Why do my lamps flick/blink intermittently as I play certain games?

[vziera]

First off here is the picture of my device formation:

Details:
1. APC P5BT-GR Surge Arrest plugged into a wall socket.
2. Matsunaga SVC1000F(Japan) Voltage Regulator connected to that Surge Arrest.
3. ICA ST1023B Shinewave Line Interactive UPS connected to the Voltage Regulator.
4. Iskra Zascite ZES-7 Surge Protector connected to the UPS.
5. My gaming rig(specs below) and two external hdds connected to the Surge Protector.

The Gaming Rig Specs (non OC):
CPU: i7 4790K
PSU: Seasonic 760 Watt 80 Plus Platinum
Cooling: Corsair H100
RAM: 4x4gb Samsung green 30nm 1600mhz DDR3 RAM
Mainboard: Asus Z97 PRO
HDDS: Intel 520 180Gb(System drive), 2x500gb WDC Black(Storage)
GPU: GTX 680 2gb Inno3d Ichill Herculez
Monitor: Dell U2412H

The games that trigger the electrical flickering/blinking:
- Age Wonders III (Most intense)
- Shadow Of Mordor
- Mortal Kombat X
- Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

PS: all game's graphics options are set to ULTRA/Max to the right.

So when I played certain games, especially Age Wonders III, my electricity would flick/blink intermittently. It gets even more noticeable as I click something in game, clicking a unit would always trigger the flickering. It's funny because when I click a unit once, the electricity would flick once as well. This gets me so worried, I'm so concerned about whether this thing could negatively affect my hardwares's lifespan and yet I don't know what else to do. I already spent way to much money on electric safety appliances. I had to purchase a ups as the area where I live is prone to power outages. Somebody please help me identify this problem and what to do about it. Thank you!

 

[Mindweaver]

One big no no I see is connecting Surge Protectors to UPS's. You should be using PDU's (Power Distribution Unit) strips coming out from the UPS to increase your outlets. I'm very surprised the surge protectors are not switching off. You should never link surge protectors either.

 

[thebluebumblebee]

What all do you have plugged into that UPS? (anything other than system and monitor?) You might be approaching it's load limit.

 

[timta2]

You could try disconnecting all of that and plug your computer straight into the wall and see what happens. If your electricity still has issues then, you will probably want to hire an electrician, but I suspect the previous posters are correct.

 

[Batou1986]

Plug the UPS into the wall and then the computer and monitor only to it
voltage regulator is unnecessary with a UPS

The lights in the house flickering is a sign of poor wiring no amount of surge protectors UPS or line filters will make your lights flicker unless they are faulty in which case they should trip something.

 

[xvi]

Woah. Little strong on the tone for some of the replies. OP is asking advice, not trying to tell you how to run your life.

If you don't mind spending a few bucks to diagnose potential issues, I'd suggest a small Kill-a-watt device (or something similar) to monitor voltage at various points while replicating the issue. I suspect if you check at the wall, you'll see your voltage drop while gaming.
I'd hazard to guess that loading up a game starts pulling enough power via the PC to drop voltage at the wall. If voltage drops, it could affect the lighting.

I'm not an electrician though.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

I'd be checking three places:
1) power coming in to the premises. If its a house, it would be at the meter. Make sure it is stable and shouldn't change much with turning stuff on and off.
2) power at the outlet you're using. If it doesn't change at the premises but changes at the outlet, that outlet has shoddy wiring, is overloaded, or breaker problems.
3) power between the UPS and the tower. If #1 and #2 look okay, it is probably the UPS or the PSU. UPS either being overloaded or just not very good; PSU doesn't have the capacitance to handle the load your system is putting on it.

I guess one could bypass #1 and #2 by simply plugging the UPS into a different circuit. You can use the circuit breakers and lamps to figure out which outlets are on which circuits.

 

[Caring1]

Not sure if the wiring standards are the same there but power outlets and ceiling lights are on different circuits.
Standard lamps and desk lamps plugged in to wall outlets may show a drop in current when a lot of devices are switched on and the draw is high.

 

[m4gicfour]

@vziera:
While measuring voltage at the wall (e.g. with a Kill-a-watt) and watching for voltage drops or fluctuations
Step 1: Try plugging PC directly from wall and try your games. Is it fine? Does the voltage reading stay nice and stable, do lights flicker, etc?
Step 2: Try PC plugged into power conditioner, power conditioner directly into wall. Fine?
Step 3: Try PC plugged into UPS, UPS directly into wall. Fine?

If 1, 2, 3 all work fine, then you'd have to check with the manufacturers of your power conditioner and UPS to see whether they're safe to use together. I would guess that it would be okay, as long as they're setup [Wall <- Conditioner <- UPS <- PC] but only if the UPS has no power conditioning circuitry of its own and is just a backup - still, check with the manufacturers if possible. If one of steps 1, 2, or 3 doesn't work... well there's your problem.

If you find out that it's okay to chain them, then you can do so but ditch the surge strips. They'll damage whatever they're plugged into if they ever do encounter a transient (protects the things plugged into them by shunting dangerous transients back out through the wall - and anything else plugged in between). Surge strips are also generally only good once, or maybe a few times. The MOVs that they use are a sacrificial component; they wear out with use, so if you have bad power from your electrical supplier, you're going to be replacing them constantly or else they'll be useless. You *might* be okay to keep the one between the wall and conditioner but... I don't know enough to make that judgement, so I would avoid using it there with a conditioner or UPS plugged into it. DEFINITELY don't plug a surge strip into the output of the UPS or conditioner.

I'd be checking three places:
1) power coming in to the premises. If its a house, it would be at the meter. Make sure it is stable and shouldn't change much with turning stuff on and off.
2) power at the outlet you're using. If it doesn't change at the premises but changes at the outlet, that outlet has shoddy wiring, is overloaded, or breaker problems.
3) power between the UPS and the tower. If #1 and #2 look okay, it is probably the UPS or the PSU. UPS either being overloaded or just not very good; PSU doesn't have the capacitance to handle the load your system is putting on it.

I guess one could bypass #1 and #2 by simply plugging the UPS into a different circuit. You can use the circuit breakers and lamps to figure out which outlets are on which circuits.

Capacity, not capacitance.

Capacitance is a unit of stored energy (as in capacitors) measured in farads.

UPS being overloaded shouldn't make the lights flicker I wouldn't think (unless they're plugged into the UPS - and yes I see *one* -, in which case it's possibly momentarily cutting the supply (on the order of single digits microseconds within the PC PSU's hold-up time) causing flicker in the lamp). The other thing might be if the flickering lights are on the wall-side (before the power conditoner) that power conditioner may be drawing substantial momentary current in an attempt to keep the output voltage within acceptable limits while the input voltage dips (bad wiring or plain bad supply from utility).

I would otherwise agree with Ford, but I am not an EE. Also agree with others that chained surge strips is a bad idea. In fact, chaining any type of power conditioning circuitry not explicitly designed to be used as such is usually a bad idea.

Not sure if the wiring standards are the same there but power outlets and ceiling lights are on different circuits.
Standard lamps and desk lamps plugged in to wall outlets may show a drop in current when a lot of devices are switched on and the draw is high.

They're not required to be if I remember my electrical code, they just usually are as a matter of practicality (you don't want your lights to go out when you trip a breaker by plugging in a vacuum and microwave at the same time. Suddenly being in the dark can be dangerous)

The lighting circuits usually serve a few rooms and sometimes the outlet circuits do as well, depending on who did the wiring, when, and to what code standard (if at all... not everybody hires a licenced electrician to work on their wiring)

Correct, however if the wiring is good and if the supply power is good, any drop in current (as a result of a drop in voltage) should be minimal. A lot of ifs and shoulds in that sentence...

 

[vziera]

I thought surge strips were just the better version of regular power outlets, I'll see if replacing them with normal power outlets will eliminate the problem. And yes, I think the only things that flickered were the devices and lights connected to the setup, not including the ceiling lights. Also I'm wondering if what m4gicfour meant by power conditioner was my SVC1000F voltage regulator. Anyways, thank you guys for the wonderful responses. I'll be right back with an update.

 

[m4gicfour]

Surge strips are just a power splitter with one key difference: They're wired up in such a way that when exposed to high voltage beyond the normal operating range, they effectively short circuit themselves to ground. This is fine when plugged directly into a wall; the power is carried out over the ground wire and the breaker at the panel will likely trip if it happens for more than a split second. That stops your stuff (or you) from being exposed to that high voltage. The problem comes when you plug it into the output of a UPS or similar device; in this case, the surge protector is going to short circuit the UPS, at best overloading it momentarily, at worst destroying it and starting a fire while possibly also shocking you if the UPS has a grounded metal case that you're unlucky enough to be touching at that moment.

They're probably not causing your problem, but they're a problem waiting to happen in this case.

In case you're interested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surge_protector
The MOV type are most common.

...and yeah, I meant the voltage regulator. I'm too used to discussing them in the context of audio equipment where they generally have a bunch of other features bundled in as well (Voltage Regulation, Ripple suppression, EMI filter, etc). Force of habit.

 

[vziera]

By power outlets I meant power splitters and yeah here comes the update. So I already checked if the problem would persist when I just connected my pc straight into the wall with only a surge protector strip since the ac cable of my PC is not long enough and I would need a bulb in the setup as the easy flickering indicator and guess what? no luck, the problem was still there. So from that test I guess I can just draw out a conclusion that the electricity circuit responsible for my room is to blame not my electrical devices right? I wanted to try out connecting my setup to another circuit but I do not have the media to do that so I'll just bite the bullet and accept this painful situation at the moment. Now I have my setup reconfigured to following:
Surge Supressor Strip to the wall - Voltage Regulator - UPS - Vanilla Power Splitter - PC and peripherals. While I know it still doesn't eliminate the flickering problem I just want to know if my current setup is now sound enough or not and if there's anything more I can possibly do to eliminate this flickering issue in the future /:

Oh and yes the case of my UPS is made of metal and is painted white.


info on this UPS
http://www.icaups.co.id/dproduct.php?id=1402
called the company's tech support about the compatibility with the voltage regulator and they encouraged me to couple them together, with the voltage regulator being placed before the UPS.

BTW, I have tried two good enough power supplies in the setup, Thermaltake TPG-750M and Seasonic P760 both made no differences. Could this also be a game bug?

 

[Bill_Bright]

Since you have connected you PC straight into the wall with only a surge protector and the problem was still there, I recommend you borrow a heavy-duty regular extension cord (not a surge protector) and see what happens. If still a problem, then you may need to move your computer to a different circuit, if possible.

And I recommend you test your wall outlet with a AC Outlet Tester to ensure your outlet is properly wired and grounded. I recommend one with a GFCI (ground fault circuit interrupt) indicator as it can be used to test bathroom and kitchen outlets too. These testers can be found for your type and voltage outlet, foreign or domestic, at most home improvement stores, or even the electrical department at Walmart. And if a fault is shown, have it fixed by a qualified electrician.

 

[vziera]

Hey Bill_Bright, is the following pic what you referred to?

I don't know if the other one below can be of substitute to that but I've tried using it as the said surge protector's replacement and no luck still.

Does it look heavy-duty enough though?

And as for the AC Outlet Tester with GFCI, I'll be on the lookout for that tomorrow and for now, is it safe to use my PC in such a situation at the moment?

Oh and by the way how do I tell if my surge protector is still good though?

Thanks!

 

[Bill_Bright]

Thanks Mods!

Hey Bill_Bright, is the following pic what you referred to?

Yes. That appears to be heavy duty enough and it does not have any surge and spike protection devices.

is it safe to use my PC in such a situation at the moment?

Since you have been using it with no problems, and you didn't report getting zapped when touching your case, I will assume it is safe, for now. But I would still test your outlets as soon as you can.

Is it only your computer that causes the lights to dim? What if other big appliances (microwave oven, refrigerator, etc.) cycle on?

Oh and by the way how do I tell if my surge protector is still good though?

There is no way, unfortunately. You can plug one of those outlet checkers in it and it will tell if the ground is good and it is wired correctly. But it cannot tell if will still suppress surges and spikes.

And BTW, the suppression devices (MOVs) inside surge and spike protectors wear out over time. And even one big hit can wear them out. Some relate them to motorcycle helmets. After you slam into a curb once and the helmet saves your noggin, even if not visible cracks, you should consider the helmet did its job and needs to be replaced.

 

[m4gicfour]

Well in the time it took me to login, bill replied again so I don't have to address those questions anymore.

The only thing I would add is that if the outlet checker shows the outlet is wired correctly, you should then still check for voltage fluctuations when your lights flicker...

You can do that with a kill-a-watt or equivalent device, provided that its response time is fast enough (can't really say how fast is fast enough though) or with a multimeter if you know what you're doing and are careful.

We already pretty much know you're having voltage issues on the circuit the PC is plugged into, but for sake of completeness:

Plug your killawatt or multimeter into the same circuit as the PC and watch as you do the things that make lights flicker. You'll likely see voltage drop significantly for a short time (and if the voltage regulator is connected, amperage increase of a proportional amount as it compensates)

Next, plug your killawatt or multimeter into a different circuit (not just a different plug, you need to be sure its on a different breaker) and do the same thing. If you see the power stay stable on the seperate circuit while your lights flicker on the computer circuit, then the branch circuit wiring the PC is plugged into is probably undersized and overloaded, or there's a high resistance/impedance connection in it somewhere. There you can call an electrician to come upgrade your circuit, but it won't be cheap. You could also just use a different circuit to power the PC, if available.

If the voltage dips on both circuits by a similar amount, then the issue is with the fusebox/breaker box, mains breaker, wiring supplying your home/apartment, or the power transmission lines themselves, and is something the power company would have to deal with (unless its just a loose or otherwise bad connection to mains in the breaker box, in which case, an electrician could fix that.)

 

[thebluebumblebee]

is it safe to use my PC in such a situation at the moment?

No. Not only that, but I don't think your abode is safe. Why? If you are drawing enough current to cause the voltage to drop (evidenced by the flickering lights), a circuit breaker should trip. If a circuit breaker is not tripping, you are not being protected which could lead to a fire. I recommend an electrician ASAP.

 

[brandonwh64]

are you playing FEAR? This would explain your issue

 

[m4gicfour]

are you playing FEAR? This would explain your issue

BOOOOurns

 

[erocker]

Get an electrician, building owner or whatever to look at the outlet you are connected to and the main box (with all of your fuses). Obviously you are overloading the line.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Get an electrician, building owner or whatever to look at the outlet you are connected to and the main box (with all of your fuses). Obviously you are overloading the line.

That's why I suggested moving to a different circuit. The outlet currently plugged into may be on the same circuit as several other items, like an AC, or refrigerator. Though certainly, if the outlet checker shows a problem, then an electrician definitely needs to take care of it.

 

[Cvrk]

- Age Wonders III (Most intense)

Most surprisingly. played almost at high 1080p that one, while MK X kills my pc.

are you playing FEAR? This would explain your issue

I call this trolling . But i also call this good times That was so funny!

 

[MxPhenom 216]

That's why I suggested moving to a different circuit. The outlet currently plugged into may be on the same circuit as several other items, like an AC, or refrigerator. Though certainly, if the outlet checker shows a problem, then an electrician definitely needs to take care of it.

that's a work around, not a fuel proof solution. The guy should have had an electrician to look over everything a long time ago

 

[Bill_Bright]

The guy should have had an electrician to look over everything a long time ago

Maybe, maybe not. It is common, for example, for several bedrooms in the same home to be on the same circuit. We can only see one outlet. If the other outlets are being used to run high wattage appliances, you don't need an electrician to come in and tell you to move stuff around.

 

[MxPhenom 216]

Maybe, maybe not. It is common, for example, for several bedrooms in the same home to be on the same circuit. We can only see one outlet. If the other outlets are being used to run high wattage appliances, you don't need an electrician to come in and tell you to move stuff around.

no shit, but it seems like he's got more of an issue then just moving stuff around.