nvidia gpu market share takes over 90% in Q4 2024 (Get's closer to full monopoly)

[Sir Beregond]

Good thing Intel getting into the mix as NVIDIA exits the gaming market in the next few years.

Doubt Arc is making any money. The B580 die is 71% bigger than the AD107 die in the 4060 and still only beats it by 10%ish. Both are variants of TSMC 5nm. Intel has got to be losing money on that.

Not sure on the future of Arc now with Pat ousted.

 

[Krit]

Intel are not making money on B580 it's too expensive and at least one generation behind in terms of tehnology. B580 has almost the same die size as RTX 4070 Ti (192-bit mid tier gpu) that costs more than 3x for about the same die size 250$ vs 800$.

But still it manages to beat RTX 4060 pretty easy and it has way more OC potential. Hopefully RTX 5060 will be 8GB not 12GB.

 

[freeagent]

They are taking a loss to get their hardware out..

Once they get footing they should be ok, just like always.

 

[kapone32]

Prices vary by regions, so the only metric to go by is MSRP.
BTW AMD did nothing to stop miners from gobble up all their GPUs, whereas Nvidia at least tried with the LHR version LOL. During the mining craze RTX 3000 was actually cheaper and more available where I live.

By the end of the mining craze the RTX 3000 was in the hands of more gamers, who have experience with DLSS+RT and decided that those features are actually worth the premium over Radeon counterpart, or as you guys called it mindshare.

Then can you explain why my local Brick and Mortar basically had none but every week on Instagram or Youtube someone would post a video with 20-30 cards mining? That lasted for more than 6 months. In the meantime AMD releases the 6500XT for less than half of the 6600 but no AV1 encoder killed it to reviewers.

 

[Sir Beregond]

They are taking a loss to get their hardware out..

Once they get footing they should be ok, just like always.

Of course, I just hope they keep at it and don't see Arc as something to axe given current state of Intel.

They can't exactly afford to be selling quantity of anything at a loss right now. I bet the volume is going to be a lot lower for Battlemage vs what we saw with Alchemist.

 

[igormp]

Doubt Arc is making any money. The B580 die is 71% bigger than the AD107 die in the 4060 and still only beats it by 10%ish. Both are variants of TSMC 5nm. Intel has got to be losing money on that.

Not sure on the future of Arc now with Pat ousted.

I get your point and I do agree that intel's profits are way slimmer than Nvidia, but you seem to be assuming that Nvidia is selling the 4060 with a "reasonable" margin, which I believe it's not the case.
I think that Arc has a slim profit margin (still positive), and that Nvidia is selling the 4060 at an absurd margin.

 

[Krit]

and that Nvidia is selling the 4060 at an absurd margin.

And it's for all RTX 40 lineup. RTX 50 will continue this smart rodeo ride and will milk as much as possible.
NVIDIA Revenue 2010-2024 | NVDA

 

[Hecate91]

Prices vary by regions, so the only metric to go by is MSRP.
BTW AMD did nothing to stop miners from gobble up all their GPUs, whereas Nvidia at least tried with the LHR version LOL. During the mining craze RTX 3000 was actually cheaper and more available where I live.

By the end of the mining craze the RTX 3000 was in the hands of more gamers, who have experience with DLSS+RT and decided that those features are actually worth the premium over Radeon counterpart, or as you guys called it mindshare.

Even with the LHR cards, Nvidia "accidentally" leaked out a driver which bypassed the mining block, miners figured out how to get nearly the same performance out of LHR cards anyway. Nvidia didn't try anything to get cards in the hands of gamers, EVGA did and Nvidia had a hand in killing them off by raising margins to the point of EVGA losing money on every card. Nvidia was caught lying about mining, and now they've gotten caught lying about their dependency on the market with AI and they're being investigated for it. At least AMD tried to supply the market with the 6500XT, everyone loves to hate on that card but it was something people bought at the time since it was enough to run games. The only Nvidia card you could buy for like a year was the garbage GT1030.
As for people having experience with DLSS or RT, the average gamer is being told DLSS is better even though alternatives that aren't locked to a single brand platform work just fine.

 

[TheinsanegamerN]

I get your point and I do agree that intel's profits are way slimmer than Nvidia, but you seem to be assuming that Nvidia is selling the 4060 with a "reasonable" margin, which I believe it's not the case.
I think that Arc has a slim profit margin (still positive), and that Nvidia is selling the 4060 at an absurd margin.

And it's for all RTX 40 lineup. RTX 50 will continue this smart rodeo ride and will milk as much as possible.

This is incorrect. Nvidia's margin prior to the AI boom was only up slightly and ada represented a margin DECREASE to 2019 levels.

turns out rampant inflation and cost increases means GPUs go up in price.

NVIDIA Profit Margin 2010-2024 | NVDA

Current and historical gross margin, operating margin and net profit margin for NVIDIA (NVDA) over the last 10 years. Profit margin can be defined as the percentage of revenue that a company retains as income after the deduction of expenses. NVIDIA net profit margin as of October 31, 2024 is...

www.macrotrends.net

 

[Sir Beregond]

I get your point and I do agree that intel's profits are way slimmer than Nvidia, but you seem to be assuming that Nvidia is selling the 4060 with a "reasonable" margin, which I believe it's not the case.
I think that Arc has a slim profit margin (still positive), and that Nvidia is selling the 4060 at an absurd margin.

Oh this is true. I guess in the end we don't know the total cost of manufacturing for either. I'm just speculating here, but it is not lost on my that Nvidia likely has an absurd level of margin for the 4060.

 

[eidairaman1]

I will buy this argument when you can prove that Nvidia actually makes a better GPU without any collusion. Let me be more specific. For the longest time you didn't see AMD chips in laptops. Was it just a case where all AMD chips sucked when compared to Intel...well, a bit. Poorer energy efficiency, but at the same time much better pricing. The problem is that behind the scenes Intel was playing dirty and basically forcing AMD out of the market.

I view the current AMD/Nvidia situation similarly. AMD focused their brand on value...and thus won the console war. They weren't making the best CPUs, and their GPUs aren't the absolute best, but the market spoke and our consoles are running primarily on AMD. The exception being the ultra budget Nintendo...who decided Tegra and energy efficiency above all else, to meld handheld and console, was what was desired. In the current market I believe that Nvidia dominates not by being the best, but by having the perception that they are absolutely better than AMD...without room for scrutiny.


What I am hoping is that refocusing on the value levels, without the silly race for absolute peak performance, is the start of a lively debate between all three players. Right now Nvidia is primarily sold off of RT...despite most games not having it (by virtue of most games being older than a couple of years). RT is...fine at high GPU performance, but even middle of the road GPUs can't do it and standard raster performance together. Most people own a 3060 level card...which isn't really viable for cranking out ray-tracing. You then get to the $500+ range, and Nvidia is willing to sell you something that will ray-trace. Cool...I can buy an entire console and some games, or one GPU. That said, if you ask a normal person Nvidia "just works." It's their perception after years of being told that Nvidia is better, and not taking it upon themselves to investigate because blowing a few hundred dollars on a curiosity is...stupid.
That said, I believe Nvidia is reaching the tipping point. The point where their ubiquity will be a poison, because their 3060 and 4060 are still nearly at full launch prices (minus scalping), and thus people will try both AMD and Intel because paying $250 for a new card is better than $300 for something already 4+ years old. Consider me a bit selfish here...but I think people will eventually get to the point where entry level hardware at premium pricing will have them trying Intel and AMD, and when they realize that (barring RT) the experience is no longer very different it'll be a no-brainer to buy AMD again, and try Intel.

Not going to deny that AMD largely made their own bed, but don't discount the power of perception. My favorite example is the RX 6600. It was decisively the best price-performance card of its generation, and even beat Nvidia's offerings in efficiency. It hit all the marks people claim to care about (ignoring RT, which was irrelevant at that performance level), in a graphics card. Yet it got almost as much derision as praise (from what I saw) from commenters, and still sold poorly. Momentum is A Thing. Just look at the response to the B580. Reviewers are almost universally, "This is pretty good!" But witness the amount of negativity about it in the comments on this very site. It doesn't live up to some imaginary Nvidia-derived standard, therefore it is crap. Or something. I don't get it.

Exactly

 

[igormp]

This is incorrect. Nvidia's margin prior to the AI boom was only up slightly and ada represented a margin DECREASE to 2019 levels.

turns out rampant inflation and cost increases means GPUs go up in price.

NVIDIA Profit Margin 2010-2024 | NVDA

Current and historical gross margin, operating margin and net profit margin for NVIDIA (NVDA) over the last 10 years. Profit margin can be defined as the percentage of revenue that a company retains as income after the deduction of expenses. NVIDIA net profit margin as of October 31, 2024 is...

www.macrotrends.net

It'd be nice if we had a margin per segment. Hard to extrapolate gaming margins from this graph given how much DC accounts for their total revenue.

 

[Hecate91]

This is incorrect. Nvidia's margin prior to the AI boom was only up slightly and ada represented a margin DECREASE to 2019 levels.

turns out rampant inflation and cost increases means GPUs go up in price.

NVIDIA Profit Margin 2010-2024 | NVDA

Current and historical gross margin, operating margin and net profit margin for NVIDIA (NVDA) over the last 10 years. Profit margin can be defined as the percentage of revenue that a company retains as income after the deduction of expenses. NVIDIA net profit margin as of October 31, 2024 is...

www.macrotrends.net

Obviously margins had to go down to pre-covid levels, Nvidia couldn't keep their mining boom level prices up.
The inflation and cost increases has very little to do with card prices when the margins are over 70%, no other tech company has profit margins that high.

 

[wolf]

At least AMD tried to supply the market with the 6500XT, everyone loves to hate on that card but it was something people bought at the time since it was enough to run games. The only Nvidia card you could buy for like a year was the garbage GT1030.

Remember when AMD rapidly repurposed a mobile GPU into a desktop card while missing expected desktop features, with a gimped bus, performing significantly lower than expected based on the line-up above it, with only 4GB VRAM after publicly saying that's not enough, at an insultingly high MSRP, during a GPU shortage, to take advantage and fleece as many desperate buyers as they could?

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

As for people having experience with DLSS or RT, the average gamer is being told DLSS is better even though alternatives that aren't locked to a single brand platform work just fine.

Absolutely agreed, their (AMD) features do work just fine, but RT and Upscaling are objectively better with an Nvidia card. I would say that the average gamer is being told the truth here, but you're not wrong in that they get the same features "on the box", just with a difference in performance and or IQ, limiting their useability relatively speaking.

 

[nguyen]

Remember when AMD rapidly repurposed a mobile GPU into a desktop card while missing expected desktop features, with a gimped bus, performing significantly lower than expected based on the line-up above it, with only 4GB VRAM after publicly saying that's not enough, at an insultingly high MSRP, during a GPU shortage, to take advantage and fleece as many desperate buyers as they could?

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

View attachment 376144

Absolutely agreed, their (AMD) features do work just fine, but RT and Upscaling are objectively better with an Nvidia card. I would say that the average gamer is being told the truth here, but you're not wrong in that they get the same features "on the box", just with a difference in performance and or IQ, limiting their useability relatively speaking.

Yeah the 6500XT is even worse than the GTX 1650 Super, a cheaper card that came out 2.2 years before (2019 vs 2022), yet there are people who think it's pure injustice that 6500XT didn't sell .

Oh the GTX 1650 is actually the 4th most popular on Steam Survey, they must have been selling well way before Covid

 

[freeagent]

7900XTX and 4080S are price competitors in my country right now, 1200-1600 bucks, plus tax.

 

[nguyen]

7900XTX and 4080S are price competitors in my country right now, 1200-1600 bucks, plus tax.

4080 Super is actually cheaper than 7900XTX in my country due to more availability of RTX (4080 Super has more models than the entire RX 7000 line up here).

4080 Super page
RX 7000 Page

 

[Hecate91]

Remember when AMD rapidly repurposed a mobile GPU into a desktop card while missing expected desktop features, with a gimped bus, performing significantly lower than expected based on the line-up above it, with only 4GB VRAM after publicly saying that's not enough, at an insultingly high MSRP, during a GPU shortage, to take advantage and fleece as many desperate buyers as they could?

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

I remember when AMD sold a card the miners didn't want, you can call it fleecing the buyers all you want but people at the time didn't care because it was a GPU you could actually buy and for anyone who didn't want to pay scalper pricing for a console. You're also conveniently leaving out the part that even a used RX580 or GTX 1060 was affected by scalper pricing. The 6500XT is a garbage card now looking back at those times, but at least AMD was offering something, while Nvidia wasn't and a GT1030 was selling for over $100.
Edit- As for the GTX 1650 Super, it was very difficult to find, or it was selling way above its $159 MSRP.

Absolutely agreed, their (AMD) features do work just fine, but RT and Upscaling are objectively better with an Nvidia card. I would say that the average gamer is being told the truth here, but you're not wrong in that they get the same features "on the box", just with a difference in performance and or IQ, limiting their useability relatively speaking.

The average gamer not being told the entire truth is the issue, while DLSS and RT may work better with an Nvidia card, it doesn't work that much better to make it worth buying an RTX 4060 8GB over an Intel Arc B580 12GB, 6700XT 12GB, or 7600XT 16GB. The perception of something being better and the mindshare are very powerful at convincing the average gamer to buy an Nvidia card. Also the features Nvidia sells at a premium like upscaling with frame gen are only available to those buying the latest card because Nvidia says so, the features aren't there for gamers on an RTX 3060 or RTX 2060, those people could really need upscaling to make previous gen cards more usable for newer games.

 

[Dr. Dro]

I've been daily driving their open source modules for months now without any issues, fwiw.
It'll be quite some time until it gets upstreamed tho (if it ever gets to this point).

I mostly chose Nvidia because CUDA, ROCm is pretty much a joke still (even though it has been improving) and I need to get work done.
If Intel came with a 32GB GPU at a reasonable price, I could give it a try and maybe even replace my 2x3090s, but I doubt such product will exist. AMD has nice hardware, but lacks SW support. Intel has really nice SW support, but lacks the HW to make use of it, so Nvidia it is with their outrageous prices due to the lack of competition.

Ready to drop the equivalent of a car on a 5090? With the dollar at 6 bucks...

 

[igormp]

Ready to drop the equivalent of a car on a 5090? With the dollar at 6 bucks...

Well, I do get paid in USD, so exchange rate is not that relevant to me in this regard.
My main issue is that a single 5090 wouldn't make much sense since whenever running in tandem with one of my 3090, it'd be slowed down to the same level of it (albeit with a nice 56GB of VRAM), and getting 2x5090 would be both hella expensive, and also awful to pack in my carry-on.

My plan so far is to just bring a new cpu and 4x64gb in my next trip to the US while keeping my 2x3090 for a bit longer.

 

[wolf]

you can call it fleecing the buyers all you want

I do, because to me it absolutely was.

You're also conveniently leaving out the part

Like how you conveniently left out the points I raised too, seemingly

The average gamer not being told the entire truth is the issue, while DLSS and RT may work better with an Nvidia card, it doesn't work that much better to make it worth buying an RTX 4060 8GB over an Intel Arc B580 12GB, 6700XT 12GB, or 7600XT 16GB. The perception of something being better and the mindshare are very powerful at convincing the average gamer to buy an Nvidia card. Also the features Nvidia sells at a premium like upscaling with frame gen are only available to those buying the latest card because Nvidia says so, the features aren't there for gamers on an RTX 3060 or RTX 2060, those people could really need upscaling to make previous gen cards more usable for newer games.

The features and being worth more depends on a great many factors, including but not limited to; the tier you're buying at, the timing during which you plan to buy (ie you mention the B580 which just launched and the 4060 has been on the market 18 months), local prices and so on, there's no one size fits all answer here, there will be times the AMD card is the better buy I absolutely agree, but that goes the other way too.

Personally I'm not pissed that new features come with new hardware, and oftentimes (perhaps always) it might actually be either necessary or deliver superior results. As for an RTX2060 or 3060, despite missing out on Nvidia's frame gen, open options are there (including lossless scaling for just a few $), and DLSS Super Resolution has continued to improve since it's inception, I doubt a 2060 buyer is all that annoyed when they can use the latest DLL in the latest games and leverage the evolution of that tech on a 6 year old card. In this regard, my 3080 has aged like, dare I say it, fine wine.

 

[Krit]

7900XTX and 4080S are price competitors in my country right now, 1200-1600 bucks, plus tax.

Slowly running out of stock in europe right now RTX 4090 costs 2200-2600€, RTX 4080 Super starts at ~1030€, RX 7900 XTX starts at ~860€, RTX 4070 Ti Super starts at ~820€, RX 7900 XT starts at ~660€.

Can someone even imagine RTX 5090, 32GB, DDR7 being cheaper than 2000$ ?

 

[Bomby569]

Can someone even imagine RTX 5090, 32GB, DDR7 being cheaper than 2000$ ?

There is one thing here that people keep constantly missing, economics, if they can sell them for 2000$, why on Earth would Nvidia sell them for less? i wouldn't do it, nobody here would. When you guys are selling used cards, do you sell them for the going market price or do you randomly put a "nice" price?
There is nothing wrong with the pricing, it's just supply and demand working.

Don't want those prices, stop buying them
Can't afford those prices and just want to complain. No one, in either Nvidia or buyers, cares about your cheap ass.
This is how the world works.

I would love to buy a house for the price my parents bought one in the same location (inflation adjusted) but that isn't going to happen either. Blame the money printers post 2008.

 

[Hecate91]

There is one thing here that people keep constantly missing, economics, if they can sell them for 2000$, why on Earth would Nvidia sell them for less? i wouldn't do it, nobody here would. When you guys are selling used cards, do you sell them for the going market price or do you randomly put a "nice" price?
There is nothing wrong with the pricing, it's just supply and demand working.

Don't want those prices, stop buying them
Can't afford those prices and just want to complain. No one, in either Nvidia or buyers, cares about your cheap ass.
This is how the world works.

I would love to buy a house for the price my parents bought one in the same location (inflation adjusted) but that isn't going to happen either. Blame the money printers post 2008.

If Nvidia can sell a card for $2000, why not sell it for $8000 as an AI card? The economics have been completely screwed up since Nvidia ruined the gpu market during the crypto boom, then making it even worse with AI crap. It's very clear Nvidia doesn't care about consumers, with increasing prices, shifting the whole product stack around, restricting features only for the latest cards, and monopolizing the market while reviewers for some reason keep defending a trillion dollar corporation for ecosystem locked features. All of the complaints of a worsening market are valid complaints.

 

[TSiAhmat]

If Nvidia can sell a card for $2000, why not sell it for $8000 as an AI card?

I am not really in the market for an "AI Card" (duh), but aren't those already really expensive? So in other words, they are already doing that...?