Throttle Stop cause CPU to never hit 4Ghz again on a Dell Optiplex 3080 Micro :(

[xDregon25x]

Hey together,

i have used Throttlestop for a long time now and what i found out is that my CPU (Intel I5 10600T) is never hitting 4Ghz, even with 1 Core.

It is stuck at 3,56Ghz max with all Cores and i feel the Lag when i do some heavy workloads.

The thing is that if i install Windows on another Partition it goes as high as 4Ghz again, i think that Throttlestop messed up some CPU configs as i hit 4Ghz before i installed it.
(Deleting the .ini File does not Solve the Problem)

Does anyone have some advices or do i need to reinstsall Windows to get this sorted out

Edit: Trying out different Power Saving Profiles does not fix this issue

 

[unclewebb]

Intel® Core™ i5-10600T Processor (12M Cache, up to 4.00 GHz) - Product Specifications | Intel

Intel® Core™ i5-10600T Processor (12M Cache, up to 4.00 GHz) quick reference with specifications, features, and technologies.

ark.intel.com

The 10600T is a 6 core - 12 thread CPU. ThrottleStop is only showing 6 threads. Did you disable hyper threading in the BIOS on purpose? Open the Task Manager and double check if half of your CPU is disabled.

If hyper threading is enabled in the BIOS, you should see 6 Cores and 12 Logical processors in the Task Manager. You can also check this in CPU-Z. If you are still having problems, run msconfig and make sure the Number of processors box is not checked. You need to reboot after you do this.

Your CPU can only use the 40 multiplier when 1 or 2 cores are active. When all 6 cores are active, this will be reduced to a maximum of 37. This has nothing to do with ThrottleStop. It is a limit of your locked T series CPU. The FIVR window shows what the default turbo ratios are based on how many cores are active.

The T series are low power CPUs. At default settings they will power limit throttle which means they will not reach their full rated speed when fully loaded. This is the type of CPU you bought. Is that not what you want?

If you are looking for maximum CPU speed, open the TPL window, clear the Disable Control box and set the PL1 power limit to 55W instead of 35W. Set Power Limit 4 to a value of 0. This limit is not needed. These changes might help you get some more CPU speed before power limit throttling begins. You will still be limited to the 37 multiplier when fully loaded or when 6 cores are active. Reinstalling Windows is not going to solve that limitation.

Exit HWiNFO and open the Limit Reasons window. If your computer is still throttling, this will show you the reason why. Post a screenshot of Limit Reasons if you need help.

i think that ThrottleStop messed up some CPU configs

ThrottleStop did not do anything. Your CPU is fine. With your CPU set to default settings, it is performing exactly as it should be.

Also check the C States window while your computer is idle. Some people like to disable the C states without realizing that the maximum turbo multipliers are not available when the C states are disabled. If you used ThrottleStop to disable the C states, you need to use ThrottleStop to re-enable them. Check the C States - AC box, select the On radio button and press the Apply button. Do this for every Windows power plan that you disabled the C states in.

 

[xDregon25x]

Oh Thank you for the Hyper Threading Info, i did not know that it was disabled... I know enabled it and it shows 12 Cores, thanks for that

Your CPU can only use the 40 multiplier when 1 or 2 cores are active. When all 6 cores are active, this will be reduced to a maximum of 37. This has nothing to do with ThrottleStop. It is a limit of your locked T series CPU. The FIVR window shows what the default turbo ratios are based on how many cores are active.

The T series are low power CPUs. At default settings they will power limit throttle which means they will not reach their full rated speed when fully loaded. This is the type of CPU you bought. Is that not what you want?

After messing with the BIOS my Clock Speed can go as high as up to 3,8Ghz shown in Task Manager when somethings happening, but not constantly. Its better and more fluent then before, but now the Temps start to rise...

I also saw that C States were Disabled in the BIOS, i now enabled it and well to be honest i dont feel any difference in Heat. Its way higher then before actually because it can now go higher then 3,56Ghz. Disabling C States limited the CPU to 3,56Ghz. If i disable it it wont go higher lol.

If you are looking for maximum CPU speed, open the TPL window, clear the Disable Control box and set the PL1 power limit to 55W instead of 35W. Set Power Limit 4 to a value of 0. This limit is not needed. These changes might help you get some more CPU speed before power limit throttling begins. You will still be limited to the 37 multiplier when fully loaded or when 6 cores are active. Reinstalling Windows is not going to solve that limitation.

I was going for the 4Ghz, but it wont happen again because of a BIOS Update.
Dell does not allow to go up that high anymore because of Fan Noise and Temps. When i first had the PC it went as high as 4Ghz, but Temps were all over the Place...

Now im Looking for a Solution to keep Temps low and Performance as high as possible without rising the temperatures...

What concernes me is that the C States Tab now has Values which Change, that wasnt the case before i had C States disabled:

What do those Percentages mean, the higher the more Idle the CPU is?

I also figured out that when i change the EPP Value near to 255 i have a way lower Idle Clock Speed as with the Default 128 one. Thats great but when i put it to max the PC is more laggy.


What do i need to change here to get the best Temps out of the CPU?

The Maxx Power the CPU takes is 30W. It does not go higher then that. Usualy it sits around 10-15W in Idle.


C States are looking like this. I really dont know what to configure here to get the CPU more into Idle.

Thank you again for the detailed Post tho!

 

[unclewebb]

but now the Temps start to rise...

With hyper threading disabled you were literally only using half of your CPU. More cores or more threads equals more heat.

The 10600T is not a K series CPU so you have to enable the C states so maximum turbo boost is available. Disabling the C states on these processors mean they will run slower when lightly loaded and they will also run hotter. For most people with these CPUs, it is not a good idea to disable the C states.

When a CPU is idle, the individual cores can spend 99% of the time in the low power C7 state. Your screenshot shows an average of 60% so that usually means you have a lot of stuff running in the background. Open up the Task Manager, go to the Details tab and find out what is running on your computer. Get rid of any stuff that you do not need. Do not auto start anything if you do not need to. A lot of poorly written software will load your CPU when it does not need to be running all of the time.

Thats great but when i put it to max the PC is more laggy.

ThrottleStop lets you run your computer however you like. Fast and efficient or slow and laggy if you want that. I prefer fast so I would never set EPP to 255. For most recent computers, you do not have to check the Speed Shift - EPP option on the main screen of ThrottleStop. If you are using the Windows Balanced power plan, it is likely that Windows will automatically set EPP to 84 which is a good compromise between speed when lightly loaded and maximum performance when fully loaded. When the Speed Shift - EPP box is not checked in ThrottleStop, you can open the FIVR window and see what EPP value Windows has set the CPU to. Change power plan settings and you should see the EPP value in the FIVR monitoring table change.

What do i need to change here to get the best Temps out of the CPU?

You do not need to change anything. You do not have a temperature problem so why change anything? Whether an Intel CPU runs at 60°C, 70°C, 80°C or 90°C makes no difference. It will still perform at full speed at any of those temperatures.

 

[dnm_TX]

@unclewebb i've read that basically from C8 up to C10(which is the Modern Standby) are only kicking in when the PC go to sleep or hibernate.
My question is,if one doesn't use neither(sleep or hibern.) what would be the best(in your opinion) to be set on,C7 or C7s ???

P.S. C7s is considered deeper sleep state then C7 in general but i couldn't find any info on it. Looks like Intel introduced it with 10th Gen CPU's.
I wonder,is it connected more to when is set to sleep or when is awake(like to save more power)?

 

[unclewebb]

C7 or C7s

If the Package C State setting in ThrottleStop is not locked, you should be able to do some testing to see if C7 or C7s is best for you. It is probably not going to make a huge difference one way or the other.

C7 and C7s are available during normal use. My desktop 10th Gen never goes beyond package C3 so I have not tested any package C states deeper than that. The most important thing you can do to improve C states residency time is to get rid of useless background tasks. One bad program running in the background can screw up a computer.

 

[dnm_TX]

If the Package C State setting in ThrottleStop is not locked

It's not locked but it's not checked either(it's checkable). Can you expand a bit more on what that Package C State(PKG undemotion for example) does exactly and why the manufacturer(in my case ASUS) didn't activated originaly in BIOS?
Pfff...i made it very confusing here. So on my end both C1 and C3 are checked but both PKG demotion/undemotion are unchecked. Hope this way is more clear as i'm not on my laptop and can't provide screenshot at this moment.

to improve C states residency time is to get rid of useless background tasks

Oh yeah,i got that covered. On idle C0 is at 0.1% which,i believe is plenty low.

 

[unclewebb]

C0 is at 0.1%

That is excellent. When I got my 10850K down to that level, I was curious so I added an extra digit to the ThrottleStop C state data to see if I could go any lower. With lots of cores and threads and not much running in the background, it is possible to go lower.

You will have to ask Asus why they did or did not enable certain demotion or undemotion options in the BIOS. For maximum C state residency time, I check the 3 undemotion options on the right side and I leave the 3 demotion options on the left side of the C states window unchecked. You will have to play around with these settings to see what works best for you. One user tried doing this and they said they felt that their computer was lagging. At my age, with 10 cores and 20 threads humming along at 5000 MHz, my brain is more likely to lag compared to my computer no matter how I set any of these C state options.

I think the PKG package options were not originally available when Core i was first introduced. It is possible that the bios writers overlooked this one when writing your bios. There is no requirement to enable or disable any of these. There might be some SSD benchmarks that prefer one setting over the other. On modern CPUs, the difference is often times very minimal whether any of these are checked or not.

 

[dnm_TX]

Thanks @unclewebb ,well explained

For maximum C state residency time

Excuse my ignorance but does that translates into lowest latency or highest power savings? I'm more aiming at low latency here.

On modern CPUs, the difference is often times very minimal whether any of these are checked or not

I'll play with those,will set the request to C7/C7s instead of C10,see if it'll make any difference.
If there is anything of significance,will continue the conversation then.
Thanks again for the prompt reply.

 

[unclewebb]

lowest latency or highest power savings

If you maximize the percentage of time in the core C7 state, that will maximize your power savings. When a CPU core goes into a deep C state, it will take longer to get back out of this state and into the C0 state to begin working on a task. The deeper the C state, the higher the latency to get out of it.

If you want the lowest possible latency, you can use ThrottleStop to disable all of the C states. This should show up as an improvement, sometimes a very significant improvement, in your SSD benchmark scores. CrystalDiskMark is my fav.

CrystalDiskMark

About CrystalDiskMark CrystalDiskMark is a simple disk benchmark software. Download Standard Edition Aoi Edition Shizuku Edition System Requirements OS Windows XP/Vista/7/8/8.1/10/11Windows Server 2003/2008/2012/2016/2019/2022 Architecture x86/x64/ARM64 Key Features Important Notice -> FAQ Unit M...

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Disabling the C states is not such a great idea when running on battery power.

 

[xDregon25x]

Thanks for the Awnsers! You surely know alot about Computers lol.

I know have now found a very good configuration where my pc still hits 3.8Ghz and goes as low as 799mhz on idle (It was around 1500-2000mhz before leading to high temps)

But i really dont know what i did there, it just worked..

170 EPP is a nice spot where my PC is still very perfoming and going to as low as 799 Mhz often in idle.

But the real differences are made with the C State options, i know set it like this but i really dont know what i did there

The thing is that my Package C State is Locked at C10, what does that mean and why cant i change that? Also what does the "Requested" C States mean, i can choose alot different States there.

Also the Demotion and Undemotion Settings are whats letting my CPU go as low as 799Mhz on Idle. It happens when i disable the C1 Demotion Option, i had everything enabled before.

What does every option mean and what should i set them to if i want the CPU to go as low as possible any time the PC is in idle?
And i cant enable the C States -AC option - dont know about that either.

Sorry for all of those questions but i needed to turn my Fan Spin rate down because it was hella noisy after a Dell Bios update and now Temps start to rise and wont go down quick because the CPU does not Idle around 799Mhz often. If it does my Temps get back to 50* really quick, else they stay in around 70*

 

[unclewebb]

The thing is that my Package C State is Locked at C10, what does that mean and why cant i change that?

The BIOS has locked the package C state register to C10. Do not set the Request value to C7. Set the Request value back to C10. These two values should match when this register is locked. There is no point in requesting a value different from what the CPU has been locked to.

If you are using the Windows Power Saver power plan, you probably do not need to check the Speed Shift - EPP box on the main screen of ThrottleStop. When using the Power Saver power plan or any Windows power plan, open the FIVR window and look in the monitoring table to see what Speed Shift EPP value Windows has set the CPU to. If Windows can control the EPP value, I would not check the Speed Shift EPP box in ThrottleStop.

What does every option mean

I do not know. It is best to randomly check and uncheck the Demotion and Undemotion boxes until your CPU runs however you like. That is what I do.

It looks like you still have too much stuff running in the background. That is the main cause of unnecessary heat when your computer is idle. When your computer is idle, the CPU gets hot because the CPU is really not that idle.