US Government Could Delay $8.5 Billion CHIPS Act Funding for Intel

[kondamin]

I’m not sure what you mean.

Intel put themselves in this position by being complacent with small incremental changes and focusing on profits in years past instead of future planning. Now they want daddy B to give them money to help them instead of selling stocks they bought back

Intel could have gone on like they did for years, companies like SONY IBM Olympus… have had their decades long zombie modes where they were t innovating but they kept going trough inertia.
intel would have been fine for a long long time

now they went in to massive debt because every government of every developed nation in the world was shoving them money to build fabs in their neck of the woods so if the supply chain crashed again they would have state of the art chips.

so no thus has nothing to do with intel being in a rut, they are still making a lot of money. They aren’t making nvidia magic ai bubble money and that’s what making investors upset.
Their 60 billion building new fabs hole is what has them in trouble

 

[mechtech]

I would too.

I remember in 2008-2009 when economy tanked and the government bailed them out and the execs just used the money to give themselves bonuses.

 

[Daven]

now they went into massive debt...they are still making a lot of money...

You cannot go into debt and still be making money in a capitalist society. In order to make ANY money that counts, your cost of making revenue must be lower than the revenue itself. This is why margins are all that matter.

Intel can have revenues of $1 trillion per quarter but if it costs that much to make that much they didn't do anything. This is why Intel is in trouble right now. The cost of making money is much higher than their revenues mainly because they do not have enough business or high enough margins to pay for the operation of so many fabs.

 

[Steevo]

You cannot go into debt and still be making money in a capitalist society. In order to make ANY money that counts, your cost of making revenue must be lower than the revenue itself. This is why margins are all that matter.

Intel can have revenues of $1 trillion per quarter but if it costs that much to make that much they didn't do anything. This is why Intel is in trouble right now. The cost of making money is much higher than their revenues mainly because they do not have enough business or high enough margins to pay for the operation of so many fabs.

Exactly, Fabs they should have been investing in instead of https://finance.yahoo.com/news/intel-intc-announces-accelerated-share-144002888.html

 

[Paganstomp]

So how are those subsidies working out for ya Intel??? What? Not doing so well? To bad.

 

[remixedcat]

I am actually shocked that the US has not inspired AMD to create a Fab in the US. I guess all of the negative narrative about AMD may have made them gun shy to pull the trigger on that. Maybe TSMC pricing will get to a level where that would seem plausible.

thing is if intel sells fabs to tsmc tsmc can charge whatever they want and cpus will cost 3k for an i5 at that rate.

we really need intel to keep everyone in check..

 

[usiname]

thing is if intel sells fabs to tsmc tsmc can charge whatever they want and cpus will cost 3k for an i5 at that rate.

we really need intel to keep everyone in check..

Selling the fabs to TSMC won't change anything, currently nobody is buying wafers from Intel, or at least its so small part of the market, that is meaningless. TSMC has its competitors - Samsung, GloFo and others that will gain market share if TSMC start to charge so high

 

[kondamin]

You cannot go into debt and still be making money in a capitalist society. In order to make ANY money that counts, your cost of making revenue must be lower than the revenue itself. This is why margins are all that matter.

Intel can have revenues of $1 trillion per quarter but if it costs that much to make that much they didn't do anything. This is why Intel is in trouble right now. The cost of making money is much higher than their revenues mainly because they do not have enough business or high enough margins to pay for the operation of so many fabs.

That’s what doing a serious investment is, you go in to debt to make more money in the future.
thats how our entire financial system works.
if everyone only invested within their immediate means the worlds gdp would be a couple of billion dollars, not 120 trillion.

amd’s hole sits at ~9 billion, something that will also take years to fill.

 

[Scrizz]

And people are pretending that Intel has already gotten the money but it seems that they have not

exactly!
I got tired of saying that. There's a reason why they had to resort to layoffs etc.
They started building the fabs on the promise they would receive money, but the timeline from when the government announced the CHIPS act to when it is going to begin disbursing money has been over two years!!!

 

[R0H1T]

You cannot go into debt and still be making money in a capitalist society. In order to make ANY money that counts, your cost of making revenue must be lower than the revenue itself. This is why margins are all that matter.

You can siphon money off/decalre bankruptcies to avoid paying your "debt," because at that point it's everyone else's problem! Come on, tell me you don't know a billion ways accountants/companies shuffle money around & we're talking just the legal ones!

 

[Vayra86]

Is it? Go tell that to NVIDIA, which has the AI marked on its hands and is laughing all the way to the bank, without manufacturing anything.

That's the current reality. But if Taiwan falls, Nvidia is f*cked and/or driven into the hands of China. Or Samsung.

 

[Draconis]

amd’s hole sits at ~9 billion, something that will also take years to fill.

Depending on source it's more like between 2.5 and 3 billion.

Companies Market Cap
Trading Economics

In 2020 it looks like they nearly cleared their debt, current debt could be acquisitions

 

[R0H1T]

But if Taiwan falls, Nvidia is f*cked and/or driven into the hands of China. Or Samsung.

If Taiwan(TSMC?) fails then everyone is effed. You're talking JHH, how about Apple who has ~4x the revenues or AWS, QC, AMD, Google, MS even Intel now

China may be stupid but I doubt they're $4-5 trillion stupid because that's the low end of what I expect the impact to be

 

[1sanpedro1]

Good. Not a fan of billion dollar companies getting welfare money just to go and layoff 15,000 people

 

[kondamin]

Depending on source it's more like between 2.5 and 3 billion.

Companies Market Cap
Trading Economics

In 2020 it looks like they nearly cleared their debt, current debt could be acquisitions

Yes they added 5 billion a couple of weeks ago or are in the process of buying something for 5 billion

 

[Scrizz]

Good. Not a fan of billion dollar companies getting welfare money just to go and layoff 15,000 people

The thing is they didn't get any money.... that's why the people got laid off....