Thursday, September 1st 2022

Arm Files a Lawsuit Against One of its Biggest Customers, Qualcomm

The world of semiconductor IP licensing is complex by nature. If you use a company's IP, you must agree to its licensing terms. Today, it is precisely those terms that are being breached in the event of Arm Ltd. filing a lawsuit against one of its biggest customers, Qualcomm. When Qualcomm acquired Nuvia Inc., regarded as one of the best CPU design teams in the industry, it transferred Arm-Nuvia license agreements as its own. It continued the development of Arm IP under Qualcomm's name. This is a standard restriction, as Arm's licensing prohibits these sorts of IP transfers among companies to protect the IP.

As the UK-headquartered company reports: "Because Qualcomm attempted to transfer Nuvia licenses without Arm's consent, which is a standard restriction under Arm's license agreements, Nuvia's licenses terminated in March 2022. Before and after that date, Arm made multiple good faith efforts to seek a resolution. In contrast, Qualcomm has breached the terms of the Arm license agreement by continuing development under the terminated licenses. Arm was left with no choice other than to bring this claim against Qualcomm and Nuvia to protect our IP, our business, and to ensure customers are able to access valid Arm-based products."
Interestingly, Arm is now " seeking specific performance of the contractual obligation to destroy certain Nuvia designs, an injunction against trademark infringement as well as fair compensation for the trademark infringement." With this case now reaching the United States District Court for the District of Delaware, it is a matter of time before we see more information about the case. The two could settle; however, Arm has pointed out that it tried it off-court with Qualcomm, and it didn't work.
Source: Arm
Add your own comment

36 Comments on Arm Files a Lawsuit Against One of its Biggest Customers, Qualcomm

#26
lexluthermiester
big_glassesHalf of it is quote from Arm, and the unquoted part is quite impartial. He even says 'it is a matter of time before we see more information about the case'
Also Arm uses "Arm" in their own newsletter... And seem to use it multiple places on their webpage
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture_family
ARM (stylized in lowercase as arm, formerly an acronym for Advanced RISC Machines and originally Acorn RISC Machine)
It doesn't matter if they themselves improperly use their own acronym, professionalism demands that a media outlet such as TPU use the proper acronym and that's what I'm calling out.

Additionally, AleksanderK has a habit of presenting articles from a very narrow & one-sided perspective, as was done here.
AleksandarKWhen Qualcomm acquired Nuvia Inc., regarded as one of the best CPU design teams in the industry, it transferred Arm-Nuvia license agreements as its own. It continued the development of Arm IP under Qualcomm's name. This is a standard restriction, as Arm's licensing prohibits these sorts of IP transfers among companies to protect the IP.
The direct statement here sides with ARM based on their claims without any consideration for Qualcomm's position. The contracts are NOT public information and are governed by NDA. There is no way for anyone outside of ARM, Qualcomm and Nuvia to know the details of what is and is not permited. Further, there are conditions under which the rights and permissions of one company are transferred to another upon purchase of the subject entity. Qualcomm is likely exercising what it interprets as it's lawful rights. Again, such disputes are for a COURT to decide, not the press. It is inappropriate for an article writer to take such an openly biased position.

What I'm saying here is that the professionalism bar needs to be set a bit higher.
Posted on Reply
#27
big_glasses
lexluthermiesteren.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture_family

It doesn't matter if they themselves improperly use their own acronym, professionalism demands that a media outlet such as TPU use the proper acronym and that's what I'm calling out.
as said was quoted from them. Formatting shouldn't be edited ether.
Arm's website (including trademark and logo guidelines) > Wikipedia.
www.arm.com/company/policies/trademarks/guidelines-trademarks
TPU is following Arm's trademark usage

lexluthermiesterAdditionally, AleksanderK has a habit of presenting articles form a very narrow & one-sided perspective, as was done here.

The direct statement here sides with ARM based on their claims without any consideration for Qualcomm's position. The contracts are NOT public information and are governed by NDA. There is no way for anyone outside of ARM, Qualcomm and Nuvia to know the details of what is and is not permited. Further, there are conditions under which the rights and permissions of one company are transferred to another upon purchase of the subject entity. Qualcomm is likely exercising what it interprets as it's lawful rights. Again, such disputes are for a COURT to decide, not the press. It is inappropriate for an article writer to take such an openly biased position.

What I'm saying here is that the professionalism bar needs to be set a bit higher.
Standard contracts (atleast in my industry) isn't usually transferable. And here (allegedly) it isn't ether (from Arm's wording)
What's the wrong in saying "standard contracts" aren't transferable?
But sure, the article is more 'positive' towards Arm than Qualcomm, and should've preferably been tldr; at top and then the press release from Arm
Posted on Reply
#28
lexluthermiester
big_glassesas said was quoted from them. Formatting shouldn't be edited ether.
Arm's website (including trademark and logo guidelines) > Wikipedia.
www.arm.com/company/policies/trademarks/guidelines-trademarks
TPU is following Arm's trademark usage



Standard contracts (atleast in my industry) isn't usually transferable. And here (allegedly) it isn't ether (from Arm's wording)
What's the wrong in saying "standard contracts" aren't transferable?
But sure, the article is more 'positive' towards Arm than Qualcomm, and should've preferably been tldr; at top and then the press release from Arm
Just because they own the company doesn't mean they get to rewrite history. They do NOT get to dictate terms. ARM stands for "Advanced RISC Machine". End of discussion, end of story.
Posted on Reply
#29
Aquinus
Resident Wat-man
lexluthermiesterThe direct statement here sides with ARM based on their claims without any consideration for Qualcomm's position. The contracts are NOT public information and are governed by NDA. There is no way for anyone outside of ARM, Qualcomm and Nuvia to know the details of what is and is not permited. Further, there are conditions under which the rights and permissions of one company are transferred to another upon purchase of the subject entity. Qualcomm is likely exercising what it interprets as it's lawful rights. Again, such disputes are for a COURT to decide, not the press. It is inappropriate for an article writer to take such an openly biased position.

What I'm saying here is that the professionalism bar needs to be set a bit higher.
While I generally agree, this definitely doesn't sound good for Qualcomm. Let's just say that this kind of restriction isn't uncommon for licensing IP and this sounds more like a case of Qualcomm attempting to push boundaries to see what they can get away with because contract language tends to be pretty exact, regardless of what the particular details are. x86 licensing works the same way to the best of my knowledge. Said license is not transferable after an acquisition, otherwise I'm sure somebody would have bought VIA by now just for the x86 license but it doesn't work that way as Qualcomm is about to find out first hand.
lexluthermiesterJust because they own the company doesn't mean they get to rewrite history. ARM stands for "Advanced RISC Machine". End of discussion, end of story.
I think you've made your point and @big_glasses can stop digging his heels in any time now. :)
Posted on Reply
#30
R0H1T
With x86-64 it was pretty cut & dry, the license was/is non transferable. This is why it was a big deal back in 2015-16 when AMD was on the verge of bankruptcy, because it would lead to Intel being the only major x86 chipmaker & even if someone were to buy AMD(IP) post bankruptcy the license wouldn't be transferable. I always wonder what some of those n**** were thinking when they said we'd be fine even if AMD went kaput around that time :shadedshu:
Posted on Reply
#31
lexluthermiester
AquinusWhile I generally agree, this definitely doesn't sound good for Qualcomm.
It'll be interesting to see how things turn out.
AquinusLet's just say that this kind of restriction isn't uncommon for licensing IP and this sounds more like a case of Qualcomm attempting to push boundaries to see what they can get away with because contract language tends to be pretty exact, regardless of what the particular details are.
Contract law is very complicated. Companies often buyout other companies to gain IP properties and/or rights access. It's common practice. For Qualcomm to make a move like this and expect a transfer of rights is neither uncommon nor unexpected. ARM might be right, Qualcomm might be right, they might both be right and thus the conflict. The devil is in the details.
Posted on Reply
#32
Aquinus
Resident Wat-man
lexluthermiesterContract law is very complicated. Companies often buyout other companies to gain IP properties and/or rights access. It's common practice. For Qualcomm to make a move like this and expect a transfer of rights is neither uncommon nor unexpected. ARM might be right, Qualcomm might be right, they might both be right and thus the conflict. The devil is in the details.
I'm just thinking about other licenses that have similar restrictions. I don't recall any cases where that clause was struck due to an acquisition for an x86 license. I'm not sure if there is a precedent for Qualcomm which is why I think it's probably an uphill battle. I'm assuming that the contract is clear in its language, the question is more one of, does ARM legally have the authority to imply such a licensing restriction and I think precedent is "yes, they do."

All in all, it could go either way, but I'd put my money on ARM.
Posted on Reply
#33
big_glasses
lexluthermiesterJust because they own the company doesn't mean they get to rewrite history. They do NOT get to dictate terms. ARM stands for "Advanced RISC Machine". End of discussion, end of story.
funniest shit I've heard this week, Arm can't define their own trademark?


@Aquinus won't stop digging my heals when I'm correct on Arm trademarking ;) I'd say it's lex that's digging his heel, unsourced/wikipedia sourced for trademark/branding vs official guidelines....
Which is more professional to use?

www.arm.com/company/policies/trademarks/arm-trademark-list/arm-trademark

----
For the license itself , it certainly depends on precedence and contract.
I'm pretty sure they can have non-transferable licenses. ( www.minterellison.com/articles/back-to-basics-negotiating-ip-rights-in-technology-development-agreements#:~:text=If%20a%20licence%20is%20non,permission%20(if%20at%20all). )

but license itself is a shitshow, and I'm reminded again why I hate working close to licensing so much
Posted on Reply
#34
lexluthermiester
big_glassesfunniest shit I've heard this week, Arm can't define their own trademark?
They can define thier own trademark, sure. They may NOT rewrite history, nor the acronym that represents who and what they are, nor demand the press not use that acronym.
big_glassesI'd say it's lex that's digging his heel
Correction, standing my ground on a correct point.
big_glassesFor the license itself , it certainly depends on precedence and contract.
I'm pretty sure they can have non-transferable licenses. ( www.minterellison.com/artic...xt=If a licence is non,permission (if at all). )

but license itself is a shitshow, and I'm reminded again why I hate working close to licensing so much
Agreed, contract law can be a real pain...
Posted on Reply
#35
DeathtoGnomes
lexluthermiesterThey can define thier own trademark, sure. They may NOT rewrite history, nor the acronym that represents who and what they are, nor demand the press not use that acronym.
AFAIK Trademarks have to used exactly as it was when it was registered, unless a correction is submitted. Using a copyrighted name is not as strict. I may have this backwards /1stcoffee.
Posted on Reply
#36
Aquinus
Resident Wat-man
big_glasses@Aquinus won't stop digging my heals when I'm correct on Arm trademarking ;) I'd say it's lex that's digging his heel, unsourced/wikipedia sourced for trademark/branding vs official guidelines....
Which is more professional to use?
It's more professional to not be making a big stink about something as trivial as this in my opinion. There are far better arguments worth winning. :laugh:
big_glassesbut license itself is a shitshow, and I'm reminded again why I hate working close to licensing so much
I've always preferred lenient licenses, but at the end of the day a lot of people run businesses to make money, not to improve open IP... unless you're mainland China, in which case all IP to them is open regardless of laws surrounding them. I do think that there is a need to be able to control your own IP and I personally think that the whole transferal aspect falls into that bucket. The real question is, in the absence of the Nuvia ARM license, does Qualcomm still have the appropriate licensure for what they're doing? If the answer is no, then I think we know where this is headed. If the answer is yes, then we know exactly what ARM is trying to do, and that's to extract money from Qualcomm. I think both angles could be valid, however I suspect that Qualcomm is missing something in their license that Nuvia had which is likely at the heart of this lawsuit. That's my take anyways from a mere pleb on the internet.
Posted on Reply
Add your own comment
Jun 3rd, 2024 05:38 EDT change timezone

New Forum Posts

Popular Reviews

Controversial News Posts