NVIDIA Project Beyond GTC Keynote Address: Expect the Expected (RTX 4090)

[Hofnaerrchen]

Only mentioning efficiency and not actual power consumption is a bad sign for end customers, while it is good news for the professional sector. The cards - already coming with a nice markup - will be even more expensive taking their power needs into consideration. Only good news: Right now it's just an announcement. Undervolting testing will show if this generation might still be worthy upgrade. Time will tell. Right now RTX 4000 is rather disappointing.

 

[cvaldes]

Only mentioning efficiency and not actual power consumption is a bad sign. The cards - already coming with a nice markup - will be even more expensive taking their power needs into consideration. Only good news: Right now it's just an announcement. Undervolting testing will show if this generation might still be worthy upgrade. Time will tell. Right now RTX 4000 is rather disappointing.

There are published specifications for power.

As is usual in all of these kind of presentations, NVIDIA decides on what to highlight and what to relegate to a press release or specification page on the website. It's not like they're going to prattle on for 4-5 hours about every single data point.

And any power specifications they publish would be for reference models or their limited Founders Edition cards.

I don't know if you realize this but AIB partners often build models that exceed NVIDIA's standard specifications. NVIDIA builds in a buffer to left people extract extra performance.

It's really up to third-party reviewers to test individual cards to provide more useful real-world performance metrics. We have to wait a few days/weeks for those to trickle in.

 

[RandallFlagg]

I don't disagree with your take because neither of us is wrong or right everyone has to do their own research and decide based on a number of factors if a 900 gpu is right for them. A car is a necessity for most people a gpu is a commodity and much less important but I don't necessarily look at cars any different I decide what I want to spend and buy whatever offers me the most im that price range.

Oh everyone does that, but there are a lot of analysis people do off the cuff like the housing example. Go back to the 1960s and houses were 1300 sq ft, but people will compare average price to today where the average is upwards of 2200 sqft. All these companies (for everything) keep trying to move upscale, and basically ignore the lower end. If I were to put this in a social context, which I don't normally like to do, they are catering to the upper middle class and ignoring the bottom 70% or so.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Only mentioning efficiency and not actual power consumption is a bad sign. The cards - already coming with a nice markup - will be even more expensive taking their power needs into consideration. Only good news: Right now it's just an announcement. Undervolting testing will show if this generation might still be worthy upgrade. Time will tell. Right now RTX 4000 is rather disappointing.

Well 450w for a 4090 that doubles the performance of a 4090ti at the same wattage is impressive gen on gen my guess is the 4080s will be 350-400w for the 16GB varient and 300-350w for the 12GB varient... I am a little puzzled that the 4090 only seems around 20-30% faster than the 4080 16GB card though the specs seem much higher with around 60% more cuda cores.

I'm also very interested in how the 12GB varient performs and if it warrants it's 900 price tag.

Maybe I missed it in the keynote but I'm also wondering if DLSS 3.0 is exclusive to Ada

 

[V3ctor]

When does GTA 6 come out? I mean... At first I was convinced on selling my 3080 and getting a 4080. But usually GTAs push HW to the limit at their own time....

So.... Maybe I'll sit this one out and keep playing on my power sipping 320W 3080

 

[ARF]

Performance:

NVIDIA introduces GeForce RTX 4090/4080 series, RTX 4090 launches October 12th for 1599 USD - VideoCardz.com

 

[AnotherReader]

The difference between the flagship and the next best GPU is the greatest it has ever been:

Well 450w for a 4090 that doubles the performance of a 4090ti at the same wattage is impressive gen on gen my guess is the 4080s will be 350-400w for the 16GB varient and 300-350w for the 12GB varient... I am a little puzzled that the 4090 only seems around 20-30% faster than the 4080 16GB card though the specs seem much higher with around 60% more cuda cores.

I'm also very interested in how the 12GB varient performs and if it warrants it's 900 price tag.

Maybe I missed it in the keynote but I'm also wondering if DLSS 3.0 is exclusive to Ada

I think you're mistaken. The 4080 will be much slower than the 4090. I'll quote from the story above this one on the front page:

The RTX 4090 is the world's fastest gaming GPU ... In full ray-traced games, the RTX 4090 with DLSS 3 is up to 4x faster compared to last generation's RTX 3090 Ti with DLSS 2. It is also up to 2x faster in today's games while maintaining the same 450 W power consumption.

The RTX 4080 16 GB has 9,728 CUDA cores and 16 GB of high-speed Micron GDDR6X memory, and with DLSS 3 is 2x as fast in today's games as the GeForce RTX 3080 Ti and more powerful than the GeForce RTX 3090 Ti at lower power

Notice that they only say it's faster than the 3090 Ti at lower power and only 2x faster than the 3080 Ti if you use DLSS 3 whereas the 4090 is 2x faster than the 3090 Ti in today's games without DLSS 3. This suggests that the 4080 16 GB isn't more than 25-30% faster than the 3090 Ti which makes it much slower than the 4090. Any one spending that much money should go for the 4090. The 4080 16 GB is only to upsell whales to the 4090.

 

[Chomiq]

Lol, those prices are nuts.

 

[ARF]

Lol, those prices are nuts.

There is always a solution - don't buy.

Another thing to mention is that RTX 4080 12 GB is a different card, not the same as the 16 GB version.

Quite a weird naming, they should call it RTX 4070 12 GB or something...

 

[oxrufiioxo]

The difference between the flagship and the next best GPU is the greatest it has ever been:

I think you're mistaken. The 4080 will be much slower than the 4090. I'll quote from the story above this one on the front page:


Notice that they only say it's faster than the 3090 Ti at lower power and only 2x faster than the 3080 Ti if you use DLSS 3 whereas the 4090 is 2x faster than the 3090 Ti in today's games without DLSS 3. This suggests that the 4080 16 GB isn't more than 25-30% faster than the 3090 Ti which makes it much slower than the 4090. Any one spending that much money should go for the 4090. The 4080 16 GB is only to upsell whales to the 4090.

That's why I can't wait for reviews and what real world performance looks like no dlss vs no dlss not a 3090ti without dlss vs a 4090 with dlss 3.0 which is a stupid comparison.

 

[cvaldes]

When does GTA 6 come out? I mean... At first I was convinced on selling my 3080 and getting a 4080. But usually GTAs push HW to the limit at their own time....

So.... Maybe I'll sit this one out and keep playing on my power sipping 320W 3080

Perhaps you should wait until GTA 6 comes out. However, I'm pretty sure that Rockstar realizes that if GTA 6 only runs acceptably on a 4090, they aren't going to sell many copies.

Say, doesn't GTA usually debut on consoles?

 

[gasolina]

the 3090ti struggle at 1080p with cyberpunk ( not even reach 80-100 fps ) so the 4090 might be apple to play at 1440p 80-100 fps RT on . This is my best bet still nvidia & amd can't provide anything with ray tracing at 4k above 80 fps until 2025

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Perhaps you should wait until GTA 6 comes out. However, I'm pretty sure that Rockstar realizes that if GTA 6 only runs acceptably on a 4090, they aren't going to sell many copies.

Say, doesn't GTA usually debut on consoles?

Yeah, with a pc port a year later with minor improvements.

 

[RandallFlagg]

... the 4090 is 2x faster than the 3090 Ti in today's games without DLSS 3...

That's the comment they made that I'm wondering if it translates to other SKUs.

I doubt it, for some of the reasons you stated. But if it does, then it'll be huge. It would imply that at 4K (which they're likely talking about) a 4060 would perform like a 3080, and a 4070 would outperform anything from Ampere.

But if they follow their standard pattern for the last couple of releases, it is more likely a 4060 will get a 30% bump, meaning it will perform like a 3060 Ti at 4K.

 

[neatfeatguy]

Can't say I'm impressed. I'll happily keep playing with my 3080 and she should last me a good 5+ years, like my 980Ti did. By the time I need to move on to something new, if there aren't artificial GPU shortages again, I'll be looking to go with AMD or possibly Intel (if they decide to stick around and keep at it).

 

[cvaldes]

Yeah, with a pc port a year later with minor improvements.

So, if GTA 6 (hypothetically) debuts in 2023 followed by a PC port in 2014, it would be a PC title based on console hardware that debuted in late 2020, nearly four year old graphics architecture by then.

 

[V3ctor]

Perhaps you should wait until GTA 6 comes out. However, I'm pretty sure that Rockstar realizes that if GTA 6 only runs acceptably on a 4090, they aren't going to sell many copies.

Say, doesn't GTA usually debut on consoles?

If you want to push for maximum at 4K you can have acceptable FPS...

I remember I had 2x HD7970 Matrix Platinum to run GTA V at maximum graphics...

 

[ARF]

That's why I can't wait for reviews and what real world performance looks like no dlss vs no dlss not a 3090ti without dlss vs a 4090 with dlss 3.0 which is a stupid comparison.

It's not about the reviews, maybe nvidia leaves an empty slot for a card targeted against the imminent Radeon RX 7800 XT launch later in November.

the 3090ti struggle at 1080p with cyberpunk ( not even reach 80-100 fps ) so the 4090 might be apple to play at 1440p 80-100 fps RT on . This is my best bet still nvidia & amd can't provide anything with ray tracing at 4k above 80 fps until 2025

You can always lower the settings and game at 4K!

 

[Valantar]

Definitely agree but everything is getting more expensive unfortunately cars, phones, electricity, food.... GPUs aren't immune to this and personally I'd rather them go all out doubling performance vs giving us 35% more performance at the same price and calling it a flagship. I'm as happy about the pricing as everyone else but I also try to be releastic. Again once reviews come out and competing RDNA3 cards are released I'll decide how good or bad these cards are at a given price.

True - but most of those other industries haven't been driving up prices for years already, padding out margins (at least not to the degree that GPU makers have). So those industries are - to some extent - driving up prices due to higher costs and needing to maintain some semblance of stability, while GPUs are seeing price hike on price hike.

Of course this also comes down to GPUs and PC gaming becoming interesting to more people, including more rich people, and thus addressing a broader (and wealthier) market, plus a whole heap of other factors. But it's undeniable that GPU makers' margins have been increasing rapidly in the last few years.

I'm personally rooting for much better priced amd cards I'm also not holding my breath.

Same here. I'd be happy to see that, but not surprised if they kept pace, sadly.

 

[cvaldes]

If you want to push for maximum at 4K you can have acceptable FPS...

I remember I had 2x HD7970 Matrix Platinum to run GTA V at maximum graphics...

Rockstar will write GTA 6 so it runs well on Xbox Series and PS5. The title will make most of its revenue from console sales.

My guess is that the later PC port will run pretty well on mid-tier graphics cards. After all, who would want to play it on a PC using an $800 graphics card if it's only marginally better graphics-wise than a $500 console?

 

[Dux]

$200 price increase from RTX 3090 to 4090. Greedvidia at it again.

 

[GerKNG]

i always love new tech. the 4090 looks really good... but damn selling a 4070 as a 4080 to justify 80 class pricing is ridiculous.

let me guess. an actual board partner card in europe after taxes costs like 2200€+...

 

[Dimitriman]

Prices are fine, I expected $2000 or $2500 for 4090

Hah, no, not for me. Jensen is completely out of touch with reality. 899/1199 for 4080? I guess the "layering on top of Ampere" is now complete. Personally, I don't care how good these cards are, if Nvidia is making me pay 900 bucks for the entry high end, I'm out. I can skip this gen.

 

[cvaldes]

i always love new tech. the 4090 looks really good... but damn selling a 4070 as a 4080 to justify 80 class pricing is ridiculous.

let me guess. an actual board partner card in europe after taxes costs like 2200€+...

I really think it's ill advised to pass judgment on new PC hardware (that hasn't been reviewed) simply based on the nomenclature/model number pattern. Especially since NVIDIA has frequently changed how they use these model numbers.

A wiser approach would be to wait for third-party PC reviewers to assess performance and then decide yourself on the value proposition that each product has in your market.

I've only visited Germany as a tourist so I don't know if residents have different ideas about how to buy things there. But that would seem to be a more sensible strategy than to look at a model number on a box.

At least here in the USA, Joe Consumer will heavily lean toward whatever is cheaper. Today's cards aren't mass market models though. Joe Consumer buys Toyota Celicas not Mercedes-Benz S600 or whatever.

 

[grammar_phreak]

Prices are in line with what?
The last xx80 tier card was $699.

About a week or two ago, rumors for the 4070 disappeared then reappeared as the 12gb 4080. Make no mistake, this is a renamed 4070 with a higher pricetag.

I expected the 4090 to be $2000 and the 16gb 4080 to be about $1000.....but I see what Nvidia did there. Why buy an AIB 16gb 4080 when a 4090 FE will be just $100-200 more?

Nvidia is trying to grab as much money as they can until worldwide economic conditions take a plunge. Also, Shareholders don't know any better and they think high prices means Nvidia has a really good product that can command such a high price.