Dell and HP Not Interested in Jumping on the NVIDIA GPP Bandwagon

[Fatalfury]

After Seeing AMD's release of RX 500X series.. i stopped caring about AMD after that
this time not even 0.1% difference...not even like rx 470 vs rx 570..
Just adding an 'X' in the name for a yearly release???? thats all you got..??

Perhaps we just need more Nvidia brands because everybody deep inside knows they are the one innovating & are 2 years ahead of AMD in PC Gaming.
They(Nvidia) got the R & D, They got the Innovation, They got the performance, They got the Effeciency, They got the Stock,

Because AMD is just casual coz they got PS4,Xbox & MAC Pros..(AMD are monoply in their own way..)
I guess Nvidia is right after all...Need all OEM to jump ship..or get stuck behind with old tech & no stock..

 

[Xaled]

After Seeing AMD's release of RX 500X series.. i stopped caring about AMD after that
this time not even 0.1% difference...not even like rx 470 vs rx 570..
Just adding an 'X' in the name for a yearly release???? thats all you got..??

Perhaps we just need more Nvidia brands because everybody deep inside knows they are the one innovating & are 2 years ahead of AMD in PC Gaming.
They(Nvidia) got the R & D, They got the Innovation, They got the performance, They got the Effeciency, They got the Stock,

Because AMD is just casual coz they got PS4,Xbox & MAC Pros..(AMD are monoply in their own way..)
I guess Nvidia is right after all...Need all OEM to jump ship..or get stuck behind with old tech & no stock..

innovative my ass. they rename existing technology and sell it under another name for 2x the price (for example g-sync). they bribe gaming developers. bribe reviewers. brainwash kiddies.
we are still getting the same performance/price since 2012. single gpu prices went from 400$ to 3000$..

 

[jabbadap]

Dell and HP cannot join the GPP for obvious reason, they build computers to suit the consumers specification. They dont manufacture video cards.

IF the sole source for this news is Kyle Bennett, I call clickbait with this article.

I would argue they do in notebook space. I.E Dell/Alienware has it's own motherboard design there and they actually use soldered bga chips instead of some oem mxm cards.

Spoiler: i.e. GPU-Z of Alienware 17" R4 with soldered gtx 1080, Note dell as subvendor(1028)

 

[bgunner]

They will join sooner or later..
its just a matter of time.
with AMD just releasing an 'X' in their name for a yearly upgrade of their cards..

i guess every one will be pissed off by the lack of innovation & annoying rebadging & rebranding..from the RED team.

It is not just a red team thing to take A GPU and rename it with a slight clock bump since the green team does the same exact thing. On average there is a new architecture every 2 times they release a new model number. This is the way for both teams to get the most from the architecture and give time for development of the next one. So to say " i guess every one will be pissed off by the lack of innovation & annoying rebadging & rebranding..from the RED team." is a bit of a stretch since BOTH do the same thing and have done it for years. Look into the Nvidia G92 and G92b dies and tell me that other than a die shrink that the architecture is different... this is back in '07-'08. Green team is guilty too.

 

[AsRock]

Glad to see some of the heavyweights resisting this NVIDIA ridiculousness.

I just hope it encourages more to join them.

 

[remunramu]

Im pretty sure in the distant future NVIDIA will get sue for this. GPP is absolutely illegal, for now GPP might not violate any regulation or whatsoever but soon someone will find a crack and sue NVIDIA for this anti consumer practices. NAME/BRAND is pretty big deal, remember when Intel practices asked OEMs not to sell AMD product years ago? The damage on AMD was big. I have a sister, shes 35, a lecturer in university. Shes just a common people with common to low knowledge about PC, when I gave her Ryzen PC last year, she thought Intel was the only CPU maker in this world and she never heard about AMD. Well-known BRAND = People assured = More sales. Unknown/New BRAND = People hesitant = Less sales. See what I mean here? >.<

 

[Fatalfury]

It is not just a red team thing to take A GPU and rename it with a slight clock bump since the green team does the same exact thing. On average there is a new architecture every 2 times they release a new model number. This is the way for both teams to get the most from the architecture and give time for development of the next one. So to say " i guess every one will be pissed off by the lack of innovation & annoying rebadging & rebranding..from the RED team." is a bit of a stretch since BOTH do the same thing and have done it for years. Look into the Nvidia G92 and G92b dies and tell me that other than a die shrink that the architecture is different... this is back in '07-'08. Green team is guilty too.

i am not sure if your getting it right..or your just ignorant..
yea Nvidia also reuse/modify exisiting architectures...but was long ago..

For ex GTX 760 -> gtx 960 -> gtx 1060

They ve been giving solid 25%+ increase in performance every year while getting more & more efficient.
i dont see where there's a decrease in performance or effeciency..

while AMD

RX 270 -> RX 370 (Same ...$#!$)
RX 470 -> 570-> 570X (Same...)
while every Gen keeps getting less efficient..they just keep pulling power power to push for that 5% Performance..(not so innovative eh)

 

[cdawall]

RX 270 -> RX 370 (Same ...$#!$)
RX 470 -> 570-> 570X (Same...)
while every Gen keeps getting less efficient..they just keep pulling power power to push for that 5% Performance..(not so innovative eh)

Each generation for amd has gotten quite a bit better performance per watt when utilized.

290x/390x Hawaii silicon was replaced by the 480 at roughly double the performance per watt. Some of the later 580 silicon and current drivers depending on game put it at a better performance per watt than pascal. Vega is horribly under utilized and while a massive portion of that can and will fall onto AMD for releasing yet again a general purpose shader instead of nvidias stripped down gaming shaders the point still stands for raw performance. A vega FE 4096 shader unit does outperform even a GP100 based unit on the compute side of the world. The issue is showing that in games.

 

[close]

When companies resort to this kind of "deals" that basically involve blackmail you know they are getting corrupt to the core. When Intel did it we got 10 years of low single digit yearly performance bumps for ever increasing prices. At one point even reputable tech news outlets were insisting that it's because "it's next to impossible to make a CPU faster than that every generation on keep the prices down". Then along came AMD with the very same "impossible improvement and low prices".
If Nvidia gets their way we'll have go back to that situation. They've learned from "the best".

 

[Tsukiyomi91]

Nvidia's GPP is a huge controversy right from the start. it's a good thing that Dell, HP & Lenovo aren't buying their ridiculous plans to get rid of AMD from the market. Hopefully other OEMs & AIB vendors will decline Nvidia's ridiculoud plans. I may be on the green camp, but the lack of competition is not helping the market one bit. AMD should step up their game if they really want to attract buyers to even up the playing field, especially with budget-oriented gamers making up the most of the PC sales. Innovation is one big hurdle for AMD's GPU division. As long they keep using old chips while stretching beyond it's theoretical limits with little to no performance gains, then it's a losing fight right from the start. Dunno whether I should pray hard that AMD make something better than Vega or this GPU game they're playing will kick them out for good, leaving their processor market against Intel.

 

[Sempron Guy]

they are inclined to refuse unless of course...

 

[bgunner]

i am not sure if your getting it right..or your just ignorant..
yea Nvidia also reuse/modify exisiting architectures...but was long ago..

For ex GTX 760 -> gtx 960 -> gtx 1060

They ve been giving solid 25%+ increase in performance every year while getting more & more efficient.
i dont see where there's a decrease in performance or effeciency..

while AMD

RX 270 -> RX 370 (Same ...$#!$)
RX 470 -> 570-> 570X (Same...)
while every Gen keeps getting less efficient..they just keep pulling power power to push for that 5% Performance..(not so innovative eh)

OK using your example the GTX 760 was actually a refresh of the GTX 660 Kelper. The GTX 660 Kelper was released on September 13, 2012 while it's refresh, the GTX 760 Kelper, was released on June 25, 2014 (less than 4 years ago). The GTX 960 Maxwell which was released on January 22, 2015 was a new architecture and then the GTX 1060 which was released on July 19, 2016 is a Pascal GPU so there is is only 2 generations of Nvidia not refreshing older architecture. So as you can see it has not even been 3 years since Nvidia has seemingly stopped using a refresh so to say, and I quote "Nvidia also reuse/modify exisiting architectures...but was long ago.." was a false statement.

Actually when AMD released the 4xx and 5xx series the performance per watt dramatically increased not to mention the total overall wattage used dropped. So again you saying and I quote "while every Gen keeps getting less efficient..they just keep pulling power power to push for that 5% Performance.." is again a false statement.

So in conclusion I believe you said it best with "i am not sure if your getting it right..or your just ignorant.." but this time I am referring to you and your understanding of current GPU situation. It is very apparent that you are an Nvidia fan, which is fine, but when it comes down to comparing different company's your preference needs to stay in the back ground and compare just the facts and the facts say you are really not caught up on both company's, performance / architecture and how the company's are currently operating.

 

[evernessince]

Hey DELL and HP, I wont be buying your products either. And NO its not because I dislike AMD, i have a card in use right now. And have had many rigs built around them, I just will not support companies essentially banning NVIDA. Besides, I want the next gen Nvidia in my next rig.

/facepalm

You obviously have no idea what you are talking about, this has nothing to do with banning Nvidia, more like the opposite.

After Seeing AMD's release of RX 500X series.. i stopped caring about AMD after that
this time not even 0.1% difference...not even like rx 470 vs rx 570..
Just adding an 'X' in the name for a yearly release???? thats all you got..??

Perhaps we just need more Nvidia brands because everybody deep inside knows they are the one innovating & are 2 years ahead of AMD in PC Gaming.
They(Nvidia) got the R & D, They got the Innovation, They got the performance, They got the Effeciency, They got the Stock,

Because AMD is just casual coz they got PS4,Xbox & MAC Pros..(AMD are monoply in their own way..)
I guess Nvidia is right after all...Need all OEM to jump ship..or get stuck behind with old tech & no stock..

You must have forgot about Nvidia's 9800, which was renamed / rebranded like 5 times. FYI RX 500X series is OEM only, I fail to see how it even effects you as a consumer.

i am not sure if your getting it right..or your just ignorant..
yea Nvidia also reuse/modify exisiting architectures...but was long ago..

For ex GTX 760 -> gtx 960 -> gtx 1060

They ve been giving solid 25%+ increase in performance every year while getting more & more efficient.
i dont see where there's a decrease in performance or effeciency..

while AMD

RX 270 -> RX 370 (Same ...$#!$)
RX 470 -> 570-> 570X (Same...)
while every Gen keeps getting less efficient..they just keep pulling power power to push for that 5% Performance..(not so innovative eh)

/facepalm

FYI "RX 270" and "RX 370" aren't even real cards.

The 570X is not a replacement for the 570. The 500X series is OEM ONLY. It's becoming apparent that only about half the people in the comments actually read the articles they claim to know about.

 

[bgunner]

The 8800 GT had the G92 Tesla chip, the 9800 GT had the G92b Tesla chip which was a die shrink from the 65 nm process tothe 55 nm process. Also the G92b Tesla chip was also used in the GTS 150 and lower end 200 series GPU's the GeForce GTS 250, GTS 240 GPUs. This make the G92 chip used 4 times with different names. Nvidia was renaming their chips before the Tesla architecture at least starting with the 6000 renamed to the 7000 series if not before, so back in 2005ish.

Just an FYI post.

 

[Super XP]

What if nvidia says: Ok, stick to AMD, gl

Imagine Alienware with Vega disaster only

Vega disaster? Claiming Vega is a disaster is nonsense of course.
Nvidia may have faster high end GPUs, but in no way can anybody claim Vega is not good for PC gaming. Its approx: 70% faster versus the RX 480 and 69% faster versus the RX 580. AMD will eventually come out with a top dog product to better combat the less than 1% high end GPU market. In the meantime, the 99% mainstream will have to do.

innovative my ass. they rename existing technology and sell it under another name for 2x the price (for example g-sync). they bribe gaming developers. bribe reviewers. brainwash kiddies.
we are still getting the same performance/price since 2012. single gpu prices went from 400$ to 3000$..

All thanks to Nvidia overpricing GPUs. Vega is highly innovative. Unfortunately, it also requires specific programming so it can be fully utilized. Vega today is ridiculously underutilized.

 

[GhostRyder]

Well, seeing as how these two are not GPU makers not sure if this would make much of a difference. Though I guess they could get the GPU's slower which could impede their new desktops/laptops designs that could be a problem. I mean for desktops I doubt it would change much since I doubt designs are going to change much in the next while, however in the laptop space that could be a problem being that these GPU's have had more significant changes over the last couple of years in terms of power and heat. But that is still just speculation on my part.

All thanks to Nvidia overpricing GPUs. Vega is highly innovative. Unfortunately, it also requires specific programming so it can be fully utilized. Vega today is ridiculously underutilized.

I agree, Nvidia has been holding off on putting out high end products at reasonable prices and slowly increasing the price over time. That being said, since the R9 290X we have not gotten a serious contender for the high end in a long time (I am not completely ignoring the Fury series, but besides the R9 Nano it was not that competitive especially compared to the R9 290X when facing off against its rival). Some of that lies on AMD's door step for not competing and honestly what do we expect NVidia to do, its easy money and they are a business trying to make money. Even with Vega not being utilized to its full extent its not going to make it jump by huge leaps even in an ideal scenario. Its a good card don't get me wrong, I just see it as late and still only decent competition for the GTX 1080 and missing out on the mobile market (For whatever reason, guessing the ram is a big issue). I would be very happy if they would release the Vega for mobile (even just the 56 model) with a Freesync panel for a good price. I love my RX 580 laptop with a Freesync panel, great value and performance!!!

 

[Super XP]

Great Points.
What AMD needs is to come out with a GPU that will have the same effect as the ZEN via the CPU market. Hopefully by 2020 we will see such a GPU. Despite Nvidia's intentions for GPP, it was the wrong move. They are essentially kicking a company that's been somewhat struggling with the GPU high end segment, AMD.

 

[evernessince]

The 8800 GT had the G92 Tesla chip, the 9800 GT had the G92b Tesla chip which was a die shrink from the 65 nm process tothe 55 nm process. Also the G92b Tesla chip was also used in the GTS 150 and lower end 200 series GPU's the GeForce GTS 250, GTS 240 GPUs. This make the G92 chip used 4 times with different names. Nvidia was renaming their chips before the Tesla architecture at least starting with the 6000 renamed to the 7000 series if not before, so back in 2005ish.

Just an FYI post.

Actually they are both G92 chips.

http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=575&card2=544

You do not even need to flash them for them to work in SLI

https://forums.geforce.com/default/...hing-you-39-ve-said-that-39-s-impossible-33-/

Some chips received the b designation but there was no difference in the hardware, it was a BIOS different only.

 

[jabbadap]

Actually they are both G92 chips.

http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=575&card2=544

You do not even need to flash them for them to work in SLI

https://forums.geforce.com/default/...hing-you-39-ve-said-that-39-s-impossible-33-/

Some chips received the b designation but there was no difference in the hardware, it was a BIOS different only.

9800 GT was using both of them, G92 tdp was 125W and G92b version had 105W tdp. There was obviously die size difference between 65nm G92(324mm²) and 55nm G92b(260mm²). Only new feature on G92b, which g92 lacks, was hybridPower(Switchable graphics, Nvidia's first steps to Optimus).

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

I would argue they do in notebook space. I.E Dell/Alienware has it's own motherboard design there and they actually use soldered bga chips instead of some oem mxm cards.

Spoiler: i.e. GPU-Z of Alienware 17" R4 with soldered gtx 1080, Note dell as subvendor(1028)

View attachment 99753

That, iirc, may be from a previous agreement that was before GPP became a thing, it doesnt prove anything.

 

[champsilva]

Vega disaster? Claiming Vega is a disaster is nonsense of course.
Nvidia may have faster high end GPUs, but in no way can anybody claim Vega is not good for PC gaming. Its approx: 70% faster versus the RX 480 and 69% faster versus the RX 580. AMD will eventually come out with a top dog product to better combat the less than 1% high end GPU market. In the meantime, the 99% mainstream will have to do.


All thanks to Nvidia overpricing GPUs. Vega is highly innovative. Unfortunately, it also requires specific programming so it can be fully utilized. Vega today is ridiculously underutilized.

1 year later after 1080, higher power consumption (Vega power consumption is almost the same of 1080 SLI), same performance of 1080, same price = FAILURE

Also, wheres AIB after 8months? This make me sake.

 

[Super XP]

No, Vega is not a fail. It might not beat out Nvidia's top cards, but its a good card. It plays anything you throw at it. It consumes more power, Oh Well, AMD will figure out the power consumption & speed/performance. They are already on it, by hiring somebody else to lead the Radeon Group division. AMD using ZEN beside Radeon is huge. Things will get much better.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

No, Vega is not a fail. It might not beat out Nvidia's top cards, but its a good card. It plays anything you throw at it. It consumes more power, Oh Well, AMD will figure out the power consumption & speed/performance. They are already on it, by hiring somebody else to lead the Radeon Group division. AMD using ZEN beside Radeon is huge. Things will get much better.

Actually you can get the same performance out of vega if/when you under volt which means less power consumption as well. There are several videos showing this.