Phenom X4, X3 45nm Lineup for H1 2009 Explained

[btarunr]

However, I must admit I am a bit disappointed that they seem to be ditching the AM2+ and DDR2 since I'm still really not sold on DDR3 especially considering the prices are still higher and I'm not going to be paying double for the same performance just for a new socket.

That's why they didn't give the AM3 lineup a clock-speed advantage over its AM2+ counterparts. The fastest AM2+ Deneb is 3.00 GHz, same with AM3. Depending on the memory of your choice, pick your chip.

 

[newtekie1]

It seems to me that AMD is taking a page from Intel's book and taking an underperforming architecture and pairing it with an insane amount of Cache to try and up the performance to competitive levels. Everyday, I think more and more that K10 is the netburst of the current processor world.

 

[KBD]

I dont know, i think this is an improvement from the earlier roadmap. Looks like we wont be getting a 4 gig Deneb FX, but speaking of FX, why isn't it up on that chart? Any thoughts on when it could be released and at what clock speed? I think it will be at 3.2Ghz and may there will be Black Editions of the other chips later down the road. That would correspond to AMD's earlier policy: release locked multi chips first and then Black Edition later.


As far as AM2+/AM3 deal, its nice of AMD to continue supporting the old socket, not everyone wants to move to DDR3 yet, i think it needs to mature more and drop in price. But i was still hoping to see official support for at least DDR3-1600, but i supppose the RAM could be overclocked to that frequency. One nice thing about is that beats Intel Nehalem DDR3-1066 boards.

 

[mdm-adph]

It seems to me that AMD is taking a page from Intel's book and taking an underperforming architecture and pairing it with an insane amount of Cache to try and up the performance to competitive levels. Everyday, I think more and more that K10 is the netburst of the current processor world.

Newtekie's world:

8M Cache on an Core 2 Chip: "Great chips -- that much added cache makes for great performance."

8M Cache on a Phenom: "Poor chips -- added cache is obviously a poor attempt to improve performance."



I agree with you that K10 is looking like the Pentium 4 of the current processor world, but it's got nothing to do with their choice of cache sizes. (It's got much more to do with the heat/performance ratio.)

 

[Abu Assar]

those who said that AMD dropped the support for AM2+ can notice that AMD didn't release any deneb AM2+ cpu that has an equivalent agena .

i.e agena core maxed at 2.6 , so deneb will start from 2.8 going through 3.0GHz and maybe in 2009/H2 they will introduce 3.2 for AM2+ and AM3 simultaneously , this or they will pull a 939 again.

and about the naming scheme , once we get used to it ; it will make much more sense , as you can divide it into 2 sections (1) 20 (2) 550 , and there is much more for future product to fill the grid : 20xxx , 30xxx , 40xxx and so on !

looks like ATi team gave them this idea as it is similar to Radeon HD 2000 , HD 3000 , HD 4000 ...

 

[KBD]

Newtekie's world:

I agree with you that K10 is looking like the Pentium 4 of the current processor world, but it's got nothing to do with their choice of cache sizes. (It's got much more to do with the heat/performance ratio.)

I think both you and newtekie hit the nail on the head, the heat/performance ratio and intro of large cache sizes reminds the revised K10 of netburst. But if i'm not mistaken Intel was alsopushing the frequency of P4s to insane levels, i guess thats where the similarity ends.

 

[PCpraiser100]

3Ghz Phenom? TWO 64-bit controllers? I want one.

 

[btarunr]

3Ghz Phenom? TWO 64-bit controllers? I want one.

it's the same with today's Phenom X4 as well. K10 dice have two memory controllers, each of 64-bit data width to connect to a memory channel (unlike a single 128-bit controller on K8). When you say "Ganged Mode", you're making the two controllers on a K10 work combined for a single 128-bit wide path (same as "dual-channel") but when you ungang them, you have two 64-bit wide paths (supposed to help multi-threaded apps). Don't confuse this to "single-channel" memory, as there, you'd have only a single 64-bit wide path. For Unganged mode, you'd still need your two modules in the correct slots on the motherboard, so each controller could access its module.

 

[WarEagleAU]

True, but all the phenoms from 9950 to 9750 is supposed to be 125W now, I thought they changed those.


And thanks, I checked newegg.com after I posted that. Foxconns looks awesome.

 

[mdm-adph]

I think both you and newtekie hit the nail on the head, the heat/performance ratio and intro of large cache sizes reminds the revised K10 of netburst. But if i'm not mistaken Intel was alsopushing the frequency of P4s to insane levels, i guess thats where the similarity ends.

Ah -- thus, until the FX series Phenoms come out, the "netburst" analogy doesn't fully apply. (Hopefully, it won't then either, if the performance is there and the chips don't catch on fire due to the heat.)

 

[soldier242]

hmmm and i thought that they'd pack a ddr2 and a ddr3 controller on one chip >_>, guess i didn't read good back then

 

[Polarman]

I look forward in seeing some benchies comparing AM2+ and AM3 using the same speed CPU.

 

[soldier242]

I look forward in seeing some benchies comparing AM2+ and AM3 using the same speed CPU.

yup that would be pretty nice indeed

 

[Abu Assar]

yup that would be pretty nice indeed

\

or deneb and agena using the same clock speed

 

[WarEagleAU]

They said something about them being interchangeable and also about them being backwards compatible. I wasnt entirely sure how they were gonna do DDR2 and DDR3 IMC on one chip though. Looks like they axed that plan.

 

[flashstar]

When Intel went to 90nm on the Prescott architecture they saw virtually no temperature drops. AMD is seeing a very healthy temperature decrease with its 45 nm cpu's. 140w to 95w for the same speed and a much greater L3 cache.

 

[Hayder_Master]

so what about phenom fx im still like it cuz 4.0ghz core clock , any news

 

[soldier242]

They said something about them being interchangeable and also about them being backwards compatible. I wasnt entirely sure how they were gonna do DDR2 and DDR3 IMC on one chip though. Looks like they axed that plan.

so am i getting it right that you just need one new board to house a DDR3 or a DDR2 phenom?

 

[ChromeDome]

i'm a little confused also. are these going to work with "old" AM2 boards as well as AM2+? the AM2 board in my specs, for instance?

 

[jbunch07]

i'm a little confused also. are these going to work with "old" AM2 boards as well as AM2+?

I believe its am2+ only.

 

[ChromeDome]

ah...i see. another quick read would bear that out

man some of us got left in the dust by AMD with our mobos. upgrade, upgrade, upgrade....

it never ends

 

[jbunch07]

ah...i see. another quick read would bear that out

man some of us got left in the dust by AMD with our mobos. upgrade, upgrade, upgrade....

it never ends

tell me about it. I've been through 3 motherboards in the past 9 months!

 

[newtekie1]

Newtekie's world:

8M Cache on an Core 2 Chip: "Great chips -- that much added cache makes for great performance."

8M Cache on a Phenom: "Poor chips -- added cache is obviously a poor attempt to improve performance."



I agree with you that K10 is looking like the Pentium 4 of the current processor world, but it's got nothing to do with their choice of cache sizes. (It's got much more to do with the heat/performance ratio.)

Where did I say the added cache on a Core 2 Chip was great for performance? And the 8MB on the Core 2 chips have always been there, when Intel went to 45nm they added another 4MB, and it didn't really help performance any. Intel added cache because they could, AMD is adding cache to try and improve performance in a flop architecture.

mdm-adph's world: "[Phenom] performs on par with equal-clocked conroe parts"

Your unconditional love for AMD has blinded you to the facts.

I think both you and newtekie hit the nail on the head, the heat/performance ratio and intro of large cache sizes reminds the revised K10 of netburst. But if i'm not mistaken Intel was alsopushing the frequency of P4s to insane levels, i guess thats where the similarity ends.

The Phenom's won't clock to the insane levels that the P4's could, but in terms of what we had now from the Phenom line-up the 3GHz stock clock is an insane level. But pushing clock speeds isn't really important. It is really what the processor companies want to do.

 

[Mussels]

tell me about it. I've been through 3 motherboards in the past 9 months!

oh how i remember AMD fans telling me in past days, how AMD didnt require contsant motherboard updates but intel did with their constant FSB changes.

at least its easy to tell if your CPU is supported on intel nowdays, amd has wattages, steppings, DDR2/3.... its just getting worse and worse.

 

[KBD]

The Phenom's won't clock to the insane levels that the P4's could, but in terms of what we had now from the Phenom line-up the 3GHz stock clock is an insane level. But pushing clock speeds isn't really important. It is really what the processor companies want to do.

Actually i wasn't referring to overclocking, i was talking about how Intel released P4 & Celerons in the above 3 gig stock frequencies. If i'm not mistaken they did overclock well after Intel moved to 90nm, and AMD stopped overclocking well after putting on onboard IMC. 3GHz for AMD is not insane thats why i said the similarity with netburst ends there. But you are right, there are parallels with netburst that we discussed above.