Intel Study: Diversity and Inclusion in Gaming

[SaLaDiN666]

The only way how to explain this study... only gaymers participated in it.

 

[dirtyferret]

The world is a strange place, when I can say to (some) people, I identify as a 17 year old Japanese female and they'll accept it - despite it being obviously untrue.

So this is your first day on the internet?

Kids should not be learning this shit from games and tv and such.

It's up to the parents to teach tolerance. If games and TV programs want to include LGBTQIA+, that's fine with me and if they don't that's fine too. No one says you must consume certain media and at the end of the day profit will always win out with media.

 

[Fergutor]

"Words like "diversity" trigger certain groups like none other. I mean it's rather amazing some days."
This phrasing is inherently non confrontational if you don't self identify with it. I really don't get what's so hard for you to get about this.

The only people I accused of anything, painted targets on themselves, by taking offense to that statement and thus proving it true.

What did I say? It's amazing and now you are making it clearer if someone didn't get it. You are that kid shouting and ten mocking. It's amazing that any adult could think there is something on such childish argument, if one can even call it that.
Seriously, who are you trying to convince?

Now I can totally see the situation:
Unsifferable kid, 11 years old, shouting towards a group of kids: "[word about the less usual sexual orientation]!!".
One or two in the group didn't recognize the voice of the known obnoxious character and turn their heads towards him.
The unpleasant kid says "AAAH HAHA!! So you are [word about the less usual sexual orientation]!!! You looked at me when I said [word about the less usual sexual orientation] so you confessed to be [word about the less usual sexual orientation]!!! HAHAHHA!!!"
The rest of the kids, recognizing the complete lack of logic in such way to determine who would be a [word about the less usual sexual orientation] or not respond: "Dude, you are [word that describe someone of a lesser intelligence]"
The kid sits down, cross his legs, take one hand to his chin and the other to the hip, and with the smuggest face possible responds: "The only people I accused of anything, painted targets on themselves, by taking offense to that statement and thus proving it true."
Heads shaking, palms in faces...

One thing is making a terrible "argument" that doesn't hold up to anything. And another is you holding to it like a tick, willing to loose your head (mind) over it.

Damnit, you then kept contradicting yourself again and again, then confusing me with someone else (saying that I accused you of being influenced by twitter and reddit), thinking that I will do as you say, and speaking high of yourself to the people that already can see, because of your own words, no need of mind reading (we can perfectly read what you and the others said here), all your...low things...
If you don't want people to see your dirty laundry (there must be a more appropriate term for this in english, but it's not my language), at least start by not making a flag with it.

damn just 4 pages of people getting triggered by survey results lol

damn just another person triggered by people's opinions on his cult lol

 

[Vayra86]

Yes, but it's unavoidable due to the article. And technically it shouldn't be, as it's really just demographics.

In your rant you missed the fact that those games are highly popular.

This is what companies like.

Yeah, that was after the thread crapping had already commenced. And even then, I didn't identify any groups, they did that to themselves. Ironic really.

I should have clarified though, not just politics, the toxic waste that is American politics.


Reading good.


Trees drink water. We live in ponds.

Didnt miss it at all - that is why it is called mainstream. But there is only so much casual, mainstream game time to be had. A few stand out. BF V wasnt one of them, I think, despite bigbudgets and new tech.

The copycat behavior isnt new. Look at Blizzard and how desperately it chased a DOTA / LoL moba success but had to abandon HotS anyway.

Its when and where those opportunities have been saturated that there is lots of space for originality, innovative games and truly new stuff. This can exist alongside one another.

The real question is, are you mainstream or have you learned to look beyond the most basic and well marketed stuff - its not unlike all the diversity in say, music.

 

[Deleted member 190774]

So this is your first day on the internet?

Clearly not as I posted a couple of days ago - duh!

Maybe I don't visit the same websites as you - or maybe you'd like to elaborate...

 

[R-T-B]

What did I say?

A lot in response to basically nothing. Which speaks volumes. You are clearly most upset by my statement.

That's all I need to say. I could make a lengthy rebuttal (I did before), but honestly it's not needed and I don't care to talk in circles.

The only way how to explain this study... only gaymers participated in it.

and don't forget, gay people survery responses should not count, amirite? Only "real" gamers should get a vote in this survey.

God almighty. Why I engage with this and don't report immediately is like some sort of passion for self-harm, let me tell you...

 

[dirtyferret]

Clearly not as I posted a couple of days ago - duh!

Maybe I don't visit the same websites as you - or maybe you'd like to elaborate...

You posted on the internet "The world is a strange place, I can say to (some) people, I identify as a 17 year old Japanese female and they'll accept it - despite it being obviously untrue."

The internet (and World) is full of web sites, forums, clubs, etc., dedicated to your Japanese transgender desire (as well as any other niche desires you can think of) and are accepting of it, so how can it be "strange"?

If you said "My evangelical church is a strange place, I can say to (some) people, I identify as a 17 year old Japanese female and they'll accept it - despite it being obviously untrue." than I would 100% agree with you and say that church is "strange".

 

[Deleted member 190774]

and don't forget, gay people survery responses should not count, amirite? Only "real" gamers should get a vote in this survey.

In your example, why would any gay person not like A GAME a straight person would like - ITS A GAME. We all have game, film, book and food preferences, not everyone likes Star Wars, Disney or Anchovies. The only difference can be if there's an in-game romance - i.e. bringing sex into it.

Perhaps the answer is having more men in the game that speak like Julian Clary... or having your avatar act 'more gay'.

The other poster was correct, there have been four pages, now five, and not one minority representative has posted anything in here to suggest what's missing from games, such that they feel unrepresented. Like most of the others here, I'm happy to listen and perhaps understand. If it's not going to happen here, where and when will it ever happen?

The internet (and World) is full of web sites, forums, clubs, etc., dedicated to your Japanese transgender desire (as well as any other niche desires you can think of) and are accepting of it, so how can it be "strange"?

Well it was (to me at least), obviously a completely arbitrary set of parameters. Besides enacting a fetish is completely different to believing you are something you're not, and claiming you're being harmed if someone disagrees with you.

And no, I didn't know those websites existed (although probably could have guessed) - and I've been around on the web since before AOL started sending out their internet connections on floppy disk.

 

[claes]

The other poster was correct, there have been four pages, now five, and not one minority representative has posted anything in here to suggest what's missing from games, such that they feel unrepresented. Like most of the others here, I'm happy to listen and perhaps understand. If it's not going to happen here, where and when will it ever happen?

This place is toxic as fuck so we don’t bother

 

[R-T-B]

In your example, why would any gay person not like A GAME a straight person would like - ITS A GAME.

Read the study and you might find one reason.

This place is toxic as fuck so we don’t bother

Sadly that's what I feel the news section has become.

The other poster was correct, there have been four pages, now five, and not one minority representative has posted anything in here to suggest what's missing from games,

I could, but I'd be afraid to do so, tbh. I'm sure this is not uncommon.

 

[Caring1]

This place is toxic as fuck

Toxic according to you maybe, others called it varying opinions, sorry not everyone agrees with yours.

 

[Deleted member 190774]

Read the study and you might find one reason.

OK, so you're accustomed to toxicity, but let me assure you - as a non-minority individual who's over 50, I can tell you life has had many, many moments that have been utterly shit (and I've lived in three countries hoping each one would be better) - but even so, if someone asked me to point something out, I would give them the / an example - and then say, "it's in the study, along with a number of other examples.".

This would be the reason I ran out of empathy years ago... But like a mug, I still make an effort to understand - even if I don't agree with you.

 

[R-T-B]

It's not just you tbh. The gamer culture is too toxic for me to even speak about what puts the "minority" label on my head. I've tried before. Not again, not today anyways.

I do appreciate that you want to listen to my concerns though. Genuine thanks for that.

 

[Ahhzz]

Speaking of "toxic", the tone in this thread will change, and people will be respectful in expressing their opinions, or those people won't be posting in here. Keep the discussion and ideas flowing, but keep it civil.

 

[Deleted member 190774]

It's not just you tbh. The gamer culture is too toxic for me to even speak about what puts the "minority" label on my head. I've tried before. Not again, not today anyways.

Can I just clarify what you mean. Do you think I am being toxic? As it looks as though that's what you're implying.

That aside, multiplayer gaming can at times be toxic. I played World of Warcraft for 8 years or so, and people can be brutal, same with Battlefield 2 - without even knowing anything about you whatsoever. In BF2, you only had to get in a helicopter that someone else wanted and you receive a tirade of abuse - and if you die, well you might as well log out and find another server to play on, and if you can't let that go over your head, you're in for a rough ride...

 

[Vayra86]

It's not just you tbh. The gamer culture is too toxic for me to even speak about what puts the "minority" label on my head. I've tried before. Not again, not today anyways.

I do appreciate that you want to listen to my concerns though. Genuine thanks for that.

Ive learned over the years that you really do choose what slice of the internet you want to see and/or care about.

This again is about the mainstream. The internet is a collective thought machine with a strong tendency to hide minority in obscurity.

That doesnt mean its not there or cannot exist. But it does mean it has little place in the mainstream. Its paradoxical even to desire it to be - the minority would lose its identity and with that, its purpose.

Much bigger, slower movement is what brings us to more acceptance. Whole generations need to pass by for this to happen, or just the simple mixing of cultures in healthy and positive societies - which says a lot more about the conditions you need rather than people "being and doing things differently". That is why some processes of integration fail and others do not. Locally, and when people cannot hide behind anonymity of a screen.

 

[64K]

That aside, multiplayer gaming can at times be toxic. I played World of Warcraft for 8 years or so, and people can be brutal

That was my experience in WoW. Players could be downright hateful to newbies. I played it for a few months back in 2012. I would get invites to run dungeons but I had no idea what I was doing at first and some players would insult the hell out of me. I would ask questions to try to learn but rarely would get any answers. I played as a warrior but it took me a while to learn that so many groups would expect me to play the role of a paladin as a warrior. From what I remember paladins were hard to come by so groups would invite a warrior instead just to be able to get in a dungeon quickly.

I had a much, much better experience in Guild Wars 2.

 

[the54thvoid]

You can't argue with an ideology and all too often those ideologies are deep-seated in religious or cultural tradition, though not always. I tend to find in real life it is those with specific and unflexing world views, that are the most toxic. I've seen it. I live in a sectarian and divided city. 'Toxic' is easily defined as a negative and resilient stance against a certain person or group, or it can define an indivual person with a 'toxic' attitude. Workplaces can have 'toxic' staff who hold no religious or political views but whose attitude can be constantly negative and wear down others.

In a culture, you'll find you have standard norms. Conditions and rules for being accepted. Most of these are flexible but it only takes a small section to take a harder stance to generate a toxic environment. Those who deny such a thing exists usually belong to the toxic group. And all colours of the rainbow have toxic sub-groups. It's not the sole domain of the Western white male. Look at other cultures and you'll find insufferable intolerance. Unfortunately, our current global climate has reached a point where social media has been used to manipulate and twist news and facts to sow division. People are too lazy to check out truths. Even the article itself about inclusivity is more about reaching out to under-represented people and to make them feel part of the system. That whole news message has been lost by some very triggered people.

The way some are reacting here you'd think Liberace's zombie ghost was coming to turn your sons into gays. And that itself is a pressing example of avoiding toxicity. The man had to deny being gay to succeed in his career. Famous actors can't 'come out' because they know their career would suffer badly. I mean, straight men can play gays, but that's okay because insecure men know they're not gay, right. But hell, that isn't what the OP is about.

In brief, to be toxic, is to continually press a negative agenda. ANYONE can do that from any subsection of society. Some smart-ass will ask what exactly is a negative agenda? Well, that's where tolerance and equality come into things. Usually religion and politics too. One persons negative is anothers lifestyle choice. And lets face it, many people take offence at others choices. And that's your human right. But if you exercise your right to be offended (*cough*, snowflake) then you become toxic. Really, all folks ought to lead their own lives and let others be. Turn the other cheek, love your fellow man, etc etc.

And yeah, this post is off-topic. I'll report it myself.

 

[Fergutor]

A lot in response to basically nothing. Which speaks volumes. You are clearly most upset by my statement.

That's all I need to say. I could make a lengthy rebuttal (I did before), but honestly it's not needed and I don't care to talk in circles.

After all your proven childishness, all your contradictions, identity confusion (I'm sure you still have no idea who said what!) that further proves how sane you are up there, all your inability to make one, only ONE valid and correctly directed critique, your inability to do reasoning and not prejudice, the irony in the terms you use when referring to others, and when all that has been put on display...you say that?!

Given my experience in this topic I have to say: typical!

 

[R-T-B]

After all your proven childishness, all your contradictions, identity confusion (I'm sure you still have no idea who said what!) that further proves how sane you are up there, all your inability to make one, only ONE valid and correctly directed critique, your inability to do reasoning and not prejudice, the irony in the terms you use when referring to others, and when all that has been put on display...you say that?!

Given my experience in this topic I have to say: typical!

Cool story bro. Please stop quoting me.

Can I just clarify what you mean. Do you think I am being toxic?

No, not you. There are people here though that prevent me from speaking in specifics, apologies.

 

[Vayra86]

After all your proven childishness, all your contradictions, identity confusion (I'm sure you still have no idea who said what!) that further proves how sane you are up there, all your inability to make one, only ONE valid and correctly directed critique, your inability to do reasoning and not prejudice, the irony in the terms you use when referring to others, and when all that has been put on display...you say that?!

Given my experience in this topic I have to say: typical!

Personal experience is a matter of your own perspective. If its typical to you what happens, stop approaching the same problem with the same solution.

Or put simply: step back and try to read what else might have been said that you failed to read. Ill speak from my own experience and say this has taught me a lot about people. Sometimes the real victory is getting an insight you didnt have before.

 

[stimpy88]

I see people must not disagree with a paying supporter in this forum...

 

[looniam]

I see people must not disagree with a paying supporter in this forum...

i'll just leave this here:

it is a joke . .

 

[Xzibit]

You can't argue with an ideology and all too often those ideologies are deep-seated in religious or cultural tradition, though not always. I tend to find in real life it is those with specific and unflexing world views, that are the most toxic. I've seen it. I live in a sectarian and divided city. 'Toxic' is easily defined as a negative and resilient stance against a certain person or group, or it can define an indivual person with a 'toxic' attitude. Workplaces can have 'toxic' staff who hold no religious or political views but whose attitude can be constantly negative and wear down others.

In a culture, you'll find you have standard norms. Conditions and rules for being accepted. Most of these are flexible but it only takes a small section to take a harder stance to generate a toxic environment. Those who deny such a thing exists usually belong to the toxic group. And all colours of the rainbow have toxic sub-groups. It's not the sole domain of the Western white male. Look at other cultures and you'll find insufferable intolerance. Unfortunately, our current global climate has reached a point where social media has been used to manipulate and twist news and facts to sow division. People are too lazy to check out truths. Even the article itself about inclusivity is more about reaching out to under-represented people and to make them feel part of the system. That whole news message has been lost by some very triggered people.

The way some are reacting here you'd think Liberace's zombie ghost was coming to turn your sons into gays. And that itself is a pressing example of avoiding toxicity. The man had to deny being gay to succeed in his career. Famous actors can't 'come out' because they know their career would suffer badly. I mean, straight men can play gays, but that's okay because insecure men know they're not gay, right. But hell, that isn't what the OP is about.

In brief, to be toxic, is to continually press a negative agenda. ANYONE can do that from any subsection of society. Some smart-ass will ask what exactly is a negative agenda? Well, that's where tolerance and equality come into things. Usually religion and politics too. One persons negative is anothers lifestyle choice. And lets face it, many people take offence at others choices. And that's your human right. But if you exercise your right to be offended (*cough*, snowflake) then you become toxic. Really, all folks ought to lead their own lives and let others be. Turn the other cheek, love your fellow man, etc etc.

And yeah, this post is off-topic. I'll report it myself.

A good portion almost half of the under-represented felt their Depiction in current games wasn't to their liking. AA being the most in their (30%) group preferring for "cosmetics". BTW women felt the most left out.

Its not just a matter of representation but the way its being done. Game company quick to include the under-rep only to continue adding stereotypes of them isn't ideal. Hey your included in the game now thanks us by buying. As people have pointed out prior. People learn from games and if their only exposure is some Stereotype by a publisher who doesn't understand and is just including it to capture a bigger piece of the market by including well its just contributing in the wrong way. Especially when you remember 600+ of the 1,824 surveyed are minors ages 10-14yrs.

 

[the54thvoid]

A good portion almost half of the under-represented felt their Depiction in current games wasn't to their liking. AA being the most in their (30%) group preferring for "cosmetics". BTW women felt the most left out.

Its not just a matter of representation but the way its being done. Game company quick to include the under-rep only to continue adding stereotypes of them isn't ideal. Hey your included in the game now thanks us by buying. As people have pointed out prior. People learn from games and if their only exposure is some Stereotype by a publisher who doesn't understand and is just including it to capture a bigger piece of the market by including well its just contributing in the wrong way. Especially when you remember 600+ of the 1,824 surveyed are minors ages 10-14yrs.

Yeah, addressing under representation by using stereotypes is more damaging than not using diverse character models.