AMD Ryzen 7000G APU Series Includes Lower End Models Based on "Phoenix 2"

[cfenton]

AMD is taking too long. Even the RTX 4060 is too slow for 720p upscaled games now. Starfield, Alan Wake 2, Avatar.

We need an iGPU that is faster than the RTX 4060 for a good price to play games at 720p/60fps locked.

That's something like the chip in the Series X. If AMD made a similar chip, but with Zen 4 and RDNA 3, it would probably get to 4060 territory. The problems are power consumption and memory bandwidth, and I don't know how to overcome those problems with a socketed setup. It also probably wouldn't be cheap.

 

[Garrus]

If current AM5 (2 x RDNA2) models have 55% the performance of a 5600G, then I'd guess 4 x RDNA3 beats the latter. That's a pretty good budget APU (even if not useful for me).
View attachment 319500


The 5600G is €122, B550 for €68, 16GB for €35, = €225. Not bad for a cheap build. Edit: Forgot it's a PCIE3 CPU so cut €20 from the board if you like.
Just the 7600 starts at €228 tho.

The GTX 1060 is ancient though. Would really like to see an APU beat that. Strix Halo hurry up.

That's something like the chip in the Series X. If AMD made a similar chip, but with Zen 4 and RDNA 3, it would probably get to 4060 territory. The problems are power consumption and memory bandwidth, and I don't know how to overcome those problems with a socketed setup. It also probably wouldn't be cheap.

Well 2024 is 4 years since the Series S launched. I think beating that with a cheap APU shouldn't be hard.

 

[kiakk]

I hope that AMD will move to desktop also something more performed than was written in this article.

We are waiting for that for 15 years already.... But we can only buy an AMD Fusion product in a console.

I Would buy an ultra efficient monolith designed APU with capable 3D performance for online competetive games on low settings with 144fps performance.
But they kill their APUs with their own market policy. A Cheap CPU + any cheap dGPU with a similar budget limit can provide also high efficiency but much more 3D performance.
(For example a GTX 1650 + i3-12100F/R5-3600 is just a "little more" money than a 5600G. CPU+dGPU is +50% more money than an 5600G itslef, but CPU&dGPU combo gives +100% - 200% 3D performance, while an 12100F and a GTX 1650 is still have a very good Performance/watt efficiency.)

I would expect a real AMD Fusion: Like They should design an AMD APU with more CU with Quad Channel DDR5 controller + MOBO brands should produce APU specific motherboards with 4 channel DDR5 with max. ~90-120W VRM capacity with high efficiency and only 1-2 PCIe x4-x8 slot need for upgrade (like Sound card for players/HTPC or drive controller+10G LAN for NAS, etc...). No need PCIe 4.0/5.0 x16 for dGPU in this case.
Only very expensive manufacturers make something similar (like minisforum), but their disadvantage is the price.

 

[AusWolf]

We are waiting for that for 15 years already.... But we can only buy an AMD Fusion product in a console.

View attachment 320327

I Would buy an ultra efficient monolith designed APU with capable 3D performance for online competetive games on low settings with 144fps performance.
But they kill their APUs with their own market policy. A Cheap CPU + any cheap dGPU with a similar budget limit can provide also high efficiency but much more 3D performance.
(For example a GTX 1650 + i3-12100F/R5-3600 is just a "little more" money than a 5600G. CPU+dGPU is +50% more money than an 5600G itslef, but CPU&dGPU combo gives +100% - 200% 3D performance, while an 12100F and a GTX 1650 is still have a very good Performance/watt efficiency.)

I would expect a real AMD Fusion: Like They should design an AMD APU with more CU with Quad Channel DDR5 controller + MOBO brands should produce APU specific motherboards with 4 channel DDR5 with max. ~90-120W VRM capacity with high efficiency and only 1-2 PCIe x4-x8 slot need for upgrade (like Sound card for players/HTPC or drive controller+10G LAN for NAS, etc...). No need PCIe 4.0/5.0 x16 for dGPU in this case.
Only very expensive manufacturers make something similar (like minisforum), but their disadvantage is the price.

The problem with Fusion as an option for gaming is, and always has been, memory bandwidth. An APU is limited to whatever DDR5 standards we're at, which is 96 GB/s at 6000 MHz, or roughly ~115 GB/s at 7200, which is currently not possible on AMD. Even if it was, it wouldn't be enough to feed anything more powerful than a 6500 XT level iGPU. Quad channel memory would increase development costs, not to mention the cost of a motherboard and quad-channel memory kits, which would make it more expensive than a mainstream CPU+GPU combo with cheap memory on a cheap motherboard. The means would defeat the purpose.

 

[Redwoodz]

AMD is taking too long. Even the RTX 4060 is too slow for 720p upscaled games now. Starfield, Alan Wake 2, Avatar.

We need an iGPU that is faster than the RTX 4060 for a good price to play games at 720p/60fps locked.

That's insane. 4060 cost $300 and is 1000 times bigger than a cpu and you expect an integrated gpu to beat it? Get real.

 

[Count von Schwalbe]

which is currently not possible on AMD

Ah, but monolithic APUs and CPUs have always had much better IMCs than the chiplet-based Zen. We just don't have any of the 5nm ones yet to compare. It should compare favorably with the 7nm IOD on current offerings, as the 7nm 5x00G series did to the 14nm IOD on Zen 3.

Well 2024 is 4 years since the Series S launched. I think beating that with a cheap APU shouldn't be hard.

You can buy it as a desktop kit - with iGPU disabled.

From all accounts I have heard GDDR6 as system memory is a really bad idea due to the huge latency penalty.

 

[AusWolf]

Ah, but monolithic APUs and CPUs have always had much better IMCs than the chiplet-based Zen. We just don't have any of the 5nm ones yet to compare. It should compare favorably with the 7nm IOD on current offerings, as the 7nm 5x00G series did to the 14nm IOD on Zen 3.

My point is that even if it's possible, ~115 GB/s still isn't enough for a decent gaming iGPU.

 

[Avro Arrow]

I'd be interested to see these APUs' IGPs compared with the IGPs that are now included with every AMD CPU. Sure, of course they'll be better but the question is "How much better?".

 

[AusWolf]

I'd be interested to see these APUs' IGPs compared with the IGPs that are now included with every AMD CPU. Sure, of course they'll be better but the question is "How much better?".

Zen 4 CPUs have a 2-CU RDNA2 unit at 2200 MHz. So if we assume similar clocks and minimal to no IPC gains, then the 12-CU iGPU in the APU should be about 6 times faster, or 50% faster than the 5700G.

 

[systemBuilder]

AMD released the first 1080p iGPU with the 5600g / 5700g (I bought the latter and some superb DDR4-4000 micron RAM). So for the first time you could run almost all 1080p games at low settings and 30-60fps on an iGPU. Is AMD going to challenge themselves to do better? They need a 1440p iGPU, something that can hit 30 fps at low settings. I think they need an iGPU with 16 CUs, not 12.

They are taking their darned sweet time making these APUs. APU laptop cores have been out for 12 months, and I don't think it tales 12 months to convert the SoDIMM I/O pins to DDR5 ... these CPUs are so late I doubt they will see much of a market, most people who wanted a powerful desktop iGPU have already bought something with a 780M iGPU from Minisforum.