Mini-ITX watercooling

[AusWolf]

Hi all,

Has anyone experimented with watercooling in a mini-ITX system? I'm curious what your experiences are, and what case + watercooling kit you guys would recommend.

As for me, I've just installed a Corsair H80i v2 into my Coolermaster Elite 130 which was a pain in the backside. The tubing of this loop is extremely rigid compared to my old H55 which I didn't expect. Besides, the tubes go right in front of the PSU, so installing the modular power cables was another headache. If anyone is considering a similar setup, DON'T, unless you're extraordinarily patient.

At least my CPU runs about 10 C cooler on average than it did with the H55, which I also didn't expect.

 

[TheLostSwede]

Sure, my NAS is liquid cooled. Had an old Corsair H60, but boy was it a pain to fit in the case, as there was only just enough space in there. It's obviously not the kind of case you'd be going for normally, as it has four hot-swappable 3.5" drive bays. I had the same issue with the tubing and it took be quite some time to get the waterblock onto the CPU, as I was severely height restricted as well.

In fact, some company ought to have done a kit for mini-ITX builds with shorter tubing, but so far, that doesn't seem to be the case.

 

[AusWolf]

Sure, my NAS is liquid cooled. Had an old Corsair H60, but boy was it a pain to fit in the case, as there was only just enough space in there. It's obviously not the kind of case you'd be going for normally, as it has four hot-swappable 3.5" drive bays. I had the same issue with the tubing and it took be quite some time to get the waterblock onto the CPU, as I was severely height restricted as well.

In fact, some company ought to have done a kit for mini-ITX builds with shorter tubing, but so far, that doesn't seem to be the case.

If they ever do, I'll be their first customer.

The other thing I should have taken into consideration is that the tubes on the H55 come out of the block's side, with a turnable joint thingy, so the PSU could sort of fold the tubes away from the cables. With the H80i v2, the tubes come out directly from the top of the CPU block with no joint, so turning or folding them is virtually impossible. I guess the pump can move more water around with no joint restricting the flow, but man I suffered installing it (and the PSU on top of it)!

 

[TheLostSwede]

If they ever do, I'll be their first customer.

The other thing I should have taken into consideration is that the tubes on the H55 come out of the block's side, with a turnable joint thingy, so the PSU could sort of fold the tubes away from the cables. With the H80i v2, the tubes come out directly from the top of the CPU block with no joint, so turning or folding them is virtually impossible. I guess the pump can move more water around with no joint restricting the flow, but man I suffered installing it (and the PSU on top of it)!

My old H60 has the angled ones, but trust me, it didn't really help, in fact, it caused an entirely different problem, due to the 3.5" drive stack coming down quite far inside my case. I would've needed one of the fancy new AIO's with detachable tubing to make it easier.
I then ran into the problem of fitting the SATA cables to the board... I should've done that before putting the board in the case, but alas...
The black cable is for the OS drive.

 

[AusWolf]

My old H60 has the angled ones, but trust me, it didn't really help, in fact, it caused an entirely different problem, due to the 3.5" drive stack coming down quite far inside my case. I would've needed one of the fancy new AIO's with detachable tubing to make it easier.
I then ran into the problem of fitting the SATA cables to the board... I should've done that before putting the board in the case, but alas...
The black cable is for the OS drive.

It looks a bit more flexible than my H80i, but not by much. I wonder why they make the tubes so rigid. I mean, it's mostly just water inside, right?

 

[Mathragh]

I've recently upgraded to a Mini-ITX mobo whilst using a H100i. Haven't yet bought a new case though so I'm still using a Corsair Carbide 500R which fits the radiator easily.
A problem I potentially had because of the watercooling would've been the motherboard VRM's running very hot so I've jury-rigged a fan right on top of the motherboard (Don't mind the dust and the mess of cables):

Planning on building my own Mini-ITX case at some point though so this is transitionary.

 

[tabascosauz]

AIOs are hard to do in SFF (<20L cases) that aren't designed with it in mind. Often times, the rad is adjacent to or directly over the block, leaving the tubing nowhere to go. Custom loops, being the complete pain in the ass they are, at least do away with that tubing problem.

To my knowledge, the only AIO that is made for SFF are the former Asetek 545LC and the current 645LT, which are marketed as being easy drop-ins in cases marketed by SFFLab (chiefly, the DAN-A4) and bundled with a thin Noctua A9x14. They have shorter tubes than you would normally expect from a single-fan AIO. Unfortunately, both are thin 92mm AIOs, made more for essential cooling in small, ~10L split-layout cases like the DAN-A4, Ghost S1 and SM560, where the CPU cooler height is so restricted by the side panel that you would otherwise be limited to using inadequate, monolithic low-profile coolers like the NH-L9x65 and NH-L9i/a.

In terms of performance, the 645LT sits pretty much at the bottom of the stack. It's not hard to beat it with anything from a NH-L12S or the popular 92mm towers like the NH-U9B SE2 / NH-U9S / NH-D9L all the way up to the mighty NH-C14S. A 120mm AIO like the H55 or X31 would probably sit in between the 92mm towers and the C14S in performance, though closer to the U9S than the C14S.

There are a number of cases that can support 240mm AIOs (and by extension, 120mms), including the M1 and SM570, but as can be expected, it is a tight fit when everything else is crammed in there. The Ghost S1 has an optional "large top hat" that provides clearance for a 240mm rad. The tophatted S1 and SM series would probably be slightly easier to work with, given that the rad is placed on the top, as opposed to the M1 where it'll have to go directly over the board on the side.

Unfortunately, you pay a premium price for a design that accommodates AIOs in a small package. The M1, A4, S1 and SM560/570/580 are all considered "premium" and priced as such.

For non-premium cases, 120mm AIOs are somewhat popular in the Silverstone SG05 and SG13, but being essentially shorter and less cluttered versions of the Elite 130 you have, chances are there will still be a fair bit of contortion involved.

 

[John Naylor]

As CLCs generally fail to match air coolers that are 1/3 the price, it's hard to justify on a performance basis. And then you still have the galvanic corrosion science experiment to deal with.
Have you considered external cooling is an option. I have a spare rad from my SUV that I am thinking of mounting under my wife's desk to keep her feet warm.

Can also use something like this

MagiCool XTREME Hexa 720 Radiator (MC-HEXA720) - FrozenCPU.com

MagiCool XTREME Hexa 720 Radiator (MC-HEXA720)

www.frozencpu.com

Alphacool Eiswand 360 CPU All In One External Cooling System - Newegg.com

Buy Alphacool Eiswand 360 CPU All In One External Cooling System with fast shipping and top-rated customer service. Once you know, you Newegg!

www.newegg.com

or

EX2-755 Computer Liquid Cooling System, Rev2.0

EX2-755 is an ambient liquid cooling system designed with features for computer cooling. This model contains a dual x 120mm fan aluminum radiator, providing

koolance.com

but Id only this if going all aluminum

 

[AusWolf]

As CLCs generally fail to match air coolers that are 1/3 the price, it's hard to justify on a performance basis. And then you still have the galvanic corrosion science experiment to deal with.
Have you considered external cooling is an option. I have a spare rad from my SUV that I am thinking of mounting under my wife's desk to keep her feet warm.

Can also use something like this

External cooling... That's an option I've never thought about, but you got me interested.

AIOs are hard to do in SFF (<20L cases) that aren't designed with it in mind. Often times, the rad is adjacent to or directly over the block, leaving the tubing nowhere to go. Custom loops, being the complete pain in the ass they are, at least do away with that tubing problem.

(...)

For non-premium cases, 120mm AIOs are somewhat popular in the Silverstone SG05 and SG13, but being essentially shorter and less cluttered versions of the Elite 130 you have, chances are there will still be a fair bit of contortion involved.

Actually, I didn't intend to use an AIO when I first built the setup 3 years ago. I was more interested in finding a decent air cooler, which proved sort of impossible due to height restrictions. That's why I got the H55 which was 'alright' in terms of performance (though not great). It served me for years, then the pump developed sort of a cracking noise on max speed recently, so I decided to replace it. The only difference I saw in the H80i v2 were the thick radiator and the double fans. I didn't think the tubes would be so hard to bend that it would take me a whole afternoon just to install it.

A few pics:

 

[tabascosauz]

@AusWolf If I'm not mistaken, the H55 just uses regular rubber hose. Unfortunately, Corsair as of late determined that the weird, stiff, "braided"-looking tubes are to be the new hotness, for some reason. NZXT has done the same to their Kraken line, they used to have plain hoses as well. The H55 / H75 / H105 were easier to work with.

240mm AIOs offer a fair bit more performance so I'd be hard-pressed to give it up, but the same can't be said for 120s. Would you consider a case that has a more conventional layout (read: without PSU floating over the board and limiting clearance like so many ITX cases from the last 2 decades) and switch to air? The M1, which I have, is the best example of such, but there are mainstream alternatives as well. Cougar QBX is an affordable one, off the top of my head. Conventional layout cases will usually allow you to easily fit a 92mm tower cooler; in a small space, you really don't stand to lose much performance.

When it comes to air, you have a lot of choices as long as you have a case like the QBX that'll support the height up to 125mm (which is all you need for anything up to a C14S or a Dark Rock TF). The space for a rear 92mm fan also helps move air out, and eliminates the ghetto 80mm fan placed on the side for VRM airflow. What I don't quite like about that case is the spot for an ATX PSU; a builder is doing himself, his hands and his sanity a disservice by cramming an ATX unit into anything smaller than 18L

I would suggest the SG08 (by the way, a fantastic case, I regret letting go of it) if you want the squat, elongated look, as it's the only such case that supports both 125mm air and a 120mm (attached to the intake directly over the board), but it's not made anymore, and doesn't have any siblings with the same design still in production.

 

[Vario]

External cooling... That's an option I've never thought about, but you got me interested.


Actually, I didn't intend to use an AIO when I first built the setup 3 years ago. I was more interested in finding a decent air cooler, which proved sort of impossible due to height restrictions. That's why I got the H55 which was 'alright' in terms of performance (though not great). It served me for years, then the pump developed sort of a cracking noise on max speed recently, so I decided to replace it. The only difference I saw in the H80i v2 were the thick radiator and the double fans. I didn't think the tubes would be so hard to bend that it would take me a whole afternoon just to install it.

A few pics:

Nice to see an Elite 130. I had an Elite 120 a few years ago. I used it with a Prolimatech SAM17 aircooler and also a Asetek 120mm AIO watercooler for awhile.

 

[AusWolf]

@AusWolf If I'm not mistaken, the H55 just uses regular rubber hose. Unfortunately, Corsair as of late determined that the weird, stiff, "braided"-looking tubes are to be the new hotness, for some reason. NZXT has done the same to their Kraken line, they used to have plain hoses as well. The H55 / H75 / H105 were easier to work with.

240mm AIOs offer a fair bit more performance so I'd be hard-pressed to give it up, but the same can't be said for 120s. Would you consider a case that has a more conventional layout (read: without PSU floating over the board and limiting clearance like so many ITX cases from the last 2 decades) and switch to air? The M1, which I have, is the best example of such, but there are mainstream alternatives as well. Cougar QBX is an affordable one, off the top of my head. Conventional layout cases will usually allow you to easily fit a 92mm tower cooler; in a small space, you really don't stand to lose much performance.

When it comes to air, you have a lot of choices as long as you have a case like the QBX that'll support the height up to 125mm (which is all you need for anything up to a C14S or a Dark Rock TF). The space for a rear 92mm fan also helps move air out, and eliminates the ghetto 80mm fan placed on the side for VRM airflow. What I don't quite like about that case is the spot for an ATX PSU; a builder is doing himself, his hands and his sanity a disservice by cramming an ATX unit into anything smaller than 18L

I would suggest the SG08 (by the way, a fantastic case, I regret letting go of it) if you want the squat, elongated look, as it's the only such case that supports both 125mm air and a 120mm (attached to the intake directly over the board), but it's not made anymore, and doesn't have any siblings with the same design still in production.

Originally I was only interested in air cooling, but now that I've spent almost 3 years with water, I'd just stick with water even in a bigger case (maybe with a 240mm rad, and a 'K' processor). My motto has been "big power in a small package" for a long time, but my next build is definitely going to be a bit bigger than this. I like the looks of the braided-like hoses, though it's a shame that we don't have the option to go for the more elastic, traditional rubber ones.

I just had a look on the QBX. The internals look a bit more airy than in my E130, but the radiator is very close to the CPU socket (I'm thinking about the rigid tubing again). Maybe air is a better option for such a small size.

Edit: The good thing about the "ghetto 80mm fan" is that my motherboard allows it to work in a semi-passive mode either through CPU or motherboard temp readings. I've set it up to work with mobo temps, so that it moves some heat away from the VRM area when needed, but shuts off completely during light use. The only good thing about the PSU placement is the same - its fan moves heat away from the VRM.

 

[Cranky5150]

Hardware Labs still make the Micro series i believe. I have the dual 92 mm rad in a micro system, and with the right airflow it;s a beast ! The only drawback is the thickness of them, but if you can fit one they cool like no other. You can get a single or dual in 80 or 92 mm.

 

[sanchom]

Look at my assembly in 7.2 liters with full water cooling, there are a lot of interesting things to note

The smallest water-cooled SFF (Core i 7 7800t rtx 2080ti) in a DAN A4 package. 7.25l

Assembling a computer took 2 weeks. The result is a very compact and very quiet device. If you have questions about the assembly, ask, I will answer.

www.techpowerup.com

 

[AusWolf]

Look at my assembly in 7.2 liters with full water cooling, there are a lot of interesting things to note

The smallest water-cooled SFF (Core i 7 7800t rtx 2080ti) in a DAN A4 package. 7.25l

Assembling a computer took 2 weeks. The result is a very compact and very quiet device. If you have questions about the assembly, ask, I will answer.

www.techpowerup.com

View attachment 152551

Impressive! I'm not sure I'd take on so much work to build a PC, but the sight of a fully watercooled mini-ITX system makes my heart skip a beat.

How do you like the 8700T? Can it keep its turbo speeds stable? When I built my PC, I was thinking about getting something like that, but then I went for the 65W i7-7700 (the 8th gen wasn't out at that time).

 

[sanchom]

Impressive! I'm not sure I'd take on so much work to build a PC, but the sight of a fully watercooled mini-ITX system makes my heart skip a beat.

How do you like the 8700T? Can it keep its turbo speeds stable? When I built my PC, I was thinking about getting something like that, but then I went for the 65W i7-7700 (the 8th gen wasn't out at that time).

The processor worked constantly at a frequency of 4100, consumption of 70 watts (6-12)
It will be better when I add a second 2080ti sli

 

[AusWolf]

The processor worked constantly at a frequency of 4100, consumption of 70 watts (6-12)

View attachment 152609

It's not too bad for an 8th gen i7, but just as I thought, a 35W TDP isn't realistic for a 14nm 6-core chip. My 7700 works at 4 GHz constant, using about 60 watts.

 

[sanchom]

It's not too bad for an 8th gen i7, but just as I thought, a 35W TDP isn't realistic for a 14nm 6-core chip. My 7700 works at 4 GHz constant, using about 60 watts.

Now I have Ryzen 9 3950x on this assembly and it consumes only 100 watts in stress test (16-32, at a frequency of 4040 on all cores and threads)