AMD Announces FidelityFX Super Resolution 3 (FSR 3) Fluid Motion Rivaling DLSS 3, Broad Hardware Support

[Kabouter Plop]

Exactly this!

In order for FG to work (whether you call it DLSS 3 FG or FSR 3, it doesn't matter), you need 2 queued frames in the render pipeline to insert a 3rd one in between. If you want a decent, lag-free gaming experience, you should limit queued frames to 1. Conclusion: frame generation is pointless. Moving on.

So like vsync where the latency go's down the more frames are pushed out.

 

[AusWolf]

So like vsync where the latency go's down the more frames are pushed out.

Vsync is useful when your GPU can push frames exceeding your monitor's refresh rate, especially with a variable refresh rate display. FG is not.

 

[Xeanoa]

I feel like this entire thread is a 150 comments of bickering who does it worse.
Never change, TPU.

 

[AusWolf]

I feel like this entire thread is a 150 comments of bickering who does it worse.
Never change, TPU.

Why don't you add something constructive, then?

 

[Xeanoa]

Why don't you add something constructive, then?

You're right, I don't have anything contructive to add. I voiced my discontent after reading through the thread trying to find the interesting bits and bobs.

 

[Tek-Check]

Does AMD need a noisy mob of armchair warriors defending them too?' I'm not being cynical, he literally said money exchanges hands and that request is part of the deal, "please prioritize and support our technology" - meanwhile you've written a veritable text wall.

As you saw, I don't represent a noisy mob. I gave you rather dispassionate and well-argued text. It gave you a space to think about it, agree or disagree with different ideas and explanations in it.

If you haven't realized why Nvidia gamers are unhappy with this is because we'll be stuck using AMD' bo—* tech instead. It's an anti-consumer choice move.

Hahaha! Of course, poor Nvidia gamers will need anti-depressive pills to deal with this "unjustice".

OK ok, I admit I added the boring part to poke, please disregard, I'm interested in a healthy discourse... And I'll do my part for it here on out.

All good. I am not the one to poke, as I am not emotionally invested in any particular company or technology. Oh, I am not telling the truth. I am in love with OLED for content consumption.

 

[fevgatos]

so you're claiming that nvidia never released or will never release a product tier slower than its predecessor?
don't make me search the history, I'm sure it happend and it might happen again.
I'm just assuming it might happen again like you are assuming it's happening with 7800xt, because reviews aren't out yet and I'm sure you haven't tested the card yourself

The funny thing is...just think about it.

The 4070 - as everyone was saying - is a 4060 in disguise. Cool. The 6800xt was competing with the 3080, and now the 7800xt is competing with basically a 4060. I can't wrap my head around that....From an xx80 competitor to an xx60 competitor, but let's blame nvidia anyways

 

[kapone32]

Just imagine what this will do for AMD APUs. By the time the AM5 APus come to desktop this should allow for Guaranteed 60 FPS at 1080P High settings.

 

[fevgatos]

I might say some have foam on their mouths regarding this release.
like nvidia hasn't done shady stuff with their developer partners in the past. how long did it take for AMD RT and FSR to get implemented in Cyberpunk? such is the market.
let's not forget how nvidia bought ageia and locked physics to their graphic cards, screwing over people that bought ageia physx accelerators.

Lad, you are making stuff up. FSR didn't even exist when cyberpunk was released.

 

[InVasMani]

AMD should implement something similar to their technique which will upscale when the scene is still, but for interpolation. It's a readily obvious area where interpolation would be used to enhance animation details along with lighting and shading effects and really weather effects within a scene without the problems of added input lag being introduced causing a issue. In periods of time where you're not really interacting within the scene input lag become rather irrelevant. The immersion on the other hand is at times in those scenario's a point of emphasis and thus a perfect compliment. I don't see any serious downside in that scenario to interpolation.

When a scene is in motion things are bit different in regard to interpolation however though I'd argue you need less of it in those scenario's at the same time. How much will you notice slight bit of improved frame fluidity within a scene in motion versus added input latency being readily felt!? It's certainly a trade off. If it's enhancing scene details enough and at low enough additional overhead perhaps it's worthy of consideration otherwise perhaps not. Relationship status of in motion interpolation it's complicated.

I think the important thing is it could be applied selectively or at the right moments and not take anything away from the experience negatively, but provide a immersion uplift on the other hand which is a fairly notable consideration.

I was actually in favor of GPU hardware interpolation and pretty adamant about potential use cases before Nvidia even released Ada or announced GPU hardware interpolation on TPU. My thoughts interpolation being a positive haven't changed, but latency overhead is a concern and what I suggested above addresses a good portion of the concern without detracting from it any. Eventually I'm sure things will become easier to apply it while in motion more proactively though without as impactful latency impact to do so.

As far as FSR3 it's clearly another step in the right direction for AMD which is nothing to gripe about. It seems like some people would have been more content with AMD not having frame interpolation or improving FSR which is foolish.

Frankly I see pretty much any post process being something that could be layered together and/or interpolated in between GPU/CPU prepared frame renders. The only thing that matters is how much latency does it require relative to expectations and if it's worth the added overhead or not. If it increases immersion and frame rate impact is satisfactory that's really that only criteria that matters.

 

[fevgatos]

If implementing a technology in your game takes time, then why would you spend extra time to implement two very similar technologies when you could do just one that fits all, and call it a day? Maybe there's no conspiracy here, just capitalism, and limited game development times.

Nvidia streamline makes easy to implement all 3 upscalers at the same time. Would probably take less time to implement all three than just FSR. Furthermore, there are games that did have DLSS but removed it before released after getting sponsored by AMD. So, they in fact spend extra time to remove a feature that's already there. It's kinda obvious that amd blocks dlss

 

[kapone32]

The funny thing is...just think about it.

The 4070 - as everyone was saying - is a 4060 in disguise. Cool. The 6800xt was competing with the 3080, and now the 7800xt is competing with basically a 4060. I can't wrap my head around that....From an xx80 competitor to an xx60 competitor, but let's blame nvidia anyways

What are you talking about? Don't blame AMD for Nvidia's machinations. How are you so confident in your position when the 3080 and 4070 have the exact same VRAM allocation. As far as blame I guess anyone except the very Company that has been trying their best to gentrify the GPU market for DIY. There is also the fact that until Sept 6 no one can speak with confidence on the performance of these cards. Now that AMD has responded with a much more user friendly (Yes that is right) implementation of something Nvidia reserved for the highest end GPUs. This seems par for the course and helps to separate further the narrative vs the truth.

 

[AusWolf]

there are games that did have DLSS but removed it before released after getting sponsored by AMD.

Why would you think that?

 

[kapone32]

Nvidia streamline makes easy to implement all 3 upscalers at the same time. Would probably take less time to implement all three than just FSR. Furthermore, there are games that did have DLSS but removed it before released after getting sponsored by AMD. So, they in fact spend extra time to remove a feature that's already there. It's kinda obvious that amd blocks dlss

Where is your proof of that? I have LIVED through plenty of Nvidia problems and please don't make them seem like some Olive Branch provider. All that is is an attempt by Nvidia to remain relevant in a Space where AMD and Intel are getting more entrenched. That is why they are so heavily focused on the Gaming Laptop space as heavy as they are but I saw Framework at AMD's event at Gamescom and we all know how good the 6600M was.

 

[fevgatos]

Why would you think that?

What do you mean why do I think that? Because it did happen. There was a game that actually did have DLSS, then it got sponsored by AMD and poof. DLSS was gone

What are you talking about? Don't blame AMD for Nvidia's machinations. How are you so confident in your position when the 3080 and 4070 have the exact same VRAM allocation. As far as blame I guess anyone except the very Company that has been trying their best to gentrify the GPU market for DIY. There is also the fact that until Sept 6 no one can speak with confidence on the performance of these cards. Now that AMD has responded with a much more user friendly (Yes that is right) implementation of something Nvidia reserved for the highest end GPUs. This seems par for the course and helps to separate further the narrative vs the truth.

What are you talking about? Im saying that nvidia released the 4060 as a 4070, and then AMD managed to do them one better by releasing the 7600xt as a 7800xt. A proper *800xt should be competing with the 4080, just like the previous gen did.

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

Yes, Nvidia agrees, developed and released the open source Streamline framework which serves this exact purpose. One implementation to service all three upscalers.

Intel adopted it and Nvidia provides DLSS precompiled for it, but AMD has refused to write and maintain an FSR plug-in for it.

Proprietary door keeper is Nvidia, no Ty.

Nvidia proved to be a shitty doorman.

So bad in fact MS ran away and Elon built a Dojo and that's just in recent history.

More generally.

The same bullshit tangents getting argued by the same green tint bregade time and again regardless of Original post topic.

I wouldn't use this much but if I do, I'll await a review, in use before I spout comical balls about it, or not.

 

[kapone32]

What are you talking about? Im saying that nvidia released the 4060 as a 4070, and then AMD managed to do them one better by releasing the 7600xt as a 7800xt. A proper *800xt should be competing with the 4080, just like the previous gen did.

Are you serious? How do you get the 7600Xt as a 7800XT when the card was just announced yestersday?

 

[fevgatos]

Are you serious? How do you get the 7600Xt as a 7800XT when the card was just announced yestersday?

The 6800xt was competing with the 3080, right? The 7800xt is competing with the 4070 (according to AMD themselves). The 4070 is basically a 4060 with a name change (according to the TPU users, probably including you, too bored to go read the 4070 thread but w/e). So the x800XT was competing with xx80 last gen, now it's competing with the 4060. Rofl

 

[AusWolf]

What do you mean why do I think that? Because it did happen. There was a game that actually did have DLSS, then it got sponsored by AMD and poof. DLSS was gone

Which one? How do you know it had DLSS before release?

 

[fevgatos]

Which one? How do you know it had DLSS before release?

Boundary. The game was in early access and had DLSS. Then AMD sponsored it. I mean it's a UE4 game, adding DLSS is basically a checkbox, the work is already done by epic.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/125b0ts

Boundary will no longer feature Ray Tracing, ditches DLSS over FSR & XeSS

Even though Surgical Scalpels showcased some really GPU-heavy RT effects for Boundary, the game will not feature any of them at launch.

www.dsogaming.com

 

[sodium]

I really hope AMD can get a proper Reflex competitor so I can actually consider AMD cards as a purchase option. I will buy a slower Nvidia card at the same price point only for this feature. Its that good.

 

[Keullo-e]

My 6700 XT is going to love this as I play at 4K60

 

[R0H1T]

Vsync is useful when your GPU can push frames exceeding your monitor's refresh rate, especially with a variable refresh rate display. FG is not.

Well if you want 1 (fake) fps for every frame in the render pipeline are you really playing a game at that point?

There was a game that actually did have DLSS, then it got sponsored by AMD and poof. DLSS was gone

Good for the publisher/developer then ~ AMD's technically more than 50% of the high end gaming market

 

[kapone32]

The 6800xt was competing with the 3080, right? The 7800xt is competing with the 4070 (according to AMD themselves). The 4070 is basically a 4060 with a name change (according to the TPU users, probably including you, too bored to go read the 4070 thread but w/e). So the x800XT was competing with xx80 last gen, now it's competing with the 4060. Rofl

Really? let's look at it in truth. Nvidia has the 409074080/4070 and they have 24/16/12 GB of Vram. On AMD's side you have (now) 7900XTX/7900XT/7800XT and they have 24/20/16 GB of VRAM. So based on that the card to compete it would be the card that has not yet released. Then you attack me. I do not not buy Nvidia because of some blind fan boy fever. I am a proud owner of a 7900XT and love it. Before you go on the mitigating factor for me is price. So I had a 7900XTX and returned it. The 7900XT was $400 (in my country) cheaper than the XTX and the 4090 is about $1000-1200 more than the XTX. As a result my Wife asked me if I was daft to spend that much on a card that would not be noticeable. Of course there is no one but Nvidia to blame them for using less VRAM but you get DLSS for that premium and I laugh at 4K with my perfectly proper 144hz panel. I was in the middle of a turn in TWWH3 so that effects the FPS. Look at Exoprimal and Armored Core 6 both new Games that are at 4K with Vsync turned off. My panel has HDR 1000 so the contrast and brightness are awesome.

 

[fevgatos]

Good for the publisher/developer then ~ AMD's technically more than 50% of the high end gaming market

Which part of having to do EXTRA work to remove a feature that is already there is "good" for anyone? You realize they could just add FSR without removing DLSS that was already there, right?

Anyways, the point was whether or not AMD is anti consumer blocking DLSS, and the answer is yes they are. Boundary is a prime example of that.

AMD has 0% of the high end gaming market. You can't be high end without proper RT acceleration.