Need help picking new GPU.

[Daemmon]

Long story short, my current GPU is dying (HiS 7950 Boost) tried all types of troubleshooting and it's RMA material, problem is, guarantee is dead and HiS has barely any support (not only on my country, just sucks... globally) .

Read several threads and such, but the prices are extremely weird on my country (mainly because of import issues, taxes and such). So I'll post my current specs + objective and list a series of options that I have available -within my budget- with their converted prices (so you can laugh about how expensive shit is here).

Gigabyte GTX960 Windforce - 379$
Zotac GTX960 AMP! Edition - 339$
Sapphire Dual-X R9 280 (3GB) - 388$
Sapphire Dual-X R9 270x (4GB) - 390$
Sapphire Dual-X R9 270x (2GB) - 310$

Zotac 960 is a little bit less because of a -30$~ discount I can get in the next few days.

My specs:

Asus Z97-C
i5-4590
GSkill 2x4GB 1886mhz
XFX PRO650W XXX Edition.

Currently my objective is 720p@60FPS . Not intending to go 1080p any time soon, personal issues with big screens and blabla. Also I prefer my PC to be as silent/cool as possible, this is always a feature I try to get, I don't live in a cold place, and I don't like my PC to put a lot of noise, so far this CPU is extremely silent, and don't want the GPU to start making the noise.

Thanks!

 

[Ja.KooLit]

which country you from?

look at those prices. Are they for real?

@720p 60 fps. the GTX 750 ti is a good one. I have one and its silent.

 

[Daemmon]

which country you from?

look at those prices. Are they for real?

@720p 60 fps. the GTX 750 ti is a good one. I have one and its silent.

Sadly... they are very real. Argentina is the country.

750ti are rolling at 320$ (Asus Strix) , I don't see the point of saving 19$ and going for a lower end one, but I may look for extra prices on the 750ti

 

[krusha03]

with those prices get the zotac.

 

[hapkiman]

If youre satisfied with 720p then the GTX 960 with 2GB VRAM is definitely the way to go. The Zotac GTX960 AMP! Edition should be fine, although I prefer MSI, or ASUS which seem to have better, more reliable build quality.

Also if heat is a concern there, the Nvidia cards are definitely the better choice. AMD cards almost always run warmer all things being equal.

Go for the Zotac.

 

[Daemmon]

If youre satisfied with 720p then the GTX 960 with 2GB VRAM is definitely the way to go. The Zotac GTX960 AMP! Edition should be fine, although I prefer MSI, or ASUS which seem to have better, more reliable build quality.

Also if heat is a concern there, the Nvidia cards are definitely the better choice. AMD cards almost always run warmer all things being equal.

Go for the Zotac.

I'm an Asus/Gigabyte guy, but the 960 Strix isn't available currently, and the Gigabyte is +40$ because of the Zotac promotion.

Seems like I'm going to go for the Zotac. I currently have 2 concerns with it (compared with the Gigabyte 960).

1) Haven't seen a decent review on the Temp/Noise side for it. So far the other 960 reviews I've seen it seems like some have come with bad VRM cooling, and others have come with decent ones. The Gigabyte has good VRM cooling, I really don't know about the Zotac.

2) Zotac 960 AMP has 1x6-pin connectors . Gigabyte has 2x6-pin. I'm pretty noob on some hardware stuff, and I normally prefer to not overclock past factory OC settings (mainly because of the temp/noise scenarios I stated before). I don't know if this is something I should care about

 

[krusha03]

I'm an Asus/Gigabyte guy, but the 960 Strix isn't available currently, and the Gigabyte is +40$ because of the Zotac promotion.

Seems like I'm going to go for the Zotac. I currently have 2 concerns with it (compared with the Gigabyte 960).

1) Haven't seen a decent review on the Temp/Noise side for it. So far the other 960 reviews I've seen it seems like some have come with bad VRM cooling, and others have come with decent ones. The Gigabyte has good VRM cooling, I really don't know about the Zotac.

2) Zotac 960 AMP has 1x6-pin connectors . Gigabyte has 2x6-pin. I'm pretty noob on some hardware stuff, and I normally prefer to not overclock past factory OC settings (mainly because of the temp/noise scenarios I stated before). I don't know if this is something I should care about

1. There are few reviews around, one of which here that says the card is quiet and doesnt run very hot but the maximum temperature is set higher than other 960 with up to 80c
2. Since the card consumes around 120W this does not make any difference

 

[quietburn]

R9 280 seems like a good overall choice considering the extra ram and Sapphire has been reliable.

If you would like to try something different (R9 280 is a 7950 which is your old card), the GTX 960 Zotac looks good on price for similar performance.
*I have never used any Zotac before and cannot be sure of its usage, reliability or support.

Maybe more importantly in your case, you may want to note that the particular Gigabyte you have shortlisted scored very well for its cooler in a recent comprehensive test:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-gtx-960,4038-10.html
A properly cooled card should be more reliable especially since you are getting all these cards at very high prices.

The only card in your list that I will avoid is the 4GB 270X as there are not many situations now that justify a premium for 4GB ram.
If a game needs 4GB ram, the 270X processing power would have already maxed out anyway. R9 280 would be a better bet if ram is your concern.

 

[Daemmon]

R9 280 seems like a good overall choice considering the extra ram and Sapphire has been reliable.

If you would like to try something different (R9 280 is a 7950 which is your old card), the GTX 960 Zotac looks good on price for similar performance.
*I have never used any Zotac before and cannot be sure of its usage, reliability or support.

Maybe more importantly in your case, you may want to note that the particular Gigabyte you have shortlisted scored very well for its cooler in a recent comprehensive test:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-gtx-960,4038-10.html
A properly cooled card should be more reliable especially since you are getting all these cards at very high prices.

The only card in your list that I will avoid is the 4GB 270X as there are not many situations now that justify a premium for 4GB ram.
If a game needs 4GB ram, the 270X processing power would have already maxed out anyway. R9 280 would be a better bet if ram is your concern.

I've had nVidia during most of my gaming PC history. It all started a sunny day in 1999 with the Riva TNT2.
I'm no "fanboy" and when I spotted this 7950, it was a clear winner in the $/performance department. It is/was my first AMD and it was kind of a letdown for me, dying in a 1 year span is not what I expect from a mid-GPU, specially since I had a GTX260 for 4+ years prior to this one, and besides dust I had no issues with it. So I'm kinda aiming to go back for nVidia, yes my personal experience is of course TERRIBLY biased, but it is what it is.

Staying at 720p@60fps makes me wonder if I really need anything with above 2gb VRAM... hell I should be able to roll 1080p at med/high with 2gb if I ever wanted to. That's why I made the thread, I don't want to go overboard on something that I know I won't upgrade.

Never used Zotac myself either, that's why I'm wondering on the temp/noise department, as I know the Gigabyte is -good- but not sure if it's worth the extra 40$

 

[krusha03]

I've had nVidia during most of my gaming PC history. It all started a sunny day in 1999 with the Riva TNT2.
I'm no "fanboy" and when I spotted this 7950, it was a clear winner in the $/performance department. It is/was my first AMD and it was kind of a letdown for me, dying in a 1 year span is not what I expect from a mid-GPU, specially since I had a GTX260 for 4+ years prior to this one, and besides dust I had no issues with it. So I'm kinda aiming to go back for nVidia, yes my personal experience is of course TERRIBLY biased, but it is what it is.

Staying at 720p@60fps makes me wonder if I really need anything with above 2gb VRAM... hell I should be able to roll 1080p at med/high with 2gb if I ever wanted to. That's why I made the thread, I don't want to go overboard on something that I know I won't upgrade.

Never used Zotac myself either, that's why I'm wondering on the temp/noise department, as I know the Gigabyte is -good- but not sure if it's worth the extra 40$

At 1080p the 960 is already better than the 7950 and at 900p the difference is even bigger. And note that this is for the gigabyte 960 which has 25MHz less on the core than the Zotac. I wouldnt be worried about the noise and the temperatures because the 960 really is a frugal card

 

[Ja.KooLit]

Sadly... they are very real. Argentina is the country.

750ti are rolling at 320$ (Asus Strix) , I don't see the point of saving 19$ and going for a lower end one, but I may look for extra prices on the 750ti

Well you are right. no point in going for lower end if the price is only 19$ difference. As you wanted silent, like others said 960 is your best bet. Zotac cards are good. My 750 ti is zotac and it is quite and cool.

 

[64K]

Zotac 960 gets my vote. At 720p you should be able to play most games on high settings and 4X AA.

 

[droopyRO]

R9 280 or GTX960, it depends on your PSU and/or preference. But as a curiosity could you elaborate on why do you use a small(by todays standards) monitor ? i began PC gaming on a 14" CRT i own a 27" LCD these days and i would not go lower than 22"

 

[quietburn]

You shortlisted AMD cards asking opinions about it and then bash it (??). You know it gets pretty tiring when any conversation you read becomes another thread in pretext to bash one side.

---

At 1080p the 960 is already better than the 7950 and at 900p the difference is even bigger. And note that this is for the gigabyte 960 which has 25MHz less on the core than the Zotac. I wouldnt be worried about the noise and the temperatures because the 960 really is a frugal card

As for the chart listed by Krusha above, 280 was missing. 7950 though using the same chip is not the same card at the same clock speed - akin to GTX 960 vs Gigabyte GTX 960 in the chart itself which has an 8% difference.

Before we draw indirect inference erroneously from the chart, know that the clock speed headroom available on 7950 (which was likely underclocked intentionally), was unusually substantial hence it subsequently became 7950 Boost then 280. GTX 960 would be best compared directly to 280. If they ended up with similar performance, 280 could still arguably be the better card (not neccesarily for your case) for the 3GB vram buffer.

In fact I would even speculate that the GTX 960 would fluctuate more in actual gameplay framerates especially on titles taxing in shading and memory bandwidth - it is hard for a 1024:64:32 128bit config to completely match a 1792:112:32 384bit config in the same lithography generation without drawbacks in some areas.

---

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-gtx-960,4038-10.html

On temperature and noise, Krusha may be missing a point brought up by the article.

Frequently, components on the board give up instead of the gpu itself. Hot spots like the vrm does not necessarily mandate that the card be overclocked in order to reach high temperatures. Poorly dissipated heat can cause these areas to be heated up substantially as well. The review presented comprehensively for the first time actual hot spots on a card - the exact areas that matter.

Considering that you are quite perturbed by graphics card reliability, it would be foolish to disregard the findings here by a professional review in place of blind recommendations in a forum.

And for sound, it was not just fan noise. It is really refreshing that they managed to measure noise caused by electronics, not the fan. Electronics noise - yes, they can emit a constant unwanted sound that can cause user fatigue.

Honestly I dislike Gigabyte but I give them credit here for a very good product that has supporting proof in the review to back it, not simply said by you or by me.

---

Since this is a pro Nvidia request, I will reserve further comments.

I am happy with nvidia, I am happy with amd. These are the only two companies around, sticking out in a tough pc market, both continuously supporting and pushing new technology that I am able to enjoy all these wonderful graphics display on my personal screen.

 

[krusha03]

You shortlisted AMD cards asking opinions about it and then bash it (??). You know it gets pretty tiring when any conversation you read becomes another thread in pretext to bash one side.

As for the chart listed by Krusha above, 280 was missing. 7950 though using the same chip is not the same card at the same clock speed - akin to GTX 960 vs Gigabyte GTX 960 in the chart itself which has an 8% difference.

Let's say the 280 is equivalent to the 7970 it is still just as fast. The Zotac has a higher factory overclock than the gigabyte so it will be faster at stock. Finally normally I would recommend a 280 over a GTX 960 at normal prices (the GTX being about $50 more expensive) but not at those prices.

On temperature and noise, Krusha may be missing a point brought up by the article.

Frequently, components on the board give up instead of the gpu itself. Hot spots like the vrm does not necessarily mandate that the card be overclocked in order to reach high temperatures. Poorly dissipated heat can cause these areas to be heated up substantially as well. The review presented comprehensively for the first time actual hot spots on a card - the exact areas that matter.

Considering that you are quite perturbed by graphics card reliability, it would be foolish to disregard the findings here by a professional review in place of blind recommendations in a forum.

And for sound, it was not just fan noise. It is really refreshing that they managed to measure noise caused by electronics, not the fan. Electronics noise - yes, they can emit a constant unwanted sound that can cause user fatigue.

Honestly I dislike Gigabyte but I give them credit here for a very good product that has supporting proof in the review to back it, not simply said by you or by me.

This is true and I am aware but while the zotac was not reviewed there, here is a review of the zotac and the temperatures and noise level is nothing that (in my opinion) would justify spending another $40. By electronic noise i assume you mean coil whine which normally if registered is mentioned in reviews. At same price I would go for the Gigabyte in a heartbeat but now at $40 premium

Edit: Found a link that has a video with noises of different 960s including the Zotac

 

[st2000]

the 280 is equivalent to the 7970

r9 280 is not r9 280x(a bit improved 7970)
all cards are downgrade as it seems to me, but all of them are ok to 720p
i'd prefer 960 zotac prefered to price, my country has bad pricing too, so ensure that second hand market is availible(for example, we got new 280x pricing equal to 290x(about 400$) and 970 gtx is 50$ more) but at second hand market you can buy 280x starting at 150$ and 290x 200$)
so look at aftermarket deals before buying a new one)

PS also i dont understand that "silent" - you want a silent card in idle or under load?cause it's realy hard to find a videocard with low dB in games/tests
for example my card is absolutely silent in idle, but while gaming i can hear it if i play w/o sound)

 

[quietburn]

Let's say the 280 is equivalent to the 7970 it is still just as fast. The Zotac has a higher factory overclock than the gigabyte so it will be faster at stock. Finally normally I would recommend a 280 over a GTX 960 at normal prices (the GTX being about $50 more expensive) but not at those prices.



This is true and I am aware but while the zotac was not reviewed there, here is a review of the zotac and the temperatures and noise level is nothing that (in my opinion) would justify spending another $40. By electronic noise i assume you mean coil whine which normally if registered is mentioned in reviews. At same price I would go for the Gigabyte in a heartbeat but now at $40 premium

Edit: Found a link that has a video with noises of different 960s including the Zotac

Good. You got your point.

 

[krusha03]

r9 280 is not r9 280x(a bit improved 7970)

Again yes 280x = rebranded 7970 and 280 = rebranded 7950 with higher clocks. What i meant is that even if the 280 can give the same performance as an 7970 when overclocked the GTX 960 is right next to it. The 280 and 960 will not be much of an upgrade to his old 7950 and the 270x will be a plain downgrade. Long story short given only those 5 cards at those 5 prices the zotac is the best choice. If op wants and can get a 2nd hand card of equivalent performance cheaper then by all means go for it. I mean look at my system do i look like your typical Nvidia fan

Good. You got your point.

Yay points

 

[st2000]

just confused 280 and 285)
and yea, our thoughts are same)
but TS said

Currently my objective is 720p@60FPS . Not intending to go 1080p any time soon

so even 560TI or 660TI is still an option(yea, its downgrade, but it's ok for 720p if you got hell prices)

 

[Daemmon]

But as a curiosity could you elaborate on why do you use a small(by todays standards) monitor ? i began PC gaming on a 14" CRT i own a 27" LCD these days and i would not go lower than 22"

Mostly neck issues. Have tested several sizes and apparently my neck can't tolerate moving around too much. Also, desktop size, which also limits how far I can sit from. I like my small 19'' LED

You shortlisted AMD cards asking opinions about it and then bash it (??). You know it gets pretty tiring when any conversation you read becomes another thread in pretext to bash one side.

As I said, I'm no fanboy and my personal experience is totally biased. But the second part that is also supporting my opinion in this case is price. When I bought this 7950 it was a clear winner, and I didn't forced myself into a nVidia. Market is weird down here, just because nVidia has some better marketing/pricing doesn't mean it's better. Performance wise this 7950 is/was a beast for the price.

Considering that you are quite perturbed by graphics card reliability, it would be foolish to disregard the findings here by a professional review in place of blind recommendations in a forum.

Have read several reviews so far. Yes, some (as I stated in another post) apparently have bad VRM cooling, but there is a huge variation between manufacturers. You linked the iChill version, that had apparently a wrong fan curve response, with an updated BIOS that hotspot went down to 94º. Windforce stayed at 86.8º, too bad there isn't a Zotac in there. Coil whine + bad VRM cooling is something that can be found on nVidia and AMD and on almost every manufacturer, just like my HiS 7950 is suffering from bad VRM cooling.

Edit: Found a link that has a video with noises of different 960s including the Zotac

Found it yesterday, accidentaly, since my german is practically 0. I like that MSI sooo much, too bad it's not in the market currently, and importers are charging ~430-450 to bring one. But I can def like how the Zotac behave a lot, it seems to be better than the Strix on the silent deparment .

so even 560TI or 660TI is still an option(yea, its downgrade, but it's ok for 720p if you got hell prices)

No good options in the market. Either too close to a 960, or used+high priced (for a used).

---------

Thanks for all the replies guys!

Btw, for those that are suggesting second-hand market, I've looked around, but since I don't live in one of the big cities the options are very very limited. I personally don't want to buy a used card, get it sent, test it and then have to return it if it doesn't work. Locally a GTX660 (non-Ti, used) is rolling 385$. How about no?

 

[st2000]

ok, in this situation i'd take zotac

 

[Daemmon]

UPDATE:

Talked with the guys from the shop. Managed to lower the price of the Gigabyte 960 Windforce to ~350$ . Should be here in a couple of days.

Thanks a lot for your help and discussion guys. I really like TPU!

Just extra info on why I decided to pick the Gigabyte 960 Windforce (350$~) over the Zotac 960 Amp (339$~).

Zotac:

-Reviews/videos shown a nice silent card.
-Reviews claimed the Zotac to be cool, yet on graphs most of them showed a 75-81ºc (factory and extra OC) temps, with no extra info on VRM temps/cooling.
- 2 of the reviews I've read claimed to hear coil whine. I know sometimes this is a PSU+GPU combo issue, but I wasn't going to take the risk.
- Backplate?

Gigabyte:

Silent card + 65ºC~ on full load + 84ºC~ on VRMs + no signs of coil whine. Also, no backplate, yes it provides that extra "durability" and maybe it looks cool... but I don't want to have a mini oven between the PCB and the backplate. Only +11$ .

 

[rruff]

hell I should be able to roll 1080p at med/high with 2gb if I ever wanted to.

Easily. Look at the reviews of the 960. 2GB may become an issue in the future if you prefer highest settings and low framerates, vs lower settings and high framerates.

Good luck! Think you made a good choice.

BTW, doesn't it seem weird that the US is pretty much the only country that *doesn't* levy high import taxes?

 

[Caring1]

BTW, doesn't it seem weird that the US is pretty much the only country that *doesn't* levy high import taxes?

Off topic, but that is what kills the home grown manufacturing industry, all those dollars are being exported instead of being spent at home.

 

[rruff]

Yes, I know. Isn't "free trade" supposed to run both directions? I export stuff myself occasionally, and the recipient always asks me to claim a low value to reduce the import tax. On the other hand I never pay tax on stuff I buy from overseas.