TSMC Boss Responds to Reports of Brutal Corporate Culture

[T0@st]

Mark Liu, the executive Chairman of TSMC, has responded to recent reports released by the North American media about supposedly challenging workplace conditions. Current and former employees of the company's U.S operation have taken anonymously to Glassdoor to complain about "brutal" treatment on behalf of TSMC leadership—resulting in a 27% overall approval rating, which sits unfavorably next to the scores of nearby competitors—for example Intel gets 85%, albeit from far more user submissions. Liu has made comments to a Taiwanese news outlet (Focus Taiwan) where he suggests that: "those who are unwilling to take shifts should not enter the industry, since this field isn't just about lucrative wages but rather a passion for (semiconductors)."

TSMC is trying to meet staffing targets for its Phoenix, Arizona operation, but early feedback and difficult residential living could stifle this recruitment drive. Liu thinks that his North American division will offer potential employees a workplace culture that is unlike the one set for crew back in Taiwan. He told the local reporter that American TSMC team members will have an easier time, relative to how things are run at the company's native facilities. He also states that leadership is open to discussions with NA workers, as long as company values are followed (to a tee).



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[BetrayerX]

Liu has made comments to a Taiwanese news outlet (Focus Taiwan) where he suggests that: "those who are unwilling to take shifts should not enter the industry, since this field isn't just about lucrative wages but rather a passion for (semiconductors)."

And there you have it, a$$h0le 101, Saying that this industry is not as lucrative with a straight face.

 

[Dr. Dro]

Shameful display, Mr. Liu. Bezos had you beat by 2016.

US20150066283A1 - System and method for transporting personnel within an active workspace - Google Patents

Disclosed herein is a human transport device and associated system to transport a user within an active workspace. The human transport device may include a platform to support a user, an enclosure coupled to the platform to surround the user, a drive subsystem to power the human transport...

patents.google.com

What? Why are you looking at me like that? Those who do not share a passion for warehouses shouldn't enter the industry. Likewise, those who don't share a passion for semiconductors shouldn't work at TSMC. It makes sense to me!

 

[64K]

So Liu is saying that employees in the US will not be exploited and exposed to brutal working conditions like his employees in Taiwan. What a jerk.

He has the wrong attitude and he probably won't let it go even if it screws up the Fab in Arizona.

 

[Dr. Dro]

So Liu is saying that employees in the US will not be exploited and exposed to brutal working conditions like his employees in Taiwan. What a jerk.

He has the wrong attitude and he probably won't let it go even if it screws up the Fab in Arizona.

I must confess, there are few things I find more loathsome than treating your employees like dirt. And this is the company which manufactures most of the world's chips... supposedly, one that should be a role model in every single regard. Just depressing.

 

[Deleted member 229121]

So their plan for improved work conditions amount to scented diapers and suicide prevention posters. Got it.

 

[AGlezB]

this is the company which manufactures most of the world's chips

You'll often hear about the insane benefits of working for some tech giants such as Google but the fact is whatever Google spends hiring professional chefs is just a cost associated with keeping talented people from leaving the for the competition.

You don't become the leading company in any field by leaving profits on the table. You'll give just enough freedom to your workers so that productivity isn't impacted and that will be geared mostly towards the employees involved in creative work because they cannot function properly otherwise. Everyone else is easily replaceable and the lower the technical requirements are for a position the easier it is to fill and the lower the benefits it has for the empoyee.

That's not TSMC, that's just capitalism. Mark Liu just said what every other Fortune 500 CEO in the world knows and applies.

 

[Squared]

I looked through some comments on Glassdoor to get an idea what people are actually saying. I saw mention of it being a higher-stress workplace, of cultural differences, and of limited ability for US HR to solve problems at the company. These problems seem like mere growing pains for a company expanding into the US. The stress in particular I think is a matter of opinion. Some people avoid any mildly stressful situation, but I can't stand that. I think there's a healthy amount of stress and it's okay and even good to have that stress in the workplace. (Although there is a point where it's too much.)

There's also comments about micromanaging and about compensation promises that won't be followed. That sounds more concerning.

But TSMC primarily hires people from Taiwan, which has the 21st highest median income in the world. It's likely that unhappy TSMC employees have other options. I suspect that describing the company as "brutal" is an exaggeration.

 

[AnarchoPrimitiv]

I'm sure TSMC will do what every company does to reward employees and show them they're valued.....not a raise...not better working conditions....a pizza party.

 

[Ferrum Master]

That's the truth for many companies... Let's be honest here, it ain't only TSMC problem. We are so over abused with snowflake problems, that the brute average workforce labor doesn't even get attention.

 

[Easo]

Oh how I hate these people... Sometimes I wonder if they actually believe their own words, not just talk the usual corpo greed speech.

this field isn't just about lucrative wages but rather a passion

 

[Dr. Dro]

You'll often hear about the insane benefits of working for some tech giants such as Google but the fact is whatever Google spends hiring professional chefs is just a cost associated with keeping talented people from leaving the for the competition.

You don't become the leading company in any field by leaving profits on the table. You'll give just enough freedom to your workers so that productivity isn't impacted and that will be geared mostly towards the employees involved in creative work because they cannot function properly otherwise. Everyone else is easily replaceable and the lower the technical requirements are for a position the easier it is to fill and the lower the benefits it has for the empoyee.

That's not TSMC, that's just capitalism. Mark Liu just said what every other Fortune 500 CEO in the world knows and applies.

Were I the CEO of such a company I'd gladly take 10 million out of my own pay (which is 30-50x that) to hire another engineer or two and make the employees actually have breathing room. This thing of overworking your employees to the bone isn't just a capitalist problem, it's also a cultural problem which is prevalent in Asia, and currently, one of Japan's greatest ills.

I believe in flexibility. Happy workers that aren't stressed and tired are productive workers. Reward workaholics by generously giving out bonuses if you must. I would totally not run any company with that doctrine.

 

[R-T-B]

That's the truth for many companies... Let's be honest here, it ain't only TSMC problem. We are so over abused with snowflake problems, that the brute average workforce labor doesn't even get attention.

Lol how'd you draw "snowflake problems" into this. Most "snowflake" types are strongly for labor rights and it's not an either/or scenario regardless.

 

[AGlezB]

Were I the CEO of such a company I'd gladly take 10 million out of my own pay (which is 30-50x that) to hire another engineer or two and make the employees actually have breathing room.

And 3 hours later the board of directors would find a reason to remove you from the CEO position. The reason is simple: you don't use 12 people to do the work of 10 and if you do then you're not F500 CEO material because the job of the CEO of a publicly traded company is not to make the employees happy but to make the investors happy. Investors aren't happy when you spend more than you absolutely have to.

This thing of overworking your employees to the bone isn't just a capitalist problem, it's also a cultural problem which is prevalent in Asia, and currently, one of Japan's greatest ills.

The issue from my POV is either social (forced to accept whatever job is available) or individual (accepting the job because of the benefits). What I mean is that provided that you actually have a choice in the matter if you choose to work for a so called black company then the fault is entirely yours. Blaming the companies for this issue is wrong IMO. They offer a lot of money for those positions and when you sign the contract you're accepting whatever conditions they have set for you.

It is human nature to always want more and companies of all sizes take advantage of that. A high salary is a honeytrap in pretty much every company in the world. You go in thinking that making that much you'll be able to afford a house in a few years and then changing to a less demanding job but then you want a bigger house and a bigger pool and a better car and holidays in Paris or the Caribbean and then you cannot leave the company because you have debts and leases and morgages and less demanding jobs don't pay that well.

I was taught that richest person is not the one that has more but the one that needs less. The happiest workers in the world usually are those doing their own thing and earning peanuts out of it.

 

[Ferrum Master]

Lol how'd you draw "snowflake problems" into this. Most "snowflake" types are strongly for labor rights and it's not an either/or scenario regardless.

Snowflake problems are often just being done because of good PR, as those are very vocal. Those are a minority and easy to fix. The major problems that represent this case are very hard to solve and are left untouched.

Those things cannot be mixed really. Most of crude average workers don't care for those snowflakes they care for their bills and family to feed, they remain silent and passive.

 

[R-T-B]

Snowflake problems are often just being done because of good PR, as those are very vocal. Those are a minority and easy to fix. The major problems that represent this case are very hard to solve and are left untouched.

Those things cannot be mixed really. Most of crude average workers don't care for those snowflakes they care for their bills and family to feed, they remain silent and passive.

Sounds like you are injecting unneccesary politics into this, really. Regardless I can't agree with anything you just said.

I think we should leave it at that. I'm certainly going to.

 

[Rotorama]

Working for a supplier of TSMC, I get strong signals that their employees and our people on-site get pressured hard, though my experience so far has been more in Taiwan.

Watching the American Factory documentary, I can only imagine what might happen TSMC tries to work over US employees like they do in Taiwan.

 

[Ferrum Master]

Sounds like you are injecting unneccesary politics into this, really. Regardless I can't agree with anything you just said.

I think we should leave it at that. I'm certainly going to.

Mate, this all about company politics and nothing else.

 

[Dr. Dro]

And 3 hours later the board of directors would find a reason to remove you from the CEO position. The reason is simple: you don't use 12 people to do the work of 10 and if you do then you're not F500 CEO material because the job of the CEO of a publicly traded company is not to make the employees happy but to make the investors happy. Investors aren't happy when you spend more than you absolutely have to.

The issue from my POV is either social (forced to accept whatever job is available) or individual (accepting the job because of the benefits). What I mean is that provided that you actually have a choice in the matter if you choose to work for a so called black company then the fault is entirely yours. Blaming the companies for this issue is wrong IMO. They offer a lot of money for those positions and when you sign the contract you're accepting whatever conditions they have set for you.

It is human nature to always want more and companies of all sizes take advantage of that. A high salary is a honeytrap in pretty much every company in the world. You go in thinking that making that much you'll be able to afford a house in a few years and then changing to a less demanding job but then you want a bigger house and a bigger pool and a better car and holidays in Paris or the Caribbean and then you cannot leave the company because you have debts and leases and morgages and less demanding jobs don't pay that well.

I was taught that richest person is not the one that has more but the one that needs less. The happiest workers in the world usually are those doing their own thing and earning peanuts out of it.

Agreed, but that's why I wouldn't be in a fortune 500 company anyway. I don't have such delusions of grandeur. But it's our position as customers to send the message, I do not like this guy's MO and I do not like to see companies mistreating their employees. I can't say I'll vote with my wallet because no TSMC means going back to the stone age (yes I'm aware this is a problem), but I will make myself vocal here.

If it's enough to sustain myself and my family, with a rainy day fund... it's enough. I would be happy to live a life taking only what I need, and more people should consider doing the same. They'd be happier for it.

 

[claes]

The issue from my POV is either social (forced to accept whatever job is available) or individual (accepting the job because of the benefits). What I mean is that provided that you actually have a choice in the matter if you choose to work for a so called black company then the fault is entirely yours. Blaming the companies for this issue is wrong IMO. They offer a lot of money for those positions and when you sign the contract you're accepting whatever conditions they have set for you.

It is human nature to always want more and companies of all sizes take advantage of that. A high salary is a honeytrap in pretty much every company in the world. You go in thinking that making that much you'll be able to afford a house in a few years and then changing to a less demanding job but then you want a bigger house and a bigger pool and a better car and holidays in Paris or the Caribbean and then you cannot leave the company because you have debts and leases and morgages and less demanding jobs don't pay that well.

I was taught that richest person is not the one that has more but the one that needs less. The happiest workers in the world usually are those doing their own thing and earning peanuts out of it.

I tend to agree but see it as entirely a social problem. If there’s any “choice” here it’s selling your labor to be exploited or not selling your labor and committing to a life of misery. Everyone deserves to flourish, but the economy wouldn’t “work,” as much as it does, if everyone was able to live comfortably, have free time, retire early, etc

 

[Makaveli]

Liu has made comments to a Taiwanese news outlet (Focus Taiwan) where he suggests that: "those who are unwilling to take shifts should not enter the industry, since this field isn't just about lucrative wages but rather a passion for (semiconductors)."

And there you have it, a$$h0le 101, Saying that this industry is not as lucrative with a straight face.

I wonder how many hours Mark Liu works in day!

I get a feeling its do as I say not as I do.

And 3 hours later the board of directors would find a reason to remove you from the CEO position. The reason is simple: you don't use 12 people to do the work of 10 and if you do then you're not F500 CEO material because the job of the CEO of a publicly traded company is not to make the employees happy but to make the investors happy. Investors aren't happy when you spend more than you absolutely have to.

And this is the reason I would never run a publically traded company.

 

[dicobalt]

Keep saying it's just the jobs nobody wants.

 

[lexluthermiester]

"those who are unwilling to take shifts should not enter the industry, since this field isn't just about lucrative wages but rather a passion for (semiconductors)."

Here's an idea Mr Liu: Utilize shifts that Americans are WILLING to work.

Forcing workers into 5 12hour shifts per week, rotating nights and days every week are NOT acceptable scheduling schemes. If YOU wouldn't work that schedule, don't insult the people who won't either, Moron. I don't know how things work in Taiwan, but over here, if you don't respect your employees, you don't HAVE employees.

 

[droopyRO]

5 12hours shifts per week rotating nights and days

You get a day off for one of those 12 hour shifts or you work more than 240 hours a month ? If so, you can't do that without having a wife that is stay at home, or your parents taking care of the house ,the groceries, cooking, dishes, laundry and the kids. Add to that a 1-2 hour commute and you are away from home for 5 days a week each week ? that is a schedule for Asia not for Europe or the US IMHO.
If you get a day off for each 12 hour shift that includes night shifts, than that might not be a bad deal.

 

[Prima.Vera]

Taiwan, China, Korea and specially Japan.
In Asia there is still the medieval working style mentality that workers are just soulless drones, hired only to perform tasks, without questioning, personality, or any other kind of life.
In Japan they even said -the workers actually (yeah, brainwashing is the finest), that family comes 3rd, after the Boss and after the Company or the work place.
So no wonder that a$$holes like this TSMC boss are making those statements with a visible frustration, that he might need to offer "special treatment" to US workers, something that instead of being the norm, he consider an exception from the rules. His rules.