Intel Asking Germany for More Money, Set to Potentially Invest in Vietnam

[ymdhis]

If the German gvt falls for this, they are idiots.

The German government will fall for this.

 

[stimpy88]

They really should stop throwing tax-payers money at the richest companies in the world...

 

[Wirko]

No, it's because France already has a large semiconductor company that they are subsidizing, ST Micro, which is a joint French/Italian venture, and unlike Intel, STMicro has most of it workforce and production in Europe.

STM is also partly owned by the French and Italian governments.

However, as says Wikipedia, they're now a Dutch company with HQ in Switzerland, which probably means that their revenue crosses so many borders and mountains that no one knows where it's gone eventually.

 

[AnarchoPrimitiv]

The German government shouldn't be subsidising Intel or indeed anyone, they should be investing money for part ownership. The whole "give private companies boatloads of money and hope they won't shaft you at the first opportunity to make a buck" nonsense is exactly how we got into this situation in the first place. Capitalism has time and time again been demonstrated as an abject failure when it comes to core industries; if something is important enough to dump 10 billion of taxpayers' money into, it's important enough for the government to be running it.

Agreed.

Intel is basically going door to door with its hand out, demanding money, and I guarantee they want that money with no strings attached, so that they can immediately throw out the work force at any moment if the stock price goes down a few percentage points.

 

[BoboOOZ]

STM is also partly owned by the French and Italian governments.

However, as says Wikipedia, they're now a Dutch company with HQ in Switzerland, which probably means that their revenue crosses so many borders and mountains that no one knows where it's gone eventually.

Geneva is right on the French border, and very close to Italy. And the money goes to the equity holders, as in any publicly traded company.

The main thing here is not revenue, it's keeping a know how and and a manufacturing capacity in Europe. It's done for strategic reasons, not purely for economic reasons, otherwise it would be cheaper to buy from Qualcomm, TSMC etc.

 

[lemonadesoda]

Funny. Governments cannot subsidise state run industries without falling foul. And certainly not foreign companies. Unless it's an American company, where revenues will be washed in Dutch and offshore corporate mixers so there are no local taxes to recover the initial subsidies and backscratching-fees. But governments are ready to indebt the future, just so they can say "we created jobs - vote for us again".

 

[KrazyT]

After all, it's easy to spend money you don't own, no ?

 

[mouacyk]

After all, it's easy to spend money you don't own, no ?

That money ain't gonna spend itself

 

[chrcoluk]

In my mind if a government subsidises investment, it should have part ownership, Intel have pulled their trousers down.

 

[Paganstomp]

Subsidies, Taxes, and You.

 

[ReallyBigMistake]

Isn't it insane that back in the 80s and even the early 90s, Europe had some of the most advanced fabs in the world because of companies like Philips and Siemens but as the 2000s started both decided to spin-off their semiconductor and memory industry and today Europe has nothing to compete against America and Asia. Full blown capitalism has really hurt Europe in some sectors.
I think the biggest ones left are STMicro and I think they don't even have competitive fabs.

​

 

[mouacyk]

In my mind if a government subsidises investment, it should have part ownership, Intel have pulled their trousers down.

It really is bastardized socialism

 

[Wirko]

Isn't it insane that back in the 80s and even the early 90s, Europe had some of the most advanced fabs in the world because of companies like Philips and Siemens but as the 2000s started both decided to spin-off their semiconductor and memory industry and today Europe has nothing to compete against America and Asia. Full blown capitalism has really hurt Europe in some sectors.

Well, at least we got ASML out of Philips.

I think the biggest ones left are STMicro and I think they don't even have competitive fabs.

That depends on what "competitive" means. In high performance processors and memory, absolutely not. In many other things, absolutely yes. For example, one area in which STM is particularly strong is radiation hardened chips for space applications.

 

[kondamin]

Isn't it insane that back in the 80s and even the early 90s, Europe had some of the most advanced fabs in the world because of companies like Philips and Siemens but as the 2000s started both decided to spin-off their semiconductor and memory industry and today Europe has nothing to compete against America and Asia. Full blown capitalism has really hurt Europe in some sectors.
I think the biggest ones left are STMicro and I think they don't even have competitive fabs.

​

Globalism is the ruin of civilisation, one boat stuck and prices for everything explode.
issues in one country and the world can no longer get certain medications.

 

[BoboOOZ]

That depends on what "competitive" means. In high performance processors and memory, absolutely not. In many other things, absolutely yes. For example, one area in which STM is particularly strong is radiation hardened chips for space applications.

Indeed, they are competitive, otherwise they would be out of the market, it's just they don't compete in the high end consumer segment at all.

But indeed they are far behind Intel TSMC in transistor density, maybe catching up with Global Foundries.

 

[trsttte]

Globalism is the ruin of civilisation, one boat stuck and prices for everything explode.
issues in one country and the world can no longer get certain medications.

That's a terrible take. Your examples are not of globalization (which I think is what you meant instead of globalism) but of concentrated supply chains that depend on single very specific resources.

The problem is not globalization but how capitalism takes advantage of it to increase profits without any though or regard for the consequences.

 

[Redwoodz]

So Intel demands 3.3 billion from Germany, meanwhile Vietnam is getting 3.4 billion from Intel. ok

 

[ThrashZone]

So Intel demands 3.3 billion from Germany, meanwhile Vietnam is getting 3.4 billion from Intel. ok

Hi,
Yeah I just had to laugh ransom Peter to pay Paul seems like to me and hope nobody notices it

 

[dicobalt]

When companies who "print money" want free money from taxpayers. This is a modern American corporate business model. The same goes for TSMC and anyone else getting free money for their very profitable business. Maybe these companies need to temper their roadmaps to be more viable instead of expecting taxpayers to sustain them.