Ryzen Owners Zen Garden

[freeagent]

It really is a nice CPU if you don't need the horsepower 12 and 16 cores provide. And because you can't really overclock, you will end up with a very quiet system. I find it to be a very easy CPU to cool for 99% of the tasks it will see. Of course, there is always that 1% that will push it, but almost no one ever goes there.

 

[Nordic]

It really is a nice CPU if you don't need the horsepower 12 and 16 cores provide. And because you can't really overclock, you will end up with a very quiet system. I find it to be a very easy CPU to cool for 99% of the tasks it will see. Of course, there is always that 1% that will push it, but almost no one ever goes there.

I have a 5950x almost entirely for BOINC. I don't need 16 cores. I like to generate big numbers. A 5800x3d does have a significant performance edge in certain games. Even 50% more FPS.

 

[dont whant to set it"']

I expect the AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D to be a gimp(le2: /thorn) in benchmark charts for both camps , for at least one more gen of cpus to be released by the main two camps*. * In some gaming benchmarks/usage in games/odd computational thingy.

le1:
Started an AM4 build with the Ryzen 3 3300X, onto a Ryzen 7 5800X(witch I fixed till it was broken), now the 3D suffix variant. Gaming wise I had headaches trying to game the same with a i7 7700K(backup rig) when I still had the 5800x in good working order.

 

[tabascosauz]

I have a 5950x almost entirely for BOINC. I don't need 16 cores. I like to generate big numbers. A 5800x3d does have a significant performance edge in certain games. Even 50% more FPS.

In terms of gaming performance you already know what to expect. Though, I will say, the performance really exposes those games that are truly terribly made (that will stutter even with a 5800X3D). With bigger app launches (e.g. Photoshop or Premiere, not Windows Explorer), the 5800X3D can feel a bit slower due to the loss of 500MHz+ of boost. In general use it's not exactly mindblowing if you're coming from a 5800X/5900X/5950X that can do 5GHz.

If you do plan on doing all-core with the 5800X3D on an air cooler, you probably will want to limit power and set Curve Optimizer (the latter of which doesn't do anything for nT temperatures on other Zen 3) because they will bring temps down significantly. Chances are even with a dual tower you will hit 90C out of the box on all-core.

But because it's all locked, you can either use software (PBO2 Tuner) and manually set your settings on each boot/make a Task Scheduler task for boot, or make/use a modded AGESA 1207 BIOS if one exists for your board. Otherwise your settings all go back to stock upon reboot.

 

[Mussels]

The main key to the x3D is that you dont need new hardware, and the only times the newer CPU's are surpassing it are:

200FPS+ (or even higher)
200W+


Seeing the x3D gaming at high FPS with no lows, and at ~40W is something these new CPU's just dont approach

 

[Nordic]

One game I play has poor fps no matter the hardware. It is especially cpu bound. Many players are reporting massive gains. Intel and amd's latest cannot compete. For example:

 

[tabascosauz]

Note to self...........don't do as reviewers do, and swap Ryzen CPUs without giving it a clean install..........

Been trying to chase down an intermittent (every 5-10 seconds or so) stutter in most my games ever since I made the 5800X3D swap. But the real motivation came from getting the MWII campaign early access yesterday and finding that the game ran like complete shit for some reason, tearing my hair out trying to solve the stuttering.

Clean installed 22H2 today. MWII is smooth|as|butter. Still have yet to test the other games. It looks like I need to do Timespy again.

I don't run gunk like iCUE or CAM. I don't run RGB software. I don't run Armoury Crate. Not sure what was causing this crap. Reinstalling games didn't help. Different drivers didn't help. Changing up my CO didn't help. B-die wasn't the culprit either. Board wasn't the culprit either.

It just goes to show that there's more to it than benchmark scores (scored respectably in Timespy and avg fps is good in all games). I guess the real 5800X3D experience starts NOW...

 

[Mussels]

One game I play has poor fps no matter the hardware. It is especially cpu bound. Many players are reporting massive gains. Intel and amd's latest cannot compete. For example:

It's the one example the x3D smashes ahead of everything else

I'm also seeing gains in older CPU bound titles (mostly DX9 RTS games) that understandably modern reviews dont cover

 

[tabascosauz]

Something dropped 1.5ns off score, but I only trimmed tRFC by 5ns and dropped tRC a bit. Nothing that should account for that kind of difference. Maybe was still that old bad windows install that was holding me back.

Things look more normal now. Off to do some TM5 and superpi

 

[Mussels]

I just moved to OpenRGB - i missed they have beta/pre-release builds and they added support for lian-li and fixed a crash bug i was experiencing, so now i'm gunna re-test with those uninstalled vs installed but quit

It's damn nice having software that lets me set all the hardware lighting profiles with a low resource footprint

Spoiler: it wasnt synapse

Is razer bad, vs all the competing softwares? No i think it's the leanest there is - but it's still behind this.

Since i dont have razer headphones etc, i dont miss anything by not having synapse installed


Lemme do a before and after with AIDA....



Before: Everything quite except their background services
L-connect 3 and razer synapse installed

L-connect removed: (basically the same - it was EXTREMELY heavy when opened upto 15% CPU but not bad when closed)

L-connect + synapse removed:

At least i can vouch for Synapse being low on resources, even fully active and running it has no performance impact. everythings within run to run variance.

Edit: Oh my TRFC is at 1064, thanks for being shite at auto detecting that one!

Time to try that out again at 1933/1866 and see if 704 still works or not (the lowest that worked on the 5800x at 1900/3800)

That helped

No clock stretching, no throttling, 4.45GHz R23 load (max speed for these)
114W is something i hope i can tweak lower, without losing performance

 

[wolf]

3700X was my first Ryzen, moved that on for a 5900X

I've decided, and already ordered a 5800X3D now, that'll tide me over beautifully till likely Zen 5 X3D. I couldn't avoid the temptation and am really looking forward to seeing those dips smooth out.

Bonus points for 3 CPU's on the same board AMD, well done.

 

[Mussels]

The only thing left that may hurt benchmark performance (but not gaming) is HWinfo itself - 0.6%-1% CPU spikes as it reads data.

Wolf: it went beyond 3, we had 1000, 2000, 3000 and 5000 for mainstream, as well as the G series chips
We also had the 4000 OEM only series, and if you count the less popular ones like the athlons they had quite a lot of different CPU's

 

[wolf]

@Mussels oh absolutely, I know that some boards basically (and eventually, somewhat not without some fiasco) got support from Ryzen 1000 all the way to a 5950x or 5800X3D and everything in-between, my comment was just praising that I personally got 3 CPU's across the same X570 board.

If I had my time again though, I'd have picked an Asus or MSI board, not Gigabyte - and not bought the 5900X, I should have bought either a 5600X/5800X or waited.

 

[tabascosauz]

3700X was my first Ryzen, moved that on for a 5900X

I've decided, and already ordered a 5800X3D now, that'll tide me over beautifully till likely Zen 5 X3D. I couldn't avoid the temptation and am really looking forward to seeing those dips smooth out.

Bonus points for 3 CPU's on the same board AMD, well done.

3700X>5900X>5800X3D good call bro, exact same over here. More and more modded 1206/1207 BIOSes being released on OCN and elsewhere now; now we got PBO and CO BIOS support on X3D for ROG, Strix and most MSI boards. I think ASRock as well. Haven't heard anything about Gigabyte yet but I'm sure someone will make one if you ask.

 

[wolf]

3700X>5900X>5800X3D good call bro, exact same over here

And you found the 5900X to 5800X3D jump compelling? I was pushed over the edge because I had the itch to upgrade something, can't justify a 4090, not wanting Intel's 13th gen at the end of that CPU sockets support, and not wanting AM5 at the start of it's support - bolstered by DDR5 being expensive.

I'm not expecting night and day differences, but cancelling out dips and blips in gameplay would be amazing already, and a boost in some notoriously CPU limited/heavy games would be nice, MSFS2020 and Spiderman w/RT come to mind.

 

[tabascosauz]

And you found the 5900X to 5800X3D jump compelling? I was pushed over the edge because I had the itch to upgrade something, can't justify a 4090, not wanting Intel's 13th gen at the end of that CPU sockets support, and not wanting AM5 at the start of it's support - bolstered by DDR5 being expensive.

I'm not expecting night and day differences, but cancelling out dips and blips in gameplay would be amazing already, and a boost in some notoriously CPU limited/heavy games would be nice, MSFS2020 and Spiderman w/RT come to mind.

It really really depends on the game. Due to a couple reasons I'm still in the process of measuring the real extent of the improvement. I just clean installed again today.

I hear MSFS is one of those big jumps for the 5800X3D. So far for me War Thunder, Insurgency Sandstorm, Risk of Rain 2 have seen some big gains. Still some gains in MW and SC2 but smaller. DCS has not been an impressive showing so far, but still too early to tell. Still have to test some important titles like Arma.

Been playing MW2 campaign this week but the game is still buggy as hell, performance a far cry from MW, can't tell yet.

For me the big thing is the CPU not hogging frigging 90-140W in gaming. Usually gaming around 35-70W now. It's a big gap under load (UPS draw down from 530W+ to about 450W tops).

 

[igralec84]

I bought DDR5 5600 CL40 because it was in stock and around 40€ cheaper than 6000 CL36 (120€ cheaper than 6400 CL32), then set the primary timings to the ones that 6000 CL36 have (36-38-38-145) and bumped voltage from 1.25v to 1.35v and that's that? Change 8 things in BIOS manually compared to just select the EXPO profile and save 40-100€?

Need to check if Kingston Fury Beast and Renegade use different chips, because Renegade only has CL32 at 6000 and 6400, can try those clocks and timings too just for laughs

EDIT: tried Fury Renegade's 6000 CL32 settings 32-38-38-128 and gained 1-2% score in Passmark memory benchmark, CB23 multi, CPU-Z and Geekbench. Not sure if it's stable though, but hasn't crashed yet, maybe some 3Dmark or Forza Horizon 5 should do the trick

 

[wolf]

@tabascosauz - much appreciated, certainly comes with many benefits and should never be a regression in games with crazy good 1% low gains and reduced power/heat.

 

[Mussels]

And you found the 5900X to 5800X3D jump compelling? I was pushed over the edge because I had the itch to upgrade something, can't justify a 4090, not wanting Intel's 13th gen at the end of that CPU sockets support, and not wanting AM5 at the start of it's support - bolstered by DDR5 being expensive.

I'm not expecting night and day differences, but cancelling out dips and blips in gameplay would be amazing already, and a boost in some notoriously CPU limited/heavy games would be nice, MSFS2020 and Spiderman w/RT come to mind.

my brother got the 5900x right before i got the x3D, for pure gaming the 3D is a no brainer. Less wattage, lower power used, colder, faster.

He does some photo editing and the 5900x still maxes out a fair bit, so it's fair to say if you do MORE than gaming - get the extra cores.

 

[AusWolf]

Hi guys.

I'm looking at two motherboards for an AM5 build.

• The Asus TUF Gaming B650M-Plus Wifi is only available on pre-order for the 16th Nov. I've used Asus TUF boards for the last couple of years. I love their robust design and easy-to-use BIOS.
• My other option is the MSi Pro B650M-A Wifi which could be at my doorstep tomorrow. It's 10 quid cheaper as well, but I can't find any info on its power design and BIOS quality.

What do you guys think? Is it worth to wait 2 weeks for the Asus TUF, or am I safe with the MSi Pro? I only want to use it with a 7700X and maybe upgrade to an X3D later. I'm not shy to turn on Eco mode, either.

 

[Mussels]

Go for whatever board has some in-depth details on the VRMs

I've been burned, and seen too many others burned by "good" brands - even my good x570 had shitty chipset cooling, while we've had some seriously amazing and seriously terrible boards from MSI launched with the same chipset

 

[AusWolf]

Go for whatever board has some in-depth details on the VRMs

I've been burned, and seen too many others burned by "good" brands - even my good x570 had shitty chipset cooling, while we've had some seriously amazing and seriously terrible boards from MSI launched with the same chipset

Well, the Asus is definitely 14-phase. The MSi one seems to be at least 12-phase from the pictures, but with no data on the web page, I can't be sure. I couldn't find any review on it, either. I'm just wondering if it actually matters if I'm only using it with a 7700X with no overclock.

 

[Mussels]

Well, the Asus is definitely 14-phase. The MSi one seems to be at least 12-phase from the pictures, but with no data on the web page, I can't be sure. I couldn't find any review on it, either. I'm just wondering if it actually matters if I'm only using it with a 7700X with no overclock.

MSI had that board advertised as 16 phase that turned out to be 4 phase with doublers, or something equally shitty if those numbers arent quite right
someone here on TPU had theirs go bang with a 5900x, if i can find the thread...

Edit: nope not yet, it had an unusual name which isnt helping me find it

 

[tabascosauz]

MSI had that board advertised as 16 phase that turned out to be 4 phase with doublers, or something equally shitty if those numbers arent quite right
someone here on TPU had theirs go bang with a 5900x, if i can find the thread...

Edit: nope not yet, it had an unusual name which isnt helping me find it

Wouldn't 16 be a quadrupler? Haven't seen those ever since Z77.

The X570 Pro Carbon was the problem child that prompted replacement by the Unify boards, but MSI hasn't slipped up since then. 4-phase with doublers into 4C024/4C029.

If anything, the Pro Carbon was just badly designed. All of MSI's non-DrMOS/SPS boards still use 4C029, it's a stout MOSFET and the 4-phase doubled or lo side doubled Vcore setup works well for all AM4 CPUs, and shouldn't have ran that hot.

Hi guys.

I'm looking at two motherboards for an AM5 build.

• The Asus TUF Gaming B650M-Plus Wifi is only available on pre-order for the 16th Nov. I've used Asus TUF boards for the last couple of years. I love their robust design and easy-to-use BIOS.
• My other option is the MSi Pro B650M-A Wifi which could be at my doorstep tomorrow. It's 10 quid cheaper as well, but I can't find any info on its power design and BIOS quality.

What do you guys think? Is it worth to wait 2 weeks for the Asus TUF, or am I safe with the MSi Pro? I only want to use it with a 7700X and maybe upgrade to an X3D later. I'm not shy to turn on Eco mode, either.

Since Z690 most boards have gotten rid of discretes entirely, so now you're just picking based on phase count, heatsink size, and parts.

Asus is using some midrange DrMOS parts, but the heatsink surface area looks out of this world. Asus is also spacing out the phases as is habit for them.

Can't find info on what MSI is using but all but guaranteed to still be DrMOS and I'd bet it's in the same performance class as Asus' 60A parts.

At 142W, barring unforeseeable design mishaps (eg. X570 Pro Carbon), it doesn't matter at all which board you choose. Both doubly overkill for what you use. I'd choose based on feature set and which BIOS you prefer.

I hope Asus isn't still removing BIOS settings on their TUF and Strix for no good reason.

 

[AusWolf]

MSI had that board advertised as 16 phase that turned out to be 4 phase with doublers, or something equally shitty if those numbers arent quite right
someone here on TPU had theirs go bang with a 5900x, if i can find the thread...

Edit: nope not yet, it had an unusual name which isnt helping me find it

Wouldn't 16 be a quadrupler? Haven't seen those ever since Z77.

The X570 Pro Carbon was the problem child that prompted replacement by the Unify boards, but MSI hasn't slipped up since then. 4-phase with doublers into 4C024/4C029.

If anything, the Pro Carbon was just badly designed. All of MSI's non-DrMOS/SPS boards still use 4C029, it's a stout MOSFET and the 4-phase doubled or lo side doubled Vcore setup works well for all AM4 CPUs, and shouldn't have ran that hot.



Since Z690 most boards have gotten rid of discretes entirely, so now you're just picking based on phase count, heatsink size, and parts.

Asus is using some midrange DrMOS parts, but the heatsink surface area looks out of this world. Asus is also spacing out the phases as is habit for them.

Can't find info on what MSI is using but all but guaranteed to still be DrMOS and I'd bet it's in the same performance class as Asus' 60A parts.

At 142W, barring unforeseeable design mishaps (eg. X570 Pro Carbon), it doesn't matter at all which board you choose. Both doubly overkill for what you use. I'd choose based on feature set and which BIOS you prefer.

I hope Asus isn't still removing BIOS settings on their TUF and Strix for no good reason.

Thank you both!

I'll have a think about it, but I'm more inclined to give MSi another go for now. Feature-wise, they're quite similar and I'm not planning on any OC with the 7700X. Heck, if it reaches 95 °C with my 280 mm AIO, I'll even turn on Eco mode.