Microsoft Closer to Removing Local Accounts from Windows 11, Removes Help Page on How to Switch to One

[TheDeeGee]

It's not bad at all. Valve has really put in the work such that basically any linux distro can install steam, turn on proton and go to town. Nvidia drivers are still annoying, but if you've got amd or intel hardware it's mac levels of easy.

What about old non-steam games from between 1998-2004-ish?

Can they be installed and run without any hassle?

I use home a local account since I don't need that bs with username and password prompt every time I start my PC or resume from sleep mode.

Yeah, that's my main concern.

I don't want the hassle of having to log in each boot.

 

[modmax]

windows 11 ltsc .....

 

[BSim500]

I have seen videos where XP is infected in zero time online, but those videos are made with windows XP completely unsecured, connected online directly and not through a router, if I am not mistaken. But what about an XP system with an antivirus(even old and not currently updated), a firewall and a router that comes with it's own protection layers. I am playing with an ancient Athlon XP, running ....Windows XP, that I do connect online. It's obviously dead slow, but having connected it for hours, even days, when I connect it's SSD on a Windows 11 system and check it, Win11 finds nothing malicious on it.

There's a lot of FUD with "OMG you'll get hacked in seconds for running a 1-day out of date OS, but my updated W11 is immune to everything!". If you run W11 like that recent Youtube XP demonstration, ie, Windows Firewall intentionally disabled, all ports open, connected to the Internet "raw" like an old 56k analogue modem (not sitting behind a Router NAT & no router firewall), then that will be hacked in a day too. So too will half the worlds modern up to date IoT appliances connected to the Internet "raw". Likewise, "I run W11" doesn't automatically mean "up to date and secure" either, as almost half the people I know running it have disabled Windows updates at some point due to the Bullsh*t factor of Microsoft constantly shovelling more and more advertising / spyware or breaking something / locking down something else in each new build, as well as disabled Windows Defender due to the wall of false positives and exceptionally dishonest practise of falsely flagging non-hostile software as "viruses" simply because Microsoft doesn't "like" them (eg, Cheat Engine, ExplorerPatcher, StartAllBack and open-source KMS Windows / Office activators that even Microsoft themselves have been caught telling customers to use). "They're 'virus-less viruses' - mainly because we don't want you configuring your own PC anymore..."

There's also the psychological factor - someone still running an older 'insecure' OS is often likely to be more vigilant and disable Server service / SMB, switch Windows Firewall to a whitelist, etc. It's the casual W11 users who often get sucked into a complacent "I'm running W11 and just updated so I have perfect security" whilst continuing to run Windows Firewall in default blacklist-only mode that happily lets anything and everything make outgoing connections, sit there with Remote Desktop Configuration, Remote Desktop Services, Remote Desktop Services UserMode Port Redirector, Remote Registry, Secondary Login, etc, services all still enabled by default on their 'secure' OS...

 

[izy]

Are you kidding me?

 

[maxli86]

I just hope it's not entirely true if not:

1) Newer hardware Windows 11 does not have driver for it like LAN, WIFI Etc.
Which is why have to install using a local account first than install all the necessary driver
before connecting to Internet.
2)When PC crashes or corrupted, when you use local account you still have a chance
the files are there on the PC. If use MS account to log in, these files might be
sync using OneDrive.
What if you never sync these files, they are lost when the Windows cannot start.

Pros and cons but to remove local account which has not been practice since early days of Windows is dumb.

 

[Onasi]

I see that lack of competition in the desktop OS space is working wonders. MS is more and more comfortable in abusing its position and, in turn, abusing the customers. Hell, Mac looks appealing with all that, also requires an account, sure, but at least you get a non-scuffed OS.
No worries, the FOSS community will finally stop bickering amongst themselves and realize what everyone sane had a while ago - they should stop the ridiculous fragmentation and endless forking and try to actually make a one-stop-shop Linux that could actually attract normies, be hassle free and come as a finished product. It can even be commercial, imagine that. That will surely happen aaaaaaaany second now. I mean, with Microsoft making such self-sabotaging moves, it surely is an opportunity, right? R-right? Oh… right. It’s the FOSS community.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Microsoft really wants you to use Windows 11 with an online Microsoft Account.

They can go F&*$ themselves.

 

[Caring1]

Hate having to say I told you so....but
This came up in a recent video where they run out of options to create a user account and what I based my previous comments on.
The only option they found was to create a business account not a personal one.

 

[Broken Processor]

If they want to keep government/corporate users that’s not going to happen.

Now that I’m thinking about it I should make a series of complaints against the practice to my representatives and consumer protection agencies as it’s basically locking me in to Microsoft cloud services

Most domains have zero use for local accounts these days and they can run there own cloud server, domain controller and the like but I'd like to see how they stop peeps spoofing a DC to create an account like I use a pi4 as a DC for accounts, windows installs, ad block, routing and much more they will probably make another product.

 

[Kohl Baas]

What about old non-steam games from between 1998-2004-ish?

AFAIK those games have their own issues running on anything apart a computer and OS from their era. It is a hit-or-miss even on windows 10. I bought Hard Truck Apocalypse on steam, you still can, but it crahses with an "unhandled exception" error if I remember correctly and there is nothing to do.

 

[pavle]

They can go F&*$ themselves.

Yes indeed, at M$ they can garble themselves all day long and what's better if people don't buy their crap, their future is indeed more garbled.

 

[stimpy88]

I can't help but wonder what happened to Microsoft. I think Nutella genuinely hates customers and could not care less about what they actually want.

 

[BSim500]

What about old non-steam games from between 1998-2004-ish? Can they be installed and run without any hassle?

Many people use Heroic Game Launcher. Another option is Lutris, or simply adding the game to Steam as an external game. Many mid 90s to mid 2000's "Windows but pre-Steam and usually with no native Linux version" era games often work fine using WINE / Proton. Some games have decent native Linux source ports, eg:-

Doom 1-2, Heretic, Hexen & Strife = GZDoom
Quake 1 = vkQuake, Quake 2 = vkQuake2
Diablo = DevilutionX
Jagged Alliance 2 = JAStracciatella
Build Engine games (Duke Nukem, Blood, Shadow Warrior, etc) = Raze
Elder Scrolls 2 Daggerfall = Daggerfall Unity
Elder Scrolls 3 Morrowind = OpenMW
DOS games usually work very well under DOSBox / ScummVM

Others have had "Enhanced" / Remastered releases (eg, Baldur's Gate, Icewind Dale, Neverwinter Nights, Planescape Torment, Day of the Tentacle, Full Throttle, Grim Fandango) that added a Linux version. So quite a lot of pre-2004 games can be made to work in Linux (even "natively") surprising well.

I can't help but wonder what happened to Microsoft. I think Nutella genuinely hates customers and could not care less about what they actually want.

I just put it down to PPE (Post-Peak Ensh*tification). Closed source has one advantage in being more focussed during its early lifespan and not getting fragmented. Later on though, when it runs out of ways to improve naturally and becomes a "mature product" (like DVD players, refridgerators, etc) all are, it's hard to keep reselling "updates" every couple of years, so the focus is on 'rental services' or just mindlessly changing things to look like they're doing something for the sake of ludicrously unsustainable "infinity growth" investor demands. Conversely, Open Source is often more prone to getting forked / fragmented / reinventing the wheel during its early lifespan, but once it matures it can stay at peak without turning itself into rentware junk or "what people actually want" being held hostage by investors.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Most domains have zero use for local accounts these days and they can run there own cloud server

That is total moose muffins. You have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[TheinsanegamerN]

That is total moose muffins. You have no idea what you're talking about.

It's not. Local accounts are being phased out in favor of 2FA cloud accounts for domain use. Local accounts are seen as a major security risk, due to their, well, local nature, having domain rights to rejoin to networks, and not being easily changed.

With Microsoft Intune, they're making said account obsolete anyway, enrollment is done with hardware hashes.

I can't help but wonder what happened to Microsoft. I think Nutella genuinely hates customers and could not care less about what they actually want.

MS, like most fortune 500 companies, figured out their consumer base is mostly made up of sheep easily led to slaughter, or captive audiences that depend on their product. So moves like this, to exert more control, are pure profit for MS.

They DO hate their customers. most companies do. You are a walking wallet, your opinions do not matter.

And it's led them to over a $3 TRILLION market value.

I see that lack of competition in the desktop OS space is working wonders. MS is more and more comfortable in abusing its position and, in turn, abusing the customers. Hell, Mac looks appealing with all that, also requires an account, sure, but at least you get a non-scuffed OS.
No worries, the FOSS community will finally stop bickering amongst themselves and realize what everyone sane had a while ago - they should stop the ridiculous fragmentation and endless forking and try to actually make a one-stop-shop Linux that could actually attract normies, be hassle free and come as a finished product. It can even be commercial, imagine that. That will surely happen aaaaaaaany second now. I mean, with Microsoft making such self-sabotaging moves, it surely is an opportunity, right? R-right? Oh… right. It’s the FOSS community.

Monopoly: "the exclusive possession or control of the supply of or trade in a commodity or service."

Microsoft doesnt have this. Mac OS exists, Linux exists, and chromeOS exists. And with microsoft dipping below 70% marketshare, its become obvious that they're in the process of losing the majority, let alone the dominant position.

 

[lexluthermiester]

It's not. Local accounts are being phased out in favor of 2FA cloud accounts for domain use.

In some situations, yes. Not all and not even most. 2FA has proven to cause more problems than it solves. It isn't perfect and it isn't even ideal.

Local accounts are seen as a major security risk, due to their, well, local nature, having domain rights to rejoin to networks, and not being easily changed.

Also moose-muffins. Changing Domain authentications is trivial and takes less than a minute for any competent system admin.

With Microsoft Intune, they're making said account obsolete anyway, enrollment is done with hardware hashes.

Which doesn't work for a great many situations.

 

[Onasi]

Monopoly: "the exclusive possession or control of the supply of or trade in a commodity or service."

Thanks for the lesson. Interestingly, my post doesn’t have the word “monopoly” in it even once. So… I am not sure what you are responding to

And with microsoft dipping below 70% marketshare, its become obvious that they're in the process of losing the majority, let alone the dominant position.

Not yet they didn’t, not in desktops.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Thanks for the lesson. Interestingly, my post doesn’t have the word “monopoly” in it even once. So… I am not sure what you are responding to


Not yet they didn’t, not in desktops. View attachment 353560

Keep in mind, there are a great many people that have switched to using their phone and/or tablet as their primary or only computing device. So limiting those numbers to "Desktop" only is not seeing the big picture. Taking into account all computing devices, Android is the dominant OS world wide. Full stop.

For microsoft to be worried about their dominance in the OS market is justified. However, pissing off the target user base by trying to force them into something they don't want is an absolutely great way to LOOSE customers. The idiots in the microsoft marketing dept need to pull their heads out from where the Sun doesn't shine.

 

[Onasi]

@lexluthermiester
Course it is. Never argued that. But people who are content with an Android tablet or phablet (or Chromebook, I suppose) as a main computer device are the same people who would not give a toss about current MS shenanigans. They probably already have a MS account for one reason or another. We’re discussing this nonsense from the big boy club perspective, we’re people who cannot replace a full-fat PC as a main device, aren’t we?

 

[lexluthermiester]

But people who are content with an Android tablet or phablet (or Chromebook, I suppose) as a main computer device are the same people who would not give a toss about current MS shenanigans.

Very fair point. To counter, one might argue, with a reasonable level of merit, that one of the reasons people have switched is due to the unreasonable hoops and nonsense imposed on PC's by microsoft's moronic requirements. It's almost as if microsoft has been taken over by a bunch of visionless tree-swinging poo-flingers who themselves can't see the forest for the trees.

We’re discussing this nonsense from the big boy club perspective, we’re people who cannot replace a full-fat PC as a main device, aren’t we?

Again, fair point.

 

[Onasi]

@lexluthermiester
That might have been true, but the great mobile exodus for the masses started a while ago, before Win 11 with its requirements was even announced. Apart from those, the requirement (or rather insisted recommendation) before was just the MS account. And making new accounts is something an average user does easily all the time without much hassle. You say all my settings will be saved and transferred if I buy a new PC? Cool! That’s another thing to remember - average consumer just buys a new PC, a laptop most often. It usually is already set up to go and he has no real interaction with MS new requirements. He doesn’t even know what TPM is, Safe Boot is probably a car accessory and POPCNT is an exotic soda.

 

[Vayra86]

I have seen videos where XP is infected in zero time online, but those videos are made with windows XP completely unsecured, connected online directly and not through a router, if I am not mistaken. But what about an XP system with an antivirus(even old and not currently updated), a firewall and a router that comes with it's own protection layers. I am playing with an ancient Athlon XP, running ....Windows XP, that I do connect online. It's obviously dead slow, but having connected it for hours, even days, when I connect it's SSD on a Windows 11 system and check it, Win11 finds nothing malicious on it.

Okay, great, and now what? You've got yourself a system that will do what Win 11 does with a shitload of extra risk involved regardless, and much lower performance and functionality. So you've left the system connected and its not infected. What have you proven here? That XP can sit online for a while and not implode? Fan-tas-tic. Its still out of date and full of security holes, easier kernel access, etc etc etc.

One easy example is ransomware protection. GL with that on XP, or getting that through third party app functionality in an unsupported OS.

Its just worse in every possible way, and if that's better in your mind than MS doing 'keylogging' and 'reading your emails'... yeah, to each their own. You're saying its better to not know who's keylogging you and getting info out of your stash than it is to actually know it (MS), that's straight up crazy talk to me, honestly. Not in the least because you could hold MS accountable, but you can't do that with a criminal you'll never identify.

Just get a present day Linux then and let Windows go, you just can't have your cake and eat it too. What's done is done.

Microsoft doesnt have this. Mac OS exists, Linux exists, and chromeOS exists. And with microsoft dipping below 70% marketshare, its become obvious that they're in the process of losing the majority, let alone the dominant position.

They're still dominant and they will remain so for at least another decade, there is no question about it. The slow bleeding of % isn't really doing anything to their position in enterprise. One big consideration is also the increase in business / IT outside of the West, notably in China etc. where they are hard at work implementing their own OS'es (% Unknown) or at the very least phase out Microsoft services because its a US company. So yeah, quantify what they're really losing here, as far as I am concerned MS is still the dominant party and OSX will never surpass them, nor anything Android based.

 

[lexluthermiester]

That might have been true, but the great mobile exodus for the masses started a while ago

Not to the point of exclusive use. That is a recent development caused by the dis-satisfaction with Windows 10 and accelerated by Windows 11.

That’s another thing to remember - average consumer just buys a new PC, a laptop most often. It usually is already set up to go and he has no real interaction with MS new requirements. He doesn’t even know what TPM is, Safe Boot is probably a car accessory and POPCNT is an exotic soda.

For the average consumer, sure. For anyone that qualifies as a power-user or specialty user, not so much.

And for those who continue to mention Linux? No. Linux is great for many things, but it is still no replacement for Windows. It's much closer than it once was, but it's not there yet.

 

[Onasi]

Not to the point of exclusive use. That is a recent development caused by the dis-satisfaction with Windows 10 and accelerated by Windows 11.

I am not sure if I agree fully with you on that. Might have played a part, but I feel it’s more of a case of average person having comparatively insignificant computer needs and the convenience of having those be accessible anywhere at any time without hassle. The most “productivity” focused thing said average person needs is an office suite, and that is something that easily can be cloud based and used on a tablet with a BT keyboard. But I feel we are sorta just bantering about minutiae now, we probably agree overall and the conclusion we’re reaching is ultimately the same.

For the average consumer, sure. For anyone that qualifies as a power-user or specialty user, not so much.

Sure, but we’re a minority. Always have been and it’s not like MS (or many other IT companies, for that matter) giving the power user and enthusiast the finger and essentially going “sort it out yourself” is a new thing, really. We’re battered housewives, at this point.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

the thing that makes me cringe it that m$ already collects telemetry data, not having a local account to sign into confirms who that data belongs to. The next step after this was brought up elsewhere, m$ intends to stream Ads directly to your PC, this new data gives them the ability to target those ads. I'm sure m$ had a long talk with their lawyers about how to circumvent anti-trust laws, which i think, them taking away local accounts would fall into with their other data mining.