Constant "EDP Other" under RING in ThrottleStop

[TheHartleyKid]

Hello,
I currently having a laptop using i5-8300H, GTX 1060. I'm using ThrottleStop in order to undervolt my computer, but recently i entered "Limits" section and found this board.

I tried to clear the error by clicking on "RING", but the error keeps coming back after 1-2 seconds. My question is, is this normal? And if it's not, what should i do?

Thanks in advance.

 

[unclewebb]

is this normal?

This happens on a lot of laptops so I guess it is normal. It would be a bigger problem if it was continuously glowing red. That would indicate that throttling was in progress.

You can try increasing the PP0 Current Limit and the IccMax values and see if this goes away.

 

[TheHartleyKid]

This happens on a lot of laptops so I guess it is normal. It would be a bigger problem if it was continuously glowing red. That would indicate that throttling was in progress.

You can try increasing the PP0 Current Limit and the IccMax values and see if this goes away.

This happens while it is idling, so i didn't think it is good.
It does go red while gaming though, because the temp would be around 90-95.

 

[unclewebb]

Did you try increasing the current limits like I recommended?

It is common for EDP OTHER under the RING column to go red at the exact same time as PL1 or PL2 or THERMAL goes red. In this situation, it is one of the turbo power limits or your CPU temperature that is holding you back.

Open up the Options window and check off, Add Limit Reasons to Log File. Press OK, go out to the main screen and turn on the Log File option. Now go play a game for 15 minutes or half an hour. When done, exit ThrottleStop so it can finalize writing the log file. Go into the ThrottleStop / Logs folder and attach the log file to your next post or copy and paste the log file data to www.pastebin.com or similar so I can have a look. That will make it easier to see if you have a significant throttling problem or not. If you have an Nvidia GPU, make sure to check this off as well in the Options window so your log will include your GPU temperatures.

Many modern gaming laptops are poorly designed. It is not unusual for the CPU cores to run at over 90°C while gaming. How big of an under volt are you using? Are you under volting both the CPU core and CPU cache equally? If you are getting those temperatures while under volting then that confirms bad design. You can pull your laptop apart and redo the thermal paste but that might void your warranty.

Head to Google and type in tongfang unclewebb. This will take you to some forums that discuss laptops that can run at their full rated speed because they have better cooling by design.

 

[techfellow]

I'm having the same issue, can you take a look at this log?
Undervolted both CPU core and cache to -125
I'm running a 2019 Razer blade 15.

 

[unclewebb]

In the Turbo Power Limits window, try setting the Turbo Time Limit to a normal value like 28 seconds. Whatever YouTube video that says drag the time slider all the way to the right is probably wrong.

When under volting the Intel GPU, you have to under volt the iGPU Unslice equally or this under volt will be ignored. If you are using an Nvidia GPU while gaming, under volting the Intel GPU will probably not gain you anything.

It is not normal for the PP0 Current Limit to be set to 0. Try setting that to at least 80. Setting it to 100 would be better yet.

Your log file is too short and it only shows a very light load on your CPU. Do some logging while gaming for a reasonable amount of time like at least 15 minutes. In the Options window try clicking on the Add Limit Reasons to Log File option. You can also check the Nivida GPU option if you have one of them. This will provide some more data so we can see if this is a big problem or not really a problem at all.

For maximum performance, set the Speed Shift EPP value to 0. This can be edited on the main ThrottleStop screen where it says 128.

Keep in mind that a red box in Limit Reasons means that throttling is in progress. A yellow box only means that throttling has previously taken place. A few milliseconds of throttling is not the end of the world but it is enough to trigger a yellow box.

 

[techfellow]

Thanks for the tips, my results were interesting, new logs attached.

I ran throttlestop's benchmark at the beginning (Seemed to be power limiting a lot)
Then I moved forward with playing a game for 15 mins, the first few mins, I was receiving terrible fps and had low GPU temps, then all of a sudden my GPU temps jumped from 55 - 70 and my FPS jumped from 30 - to a constant 200+

Can you identify what's going on here?

 

[unclewebb]

Your log file shows that you are throttling due to the PL1 power limit. Sometimes you are throttling and being limited to 35 Watts while other times you are being limited to 30 Watts. This is below the rated power limit for this CPU and well below what this CPU is capable of. You have the Turbo Boost Long Power Max value set to 60 Watts. The CPU is not using this value so it is most likely using the secondary set of turbo power limits.

The most important one to check is the Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits box in the FIVR window. It appears you have already downloaded and installed the RwDrv.sys file into your ThrottleStop folder. Checking this box might help with the variable power limits that your CPU is being forced to use.

I previously suggested that you should try changing the PP0 Current Limit but it looks like you accidentally changed the wrong one. Set the PP0 Current Limit to 80. Do not check the PP0 Power Limit box below that and do not set this to 80. Set the PP0 Power Limit back to 0 like it originally was. If it is not checked, this should be OK.

After these changes, do some more testing and post some more info. Hopefully we will have made some progress.

 

[Samuraiwyps]

Again, I'm having the same issue, would you help me?
I'm running a 2018 Razer blade advanced

Thanks in advance

 

[unclewebb]

would you help me

EDP OTHER under the RING column is hyper sensitive. Try increasing the FIVR - Core IccMax value and see if it goes away. Crank it all the way up to 255.75 A.

Is this causing any sort of problem? Turn on the Log File option in ThrottleStop, go play a game for 15 minutes or so and then exit your game and exit ThrottleStop so it can finalize the log file. Have a look at it. Is your CPU throttling? Is it performing horribly? Probably not. If you are not sure, attach it to your next post and I will have a look at it for you. The more data the better. Some throttling is not that serious. You should be more concerned with your CPU overheating. If it is hitting 100°C during normal use, it is getting too hot and that will limit maximum performance.

 

[Samuraiwyps]

EDP OTHER under the RING column is hyper sensitive. Try increasing the FIVR - Core IccMax value and see if it goes away. Crank it all the way up to 255.75 A.

Is this causing any sort of problem? Turn on the Log File option in ThrottleStop, go play a game for 15 minutes or so and then exit your game and exit ThrottleStop so it can finalize the log file. Have a look at it. Is your CPU throttling? Is it performing horribly? Probably not. If you are not sure, attach it to your next post and I will have a look at it for you. The more data the better. Some throttling is not that serious. You should be more concerned with your CPU overheating. If it is hitting 100°C during normal use, it is getting too hot and that will limit maximum performance.

Already put the IccMax to 255.75, but the EDP OTHER keeps showing and I can't remove it. Another thing happened, when I started to run some applications, this message showed up

I don't know what it is...

There is the log anyways...

Thanks a lot for your help

 

[unclewebb]

If programs are crashing and you are getting some random errors then there is a good chance that your under volt is not 100% stable. Can you pass the TS Bench 1024M test with 0 errors? Testing only 1 or 2 threads is more important than full load testing. If you pass these tests, try a 1 or 2 thread test of Prime95 or similar stress test. Most 8750H owners are only stable at -100 mV to -125 mV. Your under volt of -140 mV is probably too aggressive.

If you do some Cinebench testing, can your CPU maintain the full 39.00 multiplier for the entire test? Probably not. The heatsink and fan used in your laptop are not adequate to get maximum performance out of an 8750H. Some well engineered laptops with this CPU have no problem running indefinitely at the 39.00 multiplier while other laptops will either power limit throttle or if you raise the power limits, they will get too hot and will thermal throttle. Unless you can find a magic way to significantly improve cooling, this is what you are up against.

Your log file shows that you have reduced the CPU multiplier to 34 when loaded to try to reduce heat. After a while, it looks like your laptop drops the PL1 power limit down to 25 Watts so the CPU throttles further. You paid for a laptop with a 45 Watt CPU and Razer is only allowing you to use 25 Watts of that. Shameful on their part. You can try using the FIVR - Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits feature but I am pretty sure that this lower power limit is being set by the EC so there is no easy way to work around this issue.

Next time you go shopping, check out laptops built on the Tongfang chassis. They have put more thought into proper cooling so you can actually run the included Intel CPU at its full rated speed.

 

[RaulG07]

Hello, maybe you could help me, I would really appreciate it. In the country where I live is really hot right now, like 32c outdoors. I have a HP omen laptop with the i7 9750h processor (it comes with a 1660ti so undervolt GPU on ThrottleStop is not gonna help right?) anyway I want it undervolt the CPU to be less hot. I did all the configurations in ThrottleStop and right now is less hot but when I run the Cinebench I keep getting EDP other and PL1 on red. Can you please see my configurations maybe I did something wrong. I did tested too while playing a game for 1 hour I'll leave the log file too. Thanks

 

[unclewebb]

In the country where I live is really hot right now, like 32°C outdoors.

I wish I lived in San Salvador. I have to get off the computer pretty soon so I can go shovel 10 cm of snow.

Most mass produced laptops with Intel's 6 core processors (8750H & 9750H) have barely adequate cooling. Intel lists the maximum temperature for these processors as 100°C.

Product Specifications

quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.

ark.intel.com

Intel considers any temperature below 100°C to be safe. HP went one step further and has reduced the PROCHOT (processor hot) temperature down to 97°C. HP really wants to make sure that your CPU is always operating at a safe temperature.

You are using ThrottleStop to run your CPU at a reduced speed and you are already under volting your CPU. That appears to be working correctly. Both of these tricks help your CPU run cooler. The only thing left is to disassemble your laptop so you can have a look at the thermal paste. Some people use tricks like liquid metal between the CPU and heatsink. This can improve heat dissipation so the CPU can run cooler. On some laptops, in some countries, this might void your warranty and if you are not experienced doing this, you might damage your laptop.

I had a look at your log file. When gaming and you think your CPU is too hot, it is spending most of its time in the 70°C to 75°C range. I think for 1 second it got as high as 81°C. Most gaming laptop owners can only dream about temperatures that cool.

If it was my laptop, I would increase the Turbo Ratio Limits back up to their default values so the CPU can run at its full Intel rated speed. You paid for a high performance CPU so why not use it? Stop worrying about your CPU temperature. Modern gaming laptops are designed to run hot for extended periods of time. Intel CPUs do a great job thermal throttling. They are engineered to automatically slow down just enough to keep the CPU from running too hot. They can literally adjust their speed hundreds of times per second to keep on the safe side of 100°C.

You are right. Using ThrottleStop to under volt the Intel GPU is not going to help anything. The Intel GPU is not being used when gaming so do not bother under volting the iGPU.

It is not unusual to see some throttling when testing with Cinebench. It is fully loading all 6 cores so if your CPU is allowed to run at its full rated speed, it will probably get too hot and trigger thermal throttling. To prevent this from happening, manufacturers lower the turbo power limits to prevent the CPU from consuming too much power and running too hot. If you want your CPU to thermal throttle instead of power limit throttle, you can try increasing your turbo power limits. In the TPL window, the Long power limit is set to 50 and the short power limit is set to 65. Try increasing those both to 70 or 80 Watts and see what happens.

Before checking the FIVR - Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits feature, click on the Install button and follow the directions. The Install button in your screenshot means you still need to download the RwDrv.zip file from Mega. After that, you need to unzip and install the RwDrv.sys file into your ThrottleStop folder so this feature will work.

 

[RaulG07]

I wish I lived in San Salvador. I have to get off the computer pretty soon so I can go shovel 10 cm of snow.

Most mass produced laptops with Intel's 6 core processors (8750H & 9750H) have barely adequate cooling. Intel lists the maximum temperature for these processors as 100°C.

Product Specifications

quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.

ark.intel.com

Intel considers any temperature below 100°C to be safe. HP went one step further and has reduced the PROCHOT (processor hot) temperature down to 97°C. HP really wants to make sure that your CPU is always operating at a safe temperature.

You are using ThrottleStop to run your CPU at a reduced speed and you are already under volting your CPU. That appears to be working correctly. Both of these tricks help your CPU run cooler. The only thing left is to disassemble your laptop so you can have a look at the thermal paste. Some people use tricks like liquid metal between the CPU and heatsink. This can improve heat dissipation so the CPU can run cooler. On some laptops, in some countries, this might void your warranty and if you are not experienced doing this, you might damage your laptop.

I had a look at your log file. When gaming and you think your CPU is too hot, it is spending most of its time in the 70°C to 75°C range. I think for 1 second it got as high as 81°C. Most gaming laptop owners can only dream about temperatures that cool.

If it was my laptop, I would increase the Turbo Ratio Limits back up to their default values so the CPU can run at its full Intel rated speed. You paid for a high performance CPU so why not use it? Stop worrying about your CPU temperature. Modern gaming laptops are designed to run hot for extended periods of time. Intel CPUs do a great job thermal throttling. They are engineered to automatically slow down just enough to keep the CPU from running too hot. They can literally adjust their speed hundreds of times per second to keep on the safe side of 100°C.

You are right. Using ThrottleStop to under volt the Intel GPU is not going to help anything. The Intel GPU is not being used when gaming so do not bother under volting the iGPU.

It is not unusual to see some throttling when testing with Cinebench. It is fully loading all 6 cores so if your CPU is allowed to run at its full rated speed, it will probably get too hot and trigger thermal throttling. To prevent this from happening, manufacturers lower the turbo power limits to prevent the CPU from consuming too much power and running too hot. If you want your CPU to thermal throttle instead of power limit throttle, you can try increasing your turbo power limits. In the TPL window, the Long power limit is set to 50 and the short power limit is set to 65. Try increasing those both to 70 or 80 Watts and see what happens.

Before checking the FIVR - Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits feature, click on the Install button and follow the directions. The Install button in your screenshot means you still need to download the RwDrv.zip file from Mega. After that, you need to unzip and install the RwDrv.sys file into your ThrottleStop folder so this feature will work.

Thanks for the reply. Wow I hope one day I get to see snow in this city it's only heat and beaches.

Good to know that, I was worried because some days the heat goes up to 35c and I'm bit worried about my computer because I want it to last long.

Do you recommend me to try Liquid metal? If the results are much greater I think it doesn't brother to spend some money on it. These days I bought a thermal compound, the artic mx to reapplied to my computer. And for the warranty it doesn't apply to me anymore because I bought the laptop on micro Center on NJ, they told me that warranty does not apply over other countries.

Before seeing your reply I did reconfiguration of some things and played like 4 hours with these confs. I will leave you the pictures above. And yes I'll try to increase the both power limits in TPL.

And for the Disable and Lock Turbo Power yes I was getting an error because some driver file location, I didn't know it was that and yet you get an install button on it haha thanks

Knowing all of this, I think I'm gonna use my computer at full capacity, I know sometimes is really hot but as you said if your computer has the power why don't you use it at all and I was a bit worried of overheating damaging my laptop. Maybe I'll try the liquid metal that you said and give it a full clean from dust. Thanks for all.

 

[mysshindra]

Hello, maybe you can help me as well, I would be very grateful. I bought an MSI GE63 laptop with i7-8750H and GTX 1070. Since the beginning, I have been struggling with optimizing this CPU for max performance gain without getting thermal throttle. And I soon realized that its rather impossible or maybe I havent done it the right way.

I have applied Liquid Metal from Thermal Grizzly (and yes, it was evenly applied), undervolted bot Cpu Core and Cache to -140.6 mV, set both my laptop fans to Turbor Mode ( max speed 6000 RPM), I even lower the Turbo Boost Long Power Max to 35W (which was safe for this chip according to Intel) and also applied the same number to Turbo Boost Short Power Max.

But it always thermal throttles and reach 95-97 deg Celsius at about 20min into heavy load like gaming and when benchmarking. I feel somewhat disappointed that I couldnt get the Cpu to work at the intended speed it was designed for, hence wasting my money on the laptop. But I found this thread and now it giving me somewhat hope that you can solve my problems.

P/s: Ambient temperature is 14-18 deg Celsius because i like it cold hehehe

 

[unclewebb]

A 20°C difference in peak core temperature is usually a sign that the CPU heatsink is not sitting square on the CPU. All I can recommend is taking your laptop apart again and having a really good look at the heatsink. Check to make sure that you did not accidentally strip a screw or something like that. Clean everything up and put the heatsink in position and see if it sits square or if it rocks on the CPU. Something is not quite right. The TS Bench provides a very even load to the CPU cores. You should not be seeing a huge temperature difference from core to core like you are seeing.

 

[mysshindra]

A 20°C difference in peak core temperature is usually a sign that the CPU heatsink is not sitting square on the CPU. All I can recommend is taking your laptop apart again and having a really good look at the heatsink. Check to make sure that you did not accidentally strip a screw or something like that. Clean everything up and put the heatsink in position and see if it sits square or if it rocks on the CPU. Something is not quite right. The TS Bench provides a very even load to the CPU cores. You should not be seeing a huge temperature difference from core to core like you are seeing.

I did as you said and it worked like a charm !!!!

My liquid metal has all been dried out and it makes sense that something was wrong with it and I had to clean it thoroughly and reapplied it, now under full load with TS bench, all cores sit comfortably at maximum 66 deg Celsius and that is even with turbor long pwr max increased to 55 W !!!

Thank you, you are a life saver !

 

[Lesiu]

Hello Guys, i'm new here and i have problems with my new nitro 5 laptop i7 9750H / GTX 1660Ti / 16Gb RAM / 512Mb ssd
Here i put some screen's. can U help me ??
Sometimes Ring EDP other and Core PL2 is red

 

[unclewebb]

Sometimes Ring EDP other and Core PL2 is red

When PL2 lights up red in core, EDP OTHER usually lights up in red at the exact same time. Not sure why this happens but it does. The reason for throttling when these 2 light up simultaneously is always PL2. This is the long term turbo power limit. You did not post a screenshot of the TPL window so I cannot see what you have that set to. PL1 lights up in red when the CPU is being limited by the short term turbo power limit.

Short term, the CPU can operate at a higher power limit. After a while, to make sure the CPU does not overheat, it will switch to the long term turbo power limit. The turbo time limit is what controls the switch between the short limit to the long limit. This is typically set to 28 seconds. Intel recommends that the long term turbo limit be set equal to the TDP which for the 9750H is 45 Watts. Some OEMs are setting this to 60 Watts or beyond to maximize performance.

When EDP OTHER goes red across all 3 domains at the same time, that is usually caused by the PP0 Current Limit which can also be increased in the TPL window. You might also have to increase the FIVR IccMax current limits. THERMAL goes red when your CPU gets too hot and starts thermal throttling to protect against any long term damage.

Post some more pictures. If you use your computer for gaming, turn the Log File option on in ThrottleStop so you have an accurate record of your CPU's performance. Your log file will be in the ThrottleStop / Logs folder. Attach one to your next post.

I also like seeing some Cinebench R20 testing. This program will fully load your CPU and give a 9750H a significant work out. A log file that shows your performance running Cinebench is also valuable information.

https://www.maxon.net/en-us/products/cinebench-r20-overview/

Some laptops with a 9750H can maintain the full 40.00 multiplier for the entire Cinebench benchmark. The majority of laptops throttle like crazy and fall flat on their face when running R20.

You might be able to increase your turbo power limits by using ThrottleStop but if you are already thermal throttling, you need to improve your laptop cooling first. That is why OEMs use power limits. It helps prevent the CPU from getting too hot. The default 45W long term limit for a 9750H will cause a lot of CPU throttling when the CPU is significantly loaded. With proper cooling, the same 9750H can run at full speed, reliably, at over 80W.

 

[Lesiu]

Hello ,
Its new laptop, how can i improve cooling ?
I dont know how make Cinebench log file

 

[unclewebb]

The 9750H has a 45 Watt TDP rating. You have set the long and short turbo power limits to 24 watts in ThrottleStop. Why?

That is what PL2 in red means. Your CPU is power limit throttling. PL2 is the short term turbo power limit. Were you following some guide?

Start by setting the short term turbo power limit to 60 and the long term limit to 45. Those are typical default values for your CPU.

Cinebench log file

Not a Cinebench log file. A ThrottleStop log file while running Cinebench R20. Check the Log File option on the main screen of ThrottleStop. When you are finished testing, exit your game or exit Cinebench and then exit ThrottleStop. This allows ThrottleStop to finalize your log file. This file will have today's date in its name and this log file will be located in your ThrottleStop / Logs folder. That file shows your CPU performance. Attach it to your next post.

Your cooling looks better than most so increase your power limits so your CPU can run like Intel intended.

 

[Lesiu]

i make some changes but temps have increased ;/

 

[unclewebb]

but temps have increased

Intel CPUs can run 100% reliably up to 100°C. That is the normal thermal throttling temperature. Your laptop manufacturer has set the throttling temperature really low at 92°C so your CPU can never reach its full rated temperature. This means that your CPU temperature should never be a concern. It will always be forced to run well within spec.

Modern laptops with Intel 6 core CPUs run hot. Even low power laptops will run at over 90°C. It is just the way it is in 2020. Why not set the Speed Shift Max value back to the default setting which is 45. Setting this to 34 is limiting your CPU performance.

Your laptop is able to handle a 45W CPU. Why not use your laptop as Intel intended? It is not going to blow up or quickly die. You can use the latest version of ThrottleStop to try and increase the PROCHOT temperature back up to 100°C (Intel spec). Just download, unzip and copy the new ThrottleStop.exe into your ThrottleStop folder.

ThrottleStop 875 b4.zip

drive.google.com

If this scares you, do not use the PROCHOT Offset feature that is in the Options window. Intel sets PROCHOT Offset to 0, not 8. I would use this feature and I would also bump the long term power limit up to 50W or 55W. Holding your CPU to 45W sacrifices a lot of performance. This is not necessary. The thermal throttling temperature will protect your CPU.

 

[Lesiu]

Hi,
Thanks for the reply.
mainly wanted to reduce the CPU temperature. I have been using the laptop for a short time and in comparison to my PC I consider temperatures to be high. By using throttlestop I wanted to lower the temperature.

I set long power max to 50, short power to 60 and for now everything is ok. max temperature around 84 degrees.

Will lowering voltages lower temperatures?