• Welcome to TechPowerUp Forums, Guest! Please check out our forum guidelines for info related to our community.

AMD Second-generation Ryzen "Pinnacle Ridge" Confirmed to Support AM4

eidairaman1

The Exiled Airman
Joined
Jul 2, 2007
Messages
42,632 (6.68/day)
Location
Republic of Texas (True Patriot)
System Name PCGOD
Processor AMD FX 8350@ 5.0GHz
Motherboard Asus TUF 990FX Sabertooth R2 2901 Bios
Cooling Scythe Ashura, 2×BitFenix 230mm Spectre Pro LED (Blue,Green), 2x BitFenix 140mm Spectre Pro LED
Memory 16 GB Gskill Ripjaws X 2133 (2400 OC, 10-10-12-20-20, 1T, 1.65V)
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon 290 Sapphire Vapor-X
Storage Samsung 840 Pro 256GB, WD Velociraptor 1TB
Display(s) NEC Multisync LCD 1700V (Display Port Adapter)
Case AeroCool Xpredator Evil Blue Edition
Audio Device(s) Creative Labs Sound Blaster ZxR
Power Supply Seasonic 1250 XM2 Series (XP3)
Mouse Roccat Kone XTD
Keyboard Roccat Ryos MK Pro
Software Windows 7 Pro 64
Good points. The people bitching are mostly AMD users (they're usually budget-limited, or they'd buy Intel). Amd users feel the need for a new CPU the minute they build a system, because they don't buy top parts, and are hoping for a pencil mod to magically make their CPU twice as fast for free! The frequent motherboard change is one of the strengths of Intel, not a weakness at all. Intel users want top performance, not a bargain deal. Using a board for multiple generations is just another compromise, sacrificing performance or connectivity just to save a few bucks. I always sold my old Intel parts as a working system, and that covered half to 2/3 the cost of the new rig, and now all my friends have better gaming rigs for a lower price, and free lifetime support (parts extra!).

Shallow minded, you are

There's a reason we have choices. Sorry I built my rig the way I wanted. At least Boards don't have to be upgraded every other year to support a new cpu, easy drop ins Like Super 7 was in the day, on top of that I'm not in debt because of a build. On another note there are better things in life than being at the computer 24/7.
 
Joined
Apr 30, 2012
Messages
3,881 (0.84/day)
"Intel users want top performance" Ends up buying Core i3 or Core i5... A what?

I like the part where he sells his old system to his "Friends". I thought cool nice dude then read his post again and it sounds more like keeping them under that bus.

Good points. The people bitching are mostly AMD users (they're usually budget-limited, or they'd buy Intel). Amd users feel the need for a new CPU the minute they build a system, because they don't buy top parts, and are hoping for a pencil mod to magically make their CPU twice as fast for free! The frequent motherboard change is one of the strengths of Intel, not a weakness at all. Intel users want top performance, not a bargain deal. Using a board for multiple generations is just another compromise, sacrificing performance or connectivity just to save a few bucks. I always sold my old Intel parts as a working system, and that covered half to 2/3 the cost of the new rig, and now all my friends have better gaming rigs for a lower price, and free lifetime support (parts extra!).

The same stereotype hes complaining about, hes actively perpetuating for his own benefit. Hey friend here is a deal on my 3gen+ old hardware stay back there and don't think about new ram, connectivity and all the other stuff i'm saying that are benefits.

If its covering 2/3 of the new system wouldn't it be more "friendly" to advise them towards a current gen system with all the benefits you spouted. Doesn't need to be top end.

Seams so contradictory
 
Last edited:
Joined
Mar 16, 2017
Messages
2,161 (0.76/day)
Location
Tanagra
System Name Budget Box
Processor Xeon E5-2667v2
Motherboard ASUS P9X79 Pro
Cooling Some cheap tower cooler, I dunno
Memory 32GB 1866-DDR3 ECC
Video Card(s) XFX RX 5600XT
Storage WD NVME 1GB
Display(s) ASUS Pro Art 27"
Case Antec P7 Neo
I like the part where he sells his old system to his "Friends". I thought cool nice dude then read his post again and it sounds more like keeping them under that bus.



The same stereotype hes complaining about, hes actively perpetuating for his own benefit. Hey friend here is a deal on my 3gen+ old hardware stay back there and don't think about new ram, connectivity and all the other stuff i'm saying that are benefits.

If its covering 2/3 of the new system wouldn't it be more "friendly" to advise them towards a current gen system with all the benefits you spouted. Doesn't need to be top end.

Seams so contradictory

Nice catch. I was distracted by the generalizations made against all AMD and Intel buyers. It's almost like there's more to it than that.
 
Joined
Mar 7, 2015
Messages
23 (0.01/day)
My comments was not meant to be about AMD vs Intel. I was honestly curious if people was actually upgrading there CPU without changing there motherboard or they just like the idea of having that option but never actually did it. I guess if people are upgrading they just doing more CPU dependent things then I do. For my needs I can keep the same CPU 4-5 years and don't find my bottle neck ever being the CPU. I can understand if people are getting bottle neck by a CPU after only a year or two why this would be a issue. For me it a none factor when making my buying decisions.
 
Joined
Oct 1, 2006
Messages
4,934 (0.74/day)
Location
Hong Kong
Processor Core i7-12700k
Motherboard Z690 Aero G D4
Cooling Custom loop water, 3x 420 Rad
Video Card(s) RX 7900 XTX Phantom Gaming
Storage Plextor M10P 2TB
Display(s) InnoCN 27M2V
Case Thermaltake Level 20 XT
Audio Device(s) Soundblaster AE-5 Plus
Power Supply FSP Aurum PT 1200W
Software Windows 11 Pro 64-bit
My comments was not meant to be about AMD vs Intel. I was honestly curious if people was actually upgrading there CPU without changing there motherboard or they just like the idea of having that option but never actually did it. I guess if people are upgrading they just doing more CPU dependent things then I do. For my needs I can keep the same CPU 4-5 years and don't find my bottle neck ever being the CPU. I can understand if people are getting bottle neck by a CPU after only a year or two why this would be a issue. For me it a none factor when making my buying decisions.
TBH the point is not about if most users opt to upgrade or not, but some people with the weird mentality that somehow having an option to upgrade is a bad thing.
There are almost always unused or non-essential pins in the socket, which is why often people with broken pins on the cpu / mobo is still able to run their PC seemingly without issue.
 

eidairaman1

The Exiled Airman
Joined
Jul 2, 2007
Messages
42,632 (6.68/day)
Location
Republic of Texas (True Patriot)
System Name PCGOD
Processor AMD FX 8350@ 5.0GHz
Motherboard Asus TUF 990FX Sabertooth R2 2901 Bios
Cooling Scythe Ashura, 2×BitFenix 230mm Spectre Pro LED (Blue,Green), 2x BitFenix 140mm Spectre Pro LED
Memory 16 GB Gskill Ripjaws X 2133 (2400 OC, 10-10-12-20-20, 1T, 1.65V)
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon 290 Sapphire Vapor-X
Storage Samsung 840 Pro 256GB, WD Velociraptor 1TB
Display(s) NEC Multisync LCD 1700V (Display Port Adapter)
Case AeroCool Xpredator Evil Blue Edition
Audio Device(s) Creative Labs Sound Blaster ZxR
Power Supply Seasonic 1250 XM2 Series (XP3)
Mouse Roccat Kone XTD
Keyboard Roccat Ryos MK Pro
Software Windows 7 Pro 64
My comments was not meant to be about AMD vs Intel. I was honestly curious if people was actually upgrading there CPU without changing there motherboard or they just like the idea of having that option but never actually did it. I guess if people are upgrading they just doing more CPU dependent things then I do. For my needs I can keep the same CPU 4-5 years and don't find my bottle neck ever being the CPU. I can understand if people are getting bottle neck by a CPU after only a year or two why this would be a issue. For me it a none factor when making my buying decisions.

At this point for me it's more of a want than a need to upgrade. A friend of mine needs an upgrade bad from a P4.
 
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
2,074 (0.46/day)
Location
Jacksonhole Florida
System Name DEVIL'S ABYSS
Processor i7-4790K@4.6 GHz
Motherboard Asus Z97-Deluxe
Cooling Corsair H110 (2 x 140mm)(3 x 140mm case fans)
Memory 16GB Adata XPG V2 2400MHz
Video Card(s) EVGA 780 Ti Classified
Storage Intel 750 Series 400GB (AIC), Plextor M6e 256GB (M.2), 13 TB storage
Display(s) Crossover 27QW (27"@ 2560x1440)
Case Corsair Obsidian 750D Airflow
Audio Device(s) Realtek ALC1150
Power Supply Cooler Master V1000
Mouse Ttsports Talon Blu
Keyboard Logitech G510
Software Windows 10 Pro x64 version 1803
Benchmark Scores Passmark CPU score = 13080
Shallow minded, you are

There's a reason we have choices. Sorry I built my rig the way I wanted. At least Boards don't have to be upgraded every other year to support a new cpu, easy drop ins Like Super 7 was in the day, on top of that I'm not in debt because of a build. On another note there are better things in life than being at the computer 24/7.
Okay, forget brand loyalty - who are all these people who build gaming rigs, then feel the need to update ONLY their CPU, with every new generation or refresh? I just don't see the reasoning behind this, besides the "upgrade itch" for it's own sake.
 
Joined
Jan 12, 2012
Messages
73 (0.02/day)
Location
New York
System Name Build # 5
Processor I9-9900K
Motherboard ASUS-ROG Maximus XI Hero wifi
Cooling Cosair H100i aio
Memory G.SKILL 128GB (4 x 32GB) TridentZ RGB Series DDR4 PC4-21300 2666MHz Intel XMP 2.0
Video Card(s) EVGA RTX-3090 FTW3
Storage XPG S40G 2TB RGB Nand Gen3x4 NVMe
Display(s) LG-65CX-Oled
Case Corsair CC-9011030-WW Carbide Series Air 540 High Airflow ATX Cube Case - Black
Audio Device(s) EVGA Nu Audio card & BOSE Quietcomfort 35 II headphones
Power Supply CORSAIR-HX-1050
Software WIN 10/64
Another reason to go with AMD instead of Intel. I mean, buying new motherboard because you want CPU upgrade just isn't of any fun... The way Intel is currently handling this is just stupid. They may just as well solder the damn CPU's to motherboards, they change them at such stupid rate.

Ha Ha, "solder" I see what you did there....Maybe they can "glue" the CPU with their shitty "paste" instead.
 
Joined
Nov 21, 2010
Messages
2,355 (0.46/day)
Location
Right where I want to be
System Name Miami
Processor Ryzen 3800X
Motherboard Asus Crosshair VII Formula
Cooling Ek Velocity/ 2x 280mm Radiators/ Alphacool fullcover
Memory F4-3600C16Q-32GTZNC
Video Card(s) XFX 6900 XT Speedster 0
Storage 1TB WD M.2 SSD/ 2TB WD SN750/ 4TB WD Black HDD
Display(s) DELL AW3420DW / HP ZR24w
Case Lian Li O11 Dynamic XL
Audio Device(s) EVGA Nu Audio
Power Supply Seasonic Prime Gold 1000W+750W
Mouse Corsair Scimitar/Glorious Model O-
Keyboard Corsair K95 Platinum
Software Windows 10 Pro
@RejZoR Good old praising Vega and RyZen while using Intel and just bought a 1080Ti. Very convincing, bro. :D

These forums use :smh: make a pro-AMD, or anti-other guy comment: if you use their stuff, get called a fanboy; don't use their stuff, get called out anyway.
 

TheLostSwede

News Editor
Joined
Nov 11, 2004
Messages
17,776 (2.42/day)
Location
Sweden
System Name Overlord Mk MLI
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D
Motherboard Gigabyte X670E Aorus Master
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 SE with offsets
Memory 32GB Team T-Create Expert DDR5 6000 MHz @ CL30-34-34-68
Video Card(s) Gainward GeForce RTX 4080 Phantom GS
Storage 1TB Solidigm P44 Pro, 2 TB Corsair MP600 Pro, 2TB Kingston KC3000
Display(s) Acer XV272K LVbmiipruzx 4K@160Hz
Case Fractal Design Torrent Compact
Audio Device(s) Corsair Virtuoso SE
Power Supply be quiet! Pure Power 12 M 850 W
Mouse Logitech G502 Lightspeed
Keyboard Corsair K70 Max
Software Windows 10 Pro
Benchmark Scores https://valid.x86.fr/yfsd9w
Good points. The people bitching are mostly AMD users (they're usually budget-limited, or they'd buy Intel). Amd users feel the need for a new CPU the minute they build a system, because they don't buy top parts, and are hoping for a pencil mod to magically make their CPU twice as fast for free! The frequent motherboard change is one of the strengths of Intel, not a weakness at all. Intel users want top performance, not a bargain deal. Using a board for multiple generations is just another compromise, sacrificing performance or connectivity just to save a few bucks. I always sold my old Intel parts as a working system, and that covered half to 2/3 the cost of the new rig, and now all my friends have better gaming rigs for a lower price, and free lifetime support (parts extra!).

You think? Then you might have to rethink as I went from Intel to AMD when Ryzen launched. Nothing to do with budget, as I could've gotten either or.

I used to to give away my old parts, as I'm not cheap like you...
 
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
2,074 (0.46/day)
Location
Jacksonhole Florida
System Name DEVIL'S ABYSS
Processor i7-4790K@4.6 GHz
Motherboard Asus Z97-Deluxe
Cooling Corsair H110 (2 x 140mm)(3 x 140mm case fans)
Memory 16GB Adata XPG V2 2400MHz
Video Card(s) EVGA 780 Ti Classified
Storage Intel 750 Series 400GB (AIC), Plextor M6e 256GB (M.2), 13 TB storage
Display(s) Crossover 27QW (27"@ 2560x1440)
Case Corsair Obsidian 750D Airflow
Audio Device(s) Realtek ALC1150
Power Supply Cooler Master V1000
Mouse Ttsports Talon Blu
Keyboard Logitech G510
Software Windows 10 Pro x64 version 1803
Benchmark Scores Passmark CPU score = 13080
I went from Intel to AMD when Ryzen launched. Nothing to do with budget, as I could've gotten either or
Is there some reason you did this? You like solving driver problems? Is your favorite hobby buying lots of RAM until you find a kit that works? Did you feel like an elitist asshole when you had the fast Intel rig? Were your frame rates too high? Or some weird "I support the underdog, I'm a better person than you" thing? We all do strange things sometimes...
 
Joined
Jul 13, 2016
Messages
3,334 (1.08/day)
Processor Ryzen 7800X3D
Motherboard ASRock X670E Taichi
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 Chromax
Memory 32GB DDR5 6000 CL30
Video Card(s) MSI RTX 4090 Trio
Storage Too much
Display(s) Acer Predator XB3 27" 240 Hz
Case Thermaltake Core X9
Audio Device(s) Topping DX5, DCA Aeon II
Power Supply Seasonic Prime Titanium 850w
Mouse G305
Keyboard Wooting HE60
VR HMD Valve Index
Software Win 10
This is both good and bad.

The good is that you can upgrade your CPU without having to touch a single other component in your system.

The bad is you won't get any other system improvements.

However, the AM4 platform is far from perfect in my opinion. AMD went a bit too stingy on the PCIe lane count so it's not possible to add a second NVMe drive or other high-speed interface cards such as RAID, 10Gbps etc. which is disappointing. If only there had been support for an additional four PCIe lanes, the overall platform would've been so much better.

Sadly this doesn't look like it's something that can or will be addressed until we have a new socket now, so anyone with an AM4 system is going to be slightly limited to what they can stick in their system. Ok, 10Gbps Ethernet can still go via the chipset, but might be a bottlenecked slightly, but other things will be far too limited to go through there.

The pictured board is actually good example of a very limited product, as you have to chose between M.2 or U.2 and PCIe x4 2.0 or M.2 PCIe 2.0, as you only get one or the other, not both.

So let's hope AMD thinks ahead a little bit more when they make their next socket and does something a little bit more future proof when it comes to expandability, not just CPU upgrades.

"AMD went a bit too stingy on the PCIe lane count"

and yet threadripper, which destroys Intel in PCIe lane count. FYI most consumer motherboards don't even have 2 M.2 slots so you are going to need to buy something like a threadripper regardless.

"The bad is you won't get any other system improvements."

What? You do realize that AMD is still going to release a new chipset with each new Zen generation right? Other system improvements are completely possible.

"Ok, 10Gbps Ethernet can still go via the chipset, but might be a bottlenecked slightly, but other things will be far too limited to go through there."

Um no, 10Gbps is completely possible with zero bottleneck. The ASRock x370 gaming pro has a 5Gbps LAN right now.
 
Joined
Oct 15, 2013
Messages
23 (0.01/day)
System Name My PC
Processor Intel 3770k
Motherboard MSI Z77a-GD65
Cooling Corsair H100i
Memory Corsair 2133mhz 16gb
Video Card(s) xfx HD 7870 Black x2
Isn't this topic a bit worn out already?

Do we really need an article every month reminding us that AM4 can't afford to redesign the socket more often? Do we really need the comments stating that it's great?

Upgrade sockets you say.... List all the changes in the socket since say Z87/Z97. Not much really, I think the biggest change was DMI 3.0.

I like to hear tech news in general. It's very easy to not read it judging by the title of the article. ;)


And why would anyone upgrade a one year old system with a new one? Even if they sell the old CPU, it's still a waste of money. Intel chooses to bring new platform features over prioritizing those 0.1% of buyers who want to upgrade to every new iteration. In reality nearly everyone keeps motherboard, CPU and RAM "bundled together" throughout the lifespan of a system. Graphics cards, SSDs, HDDs, etc. are on the other hand easy to swap independently.


Why are you sugar-coating it?
Vega is the largest failure in many years for AMD, and there is no reason to buy it for gaming. So when a product is inferior, the fans keep focusing on theoretical specs over actual performance…

Freesync with 1080 like performance. That's a pretty good reason if you can find them priced accordingly.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jul 31, 2014
Messages
481 (0.13/day)
System Name Diablo | Baal | Mephisto | Andariel
Processor i5-3570K@4.4GHz | 2x Xeon X5675 | i7-4710MQ | i7-2640M
Motherboard Asus Sabertooth Z77 | HP DL380 G6 | Dell Precision M4800 | Lenovo Thinkpad X220 Tablet
Cooling Swiftech H220-X | Chassis cooled (6 fans + HS) | dual-fanned heatpipes | small-fanned heatpipe
Memory 32GiB DDR3-1600 CL9 | 96GiB DDR3-1333 ECC RDIMM | 32GiB DDR3L-1866 CL11 | 8GiB DDR3L-1600 CL11
Video Card(s) Dual GTX 670 in SLI | Embedded ATi ES1000 | Quadro K2100M | Intel HD 3000
Storage many, many SSDs and HDDs....
Display(s) 1 Dell U3011 + 2x Dell U2410 | HP iLO2 KVMoIP | 3200x1800 Sharp IGZO | 1366x768 IPS with Wacom pen
Case Corsair Obsidian 550D | HP DL380 G6 Chassis | Dell Precision M4800 | Lenovo Thinkpad X220 Tablet
Audio Device(s) Auzentech X-Fi HomeTheater HD | None | On-board | On-board
Power Supply Corsair AX850 | Dual 750W Redundant PSU (Delta) | Dell 330W+240W (Flextronics) | Lenovo 65W (Delta)
Mouse Logitech G502, Logitech G700s, Logitech G500, Dell optical mouse (emergency backup)
Keyboard 1985 IBM Model F 122-key, Ducky YOTT MX Black, Dell AT101W, 1994 IBM Model M, various integrated
Software FAAAR too much to list
Upgrade sockets you say.... List all the changes in the socket since say Z87/Z97. Not much really, I think the biggest change was DMI 3.0.

I like to hear tech news in general. It's very easy to not read it judging by the title of the article. ;)

Move back to fully external VRMs on Skylake is the major one, then the later pin-reassignment from LGA1151-1 of 200-series to LGA1151-2 of 300-series (now there's one that could have used a new socket...).

Really, as far a DT platforms go, Intel has been very reasonable with socket changes and compatibility overall.
 
Joined
Oct 15, 2013
Messages
23 (0.01/day)
System Name My PC
Processor Intel 3770k
Motherboard MSI Z77a-GD65
Cooling Corsair H100i
Memory Corsair 2133mhz 16gb
Video Card(s) xfx HD 7870 Black x2
Move back to fully external VRMs on Skylake is the major one, then the later pin-reassignment from LGA1151-1 of 200-series to LGA1151-2 of 300-series (now there's one that could have used a new socket...).

Really, as far a DT platforms go, Intel has been very reasonable with socket changes and compatibility overall.


I do believe motherboard manufacturers have come out and said that Z370 was not necessary and could have worked on Z270.

Correct me if I'm wrong though as the specifics slip my mind at the moment. :)
 
Joined
Jun 28, 2016
Messages
3,595 (1.16/day)
FYI most consumer motherboards don't even have 2 M.2 slots so you are going to need to buy something like a threadripper regardless.
This might be true for AMD Zen platform. Since 200-series dual M.2 became pretty pedestrian in the Intel world (possibly because of Optane).

What? You do realize that AMD is still going to release a new chipset with each new Zen generation right? Other system improvements are completely possible.

No one said that new chipsets won't be released and AMD users won't have access to new or fixed tech (although it is a possibility, obviously).

It's exactly these new features and system improvements that will push current Ryzen users to update the mobo as well - not just the CPU. So the AM4 longevity is a little overrated.

Um no, 10Gbps is completely possible with zero bottleneck. The ASRock x370 gaming pro has a 5Gbps LAN right now.
Says you?

I'm looking at the top of the range ASRock X370 Fatal1ty Professional. Next to the ASRock Z370 Fatal1ty Professional, which is just $40 more, it looks like it came from a lower segment.

Z370 has 10Gbit LAN and dual 1GBit (X370: 5GBit + 1GBit)
Z370 has 3 fast M.2 (X370: 1 fast, 1 slow)
Z370 has 3 PCIe 3.0 x16 (X370: 2)
Z370 has 3 USB 3.1 Gen2 (X370: 2)
 
Joined
Apr 12, 2013
Messages
7,563 (1.77/day)
So you're suggesting adding M.2, 10Gbps Ethernet and anything that's going through the chipset today and don't think there will be a bottleneck between the chipset and CPU if multiple things are used at once? Good luck with that, as it's already been shown to be a bottleneck on Intel's platforms.

The comment about no other system improvements was with regards to only upgrading the CPU and I'm sorry if this wasn't clear.
The M.2 drives IIRC connect directly with the CPU, for AMD, & only 5/10G ethernet need to be routed via chipset.

The next year or two we'll see PCIe 4.0 (or 5.0) getting adopted so the question of lanes becomes moot. Especially for AMD since Ryzen is an SoC, Intel as we know is limited by DMI.
 
Joined
Apr 12, 2013
Messages
7,563 (1.77/day)
Please read the post I replied to. Yes, one M.2 goes directly via the CPU, but the whole thing is based on my first post stating that AMD missed out by not adding four more PCIe lanes from the CPU and him saying that it'll work just fine using AMD's yet unknown next gen chipset as it'll surely be PCIe 3.0 and there won't be a bottleneck connecting all these things at the same time through the chipset.

I really wish people could read before posting arguments for or against something without know where the discussion started...
I'm countering part of what you're saying by adding that Ryzen is an SoC, so for instance if the upcoming PR or RR have PCIe 4.0 then M.2 or even 5/10G will not be bottlenecked (by limited amount of PCIe lanes) to the extent we're seeing today with first gen Ryzen.
 
Joined
Oct 27, 2009
Messages
1,190 (0.21/day)
Location
Republic of Texas
System Name [H]arbringer
Processor 4x 61XX ES @3.5Ghz (48cores)
Motherboard SM GL
Cooling 3x xspc rx360, rx240, 4x DT G34 snipers, D5 pump.
Memory 16x gskill DDR3 1600 cas6 2gb
Video Card(s) blah bigadv folder no gfx needed
Storage 32GB Sammy SSD
Display(s) headless
Case Xigmatek Elysium (whats left of it)
Audio Device(s) yawn
Power Supply Antec 1200w HCP
Software Ubuntu 10.10
Benchmark Scores http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=1780855 http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2158678 http://ww
Nothing theoretical about vega gaming performance. It is 1080ish without async and use of packed math.

I have a 1080ti for gaming and 4 vega64s for compute. Why? Because that gives me 100Tflops of tensorflow compute. Vega is probably rop limited for gaming... but it excels at compute.

Hoping the die shrink leads to higher clocked R7s.
 

newtekie1

Semi-Retired Folder
Joined
Nov 22, 2005
Messages
28,473 (4.08/day)
Location
Indiana, USA
Processor Intel Core i7 10850K@5.2GHz
Motherboard AsRock Z470 Taichi
Cooling Corsair H115i Pro w/ Noctua NF-A14 Fans
Memory 32GB DDR4-3600
Video Card(s) RTX 2070 Super
Storage 500GB SX8200 Pro + 8TB with 1TB SSD Cache
Display(s) Acer Nitro VG280K 4K 28"
Case Fractal Design Define S
Audio Device(s) Onboard is good enough for me
Power Supply eVGA SuperNOVA 1000w G3
Software Windows 10 Pro x64
This is not what we were discussing if you'd actually read the posts. The discussion was about adding more lanes directly from the CPU, not via the chipset, so there's nothing untrue about it.

Going via a multiplexed solution via the chipset is an option, but the bandwidth to the CPU is then shared by all devices which can be a bottleneck. For most people it won't be and as I mentioned in another post in this thread, at least as far as NVMe drives are concerned, it doesn't seem to benefit AMD to have a direct link to the CPU as long as you only have one drive.

No, that's not what we are discussing. Re-read the original post, what lanes btarunr is talking about, and what you responded to on the first page, the post I responded to. We are talking about the lanes off the chipset.

particularly to address 300-series chipset's main shortcoming, just 6-8 older PCI-Express gen 2.0 general purpose lanes (while Intel chipsets put out up to 24 gen 3.0 lanes).

We are specifically talking about the chipset lanes. The actual fact is that Ryzen has more PCI-E lanes coming off the CPU than Intel does. The Ryzen CPU provides 24 PCI-E 3.0 lanes, Intel's Coffee/Kaby/Sky Lake only provide 20 PCI-E 3.0 lanes.

Ryzen = 24 lanes = 16 for Graphics, 4 for NVMe, 4 for link to Chipset

Intel CFL = 20 lanes = 16 for Graphics, 4 for link to Chipset

With Intel, none of the NVMe drives are running from the CPU itself because of the limited PCI-E lanes from the CPU.

So, there are two options:

1.) We were talking about the PCI-E lanes coming off the CPU, in which case you were wrong in your statement about AMD being too stingy, because they obviously were not since they have more lanes than Intel.

OR

2.) We were talking about the lanes coming from the chipset(we were) in which AMD has the same bandwidth between the chipset and the CPU, which means they have plenty of room to expand the lanes provided by the chipset and you were wrong.

You can pick which situations you think we were actually talking about, but either way, you were wrong.

So you're suggesting adding M.2, 10Gbps Ethernet and anything that's going through the chipset today and don't think there will be a bottleneck between the chipset and CPU if multiple things are used at once? Good luck with that, as it's already been shown to be a bottleneck on Intel's platforms.

Except it hasn't really been shown to be a bottleneck in Intel's system, not that I've seen. I've run NVMe and 10Gb/s network through the chipset just fine. The link between the CPU and chipset is a 31.5Gb/s link. If you use 10Gb/s ethernet, that still leaves 21.5Gb/s for everything else. That is still an insane amount of bandwidth. Yeah, that might slightly bottleneck the fastest NVMe drives, but not to a noticeable degree. It's still 2.6GB/s of bandwidth! That's enough for an NVMe drive, a SATA storage drive, and some USB 3.0 ports to be active without any noticeable slowdown.

I really wish people could read before posting arguments for or against something without know where the discussion started...

Yes, indeed it would be nice if people wouldn't post without knowing where the discussion started...:rolleyes:

Because, the fact is we were talking about the chipset lanes. Nothing in your original post suggests you, for whatever reason, were talking about the CPU other than you stating they need a new socket for more PCI-E lanes, which doesn't make any sense when you actually know what you're talking about. No one before you was talking about the CPU lanes, and you never mention in your post you were talking about the CPU. Everyone else in this thread is talking about the chipset.

And the fact is, AMD could actually make the link to the Chipset twice as fast an Intel very easily. They have 8 extra PCI-E lanes on their CPU while Intel only has 4. Right now, AMD divides the 8 lanes as 4+4, 4 for the chipset and 4 for an NVMe drive. However, if they develop a more capable chipset with more PCI-E 3.0 lanes, they could take the 4 lanes currently used for NVMe connection and instead use those for the connection to the chipset, giving twice the bandwidth between the CPU and chipset that Intel has. That would be 63Gb/s, or 7.8GB/s. More than enough for an NVMe RAID array, 10Gb/s ethernet, all the USB ports you would want, and plenty of SATA ports.

This likely could be done with the current processors too. The motherboard would decided where the PCI-E lanes are directed. If a CPU is put in an older board, then the current configuration is used. If the CPU is put in a motherboard with a newer chipset, then all 8 lanes are used for the chipset connection, and the chipset then provides more lanes for NVMe and other expansion cards.
 
Last edited:

eidairaman1

The Exiled Airman
Joined
Jul 2, 2007
Messages
42,632 (6.68/day)
Location
Republic of Texas (True Patriot)
System Name PCGOD
Processor AMD FX 8350@ 5.0GHz
Motherboard Asus TUF 990FX Sabertooth R2 2901 Bios
Cooling Scythe Ashura, 2×BitFenix 230mm Spectre Pro LED (Blue,Green), 2x BitFenix 140mm Spectre Pro LED
Memory 16 GB Gskill Ripjaws X 2133 (2400 OC, 10-10-12-20-20, 1T, 1.65V)
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon 290 Sapphire Vapor-X
Storage Samsung 840 Pro 256GB, WD Velociraptor 1TB
Display(s) NEC Multisync LCD 1700V (Display Port Adapter)
Case AeroCool Xpredator Evil Blue Edition
Audio Device(s) Creative Labs Sound Blaster ZxR
Power Supply Seasonic 1250 XM2 Series (XP3)
Mouse Roccat Kone XTD
Keyboard Roccat Ryos MK Pro
Software Windows 7 Pro 64
Okay, forget brand loyalty - who are all these people who build gaming rigs, then feel the need to update ONLY their CPU, with every new generation or refresh? I just don't see the reasoning behind this, besides the "upgrade itch" for it's own sake.

I feel sorry for how lost you are
 

newtekie1

Semi-Retired Folder
Joined
Nov 22, 2005
Messages
28,473 (4.08/day)
Location
Indiana, USA
Processor Intel Core i7 10850K@5.2GHz
Motherboard AsRock Z470 Taichi
Cooling Corsair H115i Pro w/ Noctua NF-A14 Fans
Memory 32GB DDR4-3600
Video Card(s) RTX 2070 Super
Storage 500GB SX8200 Pro + 8TB with 1TB SSD Cache
Display(s) Acer Nitro VG280K 4K 28"
Case Fractal Design Define S
Audio Device(s) Onboard is good enough for me
Power Supply eVGA SuperNOVA 1000w G3
Software Windows 10 Pro x64
I feel sorry for how lost you are

I have to agree with Hood here. Back in the day, yeah, a lot more people upgraded just their CPUs. But back in the day, most computers were owned by enthusiasts. It wasn't a household appliance.

But now, the overwhelming majority of people do not upgrade just their CPU. So ensuring that feature isn't something the CPU manufacturers have to consider anymore. Even gamers and people that build their own systems rarely upgrade just the CPU because they want the new generation. Yes, there are some, a small some, that do it to because they originally bought a Pentium 2c/2t and want to upgrade to an i5 or i7, or an FX 4c/4t and wand to upgrade to 8c/8t, etc. But at the same time, a large reasoning for the lack of interested to upgrade to new new generation CPU is the gap between generations has greatly decreased. Back in the day, there was a pretty significant bump in performance going from a 386 to a 486, and that is why a pin compatible 486 was released for 386 motherboards. But today, we see tiny generation improvements. I mean, that's why I'm still running a 4 generation old i7 in my gaming rig. There was no compelling improvement for me to upgrade to the new generations, even if they were compatible with my motherboard, it really wouldn't have even been worth the wasted effort of pulling things apart to put in a new processor. An hour of my time isn't worth a performance improvement that I won't even notice. And I'm an enthusiast and a gamer. Normal people don't upgrade their CPUs. And in the 15+ years I've been working in and running computer repair shops, I've only ever had one person come in asking for just a cpu upgrade. While most people would rather just go out and buy a whole new computer than spend the money on a CPU upgrade.
 

Norton

Moderator - Returning from the Darkness
Joined
Dec 21, 2011
Messages
14,108 (2.97/day)
Location
Northeast USA
System Name Main PC- Gamer- Main Cruncher/Folder and too many crunching/folding rigs
Processor Ryzen 5900X- Ryzen 5950X- Ryzen 3950X and etc...
Motherboard Asrock X570 Extreme4- MSI X570S Tomahawk MAX WiFi- MSI B450M Bazooka Max and etc...
Cooling Noctua NH-U14S (dual fan)- EK 360 AIO with push/pull fans- Corsair H115i RGB Pro XT and etc...
Memory 2x16GB GSkill FlareX 3200/c14- 4x8GB Corsair Vengeance 3600/c16- 2x16GB Team 3600/c18 and etc..
Video Card(s) MSI Gaming RX 6800- Asus RTX 3070 TUF OC- MSI Ventus GTX 1660Ti and etc...
Storage Main PC (1TB WD SN850- 2TB PNY CS 3040- 2TB Seagate Firecuda) and etc...
Display(s) Main PC (2x24" Dell UltraSharp U2414H)
Case Phanteks P600s- Seasonic Q704- Fractal Meshify C and etc...
Audio Device(s) Logitech Z625 THX 2.1 speakers
Power Supply EVGA 750 G3- SeaSonic DGC 750- EVGA P2 850 and etc...
Mouse G300s
Keyboard Corsair K65
VR HMD N/A
Software Windows 10 Pro or Ubuntu
Benchmark Scores Why sit on the Bench when you can get in the game and Crunch!!!
This is not what we were discussing if you'd actually read the posts. The discussion was about adding more lanes directly from the CPU, not via the chipset, so there's nothing untrue about it.

Going via a multiplexed solution via the chipset is an option, but the bandwidth to the CPU is then shared by all devices which can be a bottleneck. For most people it won't be and as I mentioned in another post in this thread, at least as far as NVMe drives are concerned, it doesn't seem to benefit AMD to have a direct link to the CPU as long as you only have one drive.

You think? Then you might have to rethink as I went from Intel to AMD when Ryzen launched. Nothing to do with budget, as I could've gotten either or.

I used to to give away my old parts, as I'm not cheap like you...


@TheLostSwede - please to edit the first post rather than replying multiple times in a row from now on- recommend you edit your posts before a section or super mod has to come in and do it.

See guide below for reference:
https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/...osts-and-use-the-multi-quote-features.234427/
 

TheLostSwede

News Editor
Joined
Nov 11, 2004
Messages
17,776 (2.42/day)
Location
Sweden
System Name Overlord Mk MLI
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D
Motherboard Gigabyte X670E Aorus Master
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 SE with offsets
Memory 32GB Team T-Create Expert DDR5 6000 MHz @ CL30-34-34-68
Video Card(s) Gainward GeForce RTX 4080 Phantom GS
Storage 1TB Solidigm P44 Pro, 2 TB Corsair MP600 Pro, 2TB Kingston KC3000
Display(s) Acer XV272K LVbmiipruzx 4K@160Hz
Case Fractal Design Torrent Compact
Audio Device(s) Corsair Virtuoso SE
Power Supply be quiet! Pure Power 12 M 850 W
Mouse Logitech G502 Lightspeed
Keyboard Corsair K70 Max
Software Windows 10 Pro
Benchmark Scores https://valid.x86.fr/yfsd9w
@TheLostSwede - please to edit the first post rather than replying multiple times in a row from now on- recommend you edit your posts before a section or super mod has to come in and do it.

See guide below for reference:
https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/...osts-and-use-the-multi-quote-features.234427/

You know, it's fine, I've removed the posts I could, please remove the rest and I'll stay out of this "discussion" where apparently only some people have the right to an opinion. Apparently I'm an idiot that knows nothing, not even what I wrote.
 
Top