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What's your version of overkill??

phill

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Hi everyone :)

I'm trying to get some idea of what other peoples version of overkill is for a PC build. I enjoy PC building, tweaking overclocking and all the other bits that go with it but I'm just wondering if what I'm thinking is taking the build a little bit too far..?

Your opinions and thoughts are very welcome :) Thank you in advance for replying :)
 

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By far, Maximum PC magazine's Dream Machine (in the September edition of every year) tops my list. Look at 2017's build:

CPU: Intel Core i9-7900X 3.30GHz
Motherboard: Gigabyte X299 Aorus Gaming 9
RAM: 128GB (8x 16GB) Crucial Ballistix Elite
GPU: 2x Nvidia Titan Xp
OS Storage: 2x Samsung 960 Pro 512GB M.2 PCIe SSD RAID 0
Other storage: Samsung 960 Pro 2TB M.2 PCIe SSD, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 2TB, 2x HGST Ultrastar He10 10TB 7,200rpm
PSU: Corsair HX1200i and CableMod Cable Kit
Case: Phanteks Enthoo Elite Super Tower Case
Cooling: EKWB Cooling Suite, 8x Corsair ML120 Pro, 3x Corsair ML140 Pro
Monitor: Asus PG27UQ 27-inch 4K 144Hz HDR
Mouse: Mionix Castor
Keyboard: Logitech G413 Carbon
Headphones: Beyerdynamic DT 1770 Pro
Microphone: Razer Seiren Pro
Accessories: Rode PSA1 Boom Arm, Noblechairs EPIC Series (White), Nvidia HB SLI Bridge
OS: Windows 10 Home

Total cost: $18,220 U.S.

It'll be interesting to see what they do next month.
 
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For me, probably any CPU with more than 8 cores and more than 16 GB of RAM would be overkill. :D
 
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I fit one of those jic??

Overkill depends on expectations and utility , but yeah that 18k pc above is overkill for most of us but , some dont care what they need , that itch gets BAAD
 
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I'm trying to get some idea of what other peoples version of overkill is for a PC build. I enjoy PC building, tweaking overclocking and all the other bits that go with it but I'm just wondering if what I'm thinking is taking the build a little bit too far..?
:( Since you didn't tell us what the computer will be used for, there is no way to answer this.

A computer that will be used simply to process emails, create Word documents, or update Facebook, a basic i3 with integrated graphics and 4GB of RAM is probably plenty. A dedicated gamer will want a heavy duty i5/i7 or AMD equivalent and at least 16GB of RAM and dedicated and powerful graphics card designed for gaming. An architect or Pixar animator will want an extreme horsepower CPU, gobs of RAM and workstation graphics card.
 
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As one person at another site said... there's no such thing as an overpowered system, it's only underutilized.
 

dgianstefani

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:( Since you didn't tell us what the computer will be used for, there is no way to answer this.

Sure it is. If you don't need it, it's overkill.
 
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SLI is overkill for me.. let alone 3 or 4 GPUs that my board is apparently capable of (I'll never know). That and filling all of my RAM slots (128GB) just to look pretty :D
 
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Overkill?

I think Threadripper under LN2 to play games is overkill. Yep. That qualifies :)
 
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Everytime I see someone bought InWin showcase ( Z-frame class) for a start of his build....I know this PC will be overkill in my eyes. :D
 
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... Air cooled, at stock, as a home theatre PC...
 
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It's only overkill if you don't take advantage of it.
 
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Overkill and future proof are probably the most overused terms used in relationship to PCs. As every user's goals are different, the word can not be universally applied.

1. If the goal is to build the best machine for the intended usage for the lowest cost is the goal, then anything can be "overkill". Grandma who browses the web, gets emails w/ pics of her grandkids and stores recipes, pays her bills via Quicken will not benefit in any way from a i7 a GFX card, 3rd party CPU cooler and pretty much any component in the box.

2. Just about anyone in the corporate world also doesn't need anything more than a basic box. Video production, CAD, rendering, gaming, other specialized apps obviously don't fit into this category.

3. 99% of those with an SSD will never see an iota of increased productivity as a result of adding an SSD. Every argument to the contrary uses tasks that folks just don't perform on a daily basis .... the fact that yiu can open 100 tabs in chrome copy paste 2 TB of files, zip giant files measurably faster is not an issue if yu almost never do any of those things ... and booting 0.9 seconds faster isn't going to change your life in any way. I PC ius only as fast as it's weakest link and most often that is the person using the keyboard.

4. Installing a workstation CPU in a gaming box simply because "most expensive must be better", is not overkill, it's self defeating as a cheaper CPU will perform better.

5. Using a CPU with a high core count when nothing you do is even warming up the 4th core.

6. An architect or engineer buying a Quaddro card "cause they read on the inernet" that it is for CAD. Actually AutoCAD and other programs commonly used by A/Es in no way benefit from workstation CPUs or Workstation GFX cards. AutoCAD is not multi-threaded nor are these other programs. Using workstation CPUs and GFX cards here reduces performance. Now when you make the transition from 2D / 3D drafting to rendering and animation, that is the place for workstation CPUs and GFX.

On the other hand ....

1. One of the most common uses of overkill is in relation to PSUs.

https://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/msi_geforce_gtx_1070_ti_gaming_review,8.html

Power consumption is a fair amount higher compared to the reference card. Here is Guru3D's power supply recommendation:
  • GeForce GTX 1070 Ti - On your average system we recommend a 500 Watt power supply unit.
  • GeForce GTX 1070 Ti SLI - On your average system we recommend a 750 Watt power supply unit.
If you are going to overclock your GPU or processor, then we do recommend you purchase something with some more stamina. Also, at half the PSU load (50% usage) your PSU is the most energy efficient.

So, while an oversized PSU might be overkill from a "wattage standpoint", that doesn't men it is over kill. A larger PSU will have a larger cooling system. So one that operates at 50% of itc rated capacity.

a) Will produce less heat than a smaller one
b) Will use less electrticty than a smaller one
c) Will run quieter than a smaller one.
d) Will help on borderline stability issues on CPUs / GPUs as electrical noise and voltage instability increase the closer you get to rated loads.

2. CF / SLI I don't think falls into the overkill classification. It is either appropriate of inappropriate.

-Two 560 Tis were faster and cheaper than the 580, great scaling ... no brainer. More performance and less costs is never a bad decision The few games that didn't support SLI / CF were never AAA class games and most often obscure.
-Two 650 Ti's were way cheaper and a bit faster than the 680. Above applies
-Two 770s were faster and cheaper than the 780. Above applies
-Two 970s were 40% faster and cheaper than the 980. Arguments were made that less games were supporting SLI but all the big games were... so the question was .... what's better ? ... being 40 % faster in 85% of games while being 12% slower in a minority but in which case your fps was already up at 80 ? Or getting the 980 and seeing 35 fps in Tomb Raider when ya friend who spent less with twin 970s getting 58 fps ? Or 41 fps in FC3 w/ the 980 and 69 with 970 SLI...still a literal no brainer.

Nvidia changed things up with the 10xx series ... all of a sudden average scaling went from 70% to just 18% at 1080p and 34% at 1440p. What happened. I think nvidia saw that the biggest profit margins on their top tier card(s) were being lost to competition ... from themselves. AMD had no horses in the race from the 1060 on up so, it would seem, they nerfed SLI so that the SLI 1070 option was no longer attractive "by the numbers". The fact that scaling isn't bad at all at 2160p was kept so as to allow 60+ fps at 4k

So overkill ? Not in the past ... today, only make sense at 4k ... using it below 4k isn't overkill, it's just unwise, it's no longer cheaper to buy twin 1070s

3. Wasn't long ago folks were saying 16GB or faster RAM was overkill .... and a false equivalency was used to make this case. The most common argument was faster RAM had no effect on avg frame rates, and references were cited that "here's 4 games that don't show an improvement" to make the case. But this didn't take into account all instances. When impact on min frame rates was examined, we did see an effect, performance is limited by what component is "the bottleneck" and in many instances, this would be the GFX card, but when SLI was in the picture, often RAM became the bottleneck. In other instances, games like the STALKER series and for example, F1 which has 11% higher frame rates w/ 2400 as opposed to 1600.

4. I have seen it stated that CLCs are overkill ... I don't agree as I have yet to see a 240/280 CLCs topping the performance of available < $50 air coolers.

5. Delidding - While a worthwhile endeavor for Ivy Bridge, I haven't had a OC limited by temperature since Haswell arrived. Sure it get you cooler temps but since Haswell all of our OCs have been voltage limited rather than temp limited. So yes, it does earn you bragging rights to "my temps dropped 12 C", if the original temps were of no concern then that extra 12C isn't bringing anything to the table.
 

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Overkill enough for using a PC?
 
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Overkill enough for using a PC?

I'm going with yes, since I can only picture your avatar wearing this...
 
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Overkill to me is someone with an 8700/8600k, but not overclocking it, that really grinds my gears.
 

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My version? Anything past Haswell with over 8GB's of memory.
 
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Australia
By far, Maximum PC magazine's Dream Machine (in the September edition of every year) tops my list. Look at 2017's build:

CPU: Intel Core i9-7900X 3.30GHz
Motherboard: Gigabyte X299 Aorus Gaming 9
RAM: 128GB (8x 16GB) Crucial Ballistix Elite
GPU: 2x Nvidia Titan Xp
OS Storage: 2x Samsung 960 Pro 512GB M.2 PCIe SSD RAID 0
Other storage: Samsung 960 Pro 2TB M.2 PCIe SSD, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 2TB, 2x HGST Ultrastar He10 10TB 7,200rpm
PSU: Corsair HX1200i and CableMod Cable Kit
Case: Phanteks Enthoo Elite Super Tower Case
Cooling: EKWB Cooling Suite, 8x Corsair ML120 Pro, 3x Corsair ML140 Pro
Monitor: Asus PG27UQ 27-inch 4K 144Hz HDR
Mouse: Mionix Castor
Keyboard: Logitech G413 Carbon
Headphones: Beyerdynamic DT 1770 Pro
Microphone: Razer Seiren Pro
Accessories: Rode PSA1 Boom Arm, Noblechairs EPIC Series (White), Nvidia HB SLI Bridge
OS: Windows 10 Home

Total cost: $18,220 U.S.

It'll be interesting to see what they do next month.

All that & only... win10 home? C'mon, go the pro version! :laugh:

Overkill and future proof are probably the most overused terms used in relationship to PCs. As every user's goals are different, the word can not be universally applied.

1. If the goal is to build the best machine for the intended usage for the lowest cost is the goal, then anything can be "overkill". Grandma who browses the web, gets emails w/ pics of her grandkids and stores recipes, pays her bills via Quicken will not benefit in any way from a i7 a GFX card, 3rd party CPU cooler and pretty much any component in the box.

2. Just about anyone in the corporate world also doesn't need anything more than a basic box. Video production, CAD, rendering, gaming, other specialized apps obviously don't fit into this category.

3. 99% of those with an SSD will never see an iota of increased productivity as a result of adding an SSD. Every argument to the contrary uses tasks that folks just don't perform on a daily basis .... the fact that yiu can open 100 tabs in chrome copy paste 2 TB of files, zip giant files measurably faster is not an issue if yu almost never do any of those things ... and booting 0.9 seconds faster isn't going to change your life in any way. I PC ius only as fast as it's weakest link and most often that is the person using the keyboard.

4. Installing a workstation CPU in a gaming box simply because "most expensive must be better", is not overkill, it's self defeating as a cheaper CPU will perform better.

5. Using a CPU with a high core count when nothing you do is even warming up the 4th core.

6. An architect or engineer buying a Quaddro card "cause they read on the inernet" that it is for CAD. Actually AutoCAD and other programs commonly used by A/Es in no way benefit from workstation CPUs or Workstation GFX cards. AutoCAD is not multi-threaded nor are these other programs. Using workstation CPUs and GFX cards here reduces performance. Now when you make the transition from 2D / 3D drafting to rendering and animation, that is the place for workstation CPUs and GFX.

On the other hand ....

1. One of the most common uses of overkill is in relation to PSUs.

https://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/msi_geforce_gtx_1070_ti_gaming_review,8.html



So, while an oversized PSU might be overkill from a "wattage standpoint", that doesn't men it is over kill. A larger PSU will have a larger cooling system. So one that operates at 50% of itc rated capacity.

a) Will produce less heat than a smaller one
b) Will use less electrticty than a smaller one
c) Will run quieter than a smaller one.
d) Will help on borderline stability issues on CPUs / GPUs as electrical noise and voltage instability increase the closer you get to rated loads.

2. CF / SLI I don't think falls into the overkill classification. It is either appropriate of inappropriate.

-Two 560 Tis were faster and cheaper than the 580, great scaling ... no brainer. More performance and less costs is never a bad decision The few games that didn't support SLI / CF were never AAA class games and most often obscure.
-Two 650 Ti's were way cheaper and a bit faster than the 680. Above applies
-Two 770s were faster and cheaper than the 780. Above applies
-Two 970s were 40% faster and cheaper than the 980. Arguments were made that less games were supporting SLI but all the big games were... so the question was .... what's better ? ... being 40 % faster in 85% of games while being 12% slower in a minority but in which case your fps was already up at 80 ? Or getting the 980 and seeing 35 fps in Tomb Raider when ya friend who spent less with twin 970s getting 58 fps ? Or 41 fps in FC3 w/ the 980 and 69 with 970 SLI...still a literal no brainer.

Nvidia changed things up with the 10xx series ... all of a sudden average scaling went from 70% to just 18% at 1080p and 34% at 1440p. What happened. I think nvidia saw that the biggest profit margins on their top tier card(s) were being lost to competition ... from themselves. AMD had no horses in the race from the 1060 on up so, it would seem, they nerfed SLI so that the SLI 1070 option was no longer attractive "by the numbers". The fact that scaling isn't bad at all at 2160p was kept so as to allow 60+ fps at 4k

So overkill ? Not in the past ... today, only make sense at 4k ... using it below 4k isn't overkill, it's just unwise, it's no longer cheaper to buy twin 1070s

3. Wasn't long ago folks were saying 16GB or faster RAM was overkill .... and a false equivalency was used to make this case. The most common argument was faster RAM had no effect on avg frame rates, and references were cited that "here's 4 games that don't show an improvement" to make the case. But this didn't take into account all instances. When impact on min frame rates was examined, we did see an effect, performance is limited by what component is "the bottleneck" and in many instances, this would be the GFX card, but when SLI was in the picture, often RAM became the bottleneck. In other instances, games like the STALKER series and for example, F1 which has 11% higher frame rates w/ 2400 as opposed to 1600.

4. I have seen it stated that CLCs are overkill ... I don't agree as I have yet to see a 240/280 CLCs topping the performance of available < $50 air coolers.

5. Delidding - While a worthwhile endeavor for Ivy Bridge, I haven't had a OC limited by temperature since Haswell arrived. Sure it get you cooler temps but since Haswell all of our OCs have been voltage limited rather than temp limited. So yes, it does earn you bragging rights to "my temps dropped 12 C", if the original temps were of no concern then that extra 12C isn't bringing anything to the table.

Thanks for quoting that Guru3D info with PSUs. This is why I choose 600W PSU for my current gaming rig, on average my system only uses 300W during gaming sessions... all this from the so called power hungry OC FX-8350 too... but it's the overall system that counts. :)
 
Joined
Sep 7, 2017
Messages
3,244 (1.20/day)
System Name Grunt
Processor Ryzen 5800x
Motherboard Gigabyte x570 Gaming X
Cooling Noctua NH-U12A
Memory Corsair LPX 3600 4x8GB
Video Card(s) Gigabyte 6800 XT (reference)
Storage Samsung 980 Pro 2TB
Display(s) Samsung CFG70, Samsung NU8000 TV
Case Corsair C70
Power Supply Corsair HX750
Software Win 10 Pro
All that & only... win10 home? C'mon, go the pro version! :laugh:



Thanks for quoting that Guru3D info with PSUs. This is why I choose 600W PSU for my current gaming rig, on average my system only uses 300W during gaming sessions... all this from the so called power hungry OC FX-8350 too... but it's the overall system that counts. :)

Speaking of, I bought Pro. Definitely overkill on my part. Can't think of one addition I actually need... and have no clue how to set up TPM for BitLocker anyhow (and too embarrassed to make a thread about it :p).
 

phill

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Staff member
Joined
Jun 8, 2011
Messages
17,082 (3.43/day)
Location
Somerset, UK
System Name Not so complete or overkill - There are others!! Just no room to put! :D
Processor Ryzen Threadripper 3970X
Motherboard Asus Zenith 2 Extreme Alpha
Cooling Lots!! Dual GTX 560 rads with D5 pumps for each rad. One rad for each component
Memory Viper Steel 4 x 16GB DDR4 3600MHz not sure on the timings... Probably still at 2667!! :(
Video Card(s) Asus Strix 3090 with front and rear active full cover water blocks
Storage I'm bound to forget something here - 250GB OS, 2 x 1TB NVME, 2 x 1TB SSD, 4TB SSD, 2 x 8TB HD etc...
Display(s) 3 x Dell 27" S2721DGFA @ 7680 x 1440P @ 144Hz or 165Hz - working on it!!
Case The big Thermaltake that looks like a Case Mods
Audio Device(s) Onboard
Power Supply EVGA 1600W T2
Mouse Corsair thingy
Keyboard Razer something or other....
VR HMD No headset yet
Software Windows 11 OS... Not a fan!!
Benchmark Scores I've actually never benched it!! Too busy with WCG and FAH and not gaming! :( :( Not OC'd it!! :(
Right, time to reply properly now..

Firstly, thank you all who have replied.. Some rather good opinions and options as well..

Now the reason I asked was because I bought a very nice 5960X over 2 years ago. With life happening (court battles, house repairs and such like) I've never had the chance to finish off the build I started out to put together.. So I had the cherry picked 5960X, the cherry picked G Skill DDR4 ram and so on, I hoped to make a build, a little mad and mental but also something that I know would last a really long time. I did have this setup a few years ago..

IMGP0005.JPG


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IMG_9611.JPG


IMG_9598.JPG


My 920 D0, TRI SLI GTX 580 3Gb setup.. I think I ended up using 2 GTX 580's as they seemed to be enough running Dirt 2 @ 8064 x 1600....

I'm still not really in a better position today to do that, simply because having changed jobs and so on, I'm earning a lotless than before and things have got very financially challenging to say the least.. But being an enthusiast I would like to see it through and at least enjoy it a little bit until I buy another lol

So, being that I would like to eventually have the following -

Triple 120Hz 4k panels
Multiple GPUs
Custom water cooling for GPU and CPU in separate loops..
Make use of the case and hardware I currently have (for now)

There's probably more but I'm unable to remember them lol What would anyone suggest?? I'll grab a picture for the case ... Have a look below -

20160820_191533.jpg


Hopefully this helps with what I like to call, a little bit of overkill :)
 
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