Space Lynx
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- Oct 17, 2014
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Cryptocurrency and blockchain in general has the potential to give the world something great.
I disagree.
Cryptocurrency and blockchain in general has the potential to give the world something great.
System Name | Pioneer |
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It's utility in making it neigh near impossible to forge election records has already been demonstrated in at least a few regional elections.I disagree.
I don't get why people get so worked up around crypto. If you're concerned about the electric usage, Chia doesn't have it. If your concerned about ewaste, that's legit I guess, but they were going to buy something else anyways and the company is just pivoting.
Cryptocurrency and blockchain in general has the potential to give the world something great. I have always believed that. It is very much in it's infancy though, nearly everyone acknowledges this. The energy usage will fall with time, and the benefits will be fully realized with time. If people don't take weird stances like this, prematurely killing it anyways.
I mean it's totally your call. I just don't personally get it.
It's utility in making it neigh near impossible to forge election records has already been demonstrated in at least a few regional elections.
The key problem it has to overcome there, is it can't be used online. Because you need to provide proof of voter eligibility. Basically the same issue as the real world. The tech is solid.
I think that alone should be enough to give it a chance, but meh, go with what your own whims dictate.
System Name | RyzenGtEvo/ Asus strix scar II |
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Processor | Amd R5 5900X/ Intel 8750H |
Motherboard | Crosshair hero8 impact/Asus |
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Memory | Corsair Vengeance Rgb pro 3600cas14 16Gb in four sticks./16Gb/16GB |
Video Card(s) | Powercolour RX7900XT Reference/Rtx 2060 |
Storage | Silicon power 2TB nvme/8Tb external/1Tb samsung Evo nvme 2Tb sata ssd/1Tb nvme |
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System Name | Pioneer |
---|---|
Processor | Ryzen R9 7950X |
Motherboard | GIGABYTE Aorus Elite X670 AX |
Cooling | Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon and Corsair Maglev blower fans... |
Memory | 64GB (4x 16GB) G.Skill Flare X5 @ DDR5-6000 CL30 |
Video Card(s) | XFX RX 7900 XTX Speedster Merc 310 |
Storage | Intel 905p Optane 960GB boot, +2x Crucial P5 Plus 2TB PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs |
Display(s) | 55" LG 55" B9 OLED 4K Display |
Case | Thermaltake Core X31 |
Audio Device(s) | TOSLINK->Schiit Modi MB->Asgard 2 DAC Amp->AKG Pro K712 Headphones or HDMI->B9 OLED |
Power Supply | FSP Hydro Ti Pro 850W |
Mouse | Logitech G305 Lightspeed Wireless |
Keyboard | WASD Code v3 with Cherry Green keyswitches + PBT DS keycaps |
Software | Gentoo Linux x64 / Windows 11 Enterprise IoT 2024 |
You aren't wrong lol.That's totally what a miner would say ( valley girl accent )
That is not correct.SLC is capable of 50-100x the P/E cycles compared to QLC.
MLC is 5-10x more durable than QLC.
TLC is about 3x more than QLC.
The world was spinning along just fine before blockchain and will continue to do so when it's gone.. It has yet to be proven useful in any way other than to feed greed...I don't get why people get so worked up around crypto. If you're concerned about the electric usage, Chia doesn't have it. If your concerned about ewaste, that's legit I guess, but they were going to buy something else anyways and the company is just pivoting.
Cryptocurrency and blockchain in general has the potential to give the world something great. I have always believed that. It is very much in it's infancy though, nearly everyone acknowledges this. The energy usage will fall with time, and the benefits will be fully realized with time. If people don't take weird stances like this, prematurely killing it anyways.
I mean it's totally your call. I just don't personally get it.
System Name | Pioneer |
---|---|
Processor | Ryzen R9 7950X |
Motherboard | GIGABYTE Aorus Elite X670 AX |
Cooling | Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon and Corsair Maglev blower fans... |
Memory | 64GB (4x 16GB) G.Skill Flare X5 @ DDR5-6000 CL30 |
Video Card(s) | XFX RX 7900 XTX Speedster Merc 310 |
Storage | Intel 905p Optane 960GB boot, +2x Crucial P5 Plus 2TB PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs |
Display(s) | 55" LG 55" B9 OLED 4K Display |
Case | Thermaltake Core X31 |
Audio Device(s) | TOSLINK->Schiit Modi MB->Asgard 2 DAC Amp->AKG Pro K712 Headphones or HDMI->B9 OLED |
Power Supply | FSP Hydro Ti Pro 850W |
Mouse | Logitech G305 Lightspeed Wireless |
Keyboard | WASD Code v3 with Cherry Green keyswitches + PBT DS keycaps |
Software | Gentoo Linux x64 / Windows 11 Enterprise IoT 2024 |
It also was just fine without the wheel. It would've remained just fine without the wheel. The point of progress is to improve things.world was spinning along just fine before blockchain and will do so when it's gone..
My point was that unless some fundamental benefit can be demonstrated, blockchain will likely be relegated to the scrap-heap of history. Currently it is just an annoyance to the continued progress of technology and is causing MANY more problems than it can possibly hope to solve..It also was just fine without the wheel. It would've remained just fine without the wheel. The point of progress is to improve things.
No it hasn't done that overall yet but to deny it's inherently useful properties is to be ignorant and blind.
All blockchain is at it's essence is a chain of signatures with peer to peer validation. That's it. Almost every problem you take issue with is not inherent to the tech.
The issue is implementation, not idea.
System Name | Pioneer |
---|---|
Processor | Ryzen R9 7950X |
Motherboard | GIGABYTE Aorus Elite X670 AX |
Cooling | Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon and Corsair Maglev blower fans... |
Memory | 64GB (4x 16GB) G.Skill Flare X5 @ DDR5-6000 CL30 |
Video Card(s) | XFX RX 7900 XTX Speedster Merc 310 |
Storage | Intel 905p Optane 960GB boot, +2x Crucial P5 Plus 2TB PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs |
Display(s) | 55" LG 55" B9 OLED 4K Display |
Case | Thermaltake Core X31 |
Audio Device(s) | TOSLINK->Schiit Modi MB->Asgard 2 DAC Amp->AKG Pro K712 Headphones or HDMI->B9 OLED |
Power Supply | FSP Hydro Ti Pro 850W |
Mouse | Logitech G305 Lightspeed Wireless |
Keyboard | WASD Code v3 with Cherry Green keyswitches + PBT DS keycaps |
Software | Gentoo Linux x64 / Windows 11 Enterprise IoT 2024 |
Fair enough. I just feel the benefit has already been demonstrated, it just needs a massive amount of cost reduction to be justified vs the cost, which right now is unacceptably high.My point was that unless some fundamental benefit can be demonstrated, blockchain will likely be relegated to the scrap-heap of history. Currently it is just an annoyance to the continued progress of technology and is causing MANY more problems than it can possibly hope to solve..
When you take GPU mining out of the equation, I'll agree with this. Chia seems to be very energy resource lite, but when you take into account lots of people buying the equipment that would otherwise not exist or be using power one has to stop to consider how much of an extra load such is putting on the power grids of the world.I'm not even really concerned with the energy usage. It's blown out of proportion vs other industries IMO.
Totally agree with that.But the inventory stock consumption it takes from other sectors really is an issue in my eyes.
Not completely true. Running QLC in an SLC mode does in fact put it on the same class of wear leveling as native SLC because you only write to the cell once per program function. MLC, TLC and QLC have lower wear endurance because the program cycle involves multiple applications of write functions and voltage exposure per cell. QLC that is well made but operated in SLC mode will have similar(not identical) durability to native SLC itself.SLC mode is not like native SLC. Native SLC these days tends to be oriented at ultra low latencies as storage class memory (SCM) with smaller page functions and higher endurance (100K P/E). With SLC mode you have the same cell size, you just write and store in a SLC-like mode. So it's not really comparable even if performance and endurance are vastly increased as compared to the native NAND/flash (TLC/QLC).
Processor | 13700KF - 5.7GHZ |
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Keyboard | KEYCHRON V3 (DUROCK T1 + MT3 GODSPEED R2) |
Software | Windows 11 |
Benchmark Scores | Superposition 4k optimized - 20652 |
System Name | Lenovo ThinkCentre |
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Processor | AMD 5650GE |
Motherboard | Lenovo |
Memory | 32 GB DDR4 |
Display(s) | AOC 24" Freesync 1m.s. 75Hz |
Mouse | Lenovo |
Keyboard | Lenovo |
Software | W11 Pro 64 bit |
Yes, but the cells are smaller than native SLC...it's literally manufactured to a different standard. pSLC does NOT have the same endurance as native SLC. As in they hold less charge, and performance is also lower as well - significantly lower; while QLC/TLC in pSLC mode may have a tR of 20-25µs and tPROG of 200µs, Z-NAND (SLC) is 3µs and 100µs. Also, you're still operating with 16kB pages versus 2/4kB. You can do partial programming on pSLC but it increases wear significantly.Not completely true. Running QLC in an SLC mode does in fact put it on the same class of wear leveling as native SLC because you only write to the cell once per program function. MLC, TLC and QLC have lower wear endurance because the program cycle involves multiple applications of write functions and voltage exposure per cell. QLC that is well made but operated in SLC mode will have similar(not identical) durability to native SLC itself.
Because it's causing serious real world problems for a lot of people.I am not mining any coins but why are you people getting mad at the people and companies that support it?
True.Yes, but the cells are smaller than native SLC...it's literally manufactured differently.
The point is, if QLC is put into an exclusive SLC mode it's durability will closely approach that of native SLC because the cells are not being exposed to the same number of voltage application cycles, nor for as long because programing a cell in a single stage bit take a lower voltage than programing in multi-bit, triple-bit or quad-bit modes. There is a definable benefit to running TLC or QLC in SLC mode. This is why a great many drives use the "SLC cache" scheme because it's much faster and takes much less voltage to program.As per Cactus Technologies (who sell pSLC industrial drives): "At first look this seems equivalent to SLC, but the MLC (2 or more bits) architecture and finer trace widths of MLC NAND have many more issues with unexpected power loss, cell cross talk, read disturb, data corruption and data retention to be considered. It would be like building a tank on a small car chassis - you just can’t get the reliability."
I'm not sure what your point is, this is already known.the cells are not being exposed to the same number of voltage application cycles, nor for as long because programing a cell in a single stage bit take a lower voltage than programing in multi-bit, triple-bit or quad-bit modes. There is a definable benefit to running TLC or QLC in SLC mode. This is why a great many drives use the "SLC cache" scheme because it's much faster and takes much less voltage to program.
Then maybe I missed your earlier point...I'm not sure what your point is, this is already known.
If I average out the data written to my 7 SSDs over their lifetime it averages out to 95GB per day. So 54000 TBW would last me a good ~1600 years.
Also, I'm not trying to start any fights here, just putting the numbers out since it looked like some people had different ideas about the P/E ratings for the different flash types here. You can find these ratings, including for SLC mode, on datasheets, however these are behind a wall (Micron) so I know not everybody has access to them. Traditional SLC really isn't made anymore, as I mentioned above for Z-NAND it is made to compete in the SCM space with 3D XPoint so is oriented at small I/O and ultra low latencies, so there's no realistic comparison to be made. However, larger cells hold more charge which means over time as wear increases detrapping you ultimately will get more endurance (being able to do a read through the read retry process) out of it, but this is simplifying things as there are other factors.Then maybe I missed your earlier point...
No worries. We more or less agreed on the same point but from differing perspectives. It's all good. And you're right, this is much more involved & complicated then we are discussing here.Also, I'm not trying to start any fights here, just putting the numbers out since it looked like some people had different ideas about the P/E ratings for the different flash types here.
Which is a real shame, because there is definitely a market for it.Traditional SLC really isn't made anymore