my Lithuanian stuborness is kicking in right about now . . .
and i see you havent been screwed, but i would bet a part of why you wont install vista is because you know your card you payed alot of $ for WONT WORK PROPERLY in vista, not because creative couldnt make it work, but because they want to force you to buy a new card when they get one out.
the reason I won't install Vista is that the OS audio architecture is shoddily written, that, and I have no DX10 games worthy enough to call for a Vista install.
I'd rather have direct hardware access in XP, than a workaround which introduces latency in Vista.
As I've mentioned before, the issues with Vista - Creative and MS are both equally to blame for the numerous audio issues that every audio card has been running into again and again.\
During development of the OS, MS was working with nVidia and Creative on the audio architecture, to change it to be more stable, but still allow DirectSound access like we have with XP. For no reason, nVidia dropped from the project, and not long after MS gave up on it - which left Creative high and dry. They already had functioning drivers for this, but now that the audio architecture was different than they initially expected, they had to go back to the drawing board - and they also spent a lot of time with the OpenAL API to ready a new API release . . . this is the biggest reason Creative were almost 6 months behind the Vista release date with alpha drivers. This is also why we've seen so many Vista beta drivers be released, as they're still working on correct functionality. It's still hit or miss.
I have another rig here tha I maintain frequently running Vista home, and has an Elite Pro installed - and not a single issue with that, either. But I won't install Vista on my rig yet, as I don't see a need for it. Once someone releases a full DX10 game that I feel is worth the effort, I will (STALKER: Clear Sky should do the trick).
even those shops wont sell the newer creative cards to people, because the drivers suck and its pretty clear creative isnt going to fix them.
dk has said exectly why I cant support creative, even if i personaly havent ever had an x-fi card in my system let alone had vista and an x-fi.
I can see where people are unhappy with it, and I see where Creative have goofed as well - but how many people are looking at it from the manufacturer's stand point as well? Considering the numbers of users out there with Live! series cards that pitched a fit when Creative finally declared them EOSL.
Besides, the drivers don't always suck - many of the times it's hardware or software incompatibilities. This is a big issue everyone has gotten invloved with as more and more commoners who aren't tech aware like we are go out and buy an Xtreme Gamer or Xtreme Audio from Best Buy or Circuit City to install in their Dell or HP system. Factor in the number of people that can't even turn off their onboard audio, and go crying to Creative when their new hardware doesn't work right . . .
sure, I realize that on certain systems there are issues with the drivers, but there are also many "user errors" as well
by acting like creative is "do no wrong" your supporting uninformed people buying cards that they will then have to use hacked drivers to get full function out of.
and TBH i dont give a rats ass about weather or not he broke the EULA, creative broke the trust by intentionaly crippling their hardware via crapp drivers.
where have I come across as acting as Creative has "done no wrong?" I flat out stated in a few posts already what I've felt was crossing the line in-so-far as how they've treated some customers . . . I've mentioned numerous times in my X-Fi thread where I feel that Creative has screwed up. But, I also recognize the fact that there are numerous other users out ther who've never had a problem as well - why should I allow a few PR mistakes, and the whinning of commoners to influence my recommendations to another user that could potentially benefit from one of their cards? I'm also more than willing to inform new users to this site of the issues Creative have been facing, and at that point, it's up to them what they decide to install.
As to the EULA - so you're claiming that Creative disabaling features for Vista drivers for the Audigy series is wrong - even though the Audigy series were never advertised as Vista ready? The X-Fi cards, although, were advertised as such, but how do we know that disabled features on these drivers were not just a temporary headache that would be re-instated once things were ironed out (like removal of DX10.1 support in Assassin's Creed with the first patch, and then re-instated with the second)?
People were pissed off that their 6-8 year old hardware no longer functioned correctly. IMO, I say be glad they continued support for so long. Like I said before, find me a piece of hardware that old that can handle current OSes, software and games.
I'm not saying Creative have been a handful of angels here, but I'm not going to go around the web spreading tripe to all the uninformed users out there as well. There are three sides to each story, and everyone has only been interested in one side of their situation.
as to holding him crimanaly responcible, HA, he didnt charge for his acctions, he didnt make any profit from it, all they can do is at most a VERY light slap on the wrist.
also those kinds of EULA's are on questionable ground, just like companys claming that they licence software not sell it, in a story i read a while back Autodesk got pwnt in court for sending dmca notices to somebody for selling used copys of their software on ebay.
DMCA rulings have been having a hard time standing up since that act was passed - it's unfair, and doesn't allow the end user enough rights. Personally, I still hold to the Copyright Act of 1986, which allows for users to make one back-up copy of any digital media for their own use.
Anyhow, d_k didn't exactly charge for the drivers, but he was enabling features that Creative didn't support (like Dolby encoding with the X-Fis) . . . why they didn't support these features is their knowledge, as they haven't said. There could be some kind of contractual agreement between Creative and Dolby and/or Auzentech. If Creative acted like d_k's driver's didn't exist, they could've been held accountable for those drivers breaching a contract. It's all theory, we don't know, as Creative hasn't said.
and as of that - I'm fully done with this. Time to head out for the night, instead of dealing with users calling me blind as much as they are.
just trying to lighten up the conversation but as for what I think of creative 
I don't care too much.
My X-Fi is going to be sold first thing tomorrow morning. I have no need for a product coming from such a disgraceful and arrogant company. :shadedshu
