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Why does my i5 8265u only boost to 2.2? Need some expertise

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All core, only hitting 2.2 sustained on an hp laptop. Getting abysmal cinebench R20, like only 1100 points.

it never throttles, and never goes above 65c.

I did a cinebench run with the laptop in the freezer, could not boost further.
Laptop in question: HP Pavillion 15-CS1065CL
i5 8265u + 16GB DDR4, NVME SSD
Windows 10 Pro
 
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That's a pretty budget laptop with a base frequency of 1.6ghz if you're trying to load all 8 threads you're likely hitting whatever tdp limit hp has set. Your CPU comes in a 10w and 25w variant you likely have the 10w version.
 
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That's a pretty budget laptop with a base frequency of 1.6ghz if you're trying to load all 8 threads you're likely hitting whatever tdp limit hp has set. Your CPU comes in a 10w and 25w variant you likely have the 10w version.

Do you know of any ways via software or hardware markings I can confirm what TDP I have? I can remove the heat sink it’s easy enough
 
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Maybe hardware monitor check package power under like an r20 load. I'm not sure of a better way to check.


I could be wrong but I think the 25w variant has a 1.8ghz base clock
 

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Try setting a custom power profile. My mom has an old dell and I created a custom profile and now she sees a boost from 2.0 to 3.1
 

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All core, only hitting 2.2 sustained on an hp laptop. Getting abysmal cinebench R20, like only 1100 points.

it never throttles, and never goes above 65c.

I did a cinebench run with the laptop in the freezer, could not boost further.
Laptop in question: HP Pavillion 15-CS1065CL
i5 8265u + 16GB DDR4, NVME SSD
Windows 10 Pro

Its a notebook with crap cooling is why it wont push.

If you want anything to push go get a thick sagecom/eurocom/sager laptop
 
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Its a notebook with crap cooling is why it wont push.

If you want anything to push go get a thick sagecom/eurocom/sager laptop

cooling is not the issue in this case. Leaving the laptop outside here in NJ or even the freezer makes no difference even though the cores never heat up past 40c outside. Thermal throttling does not occur.
 

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Well it is bios limited at this rate.
 

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Your CPU comes in a 10w and 25w variant you likely have the 10w version.

The 10w and 25w are the same CPU. Intel just allows the CPU to run in a TDP-Down mode that limits it to ~10w. It is likely that HP is using this because of the absolute terrible CPU VRM on the laptop's motherboard.
 

unclewebb

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Try running ThrottleStop.


When testing, click on the Limits button and this will open up the Limit Reasons window. Whatever is causing your CPU to throttle will show up in red. Here is an example of a 6 core 9750H.



It is being throttled because it has reached the PL1 turbo power limit. The manufacturer has set this to 45 Watts which is the typical default setting for these CPUs.

There are lots of adjustments a person can make in ThrottleStop that can significantly help pretty much any Intel laptop with throttling issues. After a few tweaks, my 8th Gen laptop can run well above its 15W TDP rating. Not a hint of throttling until it gets too damn hot.



The more pictures of ThrottleStop you post, the easier it will be for me to make some suggestions to improve things. Post pictures from when the CPU is loaded and throttling.
 
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Thanks for the help man, looks like I'm power throttling. This capture is midway through a cinebench run. I'm interested in some higher sustained clocks while on DC power but then going back into battery saver while mobile. Is this something throttle stop can help me with?

Also, this is my older tpu account I was somehow logged in on on this PC. All further correspondence is with Ant Deek.

Capture.PNG
 

unclewebb

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In the first post you said,
it never throttles
so much for that theory! :)

This is a low power U series CPU. Intel specifically designed these things to throttle. Your CPU is performing exactly as Intel intended.

If you look at Limit Reasons, PL1 is red. When this happens, it is normal for EDP OTHER in the RING column to also go red at the exact same time. Ignore EDP OTHER. It is PL1 causing the throttling. If you look at the main ThrottleStop screen it shows to the right of the PKG (Package) Power button that the CPU is presently running at 15.0 Watts. The TDP for the Core i5-8265U is exactly 15 Watts.


Intel recommends that manufacturers set the long term turbo power limit equal to the TDP so it looks like HP has followed that advice exactly and has set this to 15 Watts. To try to work around this limitation, while Cinebench is running and your CPU is being throttled by this 15 Watt limit, click on the TPL button and open up the Turbo Power Limits window. You did not post a pic of this window like I asked, hint hint hint, so I will have to guess. The Turbo Boost Long Power Max is probably set to 15 Watts. If the Lock option is not checked, try increasing this value to 20. Click on OK and go back out to the main window and see if this has made any difference to your CPU speed or power consumption. Is PL1 still glowing red?

Your CPU is probably still throttling. There are actually multiple sets of turbo power limits that control Intel CPUs. The next thing to try is open up the FIVR window, and on the right hand side, you want to check the Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits box. Before you check this box, go a little further to the right and you should see an Install button. Click on this button and follow the directions. It will tell you to download the RwDrv.zip file from Mega. Do this. Open up the zip file and copy the RwDrv.sys file into your ThrottleStop folder. Close the FIVR window and open it back up. If it finds that you installed that file in your ThrottleStop folder, the Install button will be gone. Now you can click on the Disable and Lock box and press OK and do some more testing.

Run Cinebench again. If this box is checked and the ThrottleStop Turbo Boost Long Power Max is set to 20 Watts and your CPU is still throttling to 15 Watts, that means you are screwed. At this point there is a third set of turbo power limits controlled by the EC. I have a hunch that HP uses this third set of power limits. There is no software available at the moment to go beyond this limit.

You can use ThrottleStop to under volt the CPU core and CPU cache but on U series CPUs, the benefit of this is limited. I will explain this further later. In the FIVR window you will need to undervolt the core and cache equally. I would start by using an undervolt of about -50 mV. Reducing the voltage will allow the CPU to run slightly faster before it starts throttling. No huge gains to be had but it also helps keep the temps down.

I would also clear the BD PROCHOT box on the main screen of ThrottleStop.

Have fun playing and post some more results. I rarely hear from HP owners. Always good to learn some new info about what is possible. The Lenovo laptops I have bought lately have unlocked turbo power limits so the results are much more impressive.
 
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Thank you again for the help, it looks like i'm screwed lol. I can hit peaks of 35w but under sustained load it brings itself back to 2.2GHz.


Capture.PNG
 

unclewebb

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@AntDeek - Did you install that driver I mentioned? Did you try doing some under volting? That can get you a few hundred more MHz if your CPU is a good one.
 
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Yes the driver is installed. I’ll start undervolting later. I wish there was a way to keep the TDP up for longer durations.
 

unclewebb

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I wish there was a way to keep the TDP up for longer durations.
There is a way. Buy laptops from manufacturers that are not dicks about setting restrictive power limits. If I give a company some of my money, I want to be able to use the product they sold me however I like. HP prevents you from doing this. As you can see in the screenshot I posted, my 8th Gen low power U CPU can run at full speed because it was simple to disable the 15W long term turbo power limit. Thank you Lenovo. Too bad review sites tend to be lazy and are afraid to share this information. They live in fear that there will be no more free laptops to test so they have to keep quiet about this dirty little laptop industry secret.
 
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Honestly I just ended up with this thing because I needed to occasionally run a VM or remote into my desktop, and it was on sale at micro center for $399. Oh well. At least single core is still nice at 3.9

I had a Lenovo with the same chip, returned it due to coil whining. it annoyed the hell out of me
 
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There is a way. Buy laptops from manufacturers that are not dicks about setting restrictive power limits. If I give a company some of my money, I want to be able to use the product they sold me however I like. HP prevents you from doing this. As you can see in the screenshot I posted, my 8th Gen low power U CPU can run at full speed because it was simple to disable the 15W long term turbo power limit. Thank you Lenovo. Too bad review sites tend to be lazy and are afraid to share this information. They live in fear that there will be no more free laptops to test so they have to keep quiet about this dirty little laptop industry secret.

Hello, chiming in with my girlfriend's Lenovo Pavilion 15 with the same CPU as OP has: I5-8265U. Registered just to confirm @unclewebb's post about HP laptops.

Though it seems voltage can be lowered with the offset according to temperature results on HWMon, it doesn't seem the boost power limits are allowing themselves to be adjusted. Sad. I'm testing by pushing the system to its limits with prime95, but it lowers it to 2 Ghz max temperature regardless of my settings. Yes I've installed the lock disabler etc. Seems like the Pavilion line doesn't allow for the more interesting cpu improvements. If anyone ever finds a way, I'd be very interested. Considering that throttle temps are at ~60 C, there's a lot of temperature overhead to play around with.

I'm very disappointed in HP because of this and never would have agreed to buy this laptop if I had known it was locked down to this extent.

Small update: I played a video game and kept going in and out of game to check what the core speed was, and weirdly enough, after five minutes ingame, it was at around 3 ghz (and at higher temps around 80+) rather than what Prime95 produces. I'm truly at a loss.
 

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Probably has to do with workloads that are cpu-only, as opposed to those that are CPU and GPU intensive.
 

unclewebb

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@Maxstate - Thanks for sharing. Not sure if you have heard yet but your laptop's performance might get worse in the near future. Intel has released a microcode update that disables both under volting and the turbo ratio limit multiplier control. After this fix gets installed on your computer, power consumption will increase so your laptop will be a little warmer during normal use. At full load, the CPU will be forced to throttle and slow down some more so it does not exceed the 15 Watt TDP power limit.

If you look in the ThrottleStop FIVR window on the right hand side it will say PowerCut - µCode 0xA4. That is your microcode version. There is an October 2019 Windows 10 update that will install µCode 0xAE. I think that one is still OK and will still allow CPU voltage control. The next one after that is probably µCode 0xB_ something and it is the one to avoid. If you want to hang on to under volting, avoid updating the bios from HP and be careful what you install from Windows Update. I use SledgeHammer to keep an eye on what good stuff Microsoft wants to install on my computer.


I would also make a backup copy of

C:\Windows\System32\mcupdate_GenuineIntel.dll

That file is the microcode update installed by Windows Update. If you do not install an updated BIOS from HP, you might be able to go back to an older µCode version by swapping this file to a previous version. After that, reboot and you should be able to continue under volting. Fun times ahead in 2020 for Intel laptop owners.
 
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@Maxstate - Thanks for sharing. Not sure if you have heard yet but your laptop's performance might get worse in the near future. Intel has released a microcode update that disables both under volting and the turbo ratio limit multiplier control.

Is this for all Intel Laptop CPU's? Curious because I run mine currently with -130 on the voltage, and with 4.5 GHz all-core unlocked instead of the stock 4.0 GHz limitation (though that really doesn't matter much, cooling virtually never allows it to turbo past 4.0 anyway).
 

unclewebb

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Is this for all Intel Laptop CPU's?
Yes. The microcode update that blocks under volting was released by Intel in December.


It is just a matter of time before it is installed in new bios versions from manufacturers. It might be a few more months before it is automatically installed by Windows Update. Keep your eyes open. It is coming. HP seems to be the first manufacturer releasing bios updates with this fix installed.

 
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I love how you called it a 'fix', because I'm sure the HP marketing team thought of that one too. Is this purely a profit thing? As in, they're doing it so people can't draw this extra juice from their machine without paying for it? Thanks a lot for the heads-up. I'm gonna disable Windows Update and remove HP Support Assistant, copy the dll file and then check out Sledgehammer. I owe you - at least - one.

Probably has to do with workloads that are cpu-only, as opposed to those that are CPU and GPU intensive.
To streamline this, I've started undervolting her GPU as well through MSI Afterburner. Scuttlebutt says cpu and gpu share one heat-exhaust system, so that one affects the other. Makes sense. Gonna draw the most I can out of this thing.

Update:

@unclewebb : do you suggest using DEFCON-1 on SledgeHammer, or? If you can be bothered, I'd love to hear best practice in this case.
 
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