Looking for Gpu update (Old PC)

[KedsDead]

Not sure, how a RX 580 or a RX 5500 XT are 250w GPUs.. but ok..

 

[dgianstefani]

Every card has always had spikes going back 2 decades at least. PSUs dealt with it then, and it was only really the 30-series that brought the issue to light for mainstream builds.

If the PSU is an issue, it's going to be an issue for just about anything suggested here, including your suggestion of a 4060.

Unfortunately jonnyguru.com is dead but if you can bear to search the waybackmachine you'll find they covered re-reviews of a few decade-old PSUs both high-end OCZ units and low-end Antec models, both of which aced the tests and delivered their ratings after a decade of genuine use. I'm sure they tested more, but this myth that PSUs lose huge amounts of their rated power delivery over time is simply that, a debunked myth.

If it's a bad PSU then it's a bad PSU and will be a problem soon regardless of whether OP changes hardware.

Who said "huge"?

It's absolutely not a myth that power supplies, like any other hardware, wear out over time. Antec and OCZ are/were also some of the best PSU brands around, not this unknown Nox brand.

Now you're trying to say, oh, well all of these cards would be an issue, once your claim of RX 570 supposedly being a 120 W card is proven wrong.

The false equivalence you're trying to establish by saying that putting a seven year old CPU+GPU upgrade into a system with an 11 year old PSU, drawing 400 W+ of power, is the same "problem" as installing a more efficient, newer GPU like a 4060, which draws 149 W in spikes and 130 W on average, for a combined system power draw of ~200 W, is quite misleading and irresponsible.

Not sure, how a RX 580 or a RX 5500 XT are 250w GPUs.. but ok..

You can argue with W1zzard if you like, he runs the tests. And no, RX580 is actually a 260W GPU, so twice the power draw of a 4060.

 

[KedsDead]

Even TPUs review only shows it at 150w for average gaming.

Edit

Ok, so 208 at peak, and 218 with furmark.. We dont even know what games this OP is playing, and at MAX load his PSU should be fine.

 

[dgianstefani]

Even TPUs review only shows it at 150w for average gaming.

Are average results what trip power supplies? Or peak draw?

 

[KedsDead]

Ok.. I will give you that. But, recommending a GPU that is the miles beyond want his CPU can push is not going to help the OP.

 

[dgianstefani]

Even TPUs review only shows it at 150w for average gaming.

Edit

Ok, so 208 at peak, and 218 with furmark.. We dont even know what games this OP is playing, and at MAX load his PSU should be fine.

215 W, and 260 W spikes, as tested in the newest GPU review that still had the RX580 (7 year old card).

More accurate information is 215 W, with spikes of 260 W.

View attachment 338671View attachment 338672

Zotac GeForce RTX 3080 AMP Holo Review

The GeForce RTX 3080 AMP Holo is Zotac's flagship variant of the RTX 3080. It comes overclocked out of the box and has a powerful 16+3 VRM design. Temperatures and noise levels are slightly better than the Founders Edition, and idle-fan-stop is included, too.

www.techpowerup.com

Ok.. I will give you that. But, recommending a GPU that is the miles beyond want his CPU can push is not going to help the OP.

He won't have that system forever, the 4060 could go into any new system or updated system he moves to, but throwing away ~$100 or whatever on an ancient card just because it will bottleneck a bit less (4060 will still provide better performance, despite any bottlenecking) seems like bad logic.

 

[Chrispy_]

Who said "huge"?

It's absolutely not a myth that power supplies, like any other hardware, wear out over time. Antec and OCZ are/were also some of the best PSU brands around, not this unknown Nox brand.

Now you're trying to say, oh, well all of these cards would be an issue, once your claim of RX 570 supposedly being a 120 W card is proven wrong.

I've remembered the RX570 wrong. It was 120W under Furmark for sure, (I've bought, tested, and sold hundreds of them in the past) but IIRC that generation of GPUs only reported the GPU die draw, not the total board power, so I can believe 180W

The 1650 will draw less than a 4060, the 1060 will draw about the same as a 4060, and the RX480 was tested at 165W at launch, but AMD had to revise that to 150W strictly with a driver update after being called out by a few reviewers for exceeding the 75W slot power + 75W 6-pin spec.

If we're worried about an extra 40W over the existing system components, then this thread isn't a GPU thread anymore, it's a "guess the old PSU" thread which isn't productive because everyone is just blindly guessing with no real data and the only way to know is to try hardware and see.

He won't have that system forever, the 4060 could go into any new system or updated system he moves to, but throwing away ~$100 or whatever on an ancient card just because it will bottleneck a bit less (4060 will still provide better performance, despite any bottlenecking) seems like bad logic.

We're all making assumptions here, but you're making the bold assumption that OP has $300+ to spare RIGHT NOW and that he's going to move to a brand new CPU+BOARD+RAM+COOLER+PSU costing another ~$400 before that 4060 has depreciated by the €80 cost of an used 1060.

Look at his hardware. Is your assumption a sane, rational, justified assumption?
I've said what I was going to say and have nothing more to add (for today, at least!)

 

[dgianstefani]

I

I've remembered the RX570 wrong. It was 120W under Furmark for sure, (I've bought, tested, and sold hundreds of them in the past) but IIRC that generation of GPUs only reported the GPU die draw, not the total board power, so I can believe 180W

The 1650 will draw less than a 4060, the 1060 will draw about the same as a 4060, and the RX480 was tested at 165W at launch, but AMD had to revise that to 150W strictly with a driver update after being called out by a few reviewers for exceeding the 75W slot power + 75W 6-pin spec.

If we're worried about an extra 40W over the existing system components, then this thread isn't a GPU thread anymore, it's a "guess the old PSU" thread which isn't productive because everyone is just blindly guessing.

I'm not sure how 260 watts (RX580) is similar to 150 watts (RTX 4060), or how the "mandatory" CPU upgrade, where a 160 W 3770K was suggested, works out together to only use "40 W" more than his current system, which has a 90 W peak CPU and an 80 W GPU.

 

[Takui]

guys, i'm not changing the power supply or cpu, not even a fan
I only looking for the best performance gpu for the hard, in the second hand market, in reddit they recommended me gtx 1080 in oculus forum
but my doubt is getting a 2060 for a bit more €uros( like 20 more) or getting an older gpu in case the cpu was bottleneckd.
I don't know anything about psus, just that i have 2 6 pines connectors avalaible and a 2 extra pins connector, no power suply problems in a decade

 

[dgianstefani]

We're all making assumptions here, but you're making the even crazier assumption that OP has $300+ to spare RIGHT NOW and that he's going to move to a brand new CPU+BOARD+RAM+COOLER+PSU costing another ~$400 before a $300+ 4060 has depreciated by the cost of an old €90 GPU.

Look at his hardware. Is your assumption a sane, rational, justified assumption?

OP literally suggested an RTX 4060, indicating he can afford it. The future is the future, noone knows. I'd personally prefer a 130 W one year old GPU in 2025 rather than a 260 W eight year old card.

guys, i'm not changing the power supply or cpu, not even a fan
I only looking for the best performance gpu for the hard, in the second hand market, in reddit they recommended me gtx 1080 in oculus forum
but my doubt is getting a 2060 for a bit more €uros( like 20 more) or getting an older gpu in case the cpu was bottleneckd.
I don't know anything about psus, just that i have 2 6 pines connectors avalaible and a 2 extra pins connector, no power suply problems in a decade

RTX 2060 would be fine over a GTX 1080, that's for sure.

But if you can afford them, the new RTX 3060/4060 you also suggested are both better options, with the 4060 being particularly good since it uses so little power and your PSU is a question. With your current graphics card only drawing 80 watts and your CPU 90 w, it's not surprising you haven't had issues.

 

[Takui]

uggested an RTX 4060, indicating he can afford it. The future is the future, noone knows. I'd personally prefer a 130 W one year old GPU in 2025 rather than a 260 W eight year old card.

well, i would prefer expending 100-130€ if i know it will not be a problem using an used 1080 or 2060,
On the other hand, I see that they sell new the 8 GB 4060 and the 12 GB 3060 (same price), but I don't know if they will be too much for my old hard.

 

[dgianstefani]

well, i would prefer expending 100-130€ if i know it will not be a problem using an used 1080 or 2060,
On the other hand, I see that they sell new the 8 GB 4060 and the 12 GB 3060 (same price), but I don't know if they will be too much for my old hard.

They'll be easier on your old hardware, because they draw less power than the other alternatives you're considering. But if money is tight, get the 2060.

You can't know it won't be a problem buying a used card. That's a risk you have to take, which increases the older the card is.

A lot of used RX580 and GTX 1080 will have been used for mining too, which is a factor to consider.

 

[Takui]

Im not considering RX580 anyway, i got one from aliexpress, i got artifacts from the first day, i returned it
I friend got another one from local marketplace with same results

 

[dgianstefani]

Im not considering RX580 anyway, i got one from aliexpress, i got artifacts from the first day, i returned it
I friend got another one from local marketplace with same results

Yeah the "new" Aliexpress cards are often just repackaged, cleaned used cards.

 

[pavle]

I'd say just buy RTX 2060 and you'll be fine, it's got the same number of shader processors as the GTX 1070 but with more functionality. RAM (6GB) should not be too limiting if you won't play the latest stuff.

 

[LabRat 891]

VR capability starts at about the Vega 64/1080ti. Neither is appropriate on the PSU OP has.

i7 3770K CPU will hit 160 watts stock.
Suggesting that, together with an RX580 would be 420 watts under load. For a questionable branded cheapo PSU that can theoretically deliver 456 W on the 12 V rail, if specs are accurate, when brand new, not 10+ years old.

I really am shocked at the irresponsibility of what's being suggested here. Beyond just the simple fact that OP had clearly stated he's not interested in upgraded CPU/motherboard, and is using an ancient case with a single tower, single fan budget CPU cooler.

mostly agreed.

Spoiler: Snip

(Other than cost) A 7600 XT is probably one of the lower-power cards that'd provide sufficient performance, however it's still a ~200-230W peak card (similar to used Polaris offerings)

(again, other than cost) The RX 7600 (vanilla) OtOH, looks more-appropriate.

However, as mentioned: A 'cheapo' PSU w/ aged caps, put under an appreciable load, is a recipe for fire and destruction.

@OP: Upgrade your PSU. (even a Delta or FSP unit pulled from a recent OEM prebuilt, would be a far safer choice).

guys, i'm not changing the power supply or cpu, not even a fan
I only looking for the best performance gpu for the hard, in the second hand market, in reddit they recommended me gtx 1080 in oculus forum
but my doubt is getting a 2060 for a bit more €uros( like 20 more) or getting an older gpu in case the cpu was bottleneckd.

You are going to destroy the other parts in the machine with such reckless abandon.
If *I* were hacking together an upgrade like this, I'd be finding ANY additional PSU to act as a secondary unit. Which, has it's own mess of potential issues (yes, that was a double-entendre).

Example: A 1st generation Xbox 360 power brick, supplies ~200W of +12VDC, with voltage stabilization/feedback control.
Which, is on my list of 'whacky projects': GPU-AUX PSU from X360 power brick.

I don't know anything about psus, just that i have 2 6 pines connectors avalaible and a 2 extra pins connector, no power suply problems in a decade

Capacitors age. -and, questionable-to-begin-with build quality in unknown units + age = killing other components when it inevitably fails.
Maybe, you'll be lucky and it'll only shoot a flame out the back. (speaking from experience w/ aged-out Gateway and eMachine OEM PCs I've tinkered with.)

 

[Takui]

I forgot to mention, my monitor is FullHd only (philips 243v)

 

[Chrispy_]

I forgot to mention, my monitor is FullHd only (philips 243v)

I don't think that changes anything.

4060 is the fastest and most expensive thing you should buy, without overly-stressing your PSU.
1060 6GB for €80, used, is probably the most cost-effective thing you can buy, without overly-stressing your PSU.

Realistically, if you don't want to change your PSU, those two are pretty safe bets, and of those two I wouldn't bother spending the €250 more on the 4060 unless you have plans to upgrade the rest of the PC in the next year or two, because your CPU will hold it back a lot.

Both of those are still a gamble; The 4060 might give you UEFI-compatibility issues with your old motherboard, requiring a BIOS update that may not even exist. I *think* the P8H77 is going to be okay, and I don't see any BIOS updates for it that mention UEFI GPU compatibility, so hopefully it was included out of the box with support. Ignoring the compatibility risk, both the 4060 and 1060 are 120-Watt cards which is 40W more than your existing Radeon. If (and this is only an 'if') your PSU is on the way out, that extra 40W of power draw might be the final nail in the coffin. I personally think you'll be fine - most old systems I see with RX 480, RX 570, GTX 1060 cards tend to have equally old 450-650W PSUs, some good quality, some not.

Your PSU is an unknown, so literally anything you do that increases the power draw is a gamble. If you don't want to take that gamble, get a GTX 1650 or 3050 6GB, both of which use less power than your existing Radeon - but they're not exactly great value cards.

 

[Takui]

thanks a lot guys!

 

[Solid State Soul ( SSS )]

Rtx 3050, anything above that would be diminishing returns as the old CPU would be a big bottleneck

 

[dgianstefani]

I don't think that changes anything.

4060 is the fastest and most expensive thing you should buy, without overly-stressing your PSU.
1060 6GB for €80, used, is probably the most cost-effective thing you can buy, without overly-stressing your PSU.

Realistically, if you don't want to change your PSU, those two are pretty safe bets, and of those two I wouldn't bother spending the €250 more on the 4060 unless you have plans to upgrade the rest of the PC in the next year or two, because your CPU will hold it back a lot.

Both of those are still a gamble; The 4060 might give you UEFI-compatibility issues with your old motherboard, requiring a BIOS update that may not even exist. I *think* the P8H77 is going to be okay, and I don't see any BIOS updates for it that mention UEFI GPU compatibility, so hopefully it was included out of the box with support. Ignoring the compatibility risk, both the 4060 and 1060 are 120-Watt cards which is 40W more than your existing Radeon. If (and this is only an 'if') your PSU is on the way out, that extra 40W of power draw might be the final nail in the coffin. I personally think you'll be fine - most old systems I see with RX 480, RX 570, GTX 1060 cards tend to have equally old 450-650W PSUs, some good quality, some not.

Your PSU is an unknown, so literally anything you do that increases the power draw is a gamble. If you don't want to take that gamble, get a GTX 1650 or 3050 6GB, both of which use less power than your existing Radeon - but they're not exactly great value cards.

The other thing is that by simply frame rate limiting the FPS from the NVCP, to just below the monitor refresh rate, i.e 59 for 60 Hz, 117 for 120 Hz, 237 for 240 Hz, you can make the GPU use significantly less power. This scales better on NVIDIA too, so a ~120 W 4060 would realistically be using a lot less than that if frame limited, and you wouldn't see those power draw numbers anyway with a 3470 CPU even without a frame limit, since CPU limitation would keep the GPU below 100% usage.

 

[Takui]

The other thing is that by simply frame rate limiting the FPS from the NVCP, to just below the monitor refresh rate, i.e 59 for 60 Hz, 117 for 120 Hz, 237 for 240 Hz, you can make the GPU use significantly less power. This scales better on NVIDIA too, so a ~120 W 4060 would realistically be using a lot less than that if frame limited, and you wouldn't see those power draw numbers anyway with a 3470 CPU even without a frame limit, since CPU limitation would keep the GPU below 100% usage.

so, my monitor refres rate can be chosen on screen administrator: 59.939 hz or 60, should i put it to 60 and then on NVCP adjust to 59?

I bought a 1650 super on wallapop, but i'm not sure the seller is sending...

 

[dgianstefani]

so, my monitor refres rate can be chosen on screen administrator: 59.939 hz or 60, should i put it to 60 and then on NVCP adjust to 59?

I bought a 1650 super on wallapop, but i'm not sure the seller is sending...

Just right click desktop and set 59 in NVCP, you don't need to do anything else.

Use NVCleaninstall for the drivers and DDU for removing your old drivers.

These are the settings I use in NVCP for minimal latency, you can copy except use 59 instead of 237 if you're on 60 Hz.

 

[Takui]

thanks

 

[Desktopstu]

You currently have the i5 3570? id upgrade to the i7 4 core 8 thread 3770- it will cost you very little and the extra threads will make a bg difference. I have a pc here that was upgraded from 3570 to 3770 last year and I was impressed with the improvements.

Graphics wise id advise AMD RX6600XT or nVidia RTX3060 or Intel A750. All are around £200 in uk.

Dont worry too much about a bit of bottlnecking. You can use the graphics card againn onn a later build. Id advise against the 1650 or anything with under 8gb VRAM as it will have little re sell or re use value.