• Welcome to TechPowerUp Forums, Guest! Please check out our forum guidelines for info related to our community.

NVIDIA Segregates Turing GPUs; Factory Overclocking Forbidden on the Cheaper Variant

btarunr

Editor & Senior Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Oct 9, 2007
Messages
47,252 (7.54/day)
Location
Hyderabad, India
System Name RBMK-1000
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 5700G
Motherboard ASUS ROG Strix B450-E Gaming
Cooling DeepCool Gammax L240 V2
Memory 2x 8GB G.Skill Sniper X
Video Card(s) Palit GeForce RTX 2080 SUPER GameRock
Storage Western Digital Black NVMe 512GB
Display(s) BenQ 1440p 60 Hz 27-inch
Case Corsair Carbide 100R
Audio Device(s) ASUS SupremeFX S1220A
Power Supply Cooler Master MWE Gold 650W
Mouse ASUS ROG Strix Impact
Keyboard Gamdias Hermes E2
Software Windows 11 Pro
While working on GPU-Z support for NVIDIA's RTX 20-series graphics cards, we noticed something curious. Each GPU model has not one, but two device IDs assigned to it. A device ID is a unique identification that tells Windows which specific device is installed, so it can select and load the relevant driver software. It also tells the driver, which commands to send to the chip, as they vary between generations. Last but not least, the device ID can be used to enable or lock certain features, for example in the professional space. Two device IDs per GPU is very unusual. For example, all GTX 1080 Ti cards, whether reference or custom design, are marked as 1B06. Titan Xp on the other hand, which uses the same physical GPU, is marked as 1B02. NVIDIA has always used just one ID per SKU, no matter if custom-design, reference or Founders Edition.

We reached out to industry sources and confirmed that for Turing, NVIDIA is creating two device IDs per GPU to correspond to two different ASIC codes per GPU model (for example, TU102-300 and TU102-300-A for the RTX 2080 Ti). The Turing -300 variant is designated to be used on cards targeting the MSRP price point, while the 300-A variant is for use on custom-design, overclocked cards. Both are the same physical chip, just separated by binning, and pricing, which means NVIDIA pretests all GPUs and sorts them by properties such as overclocking potential, power efficiency, etc.



When a board partner uses a -300 Turing GPU variant, factory overclocking is forbidden. Only the more expensive -30-A variants are meant for this scenario. Both can be overclocked manually though, by the user, but it's likely that the overclocking potential on the lower bin won't be as high as on the higher rated chips. Separate device IDs could also prevent consumers from buying the cheapest card, with reference clocks, and flashing it with the BIOS from a faster factory-overclocked variant of that card (think buying an MSI Gaming card and flashing it with the BIOS of Gaming X).

All Founders Edition and custom designs that we could look at so far, use the same -300-A GPU variant, which means the device ID is not used to separate Founders Edition from custom design cards.

View at TechPowerUp Main Site
 
Joined
Feb 3, 2017
Messages
3,765 (1.32/day)
Processor Ryzen 7800X3D
Motherboard ROG STRIX B650E-F GAMING WIFI
Memory 2x16GB G.Skill Flare X5 DDR5-6000 CL36 (F5-6000J3636F16GX2-FX5)
Video Card(s) INNO3D GeForce RTX™ 4070 Ti SUPER TWIN X2
Storage 2TB Samsung 980 PRO, 4TB WD Black SN850X
Display(s) 42" LG C2 OLED, 27" ASUS PG279Q
Case Thermaltake Core P5
Power Supply Fractal Design Ion+ Platinum 760W
Mouse Corsair Dark Core RGB Pro SE
Keyboard Corsair K100 RGB
VR HMD HTC Vive Cosmos
I have only one question: Where the hell are all these -400 Turing GPU's at MSRP then, huh? :D
 

FreedomEclipse

~Technological Technocrat~
Joined
Apr 20, 2007
Messages
24,090 (3.74/day)
Location
London,UK
System Name DarnGosh Edition
Processor AMD 7800X3D
Motherboard MSI X670E GAMING PLUS
Cooling Thermalright AM5 Contact Frame + Phantom Spirit 120SE
Memory 2x32GB G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO DDR5 6000 CL32-38-38-96
Video Card(s) Asus Dual Radeon™ RX 6700 XT OC Edition
Storage WD SN770 1TB (Boot)| 2x 2TB WD SN770 (Gaming)| 2x 2TB Crucial BX500| 2x 3TB Toshiba DT01ACA300
Display(s) LG GP850-B
Case Corsair 760T (White) {1xCorsair ML120 Pro|5xML140 Pro}
Audio Device(s) Yamaha RX-V573|Speakers: JBL Control One|Auna 300-CN|Wharfedale Diamond SW150
Power Supply Seasonic Focus GX-850 80+ GOLD
Mouse Logitech G502 X
Keyboard Duckyshine Dead LED(s) III
Software Windows 11 Home
Benchmark Scores ლ(ಠ益ಠ)ლ
So....

In short, we are going to be needing software mods to get overclocking back?? Challenge accepted

(not by me of course, I wouldnt know where to start but there are lots of smart people on the internet)



Ahhh I get it now.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
9,461 (3.28/day)
System Name Good enough
Processor AMD Ryzen R9 7900 - Alphacool Eisblock XPX Aurora Edge
Motherboard ASRock B650 Pro RS
Cooling 2x 360mm NexXxoS ST30 X-Flow, 1x 360mm NexXxoS ST30, 1x 240mm NexXxoS ST30
Memory 32GB - FURY Beast RGB 5600 Mhz
Video Card(s) Sapphire RX 7900 XT - Alphacool Eisblock Aurora
Storage 1x Kingston KC3000 1TB 1x Kingston A2000 1TB, 1x Samsung 850 EVO 250GB , 1x Samsung 860 EVO 500GB
Display(s) LG UltraGear 32GN650-B + 4K Samsung TV
Case Phanteks NV7
Power Supply GPS-750C
To me this is just another sign that Nvidia are slowly trying to move onto manufacturing their own cards independently.
 

btarunr

Editor & Senior Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Oct 9, 2007
Messages
47,252 (7.54/day)
Location
Hyderabad, India
System Name RBMK-1000
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 5700G
Motherboard ASUS ROG Strix B450-E Gaming
Cooling DeepCool Gammax L240 V2
Memory 2x 8GB G.Skill Sniper X
Video Card(s) Palit GeForce RTX 2080 SUPER GameRock
Storage Western Digital Black NVMe 512GB
Display(s) BenQ 1440p 60 Hz 27-inch
Case Corsair Carbide 100R
Audio Device(s) ASUS SupremeFX S1220A
Power Supply Cooler Master MWE Gold 650W
Mouse ASUS ROG Strix Impact
Keyboard Gamdias Hermes E2
Software Windows 11 Pro
So....

In short, we are going to be needing software mods to get overclocking back??

Manual overclocking by end-users (you) allowed on all cards.
 
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
Messages
1,793 (0.46/day)
So....

In short, we are going to be needing software mods to get overclocking back?? Challenge accepted

(not by me of course, I wouldnt know where to start but there are lots of smart people on the internet)

Read again, they are like gtx 1070ti, AIBs are prohibited to sell OC variants of lesser binned chip. There's no restrictions to end users.
 

the54thvoid

Super Intoxicated Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 14, 2009
Messages
13,066 (2.39/day)
Location
Glasgow - home of formal profanity
Processor Ryzen 7800X3D
Motherboard MSI MAG Mortar B650 (wifi)
Cooling be quiet! Dark Rock Pro 4
Memory 32GB Kingston Fury
Video Card(s) Gainward RTX4070ti
Storage Seagate FireCuda 530 M.2 1TB / Samsumg 960 Pro M.2 512Gb
Display(s) LG 32" 165Hz 1440p GSYNC
Case Asus Prime AP201
Audio Device(s) On Board
Power Supply be quiet! Pure POwer M12 850w Gold (ATX3.0)
Software W10
If they're restricting overclocking on cards that cannot handle it, is that so bad? There's a lot of silicon in them there hills, may be it's temperamental?
What sucks is the premium for the ones that can overclock. I'll be surprised if the cheap one is cheaper than the MSRP.
 
Joined
May 29, 2012
Messages
532 (0.12/day)
System Name CUBE_NXT
Processor i9 12900K @ 5.0Ghz all P-cores with E-cores enabled
Motherboard Gigabyte Z690 Aorus Master
Cooling EK AIO Elite Cooler w/ 3 Phanteks T30 fans
Memory 64GB DDR5 @ 5600Mhz
Video Card(s) EVGA 3090Ti Ultra Hybrid Gaming w/ 3 Phanteks T30 fans
Storage 1 x SK Hynix P41 Platinum 1TB, 1 x 2TB, 1 x WD_BLACK SN850 2TB, 1 x WD_RED SN700 4TB
Display(s) Alienware AW3418DW
Case Lian-Li O11 Dynamic Evo w/ 3 Phanteks T30 fans
Power Supply Seasonic PRIME 1000W Titanium
Software Windows 11 Pro 64-bit
This seems like a good thing that they're basically doing their own in-house binning for every chip that gets released as opposed to relying on the AIB manufacturers to bin the chips for their high-end parts only. Manual OC'ing is still allowed for everything but factory overclocks are exclusive to the binned chips which probably also means they'll manually OC better for the user as well.
 
Last edited:

Aquinus

Resident Wat-man
Joined
Jan 28, 2012
Messages
13,171 (2.81/day)
Location
Concord, NH, USA
System Name Apollo
Processor Intel Core i9 9880H
Motherboard Some proprietary Apple thing.
Memory 64GB DDR4-2667
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon Pro 5600M, 8GB HBM2
Storage 1TB Apple NVMe, 4TB External
Display(s) Laptop @ 3072x1920 + 2x LG 5k Ultrafine TB3 displays
Case MacBook Pro (16", 2019)
Audio Device(s) AirPods Pro, Sennheiser HD 380s w/ FIIO Alpen 2, or Logitech 2.1 Speakers
Power Supply 96w Power Adapter
Mouse Logitech MX Master 3
Keyboard Logitech G915, GL Clicky
Software MacOS 12.1
To me this is just another sign that Nvidia are slowly trying to move onto manufacturing their own cards independently.
That is a monumental feat that will likely backfire in nVidia's face if they try to do this. Owning your own factories to produce chips like these is an industry in and of itself. If Intel seems to be struggling to do it, what makes you think nVidia is going to fare any better? It's not like Intel has no experience doing this either so, it just doesn't feel like the right move which makes me question the validity of your statement.
If they're restricting overclocking on cards that cannot handle it, is that so bad? There's a lot of silicon in them there hills, may be it's temperamental?
Maybe a reason why reviews keep getting pushed out? Driving enhancements to make the GPUs not look as bad as they really are. I think they're buying time to save face for rushing a product out the door and over-hyping it. The reality is that there was no need for it. I honestly think nVidia has more to lose than not by pulling this kind of stunt.
 
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
14,117 (3.82/day)
Location
Sunshine Coast
System Name H7 Flow 2024
Processor AMD 5800X3D
Motherboard Asus X570 Tough Gaming
Cooling Custom liquid
Memory 32 GB DDR4
Video Card(s) Intel ARC A750
Storage Crucial P5 Plus 2TB.
Display(s) AOC 24" Freesync 1m.s. 75Hz
Mouse Lenovo
Keyboard Eweadn Mechanical
Software W11 Pro 64 bit
What's going to stop the Device I.D. being changed?
It's been done before to fake cards being something they aren't.
 
Joined
Aug 13, 2010
Messages
5,474 (1.05/day)
I'm afraid this has something to do with their AI overclocking.
Gonna test it with my third-party MSI card and see what happens.
 
Joined
Feb 11, 2009
Messages
5,561 (0.96/day)
System Name Cyberline
Processor Intel Core i7 2600k -> 12600k
Motherboard Asus P8P67 LE Rev 3.0 -> Gigabyte Z690 Auros Elite DDR4
Cooling Tuniq Tower 120 -> Custom Watercoolingloop
Memory Corsair (4x2) 8gb 1600mhz -> Crucial (8x2) 16gb 3600mhz
Video Card(s) AMD RX480 -> RX7800XT
Storage Samsung 750 Evo 250gb SSD + WD 1tb x 2 + WD 2tb -> 2tb MVMe SSD
Display(s) Philips 32inch LPF5605H (television) -> Dell S3220DGF
Case antec 600 -> Thermaltake Tenor HTCP case
Audio Device(s) Focusrite 2i4 (USB)
Power Supply Seasonic 620watt 80+ Platinum
Mouse Elecom EX-G
Keyboard Rapoo V700
Software Windows 10 Pro 64bit
If they're restricting overclocking on cards that cannot handle it, is that so bad? There's a lot of silicon in them there hills, may be it's temperamental?
What sucks is the premium for the ones that can overclock. I'll be surprised if the cheap one is cheaper than the MSRP.

Well.... its them (possibly) claiming they cannot handle the overclock.
Don't you think a manufacture would find out by themselves if it can or cannot handle an overclock?

If Nvidia said "our lower-end cards wont be able to be overclocked, they will become unstable", that would be an entirely different story then "we FORBID YOU to sell overclocked cards of this variant".
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jun 28, 2018
Messages
299 (0.13/day)
The reality is that there was no need for it.

Well, It was people who badly wanted a new series of graphics cards in 2018. They already have prepared the pitchforks...

The fact is, Nvidia did not have to launch anything. Pascal, despite the age, would continue being the best high-end cards on the market.
 
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
9,461 (3.28/day)
System Name Good enough
Processor AMD Ryzen R9 7900 - Alphacool Eisblock XPX Aurora Edge
Motherboard ASRock B650 Pro RS
Cooling 2x 360mm NexXxoS ST30 X-Flow, 1x 360mm NexXxoS ST30, 1x 240mm NexXxoS ST30
Memory 32GB - FURY Beast RGB 5600 Mhz
Video Card(s) Sapphire RX 7900 XT - Alphacool Eisblock Aurora
Storage 1x Kingston KC3000 1TB 1x Kingston A2000 1TB, 1x Samsung 850 EVO 250GB , 1x Samsung 860 EVO 500GB
Display(s) LG UltraGear 32GN650-B + 4K Samsung TV
Case Phanteks NV7
Power Supply GPS-750C
That is a monumental feat that will likely backfire in nVidia's face if they try to do this. Owning your own factories to produce chips like these is an industry in and of itself. If Intel seems to be struggling to do it, what makes you think nVidia is going to fare any better? It's not like Intel has no experience doing this either so, it just doesn't feel like the right move which makes me question the validity of your statement.

I am not talking about manufacturing their own silicon I am talking about the cards themselves. Nvidia keeps pushing this Founders Edition thing and it looks to be in the detriment of custom designs from AIBs. If you think about it there is no reason any custom card would be superior in any significant way over the FE variants other than the price and even then it turns out they're all going to be massivly overpriced.

Why the hell would you pay 1200$ for a blower 2080ti (with potentially restricted overclocking) and not buy it straight from Nvidia for roughly the same money and with a very good cooler, power delivery and all that. See where this is going ? Of course right now they have nowhere near the required capacity to produce enough cards but they are sure taking measures to ensure that when the time comes they'll have a easy time. It all makes a lot of sense when you look into it, that's the next big step Nvidia wants to make.
 
Last edited:

W1zzard

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
May 14, 2004
Messages
27,863 (3.71/day)
Processor Ryzen 7 5700X
Memory 48 GB
Video Card(s) RTX 4080
Storage 2x HDD RAID 1, 3x M.2 NVMe
Display(s) 30" 2560x1600 + 19" 1280x1024
Software Windows 10 64-bit
What's going to stop the Device I.D. being changed?
It's been done before to fake cards being something they aren't.
This was fixed many years ago. The fakes are based on GTS 450 and GTX 550 which could have their IDs changd to anything else
 

iO

Joined
Jul 18, 2012
Messages
529 (0.12/day)
Location
Germany
Processor R7 5700x
Motherboard MSI B450i Gaming
Cooling Accelero Mono CPU Edition
Memory 16 GB VLP
Video Card(s) AMD RX 6700 XT Accelero Mono
Storage P34A80 512GB
Display(s) LG 27UM67 UHD
Case none
Power Supply Fractal Ion 650 SFX
So they found an additional income by charging a premium for binned chips if the AIBs want to offer OC models.
And we customer are no longer able to get a cheap card and OC it for extra performance. Yay!
 
Joined
Dec 28, 2012
Messages
3,900 (0.89/day)
System Name Skunkworks 3.0
Processor 5800x3d
Motherboard x570 unify
Cooling Noctua NH-U12A
Memory 32GB 3600 mhz
Video Card(s) asrock 6800xt challenger D
Storage Sabarent rocket 4.0 2TB, MX 500 2TB
Display(s) Asus 1440p144 27"
Case Old arse cooler master 932
Power Supply Corsair 1200w platinum
Mouse *squeak*
Keyboard Some old office thing
Software Manjaro
If they're restricting overclocking on cards that cannot handle it, is that so bad? There's a lot of silicon in them there hills, may be it's temperamental?
What sucks is the premium for the ones that can overclock. I'll be surprised if the cheap one is cheaper than the MSRP.
And what guarantee is there that Nvidia is only binning chips that cant OC, as opposed to, you know, only allowing OCs on these Special chips that cost more.

This is nvidia we are talking about here, if they can fleece people for more money, they will do it.
 
Joined
Nov 29, 2016
Messages
671 (0.23/day)
System Name Unimatrix
Processor Intel i9-9900K @ 5.0GHz
Motherboard ASRock x390 Taichi Ultimate
Cooling Custom Loop
Memory 32GB GSkill TridentZ RGB DDR4 @ 3400MHz 14-14-14-32
Video Card(s) EVGA 2080 with Heatkiller Water Block
Storage 2x Samsung 960 Pro 512GB M.2 SSD in RAID 0, 1x WD Blue 1TB M.2 SSD
Display(s) Alienware 34" Ultrawide 3440x1440
Case CoolerMaster P500M Mesh
Power Supply Seasonic Prime Titanium 850W
Keyboard Corsair K75
Benchmark Scores Really Really High
OK... Thanks for the clickbait headline.

Nothing to see here folks, move along.
 
Joined
Aug 27, 2015
Messages
555 (0.16/day)
Location
In the middle of nowhere
System Name Scrapped Parts, Unite !
Processor Ryzen 5 3600 @4.0 Ghz
Motherboard MSI B450-A Pro MAX
Cooling Stock
Memory Team Group Elite 16 GB 3133Mhz
Video Card(s) Colorful iGame GeForce GTX1060 Vulcan U 6G
Storage Hitachi 500 GB, Sony 1TB, KINGSTON 400A 120GB // Samsung 160 GB
Display(s) HP 2009f
Case Xigmatek Asgard Pro // Cooler Master Centurion 5
Power Supply OCZ ModXStream Pro 500 W
Mouse Logitech G102
Software Windows 10 x64
Benchmark Scores Minesweeper 30fps, Tetris 40 fps, with overheated CPU and GPU
so it'll be RTX 2080 Ti
and...RTX 2080 Ti-K UNLOCKED, UNLEASHED, UNRESTRAINED !! version
nvidia eyes greener than ever !
 
Joined
May 29, 2012
Messages
532 (0.12/day)
System Name CUBE_NXT
Processor i9 12900K @ 5.0Ghz all P-cores with E-cores enabled
Motherboard Gigabyte Z690 Aorus Master
Cooling EK AIO Elite Cooler w/ 3 Phanteks T30 fans
Memory 64GB DDR5 @ 5600Mhz
Video Card(s) EVGA 3090Ti Ultra Hybrid Gaming w/ 3 Phanteks T30 fans
Storage 1 x SK Hynix P41 Platinum 1TB, 1 x 2TB, 1 x WD_BLACK SN850 2TB, 1 x WD_RED SN700 4TB
Display(s) Alienware AW3418DW
Case Lian-Li O11 Dynamic Evo w/ 3 Phanteks T30 fans
Power Supply Seasonic PRIME 1000W Titanium
Software Windows 11 Pro 64-bit
OK... Thanks for the clickbait headline.

Nothing to see here folks, move along.
How is it clickbait? The headline describes exactly what is happening. Their AIB partners aren't allowed to sell factory overclocked cards unless they use the specifically binned chips.
 

rtwjunkie

PC Gaming Enthusiast
Supporter
Joined
Jul 25, 2008
Messages
13,996 (2.34/day)
Location
Louisiana
Processor Core i9-9900k
Motherboard ASRock Z390 Phantom Gaming 6
Cooling All air: 2x140mm Fractal exhaust; 3x 140mm Cougar Intake; Enermax ETS-T50 Black CPU cooler
Memory 32GB (2x16) Mushkin Redline DDR-4 3200
Video Card(s) ASUS RTX 4070 Ti Super OC 16GB
Storage 1x 1TB MX500 (OS); 2x 6TB WD Black; 1x 2TB MX500; 1x 1TB BX500 SSD; 1x 6TB WD Blue storage (eSATA)
Display(s) Infievo 27" 165Hz @ 2560 x 1440
Case Fractal Design Define R4 Black -windowed
Audio Device(s) Soundblaster Z
Power Supply Seasonic Focus GX-1000 Gold
Mouse Coolermaster Sentinel III (large palm grip!)
Keyboard Logitech G610 Orion mechanical (Cherry Brown switches)
Software Windows 10 Pro 64-bit (Start10 & Fences 3.0 installed)
I am not talking about manufacturing their own silicon I am talking about the cards themselves. Nvidia keeps pushing this Founders Edition thing and it looks to be in the detriment of custom designs from AIBs
What blower cooler? Founders Editions are not blower coolers with 20 series. Did you miss all the pictures?
 
Joined
Jul 9, 2015
Messages
3,413 (0.99/day)
System Name M3401 notebook
Processor 5600H
Motherboard NA
Memory 16GB
Video Card(s) 3050
Storage 500GB SSD
Display(s) 14" OLED screen of the laptop
Software Windows 10
Benchmark Scores 3050 scores good 15-20% lower than average, despite ASUS's claims that it has uber cooling.
I think market does indeed deserve "nvidia's K chips".

My only problem is with how "serial" will the stuff that reviewers, who signed draconian NDA, will publish on 19th be.

So....

In short, we are going to be needing software mods to get overclocking back?? Challenge accepted

(not by me of course, I wouldnt know where to start but there are lots of smart people on the internet)


Ahhh I get it now.

Erm, there were plenty of female nazis, the most famous director, for once, what is your signature about?
 
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
590 (0.24/day)
for the extremely low pricing of these cards to start with I can see this as a way to increase the profit platform . in a way you kinda seen this with say evga and a ref. sc may oc well or not at all , but a classy / kingpin is binned to hold there best factory oc + what you can add . maybe I'm wrong but it sounds like what evga has been doing in there lines of cards anyway now just on nvidias own guideline scale
 
Joined
Dec 28, 2012
Messages
3,900 (0.89/day)
System Name Skunkworks 3.0
Processor 5800x3d
Motherboard x570 unify
Cooling Noctua NH-U12A
Memory 32GB 3600 mhz
Video Card(s) asrock 6800xt challenger D
Storage Sabarent rocket 4.0 2TB, MX 500 2TB
Display(s) Asus 1440p144 27"
Case Old arse cooler master 932
Power Supply Corsair 1200w platinum
Mouse *squeak*
Keyboard Some old office thing
Software Manjaro
What blower cooler? Founders Editions are not blower coolers with 20 series. Did you miss all the pictures?
I think he is referring to AIBs that makes plastic blowers of reference cards that are cheaper then FEs, and why would you buy an AIB blower when the reference nvidia cooler is as good as third party coolers. In such a situation, there would be no real reason to buy a third party nvidia card at all, as the reference card is already as good as AIB cards. It comes off as nvidia gunning to be like 3DFX, making all their own cards.
 
Joined
Feb 14, 2012
Messages
2,355 (0.50/day)
System Name msdos
Processor 8086
Motherboard mainboard
Cooling passive
Memory 640KB + 384KB extended
Video Card(s) EGA
Storage 5.25"
Display(s) 80x25
Case plastic
Audio Device(s) modchip
Power Supply 45 watts
Mouse serial
Keyboard yes
Software disk commander
Benchmark Scores still running
Are they actually binned, or does the -A simply denote that the oc tax was paid?
 
Top