT performance (in my opinion, matching a flagship first gen rival with the first gen non-flagship card is not disappointing or not in a way it is mentioned) but in other aspects it's a great card, and of course these people are not the ones to whom I addressed my comment.

 

[steen]

If you need the best RT performance RIGHT NOW, then Nvidia is clearly the way to go. That being said, I won't be surprised if after a year or two, RT performance of the 6800 and 6800xt is noticeably better than 2080ti.

A lot will depend on which arch is better suited to inline RT with future titles. I'd hazard most titles are optimised for Nv ATM (obviously) where run-time optimisation will be trickier for AMD. I guess if AMD have a stable software stack they can build on performance from there.

G6X is NVIDIA exclusive from what I understand, also AMD's board partners cannot change memory technologies

Exclusive insofar as implementing the tech in their memory controllers. I think AMD is unlikely to use GDDR6X even for their next gen.

Good performance, however it seems the infinity cache approach to accelerating memory performance can't keep up with 4k performance.

It's a bit early to tell & may still require driver tuning. It may be a case of frametime being more alu limited @ 4k giving Ampere the advantge.

I hope a board partner attempts a gddr6x version just to see if y theory is correct.

Not possible.

 

[okbuddy]

While being 9% cheaper, I consider that a win!
Certainly, they might just end up being the same (and ridiculously high) price.

wait, if AMD keeps fixing the drivers

will 6800xt finally be as good as 3080, like 0% margin

 

[Jinxed]

Do you ?

AMD is doing away with a narrower bus and slower memory, they can always bump those up and gain a considerable chunk of performance just by doing that and nothing more. Also caches scale really well with newer nodes in terms of power, there is a very good chance AMD will trash Nvidia in performance/watt even harder when both get to the next node.

Also, you do realize AMD is probably already working on a future 5nm design by now. Meanwhile I am led to believe Nvidia is figuring out how to bring Ampere to 7nm ? Do I have to explain how things aren't exactly going too well for them if that's the case ?

Seems like Nvidia has just done an Intel style upsy-daisy by screwing up their node situation.

Actuall you don't. AMD in fact HAD to go for a feature like Infinity Cache. It was not an option, it was a requirement. It's because of their raytracing solution. If you look at the RDNA2 presentation slides, there is a clear line that says:
"4 texture OR ray ops/clock per CU"

https://www.techpowerup.com/img/m7WjdguDI7kJLI8C.jpg

Now what do you think that means? I'll enlighten you. Remember there is such a thing as the bounding volume hierarchy tree (BVH). That is a big chunk of data, as it holds the bounding boxed for all objects in the scene to help optimize ray intersections. Unfortunately for AMD, as you see in the slide, their cores cannot perform raytracing operations at the same time as texturing operations, unlike in Nvidia's design. Even worse, they are using the same memory (as AMD repeatedly stated) as they use for texture data. If AMD GPUs did not have the Infinity Cache, they would be in huge trouble, as their per-core cache would keep being invalidated all the time, having to dump the BVH data and replacing them with texture data (and vice versa). And you can see the Big Navi paying the price for that in 4k and raytracing.

 

[birdie]

More VRAM is always good.

More VRAM is always more expensive. Specially for NVIDIA which uses exclusive to it GDDR6X.

FTFY.

And these two games are outliers and I presume could have been fixed if they had been released recently. Lastly good luck finding any visual differences between Uber and Ultra textures on your 4K monitor.

 

[B-Real]

More VRAM is always more expensive. Specially for NVIDIA which uses exclusive to it GDDR6X.

And why is it our problem? NV chose this way, AMD chose another. Anyway, the 3080 probably won't have a problem with its 10 GB of VRAM, but the 3070 will.

 

[regs]

"Much has been talked about VRAM size during NVIDIA's Ampere launch. The GeForce RTX 3080 offers 10 GB VRAM, which I still think is plenty for today and the near future. Planning many years ahead with hardware purchases makes no sense, especially when it comes to VRAM—you'll run out of shading power long before memory becomes a problem. GTX 1060 will not drive 4K, no matter if it has 3 GB or 6 GB. Game developers will certainly make use of the added memory capacity on the new consoles, we're talking 8 GB here, as a large portion of the console's total memory is used for the OS, game and game data. I think I'd definitely be interested in a RX 6700 Series with just 8 GB VRAM, at more affordable pricing. On the other hand, AMD's card is cheaper than NVIDIA's product, and has twice the VRAM at the same time, so really no reason to complain."

Wizzard, no offence, but this part is wrong.
There is already a different between 8 GB and 10/11/12 GB in DOOM Eternal at 4K and Wolfenstein 2 with manually enabled maximum settings (above Mein Leben) at 1440p.

For people who mod, the actual PCMR users, not just the ones who think opening an ini file every 5 years makes them hardcore, this does matter too.

More VRAM is always good. Personally, 8GB is obsolete for me for 1440p and 4K. 10GB is not but its close since I can break it if I want to. But not obsolete. Still, just because you never used something does not mean that it isnt important.

10 GB does affect DOOM Eternal performance a bit, but in 8K. In 4K 8 GB is more than sufficient for upcoming years.

Обзор видеокарт NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3080/3090 Founders Edition и тесты на 8К-экране

Обзоры видеокарт NVIDIA 30-й серии, которые мы опубликовали в прошлом месяце, отклонились от привычной схемы.

3dnews.ru

 

[Cheeseball]

-NV cards can be UVd to get better power consumption

To add clarity to this, they can be undervolted (I would assume .850mV as I'm at .825mV for a 1% loss) to just slightly below the peak gaming power usage of the 6800 XT (284W) and still retain stock performance. Samsung 8nm is definitely inferior to TSMC 7nm for sure, but not by much.

I'd like to see someone try undervolting (not overclocking) the 6800 XT. I would be seriously impressed if it can get below 240W.

 

[Chomiq]

6800 is surprisingly in stock. 6800 XT - not so much, but price matches 3080 FE.