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TerraMaster D8 Hybrid

TheLostSwede

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TerraMaster's D8 Hybrid combines hard disk drives and M.2 NVMe drives in a USB Type-C connected DAS that can also be used to add more drives to a NAS. Thanks to the 10 Gbps USB interface, it is able to outperform any Gigabit Ethernet NAS.

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Seems mildly interesting as a simple storage expansion for a NAS, but I had mostly negative experiences with USB to SATA bridges so I wonder how well does this one handle HDD power management, especially disk spindown. Most of USB bridges just ignore host commands and have their own nononfigurable timers, hdparm doesn't work and sdparm works with only some of them.
It definitely is too expensive though, encroaching on cheap NAS territory - in fact, the normal retail price is the same as their entry level 4 bay NAS, F4-212.
 
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My DIY NAS with i9 11900T, 16GB RAM on a Z590I VISION D with disks sleeping and running Docker with 3 containers eats ~16W from the wall... Something is wrong software wise, it should eat under 10W, while nitpicking, but still a design goal for being what it is for 300$.

Regarding USB to SATA... I have mixed experience too... especially when used as a backup device, so I have to trust it.
 
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Kinda new to this stuff but dont you want an ethernet port on one of these? like what are you suppose to hook it up to, directly to a pc and share it from there?
 
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Kinda new to this stuff but dont you want an ethernet port on one of these? like what are you suppose to hook it up to, directly to a pc and share it from there?
That is the difference between them. This is a DAS (Direct Attached Storage) so no ethernet. Network Attached Storage has an ethernet.

A DAS doesn't need to be shared, it can be used for local storage only. You could share it via the host PC, but then you might as well get a NAS.
 

TheLostSwede

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Seems mildly interesting as a simple storage expansion for a NAS, but I had mostly negative experiences with USB to SATA bridges so I wonder how well does this one handle HDD power management, especially disk spindown. Most of USB bridges just ignore host commands and have their own nononfigurable timers, hdparm doesn't work and sdparm works with only some of them.
It definitely is too expensive though, encroaching on cheap NAS territory - in fact, the normal retail price is the same as their entry level 4 bay NAS, F4-212.
Disk spin down was never an issue, while it was connected to a Windows system at least. I can't tell you in Linux, but the SATA drives showed up properly in CrystalDiskInfo alongside all the smart data as expected. However, the SSDs didn't show up there and didn't seem to support proper low power modes, as noted in the review.

Kinda new to this stuff but dont you want an ethernet port on one of these? like what are you suppose to hook it up to, directly to a pc and share it from there?
As it's a DAS (as explained above), yes you hook it up directly to whatever device you want to use it with. Great for backing up data, not so much for sharing it.
 
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Man, after using ZFS on NAS, I cant imagine to use something instead anymore.
These TerraMasters should be also tested with something like TrueNAS os (how it gonna handle USB and etc)
 
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TheLostSwede

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Man, after using ZFS on NAS, I cant imagine to use something instead anymore.
These TerraMasters should be also tested with something like TrueNAS os (how it gonna handle USB and etc)
This is a DAS though, not a NAS...
But as it can be used to expand the storage on a NAS, it ended up in the NAS category, rather than portable storage.
Also, must be nice to be made of money, not everyone is, nor does everyone need a ZFS NAS.
 
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Also, must be nice to be made of money, not everyone is, nor does everyone need a ZFS NAS.
wdym. ZFS is free >.>
and supported on many linux distros.

And its very useful for any user, since it provides cool compression features and data integrity checks.
In some cases its even easier to use, than classic Ext4/XFS. And its kinda working better than brtfs.

I mean to use this DAS with some popular os (user friendly and ZFS out of box), like FreeNas, since a lot of people use this os on home Nas, and may use this DAS as an "extention block".
 

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wdym. ZFS is free >.>
and supported on many linux distros.

And its very useful for any user, since it provides cool compression features and data integrity checks.
In some cases its even easier to use, than classic Ext4/XFS. And its kinda working better than brtfs.

I mean to use this DAS with some popular os (user friendly and ZFS out of box), like FreeNas, since a lot of people use this os on home Nas, and may use this DAS as an "extention block".
ZFS might be "free" but the hardware to run it, isn't.

I'm afraid my OMV NAS is still in Taiwan and I don't have anything else to test it with, so the review is what it is.
Also, TerraMaster doesn't promise it'll be fully compatible with other NAS devices than their own. There's technically no reason why it shouldn't, but I don't have a fully kitted out "lab" to test things in. Also, this is only our second new device in the NAS category that we've tested, but I might update the review in the future once I have something else to test it with.
 
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ZFS might be "free" but the hardware to run it, isn't.
many peope use old PCs as NAS, when they out of money for some more fancy stuff. If TerraMaster or Synology does not have ZFS out of box, it does not mean that ZFS is something special.
also I think people with money gonna buy this, since it has 300$ price tag, people without free money gonna take a m.2/hdd enclosure or a dock station instead.

By design this DAS suits best as an extension to any NAS or Home Server, since its not a good Idea to have noisy spinning HDDs in the same room with you, plus never stopping fan.
And if I want to connect some M.2 drives only, I can find more cheaper and more smaller devices. Same for hot backups on HDD.

Oooooh! And also would be nice to see how that DAS works with smart TVs xd
 
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Oooooh! And also would be nice to see how that DAS works with smart TVs xd

And how you would solve the legal issues with it?
 
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If I understand this correctly, with this DAS only supporting RAID 0 or 1 for the first two drives, and Windows not allowing software raid on it (e.g. RAID 1+0 or 5 with four drives, which is probably the main motivation for buying this thing), then what is really the point of this vs. just buying individual external HDD cases?
(I assume this will work fine in Linux though, as it supports RAID over USB sticks if you wanted to.)

I get that this can be used as an extension for an existing NAS, but the features and flexibility of this seems far to limited.

Seems mildly interesting as a simple storage expansion for a NAS, but I had mostly negative experiences with USB to SATA bridges so I wonder how well does this one handle HDD power management, especially disk spindown. Most of USB bridges just ignore host commands and have their own nononfigurable timers, hdparm doesn't work and sdparm works with only some of them.
That's my concern too, along with SMART support, all of which is essential if you try to run any kind of RAID on top of it.

It definitely is too expensive though, encroaching on cheap NAS territory - in fact, the normal retail price is the same as their entry level 4 bay NAS, F4-212.
It's certainly too expensive.
But I think a typical NAS is a fairly bad deal anyways, as the only real advantage is getting something that should almost work "out of the box" (except for installing disks and setup). But I believe that those who don't strictly need it to be network shared, and doesn't have data sets large enough, should just manage with internal drives and external drives (extra copies), and only cross that bridge when they have to. And for the other group, either individuals or small companies, who needs it network attached or have larger data sets, then just building a proper file server should also be considered. The typical NAS boxes have really poor underpowered and usually "consumer grade" hardware, despite having a premium price. For that price you can almost buy server or workstation grade parts (excl. redundant PSUs, controllers etc.), which will greatly outperform most of these boxes, be properly cooled, have ECC and all desired features, upgradable RAM, and most importantly be modular when something eventually fails. Rack mounted cases are desirable if it's intended to be in a server closet, but if it's in a (home) office, then going for a standard quiet case is smarter (like a Fractal Design 7/XL), as hotswapping is really not necessary when running a single server of 2-12 disks. You can find pretty capable motherboards (e.g. Supermicro) for ~$300-400, a quad core low power Xeon (even if it's LGA1200, they are still great deals), etc. for acceptable prices. And OS setup isn't hard either, a basic install of a Linux distro, drive setup and sharing is al that's needed. Plus there is no worry that the manufacturer will discontinue software updates, you can keep rocking this thing for 10+ years. ;)

And its very useful for any user, since it provides cool compression features and data integrity checks.
In some cases its even easier to use, than classic Ext4/XFS. And its kinda working better than brtfs.
There are certainly use cases where ZFS makes sense, especially those companies who need a large pool for a varied mix of VMs, with some mostly static data and some heavily used, and the need to grow with larger/more drives over time. And for such use cases, data deduplication, compression, SSD and RAM caching etc. is very useful too.
But if we're talking about users with up to 8 drives (probably single user or a tiny office), then it's really not worth the hassle and all the downsides. Not only is it very demanding of resources, especially RAM, but can also have some overhead, so this needs to be run on a dedicated "server" (so a DAS is not the right option for ZFS). The management and maintenance will require lots of more effort and experience than a basic software RAID in either Linux or Windows (I can't speak for Mac), plus ZFS isn't better than e.g. md/ext4 in terms of data integrity (md supports scrub too).

I'm not a fan of RAID5, not just because of higher risk, but the performance is usually horrible, I'd usually recommend RAID 1 for 2 disks, RAID 1+0 for 4 disks, RAID6 for larger amounts (albeit RAID6 usually being slow). RAID 1+0 with four disks will currently allow at least 2x24 TB using CMR disks or 2x28 TB using SMR disks, which will give most prosumers/small business owners pretty good mileage. And it might be worth considering just replacing a "simple" RAID setup with larger drives when you grow out of it rather than having a fancy setup with old and new drives. :)
 
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I have a Mediasonic ProBox 8 Bay DAS unit that is of some vintage now. It supports a number of RAID levels but not RAID 5. The closest to it is RAID 50 which works well enough IMO. I also have a number of 4 bay and 5 bay units that support RAID 5. Initially I didn't see the point of the TerraMaster's D8 Hybrid but if it'll do software RAID it isnt too bad IMO at ~$200 USD. Less so at ~$300 but perhaps still reasonable compared to something like the QNAP TR-004 four bay hardware RAID DAS unit (with no support for even one NVMe SSD) at about ~$200 USD.

Yes, USB4 or Thunderbolt would have been better but a lot of people aren't setup to take advantage of either. Most Thunderbolt users are Mac user and I'd wager most people here aren't daily driving a Mac as their main PC.

If the TerraMaster's D8 Hybrid can be connected to a NAS or server (hell even a router if it has USB ports) IMO it's good enough to extend storage a little in some cases.

If you have a DIY server / NAS or repurposed some older enterprise level hardware like a Dell PowerEdge R720XD (with disk shelf) then great, the TerraMaster's D8 Hybrid may be laughable to you. Still, I have said hardware and this isn't as bad as I thought it would be.
 
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I would I like to see a cheaper version without NVME support. To make it more doable for DIY server.
Again the QNAP TR-004 goes for about ~$200 USD, has four 3.5" SATA bays, has hardware RAID (for all four bays) and supports USB 3.2 gen 2 10Gbs. QNAP also have a two bay version. The pricing is reasonable IMO especially so with respect to Synology expansion units. If you want cheaper than that (without NVMe) you'll likely have to step down to USB 3.0 which is 5Gbs and IMO painfully slow and they likely won't be that much cheaper,... (~$150 maybe ~$160).
 
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Again the QNAP TR-004 goes for about ~$200 USD, has four 3.5" SATA bays, has hardware RAID (for all four bays) and supports USB 3.2 gen 2 10Gbs. QNAP also have a two bay version. The pricing is reasonable IMO especially so with respect to Synology expansion units. If you want cheaper than that (without NVMe) you'll likely have to step down to USB 3.0 which is 5Gbs and IMO painfully slow and they likely won't be that much cheaper,... (~$150 maybe ~$160).
maybe they will update TR-004 to usb 10Gbs next.
and Synology just overpriced crap.
 
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It's also worth pointing out that something like a TerraMaster D5 Thunderbolt 3 DAS with 5 bays goes for something like ~$600 to ~$700 USD (No NVMe). S0 yes, something faster would be great but you'll pay for that speed and that's assuming you have a Thunderbolt capable system to connect it to.
 
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It's also worth pointing out that something like a TerraMaster D5 Thunderbolt 3 DAS with 5 bays goes for something like ~$600 to ~$700 USD (No NVMe). S0 yes, something faster would be great but you'll pay for that speed and that's assuming you have a Thunderbolt capable system to connect it to.
I don't think I need more than 10gbs USB, for HDD, that works in half-duplex mode, and barely hits 1-2Gbit seed. I can have 4-5 or more of them without problems.
In other hand I don't want 4 full-duplex nvme drives hanging on a "slow" 10 Gbs link.
So i don't see the reason to have the "Hybrid" in D8, and pay some extra money for nvme controllers and one extra usb bridge.
Just make it 10Gbs only and give 150$ price tag, and I will be happy xd
 
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I don't think I need more than 10gbs USB, for HDD, that works in half-duplex mode, and barely hits 1-2Gbit seed. I can have 4-5 or more of them without problems.
In other hand I don't want 4 full-duplex nvme drives hanging on a "slow" 10 Gbs link.
So i don't see the reason to have the "Hybrid" in D8, and pay some extra money for nvme controllers and one extra usb bridge.
Just make it 10Gbs only and give 150$ price tag, and I will be happy xd
Again, that isn't necessarily a price saving measure. You can probably find what you described but at USB 3.0 speeds. At 10Gbps you might be able to find something like the Mediasonic (HF7-SU31C) but IIRC there's no RAID and it cost about ~$160 USD.

If you can find something with 4 SATA bays, USB 3.2 Gen 2 / 10Gbps speed with RAID under ~$200 USD I'd love to see it. not saying it isn't out there, only that I have yet to see it.

IMO, the TerraMaster's D8 Hybrid is a decent product at ~$200 Kickstarter pricing and worth a look see at its ~$300 retail price.
 
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I'm still trying to decide if I want to back the D8 Hybrid. It would be a great addition to the Ugreen DXP8800 Plus 8bay NAS I just received but it's UGOS doesn't allow attached storage to be easily accessible externally.
 
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