what HDD's work vertically ( too ) ?

[Legacy Ivy Terascale]

what up guys ? 3 years ago i learned that some HDD's dont work vertically , toshiba P300
here's what i had/saw at others and noticed
- Seagate DesktopPC ........................... tried vertical .................................................................................................................... works vertical
- Toshiba P300 ......................................... tried vertical and horizontal ................................................................................... works horizontal
- WD Purple .............................................. tried horizontal .............................................................................................................. works horizontal
- Western Digital Blue ........................ tried horizontal ( and saw vertical on RandonGaminginHD ) .............. works horizontal
- Segate Baracuda ................................ tried horizontal ............................................................................................................... works horizontal

what other HDD's dont work vertically ?

can specs indicate that ?

if yes , what to look for ?

 

[Solaris17]

I would say it was something wrong with that drive. HDDs don’t care and aren’t aware how they are mounted. NAS, vertical drive bays behind secondary panels, SAN vertical mounts, HDD storage pods, USB enclosures are all perfect examples of the inability to control how consumers mount them or the purposeful vertical mount characteristics employed by manufacturers on purpose.

I deal heavily with data and they really just don’t care. I’m not talking enterprise only either. Consumer disks are frequently subject to these kinds of mounting positions.

All physical aspects of how HDDs are assembled are basically the same; heads platters; physics. With the only changes generally being head distance, number of heads/platters. Physically anyway the construction of HDDs has changed very little.

If your test case is a few or 1 I would say the drive is the problem. If there is actual statistical proof not just hearsay then I would say it’s a manufacturer problem with that specific model they should be made aware of.

Actual IRL usage actually proves the opposite. That it doesn’t actually matter.

 

[Jetster]

I've never heard of a drive that would not work because of its orientation, ether in written instructions or personal experience. Even old drives that you have to park. Not saying there isn't one out there, I've never run across it before

 

[Legacy Ivy Terascale]

I would say it was something wrong with that drive. HDDs don’t care and aren’t aware how they are mounted. NAS, vertical drive bays behind secondary panels, SAN vertical mounts, HDD storage pods, USB enclosures are all perfect examples of the inability to control how consumers mount them or the purposeful vertical mount characteristics employed by manufacturers on purpose.

I deal heavily with data and they really just don’t care. I’m not talking enterprise only either. Consumer disks are frequently subject to these kinds of mounting positions.

All physical aspects of how HDDs are assembled are basically the same; heads platters; physics. With the only changes generally being head distance, number of heads/platters. Physically anyway the construction of HDDs has changed very little.

If your test case is a few or 1 I would say the drive is the problem. If there is actual statistical proof not just hearsay then I would say it’s a manufacturer problem with that specific model they should be made aware of.

Actual IRL usage actually proves the opposite. That it doesn’t actually matter.

i tried it on 2 computers
have you tested Toshiba P300 too ?

 

[LabRat 891]

The only reason I can think of that a drive would 'not work' in a particular orientation but otherwise remain functional, would be a 'flawed' implementation of sensor-based physical protection.
ie, the orientation 'sensing' is programmed to interpret that orientation as "I'm falling", "I'm about to fall", or "I'm in transport", keeping the heads locked.
-"Free-Fall" or "G-Shock" protection based on an IC gyro, etc.


so... maybe, related?

 

[natr0n]

some fans are like this. Never had a prob with hdd

 

[Jetster]

DVD drives can run vertically

 

[Fokker]

I've never had a drive that cared about orientation or one that recommend one over the other. Many NAS enclosures mount drives along their edge to reduce the footprint and I've never seen one make a recommendation or list a restriction to what drives work in that fashion. The only thing that might prevent them from operating would be a protection mechanism malfunctioning as mentioned.

 

[LabRat 891]

DVD drives can run vertically

Generally speaking, yes.
In my experience though, something can become aged/worn and cause malfunctions in that orientation.
(AFAIK bog standard Optical Drives for PCs do not have orientation and/or G sensors.)

I know that some styles of motors are disadvantaged in certain orientations but, as natr0n mention, I've only seen that particular limitation in fans.

 

[bonehead123]

Way back when the 1st WD 10k RPM Raptors came out, I remember seeing a lot of comments from users about how hot they ran due to the higher RPM's of the platters, and the proposed solution at the time was to either mount them with a cooling pack, or mount them upside down, which was supposed to allow the additional heat to disperse more quickly from the bottom of the drive casing...

Well I tried the upside down trick, and it did not seem to make any difference in the drive's operational functions, speeds or longevity... I even had a few mounted sideways too without any issues...

And my nephews are still using the last 3 of them that I bought in '06...nottaproblemo

 

[GerKNG]

my brother runs a toshiba P300 since half a decade and it's vertically mounted at the back of his case.

 

[FoulOnWhite]

They do feel funky if you move them while spinning though, which i have done, and still no problem.

 

[LabRat 891]

They do feel funky if you move them while spinning though, which i have done, and still no problem.

Gyroscopic effect! The 'oh sh!t' moment when you manage to make the heads crash is 'great', too.
(Let's just assume I've only done that to already 'bad' drives )

 

[windwhirl]

I'm in agreement with everyone here, I've never seen or heard of a drive that would not work or would work non-optimally when mounted horizontally or vertically. You can look into the hard drives' manuals yourself and see that there is no recommendation for either horizontal or vertical mount anywhere.

In fact, in Seagate's manuals you will see this:

 

[ExcuseMeWtf]

Any reasonably modern HDDs have fluid dynamic bearings, which don't care about orientation. Only make sure it does not change while drive is operating...

> 1997 – Seagate introduces the first hard drive with fluid bearings[43]

 

[Psychoholic]

Agreed with the statements here, they dont care how they are oriented.
I deal with large storage arrays on a daily basis, (300+ Drives) some systems have them mounted horizontally, some vertical.. same model drives in both.

 

[Legacy Ivy Terascale]

the one that only works horizontally is a 1TB
there's another one identical model , not sure if i tried it vertical too and what was the result than
what i CERTAINLY know is that i tried them with the 350w TFX PSU from a Dell 3800 Vostro Slim
that's the same PSU i used the SG DesktopPC HDD for 6 years , vertically off course

could the TFX PSU be the cause : work either way with Seagate DesktopPC , but limit the P300's usability ?

 

[windwhirl]

the one that only works horizontally is a 1TB
there's another one identical model , not sure if i tried it vertical too and what was the result than
what i CERTAINLY know is that i tried them with the 350w TFX PSU from a Dell 3800 Vostro Slim
that's the same PSU i used the SG DesktopPC HDD for 6 years , vertically off course

could the TFX PSU be the cause : work either way with Seagate DesktopPC , but limit the P300's usability ?

No, power supplies should have no effect in this regard, as they simply provide energy.

 

[chrcoluk]

All my drives work fine mounted that way, the P180 case I just retired mounts up to 4 drives that way, and many NAS units do also. I used to have a little paranoia about it, but after researching that the vendors fully support it, I am no longer bothered, just dont move drives whilst they in operation.

 

[JWNoctis]

Gyroscopic effect! The 'oh sh!t' moment when you manage to make the heads crash is 'great', too.
(Let's just assume I've only done that to already 'bad' drives )

Only slightly better was the "Oh %^&*" when you accidentally pressed down on the top of a "slimline" portable drive, and hear the drive's top shell scrape loudly against the spindle. That drive survived the experience, and was still alive when I last plugged it in, years later. So I guess the story does have a happy ending...just don't try replicating it on a good drive, of course.

I agree that orientation should not matter for all currently known and made HDDs, so far as whether they could run in that orientation, having never heard otherwise before this and seeing plenty of server racks and NAS setups with drives mounted vertically.

the one that only works horizontally is a 1TB
there's another one identical model , not sure if i tried it vertical too and what was the result than
what i CERTAINLY know is that i tried them with the 350w TFX PSU from a Dell 3800 Vostro Slim
that's the same PSU i used the SG DesktopPC HDD for 6 years , vertically off course

could the TFX PSU be the cause : work either way with Seagate DesktopPC , but limit the P300's usability ?

Back up everything worthwhile on that drive, just in case. Something might be breaking down.

 

[lexluthermiester]

3 years ago i learned that some HDD's dont work vertically

Wait, what? Hard drives should work in any orientation you mount them. 45 years ago your problem would be legit, but from the birth of 5.25" and 3.5" hard drives, that limitation disappeared as a result of the advances in design. So, if you're having issues with operation of that drive in a vertical position, the drive likely has a problem, especially for a Toshiba P300 as those are supposed to be very robust.

I would say it was something wrong with that drive. HDDs don’t care and aren’t aware how they are mounted.

This.

Not saying there isn't one out there, I've never run across it before

There were before the 5.25" drive designs.

 

[AsRock]

I would say it was something wrong with that drive. HDDs don’t care and aren’t aware how they are mounted. NAS, vertical drive bays behind secondary panels, SAN vertical mounts, HDD storage pods, USB enclosures are all perfect examples of the inability to control how consumers mount them or the purposeful vertical mount characteristics employed by manufacturers on purpose.

I deal heavily with data and they really just don’t care. I’m not talking enterprise only either. Consumer disks are frequently subject to these kinds of mounting positions.

All physical aspects of how HDDs are assembled are basically the same; heads platters; physics. With the only changes generally being head distance, number of heads/platters. Physically anyway the construction of HDDs has changed very little.

If your test case is a few or 1 I would say the drive is the problem. If there is actual statistical proof not just hearsay then I would say it’s a manufacturer problem with that specific model they should be made aware of.

Actual IRL usage actually proves the opposite. That it doesn’t actually matter.

I agree how ever over time wear and tear on the harder on the bearings over time imo.

 

[Fokker]

Speaking of drives operating in the vertical: I just dug out some 22 year old WD800 80GB drives (they're IDE) in Vantec external housings that read just fine.

 

[Wirko]

Both orientations are common but what about the third possible orientation, the one with connectors at the top or at the bottom? Is it considered safe for the HDD?

45 years ago your problem would be legit

Funny that you say 45 years. In 1980, Shugart started selling a "compact" all-in-one HDD, the first one that resembles today's HDDs. But a year earlier, a hard disk drive was the size of a washing machine, with exchangeable disks assemblies. Probably had to be exactly level to even work.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Both orientations are common but what about the third possible orientation, the one with connectors at the top or at the bottom? Is it considered safe for the HDD?


Funny that you say 45 years. In 1980, Shugart started selling a "compact" all-in-one HDD, the first one that resembles today's HDDs. But a year earlier, a hard disk drive was the size of a washing machine, with exchangeable disks assemblies. Probably had to be exactly level to even work.

I was there and remember it. You're not wrong. Although, to be fair, they were cabinet sized. 14", 12" and 10" platter sizes(as well as other sizes). They were BIG. They only had between 2.5MB and 20MB space capacities. And they needed to be mounted only horizontally. Anything else would result in read/write misalignment, head crashing and head actuation voice coil damage. There's a channel on Youtube that has chronicled the Centurion systems computers. I've seen ones like those and a few others.

Usagi Electric

Welcome to Usagi Electric! On this channel, we dive into old school technology, focusing heavily on vacuum tubes. My primary goal is to build computing circuits based off the legendary machines of yesteryear, only with a slight modern twist. All the tubes will be operating with very low...

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This playlist will boggle your mind. He's put massive amounts of work into getting that equipment back to a working state. He also shows the rigmarole computer users went through back then.