Problem with G-sync on RTX 4070 windowed mode DX11

[H4zelnut]

since I replaced my RTX 2060 with RTX 4070 I noticed Genshin running very choppy, I have been testing it for few days and these are my conclusions:
- the problem appears on 4070 and not on 2060 even with the same driver
- happens with both 531.61 and 531.68 drivers
- I tested it with two monitors - Dell S2721DGF (G-sync compatible) and AOC G2460PG (G-sync), the AOC monitor doesn't stutter but flickers instead
- the stutter on Dell monitor is much worse when refresh rate is set to 120 Hz or 60 Hz than when it's set to 144 Hz or 165 Hz
- the flicker on AOC monitor only appears in windowed mode (tested with Sekiro and The Surge)
- the flicker on AOC monitor only appears in DX11 (tested with Monster Hunter World)
- the AOC monitor also stutters when refresh rate is set to 60 Hz
- additionally in The Surge with G-sync on when I set v-sync in game to half refresh rate it's completely broken in windowed mode but works fine in full screen or with G-sync disabled
- no issues with Vulkan (tested with DOOM 2016)
- I was able to reproduce the stutter from Genshin in Monster Hunter World on Dell monitor by following these steps: setting monitor refresh rate to 120 Hz, launching the game in windowed mode with DX11 and setting framerate cap at 60. the stutter disappears after changing API to DX12
- forcing Genshin to run in exclusive full screen through shortcut worked like a charm, all microstutter gone and it's as smooth as it can be while being capped at 60 fps.

I already wrote this on Nvidia forum, I hope it gets fixed asap

 

[tabascosauz]

since I replaced my RTX 2060 with RTX 4070 I noticed Genshin running very choppy, I have been testing it for few days and these are my conclusions:
- the problem appears on 4070 and not on 2060 even with the same driver
- happens with both 531.61 and 531.68 drivers
- I tested it with two monitors - Dell S2721DGF (G-sync compatible) and AOC G2460PG (G-sync), the AOC monitor doesn't stutter but flickers instead
- the stutter on Dell monitor is much worse when refresh rate is set to 120 Hz or 60 Hz than when it's set to 144 Hz or 165 Hz
- the flicker on AOC monitor only appears in windowed mode (tested with Sekiro and The Surge)
- the flicker on AOC monitor only appears in DX11 (tested with Monster Hunter World)
- the AOC monitor also stutters when refresh rate is set to 60 Hz
- additionally in The Surge with G-sync on when I set v-sync in game to half refresh rate it's completely broken in windowed mode but works fine in full screen or with G-sync disabled
- no issues with Vulkan (tested with DOOM 2016)
- I was able to reproduce the stutter from Genshin in Monster Hunter World on Dell monitor by following these steps: setting monitor refresh rate to 120 Hz, launching the game in windowed mode with DX11 and setting framerate cap at 60. the stutter disappears after changing API to DX12
- forcing Genshin to run in exclusive full screen through shortcut worked like a charm, all microstutter gone and it's as smooth as it can be while being capped at 60 fps.

Did you actually verify that G-sync is on when you're in-game? Via the G-sync indicator in NVCP? Display dropdown > G-sync Compatible indicator.

I know exactly the map stutter that you are referring to, and most of the time it just means G-sync is not actually in operation. I use M32Q and S2721DGF myself - it's not really monitor-specific, all Freesync Premium (aka G-sync Compatible) monitors are the same with regard to both stuttering and flickering.

Genshin's (and other Unity games) problem with G-sync and Freesync Premium is well-documented. If you try to enable G-sync windowed to get around the problem, chances are you will see severe flickering in-game. Switching DX11 to DX12 in other games probably makes sense because DX12 is what blurs the line between true fullscreen and windowed fullscreen.

Windows 11's built-in Windowed VRR option works pretty well with Genshin, no -window-mode exclusive tweak required thanks to MPO. Unfortunately, as of late, it seems to be completely up to chance whether G-sync seems to "recognize" Genshin. I had to reinstall the game a couple weeks ago, and for almost a week G-sync would refuse to recognize the game window as fullscreen with MPO - no matter the driver installed, game install location, monitor settings, etc. I don't know if this is the fault of recent game updates or Windows updates, or if it has gotten better in the past month.

It ended up clearing up on its own after a few days, but I was also running off a completely clean Windows and NVCleanstall after my 7900XT > 4070 Ti change, so ymmv. If you're trying to rule out driver shenanigans, should probably either DDU and/or clean install Windows.

If you have up to date Win 11 + G-sync in other game + MPO untouched + verify that -window-mode fix works, try reinstalling the game first and give it a bit of time. Make sure you don't disable MPO if you use registry tweak or normally tick that option in NVCleanstall. If all else fails, -window-mode exclusive should always work.

Unfortunately, neither the stuttering nor flickering come across very well on video. I know what you're referring to, though.

 

[H4zelnut]

Did you actually verify that G-sync is on when you're in-game? Via the G-sync indicator in NVCP? Display dropdown > G-sync Compatible indicator.

I know exactly the map stutter that you are referring to, and most of the time it just means G-sync is not actually in operation. I use M32Q and S2721DGF myself - it's not really monitor-specific, all Freesync Premium (aka G-sync Compatible) monitors are the same with regard to both stuttering and flickering.

Genshin's (and other Unity games) problem with G-sync and Freesync Premium is well-documented. If you enable G-sync windowed, chances are you will see severe flickering in-game. Switching DX11 to DX12 in other games probably makes sense because DX12 is what blurs the line between true fullscreen and windowed fullscreen.

Windows 11's built-in Windowed VRR option works pretty well with Genshin, no -window-mode exclusive tweak required thanks to MPO. Unfortunately, as of late, it seems to be completely up to chance whether G-sync seems to "recognize" Genshin. I had to reinstall the game a couple weeks ago, and for almost a week G-sync would refuse to recognize the game window as fullscreen with MPO - no matter the driver installed, game install location, monitor settings, etc. I don't know if this is the fault of recent game updates or Windows updates, or if it has gotten better in the past month.

It ended up clearing up on its own after a few days, but I was also running off a completely clean Windows and NVCleanstall after my 7900XT > 4070 Ti change, so ymmv.

Try reinstalling the game first and give it a bit of time. Make sure you don't disable MPO if you use registry tweak or normally tick that option in NVCleanstall. If all else fails, -window-mode exclusive should always work.

my Dell monitor has refresh rate monitoring, this is what it looks like in windowed mode, I'm not talking about the frametime spikes on map screen in Genshin - that I know was always there, I'm talking about horrible microstutter when in game that doesn't show on frametime graph, I recorded the map to show backlight flicker on AOC monitor. with forced full screen the refresh rate oscillates between 57 and 62 Hz as it should with G-sync

 

[tabascosauz]

my Dell monitor has refresh rate monitoring, this is what it looks like in windowed mode

I know, I have a S2721DGF too. It doesn't matter. You need to find out if G-sync is actually functioning, and the easiest way is to enable the G-sync Compatible indicator and watch for it appearing in the upper right of your screen. Regardless of whether MPO/Windowed VRR is working properly, Genshin with the -window-mode exclusive tag should always allow for proper G-sync.

The wild fluctuations are honestly just a consequence of G-sync Compatible/Freesync Premium's eccentricities colliding with a poorly coded, poorly optimized 60Hz capped game like Genshin. Functional G-sync will smooth over all of that regardless.

 

[H4zelnut]

I know, I have a S2721DGF too. It doesn't matter. You need to find out if G-sync is actually functioning, and the easiest way is to enable the G-sync Compatible indicator and watch for it appearing in the upper right of your screen. Regardless of whether MPO/Windowed VRR is working properly, Genshin with the -window-mode exclusive tag should always allow for proper G-sync.

The wild fluctuations are honestly just a consequence of G-sync Compatible/Freesync Premium's eccentricities colliding with a poorly coded, poorly optimized 60Hz capped game like Genshin. Functional G-sync will smooth over all of that regardless.

View attachment 293475

I'm sure it was on, I messed with it for few days, turning it on and off multiple times and it works in other games but here you go and believe me - there is a horrible microstutter in windowed mode

 

[tabascosauz]

I'm sure it was on, I messed with it for few days, turning it on and off multiple times and it works in other games but here you go and believe me - there is a horrible microstutter in windowed mode

I fully believe you on the microstutter but I mean......just don't use windowed G-sync mode, it's not a good fix for anything. Just because it works for other games doesn't mean anything, Genshin is anything but a competently coded game.

You're not even on Windows 11, so the only way you can get smooth G-sync is using -window-mode exclusive, and set G-sync back to default fullscreen mode. Windowed VRR is a Win 11 exclusive.

If you still have bad stuttering in -window-mode exclusive with fullscreen G-sync, then you might want to explore other options like DDU and clean install. What's the rest of your specs? Literally know nothing about your computer other than the fact it has a 4070 now and it's on Win10. GPU load is low in Genshin, CPU single-core performance matters and so does disk I/O.

 

[H4zelnut]

I fully believe you on the microstutter but I mean......just don't use windowed G-sync mode, it's not a good fix for anything. Just because it works for other games doesn't mean anything, Genshin is anything but a competently coded game.

You're not even on Windows 11, so the only way you can get smooth G-sync is using -window-mode exclusive, and set G-sync back to default fullscreen mode. Windowed VRR is a Win 11 exclusive.

If you still have bad stuttering in -window-mode exclusive with fullscreen G-sync, then you might want to explore other options like DDU and clean install. What's the rest of your specs? Literally know nothing about your computer other than the fact it has a 4070 now and it's on Win10. GPU load is low in Genshin, CPU single-core performance matters and so does disk I/O.

and Genshin runs like dream in full screen

 

[tabascosauz]

View attachment 293480
and Genshin runs like dream in full screen

No problems then? Specs are plenty strong for Genshin.

It just doesn't run well in windowed or when G-sync is off, if you're sensitive to stuttering. For better alt+tab (since -window-mode exclusive can cause wonkiness at times), you can always upgrade to Win11 to try Windowed VRR, but it should be more accurately described as "Windowed Fullscreen VRR", since the game will still run like shit when in an actual window.

But if you prefer windowed for multitasking for example, you might just have to live with the choppiness.

 

[H4zelnut]

I captured the stutter in Sekiro using Xbox Game Bar to record, interestingly recording with Geforce overlay doesn't record this stutter

 

[Toothless]

Stop running windowed. Freesync/Gsync aren't made for windowed mode even when you check it off in control panels. It's hit and miss.

You're literally making the problem by not running it as intended.

 

[H4zelnut]

Stop running windowed. Freesync/Gsync aren't made for windowed mode even when you check it off in control panels. It's hit and miss.

You're literally making the problem by not running it as intended.

some games like Genshin only have borderless window mode by default, and it worked fine with RTX 2060

 

[tabascosauz]

some games like Genshin only have borderless window mode by default, and it worked fine with RTX 2060

Do you read? I just told you. G-sync Windowed is notoriously unreliable. You have already figured out that G-sync is functioning when properly fullscreen with the -window-mode arg. Windows 10 doesn't have the new MPO features, go try Windows 11 and see if it improves with Windowed VRR, if you are still hell-bent on running things in a window.

 

[jext]

Set a frame limit for the applicatoin in NVIDIA control panel

 

[H4zelnut]

Do you read? I just told you. G-sync Windowed is notoriously unreliable. You have already figured out that G-sync is functioning when properly fullscreen with the -window-mode arg. Windows 10 doesn't have the new MPO features, go try Windows 11 and see if it improves with Windowed VRR, if you are still hell-bent on running things in a window.

are you saying I should just let it be broken because there is a workaround? I shouldn't have to go through such bullcrap, it took me over a week to figure out what was wrong. I never had a problem with G-sync on this PC before, not with RTX 2060, not with GTX 1070. also if G-sync being broken in windowed mode is so common then why the hell haven't they removed that option from Control Panel?! it runs much worse than with normal V-sync

Set a frame limit for the applicatoin in NVIDIA control panel

doesn't work, I have it set for Genshin and it did nothing

 

[tabascosauz]

are you saying I should just let it be broken because there is a workaround? I shouldn't have to go through such bullcrap, it took me over a week to figure out what was wrong. I never had a problem with G-sync on this PC before, not with RTX 2060, not with GTX 1070

You literally haven't tried anything recommended. You just keep repeating the tired old line that windowed G-sync isn't working. I gave you a number of realistic things you could try:

• Windows 11 and Windowed VRR exists
• Vulkan and OpenGL Present Method in NVCP 52x.xx and later
• DDU
• Reinstall Genshin

I'm not questioning your experience, but in 2.5 years of playing this game I have never seen G-sync or Freesync work when the game is in windowed mode, regardless of NVCP G-sync setting. That's on a 2060 Super, 3070 Ti, 7900XT and 4070 Ti. What else do you want me to say? "Go bother hyv and Nvidia about it"?

Playerbase has been bothering hyv about G-sync for years. In the end, it was neither hyv nor Nvidia but Microsoft that came through, and now with Win11 you don't need the -window-mode workaround anymore. Running in windowed is still largely unchanged, however.

 

[Toothless]

I pulled the game up and.. does it even go past 60fps? I see 30, 45, and 60 options.

 

[tabascosauz]

I pulled the game up and.. does it even go past 60fps? I see 30, 45, and 60 options.

It doesn't, and it's extremely annoying because the engine forces not only 60fps but 60Hz. Meaning 60Hz monitors work like a charm, but any high refresh rate panel requires working Freesync/G-sync/VRR in order not to be stuttering horribly 100% of the time. Framecaps and V-sync have no effect (although V-sync can still improve smoothness slightly but only when VRR is already working).

Add to that the fact that it's one of those Unity games that don't have a real fullscreen mode, meaning either you do the -window-mode arg if you're on W10, or enable Window VRR and pray to the gods if you're on W11.

To add insult to injury, it's also a game that Radeon drivers (at least RDNA3) deems "unworthy" of more VRAM clock befitting of a 3D load, so fluctuating low VRAM clock adds another layer of stuttery mess to the pile unless you can add more GPU load. Or are on a later driver that forces full 2500MHz VRAM on multi-monitor at all times, thereby removing the fluctuations.

It's 120Hz on iPad Pro, but hyv continues to ignore the PC playerbase

 

[Toothless]

It doesn't, and it's extremely annoying because the engine forces not only 60fps but 60Hz. Meaning 60Hz monitors work like a charm, but any high refresh rate panel requires working Freesync/G-sync/VRR in order not to be stuttering horribly 100% of the time. Framecaps and V-sync have no effect (although V-sync can still improve smoothness slightly but only when VRR is already working).

Add to that the fact that it's one of those Unity games that don't have a real fullscreen mode, meaning either you do the -window-mode arg if you're on W10, or enable Window VRR and pray to the gods if you're on W11.

It's 120Hz on iPad Pro, but hyv continues to ignore the PC playerbase

Well glad my freesync works perfectly with the game. Never knew it forced the panel down to 60hz.

 

[H4zelnut]

You literally haven't tried anything recommended. You just keep repeating the tired old line that windowed G-sync isn't working. I gave you a number of realistic things you could try:

• Windows 11 and Windowed VRR exists
• Vulkan and OpenGL Present Method in NVCP 52x.xx and later
• DDU
• Reinstall Genshin

I'm not questioning your experience, but in 2.5 years of playing this game I have never seen G-sync or Freesync work when the game is in windowed mode, regardless of NVCP G-sync setting. That's on a 2060 Super, 3070 Ti, 7900XT and 4070 Ti. What else do you want me to say? "Go bother hyv and Nvidia about it"?

Playerbase has been bothering hyv about G-sync for years. In the end, it was neither hyv nor Nvidia but Microsoft that came through, and now with Win11 you don't need the -window-mode workaround anymore.

View attachment 293614

what's the point in reinstalling Genshin, it's not a game spceific issue. neither I should be forced to upgrade to Win11, at least I consider it a last resort solution. I am bothering Nvidia about it and I'm going to keep doing it if it's not fixed with next driver update.

 

[Toothless]

what's the point in reinstalling Genshin, it's not a game spceific issue. neither I should be forced to upgrade to Win11, at least I consider it a last resort solution. I am bothering Nvidia about it and I'm going to keep doing it if it's not fixed with next driver update.

It's a game issue with Genshin. Gsync has NEVER had official support for windowed. You can complain all you want and get mad but they're not going to do anything in one or ten updates.

 

[tabascosauz]

what's the point in reinstalling Genshin, it's not a game spceific issue. neither I should be forced to upgrade to Win11, at least I consider it a last resort solution. I am bothering Nvidia about it and I'm going to keep doing it if it's not fixed with next driver update.

Good luck then maybe you can finally accomplish what no one else can

 

[H4zelnut]

I reinstalled Sekiro, even put it on nvme drive, guess what - it did jack s**t, just as I expected

It's a game issue with Genshin. Gsync has NEVER had official support for windowed. You can complain all you want and get mad but they're not going to do anything in one or ten updates.

I wrote multiple times it worked on my previous graphiccs card. I googled up some old posts from few years ago describing similar issue so it's not a first time they broke G-sync with new driver

at leas they should put some goddamn warning in control panel that G-sync may not work in windowed mode but there is nothing

 

[Toothless]

I reinstalled Sekiro, even put it on nvme drive, guess what - it did jack s**t, just as I expected


you idiot I wrote multiple times it worked on my previous graphiccs card. I googled up some old posts from few years ago describing similar issue so it's not a first time they broke G-sync with new driver

at leas they should put some goddamn warning in control panel that G-sync may not work in windowed mode but there is nothing

Getting angry and insulting isn't how you get people to look at your posts, fyi. Yes I saw your last card worked but that doesn't mean that's it's going to always work.

 

[H4zelnut]

You literally haven't tried anything recommended. You just keep repeating the tired old line that windowed G-sync isn't working. I gave you a number of realistic things you could try:

• Windows 11 and Windowed VRR exists
• Vulkan and OpenGL Present Method in NVCP 52x.xx and later
• DDU
• Reinstall Genshin

I'm not questioning your experience, but in 2.5 years of playing this game I have never seen G-sync or Freesync work when the game is in windowed mode, regardless of NVCP G-sync setting. That's on a 2060 Super, 3070 Ti, 7900XT and 4070 Ti. What else do you want me to say? "Go bother hyv and Nvidia about it"?

Playerbase has been bothering hyv about G-sync for years. In the end, it was neither hyv nor Nvidia but Microsoft that came through, and now with Win11 you don't need the -window-mode workaround anymore. Running in windowed is still largely unchanged, however.

View attachment 293614

thanks for wasting my time on installing Win11 that shit doesn't work, my monitor was running at fixed refresh rate and I had all 3 things toggled on, even rebooted the PC. and since I installed graphics driver on freshly formated drive doing clean install on Win10 won't do shit either. I don't think doing that ever solved anything

 

[tabascosauz]

thanks for wasting my time on installing Win11 that shit doesn't work, my monitor was running at fixed refresh rate and I had all 3 things toggled on, even rebooted the PC. and since I installed graphics driver on freshly formated drive doing clean install on Win10 won't do shit either. I don't think doing that ever solved anything

I told you like 3 times that Win11 won't provide you specifically with what you seem to be looking for (your obsession with G-sync windowed). Either there were older drivers that happened to work better in that regard, or the 2060 just happens to do better. What it does is improve fullscreen functionality so -window-mode is no longer necessary, so you won't need that "workaround" you are also so pissy about.

Upon seeing that you are hesitant about Win11, I specifically recommended that you grab another drive if you have one and put a Win11 install on there instead, so your normal Win10 boot remains unaffected. I guess reading comprehension is an issue?

Thought you were intent on going and bugging Nvidia instead?

I reinstalled Sekiro, even put it on nvme drive, guess what - it did jack s**t, just as I expected

I never said anything about Sekiro, period. You were the one who brought it up as if trying to disprove a point I never made.