is my throttlestop undervolt correct?

[fulaan]

hello first id like to say i am not very techie,i just follow basic guides i find on the web.

my laptop is msi ge67hx 12800hx processor i7.

the first pic below is of core temp before using throttlestop and the second pic is of core temp after applying throttle stop settings.

and the next three pics are of my throttlestop settings with undervolt of 100.6.

are my throttlestop settings correct please or is there anything i need to change?

 

[unclewebb]

ThrottleStop cannot access the CPU voltage control register when Windows VBS is enabled. If you want to use ThrottleStop, follow the links in my signature to disable core isolation memory integrity and anything else VBS related. After you do that, exit ThrottleStop, delete the ThrottleStop.INI configuration file and reboot.

You can run msinfo to determine if virtualization is enabled or not. Post some update FIVR screenshots. The FIVR monitoring table should not be showing 0.0332 for all of the voltages, the VCCIN slider should be set to Default and it should not be adjustable.

Some users prefer leaving VBS enabled for the enhanced security it provides. If you feel more comfortable with VBS enabled then you will not be able to use ThrottleStop for CPU voltage control.

 

[fulaan]

hello thanks i have disabled vbs.

i now have the following first picture is of fivr before changing any voltage settings and second pic is after changing voltages

pic below is of throttlestop front screen with turn on pressed,im guessing thats how it should be?

 

[fulaan]

this is my core temps having done the above

 

[unclewebb]

Your last FIVR screenshot shows that your undervolt requests are showing up in the FIVR monitoring table under the Offset column. That appears to be working correctly now.

Idle temperatures are not important. Does lowering the voltage help when your CPU is loaded?

Why is Disable Turbo checked? That significantly reduces performance.

 

[fulaan]

i checked disable turbo because i was following someones settings for my laptop and he had it checked.

i unchecked disable turbo and immediately got blue screen and laptop turned off.

 

[unclewebb]

A blue screen means your undervolt settings are not stable. Checking the Disable Turbo box reduces your CPU performance in half. I would not recommend doing that.

Set your undervolt settings back to zero. A lot of 12th Gen HX CPUs are not stable when undervolting the cache. In the FIVR window, just below the monitoring table is a setting that lets you control the maximum cache ratio. The maximum is presently set to 44. That is usually far too high for a 12th Gen CPU. I would reduce that to approximately 30 before trying to adjust the cache voltage. You should also consider setting the mV Boost @ 800 MHz value to 100 or 150. That can help with stability problems when undervolting these processors.

 

[fulaan]

ok thanks for your help

i have done everything you said and undervolted to 70 this time and no blue screen.

is the front screen below correct now. do i check 'high performance' ?

and if i check 'task bar' does that mean it automatically runs on start up?

 

[unclewebb]

do i check 'high performance' ?

I prefer to use the Windows High Performance power plan when plugged in. Most people with laptops prefer to use the Windows Balanced power plan. In that case, there is no need to check the ThrottleStop High Performance box. This feature was only included in ThrottleStop because sometimes Windows likes to hide the High Performance power plan in its Power Options. This setting is an easy way to access the default Windows power plans.

task bar

The Task Bar check box only controls whether ThrottleStop minimizes to the task bar at the bottom or not. No need to check that.

To auto start ThrottleStop when Windows starts up, I recommend using the Windows Task Scheduler. Here is a guide.

https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/effective-clock-speed.293296/#post-4749675

You can play around with undervolting more and you can play around with the Cache Ratio Max value that I suggested. Using 30 for this setting was just a number off the top of my head. Now that mV Boost is set, you might be able to increase the Cache Ratio Max value while still being stable.

 

[fulaan]

thanks very much

and lastly i press the 'turn on' button so it shows as in the last pic above?

 

[unclewebb]

'turn on' button

It does not hurt anything to press the Turn On button. It is probably not necessary for your CPU. This button only controls the Set Multiplier function and the Clock Modulation function. You are not using either of those.

 

[fulaan]

thanks very much for your help

 

[fulaan]

me again,
i seem to be pretty stable with 125 undervolt and with cache ratio at 36 and mv boost at 150.

if i experiment a bit more, is the primary thing we are trying to achieve is to get the undervolt as big as possible? what im trying to ask is for example if i was to lower the cache ratio to 30 and be able to achieve undervolt of 150; would this be preferable to keeping undervolt at 125 and cache ratio at 36?

 

[ChemicalDruid]

me again,
i seem to be pretty stable with 125 undervolt and with cache ratio at 36 and mv boost at 150.

if i experiment a bit more, is the primary thing we are trying to achieve is to get the undervolt as big as possible? what im trying to ask is for example if i was to lower the cache ratio to 30 and be able to achieve undervolt of 150; would this be preferable to keeping undervolt at 125 and cache ratio at 36?

Please correct me if I am wrong -

There are three competing goals involved here:
- Performance: Increase without increasing power or temperatures (this factor can be only indirectly controlled, e.g. power plan, ThrottleStop)
- Power: Decrease without decreasing performance and without increasing temperatures (this factor can be directly controlled, e.g. ThrottleStop)
- Temperatures: Decrease without decreasing power or performance (this factor can be directly controlled, e.g. cooling pad, or indirectly controlled, e.g. ThrottleStop)

See how ThrottleStop can factor in all of them?

The amount you undervolt by is only determined by one factor - is your system stable or not? Keep going down (which should help improve all three goals) until you need to stop due to BSODs or freezes. Once you reach stability, increasing power by ratios or multipliers will affect performance and most probably temperatures; find your desired equilibrium when changing any parameter leads to an undesired scenario. You will have found your "sweet spot" - a dead end you won't want to escape.

 

[fulaan]

thanks,this is what im trying to understand.

can i ask ,what do 'mv boost' and 'cache ratio' do exactly and what effect does lowering or raising them have?

 

[unclewebb]

mv boost

mV Boost increases the CPU voltage when the CPU is running at low MHz. Some users with HX processors have found that this can increase stability. This allows them to undervolt the core and the P cache more which are the two most important voltages. Less voltage equals less power consumption and that equals less heat or less fan noise.

The speed of the on chip cache memory can allow a CPU to access data faster. This increases overall performance. When you increase the cache ratio, some games and applications will perform better. For other applications that are not cache dependent, it might not make much difference at all. There might be a big drop in performance if you reduce the cache ratio too much.

Do some testing. If game performance is important to you then run some game benchmarks while using different settings. That will help answer your questions.

 

[fulaan]

mV Boost increases the CPU voltage when the CPU is running at low MHz. Some users with HX processors have found that this can increase stability. This allows them to undervolt the core and the P cache more which are the two most important voltages. Less voltage equals less power consumption and that equals less heat or less fan noise.

The speed of the on chip cache memory can allow a CPU to access data faster. This increases overall performance. When you increase the cache ratio, some games and applications will perform better. For other applications that are not cache dependent, it might not make much difference at all. There might be a big drop in performance if you reduce the cache ratio too much.

Do some testing. If game performance is important to you then run some game benchmarks while using different settings. That will help answer your questions.

so with regards to mv boost is lower number better or higher? you suggested i change it to 150. should i be looking to increase or decrease this number?

and cache ratio without any changes is 44 and you told me to change to 30. i should be looking ti get this as close to 44 as possible?

 

[ChemicalDruid]

so with regards to mv boost is lower number better or higher? you suggested i change it to 150. should i be looking to increase or decrease this number?

The mV boost amount should match or exceed the undervolt amount. This should prevent BSODs after returning from Sleep mode or during idle operation. Once the CPU goes into higher frequencies, that mV boost gets cancelled and the undervolt does its intended job (hopefully!)

and cache ratio without any changes is 44 and you told me to change to 30. i should be looking ti get this as close to 44 as possible?

As a fellow "patient" (12900HX), I suggest you keep that ratio to 30 (always while undervolting) and play with all other parameters until you're happy. Make it the last parameter to repeatedly increase by one until you lose stability, then dial back to the highest stable figure.

 

[fulaan]

The mV boost amount should match or exceed the undervolt amount. This should prevent BSODs after returning from Sleep mode or during idle operation. Once the CPU goes into higher frequencies, that mV boost gets cancelled and the undervolt does its intended job (hopefully!)


As a fellow "patient" (12900HX), I suggest you keep that ratio to 30 (always while undervolting) and play with all other parameters until you're happy. Make it the last parameter to repeatedly increase by one until you lose stability, then dial back to the highest stable figure.

thanks

my boost is at 150 as suggested by unclewebb, and my undervolt is at -125. unclewebb suggested i put my cache at 30 but i have been trying to increase it. ive had it at 36 but i have been getting bsod after returning from sleep/hibernation. so ive returned my cache back to 30 and will see how these settings are.

 

[fulaan]

been experimenting with the settings and i am currently at:

on the first screen speed shift epp was originally unchecked but i read somewhere to put it on and change the value to 20. is speed shift epp best left on or off?

i have been reducing the voltages down to -125 and even -150. -150 would be stable for a while and then it may randomly bsod. -125 was mostly stable but would sometimes bsod upon waking from hibernation/sleep. so im now on -96 and it is pretty stable so far. ill try and undervolt a little more in small increments and see how far it can go and stay stable. my cache ratio and mv boost are at 30 and 150 as recommended by unclewebb, if i try by trial and error to increase these numbers is it going to be something worthwhile doing?

 

[ChemicalDruid]

Unclewebb, chime in whenever you see fit

If you are confident that your voltage offset and mV boost values provide 100% stability, start increasing that 30 by one and make sure that 100% stability is still there before going further with increasing it. Meaning, use stress tests and real-world workloads for some time to reveal any stability issues that may be uncovered by the increased ratio.

In order to answer your query, and provide some generally good advice for others, I have gathered some previous comments by unclewebb here from various posts, for an overall reference regarding modern CPUs like yours and mine:

• Turn On button: This button only applies to older CPUs that use SpeedStep. When using Speed Shift (SST), this button does not matter. The power limits, voltages, etc., etc., all work regardless of whether you click this button or not.
• SpeedStep is old school. If you see SST in green on the main screen of ThrottleStop, that means your computer is using the newer Speed Shift Technology. When Speed Shift is enabled, having SpeedStep enabled or not makes no difference.
• I use the Windows High Performance power plan and run my CPU at full speed all of the time. If you want your CPU to slow down when lightly loaded, use the Windows Balanced power plan.
• You do not need to check Speed Shift EPP if you use the Windows Balanced power plan - Windows will then set Speed Shift EPP appropriately.
• If you check the Speed Shift EPP box, you will end up with a constant fight between ThrottleStop and Windows 11 as they both write different values to the same Speed Shift EPP register. Fights are never good.
• C1E makes very little difference because modern CPUs will spend their idle time in core C7 instead of C1E.
• Checking the Disable Turbo box reduces your CPU performance in half. I would not recommend doing that. [ChemicalDruid: except when you intend to reduce thermals/power usage by sacrificing performance)
• Instead of using Disable Turbo, you can control the maximum CPU speed by adjusting the Speed Shift Max value in the TPL window.
• Checking the Speed Shift box in the TPL window tells ThrottleStop to maintain the Speed Shift Max value which can help your CPU maintain full speed.
• I recommend checking the MMIO Lock box near the top right of the TPL window because power is varying. That prevents these power limits from ever changing. You do not need to use Sync MMIO when MMIO Lock is checked. [ChemicalDruid: just ensure you are not running any other software that manages power limits in real-time so that there are no fights, as those are never good]
• IccMax controls the maximum amount of current going to the processor. When IccMax is set too low, this can cause EDP throttling. I would also set Power Limit 4 to either a value of 0 or set this to the max which is usually 1023. You have a high performance computer. No reason to throttle it. I would also clear the Thermal Velocity Boost box in the FIVR window to prevent TVB throttling.
• Try setting IccMax for the P core and the P cache to the max, 511.75 [12th Gen and newer] or 255.75 [11th Gen and older]

 

[fulaan]

chemicaldruid thanks for the info in your posts.

im having problem with bsod on waking from sleep and hibernation. undervolting to 100 and even 125 is otherwise stable,its just the bsods on waking up from sleep or hibernation. anything i can try to stop the bsods?

I would also set Power Limit 4 to either a value of 0 or set this to the max which is usually 1023. You have a high performance computer. No reason to throttle it. I would also clear the Thermal Velocity Boost box in the FIVR window to prevent TVB throttling.

just wanted to ask where do i change the 'power limit 4' ? do i change both boxes where it says 330 to 1023?

 

[unclewebb]

where do i change the 'power limit 4' ?

The left box shows what PL4 is currently set to. You cannot click on that box or change that box. Enter a new value into the box on the right hand side, push Apply, and the box on the left hand side should change. That would indicate that PL4 has been updated.

Some people like to set PL4 to a value of 0 and some like to set this to the max. I do not think either of those values makes any difference. Whatever works for you is OK.

@ChemicalDruid
That looks like an excellent write up.

 

[fulaan]

ok thanks unclewebb any suggestions on how to stop bsods from sleep/hibernation wake please?

 

[unclewebb]

how to stop bsods from sleep/hibernation wake please?

@ChemicalDruid and I are working on this issue. If we make any progress, I will let you know.