The 10 year plan computer

[Dragam1337]

Imo it's silly wanting a computer to last 10 years anyways... if money is tight, then just buy a budget cpu now of the current architecture (something like a 13400f), cheap mobo, cheap 32gb ram. And get a cheap 2nd hand highend gpu like a 6800xt (or if you want to buy new, then something like a 4070 super). Replace it all in 5 years.

 

[dgianstefani]

Imo it's silly wanting a computer to last 10 years anyways... if money is tight, then just buy a budget cpu now of the current architecture (something like a 13400f), cheap mobo, cheap 32gb ram. And get a cheap 2nd hand highend gpu like a 6800xt (or if you want to buy new, then something like a 4070 super). Replace it all in 5 years.

13400f is Alderlake rebranded, so two years old architecture at this point. 13600 is the first Raptor Lake CPU with the revised architecture and more cache per core.

 

[Dragam1337]

13400f is Alderlake rebranded, so two years old architecture at this point. 13600 is the first Raptor Lake CPU.

14400f then. x600 is obviously higher priced and goes against the point of my suggestion.

 

[dgianstefani]

14400f then. x600 is obviously higher priced and goes against the point of my suggestion.

Still Alder Lake Golden Cove core, increased clocks by 100 MHz over 13400F.

 

[SL2]

I think in 10 years from its launch date of 2021 a 11900 will still be suitable for most day to day use,

Wow, you still think that's a better choice over a 10700K? I guess you don't read the posts here..

 

[Dr. Dro]

13400f is Alderlake rebranded, so two years old architecture at this point. 13600 is the first Raptor Lake CPU with the revised architecture and more cache per core.

Intel's site says it's Raptor?

Intel® Core™ i5-13400F Processor (20M Cache, up to 4.60 GHz) Product Specifications

Intel® Core™ i5-13400F Processor (20M Cache, up to 4.60 GHz) quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.

ark.intel.com

Seems like it's all Raptor top to bottom with some exceptions to that rule, the "Intel Processor 300", which is intended to replace the Pentium Gold (Alder Lake) models is also Raptor based

Intel® Processor 300 (6M Cache, up to 3.90 GHz) Product Specifications

Intel® Processor 300 (6M Cache, up to 3.90 GHz) quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.

ark.intel.com

 

[Dragam1337]

Still Alder Lake Golden Cove core, increased clocks by 100 MHz over 13400F.

Curious, it isn't listed as such on TPU.

Regardless, with cheap ram there won't be much difference between those cpu's anyways, and as money is clearly the primary concern for OP, he should just go with what is the cheapest, so he can spend the bulk of the budget on gpu.

 

[cvaldes]

Well the newer components are typically more obsolescence proof but also more expensive. OP has set a very ambitious lifespan target of 10 years. His build will look less geriatric in 2034 if he sticks more modern components in his box today.

All PC component purchases are some sort of compromise. He would give himself more options if he A.) increased his budget or B.) decreased the life expectancy of the build. It's not how these components will run in years 1-5, it's really about how they will hold up in years 6-10, especially the last few years when his wife's phone will have better performance in many ways than this lofty project.

He will likely be pleased with whatever he selects when he assembles the parts. There's little doubt there. It's how well his satisfaction will be in 2030. With the exception of CP2077 at high framerates/high graphics settings, pretty much any computer in the last 3-4 years can do the things he called out in his original post with flying colors.

 

[dgianstefani]

Intel's site says it's Raptor?

Intel® Core™ i5-13400F Processor (20M Cache, up to 4.60 GHz) Product Specifications

Intel® Core™ i5-13400F Processor (20M Cache, up to 4.60 GHz) quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.

ark.intel.com

Seems like it's all Raptor top to bottom with some exceptions to that rule, the "Intel Processor 300", which is intended to replace the Pentium Gold (Alder Lake) models is also Raptor based

Intel® Processor 300 (6M Cache, up to 3.90 GHz) Product Specifications

Intel® Processor 300 (6M Cache, up to 3.90 GHz) quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.

ark.intel.com

1.25 MB cache per core therefore Golden Cove.

Raptor Cove is 2 MB per core. xx600 and up have it.

Raptor Lake is the "generation", all 14th Gen CPUs are technically Raptor Lake, not all use Raptor Cove revised cores, with better v/f curve and more cache, plus better memory support.

The 13400F and 14400F both use reworked 12900K dies.

You can tell easily by looking at L2 cache amount compared to P cores.

 

[Dr. Dro]

Wow, you still think that's a better choice over a 10700K? I guess you don't read the posts here..

Both of them are effectively worthless, but they're not willing to listen. And that's even assuming that the next 10 years develop like the past 10 did, which is a _very_ unsafe bet. Well, someone resurrect this thread by 2034, cheers

1.25 MB cache per core therefore Golden Cove.

Raptor Cove is 2 MB per core. xx600 and up have it.

Raptor Lake is the "generation", all 14th Gen CPUs are technically Raptor Lake, not all use Raptor Cove revised cores, with better v/f curve and more cache, plus better memory support.

The 13400F and 14400F both use reworked 12900K dies.

You can tell easily by looking at L2 cache amount compared to P cores.

View attachment 340634

Man intel made a true mess here then. Usually the "code name" didn't conflate with generation, reagrdless of what the CPU was marketed as. Not good.

 

[Dragam1337]

1.25 MB cache per core therefore Golden Cove.

Raptor Cove is 2 MB per core. xx600 and up have it.

Raptor Lake is the "generation", all 14th Gen CPUs are technically Raptor Lake, not all use Raptor Cove revised cores, with better v/f curve and more cache, plus better memory support.

The 13400F and 14400F both use reworked 12900K dies.

You can tell easily by looking at L2 cache amount compared to P cores.

View attachment 340634

Next level fuckery from intel.

But as said, it really doesn't matter for the purpose of what i wrote.

 

[dgianstefani]

Both of them are effectively worthless, but they're not willing to listen. And that's even assuming that the next 10 years develop like the past 10 did, which is a _very_ unsafe bet. Well, someone resurrect this thread by 2034, cheers



Man intel made a true mess here then. Usually the "code name" didn't conflate with generation, reagrdless of what the CPU was marketed as. Not good.

Eh, doesn't really matter, anyone serious about gaming at high refresh will be using at least an i5 - K series anyway, and those have been Raptor Cove since 2022.

The lower end models are designed to be cheap first, and performant second.

The 12400F/13400F/14400F all provide good performance per dollar, which is what matters for people buying those parts. Just don't confuse them with Raptor Cove, and expect 8000 MT memory or better IPC.

 

[cvaldes]

Both of them are effectively worthless, but they're not willing to listen. And that's even assuming that the next 10 years develop like the past 10 did, which is a _very_ unsafe bet. Well, someone resurrect this thread by 2034, cheers.

That's for sure.

Advancements in computing are not some sort of linear plotline.

It is extremely unlikely that we will go another ten years without the emergence of a new type of differentiated silicon that will provide highly desirable functionality that current silicon will not be able handle due to a workload unsuitable for current transistors.

What that usage case will be no one here can predict but computing technology doesn't stay still very long. Some day, some group will announce a new video compression standard that today's best GPUs don't have hardware support for. And yet at some point your phone will likely support it.

Even in desktop CPUs we have seen the recent emergence of p-cores and e-cores, a feature that has been in mobile SoCs for many, many years.

 

[dgianstefani]

That's for sure.

Advancements in computing are not some sort of linear plotline.

It is extremely unlikely that we will go another ten years without the emergence of a new type of differentiated silicon that will provide highly desirable functionality that current silicon will not be able handle due to a workload unsuitable for current transistors.

What that usage case will be no one here can predict but computing technology doesn't stay still very long.

Even in desktop CPUs we have seen the recent emergence of p-cores and e-cores, a feature that has been in mobile SoCs for many, many years.

Even just 15th generation Intel has three significant advancements, Gate All Around transistors (RibbonFET), tile based dies with an active interposer for the efficiency/performance of monolithic but the flexibility of chiplets (Foveros), and Backside Power Delivery (PowerVIA). The last major transistor advancement was FinFET in 2012 with Ivy Bridge.

GAA transistors are still technically finFET I suppose.

 

[Klemc]

Intel needs one powerplant by house, i would file a complaint in times of ecologigal disasters.

My 9700F was 65w !!!!!!!

 

[cvaldes]

Even just 15th generation Intel has three significant advancements, Gate All Around transistors (RibbonFET), tile based dies with an active interposer for the efficiency/performance of monolithic but the flexibility of chiplets, and Backside Power Delivery (PowerVIA). The last major transistor advancement was FinFET in 2011.

Yeah, I was talking more about new feature introduction. Whatever advancements occur in semiconductor design and manufacturing will eventually trickle down to consumer parts.

However the average person doesn't understand all of the advancements in the semiconductor industry. They do understand when their smartphone camera takes better low light photos, the battery lasts longer, or there's some fancy image to text identification thingy.

You could send an Intel or AMD Powerpoint slide deck to most people, they'd flip through it, hand it back to you with glazed eyes and say, "well, what's my benefit?" I'm not sure if 10% of TPU forum participants can explain what FinFET is, let alone what it replaced and what will likely replace it.

Hell, many people here think DLSS is "cheating", that native rasterization is always better. All computer graphics are fakery.

You could list all of the semiconductor advancements of 15th gen Intel here but that's not going to mean anything to OP.

 

[dgianstefani]

Intel needs one powerplant by house, i would file a complaint in times of ecologigal disasters.

My 9700F wads 65w !!!!!!!

And so is the 14700F, if you want to pretend base power limits are what the CPUs actually draw.

 

[Klemc]

And so is the 14700F, if you want to pretend base power limits are what the CPUs actually draw.

View attachment 340638

9000 had no max 200/350w thingy.

PDT
65 W

It could exceed a bit the 65w, but never draw higher than less 90w anyway.

Intel needs to be in court, they poluate the world.

 

[evernessince]

I just want to thank all of you who have responded. I appreciate the advice.

The gist of the advice is, 11th gen for a 10 year plan is a mistake and i can see where you are coming from with that point. The reason I started out with 10th / 11th was this: id built my partner a 10400 based pc around 2021 and its been great, but what I really wanted to do was get her an i7 but at the time I couldnt afford it when they came out. I recently got her an i7 10700 and that meant there was this `spare `10400` and this started me thinking about the proposed 10 year plan. I know its not an ideal solution but I thought it may make an interestingn project to see if I could build a pc from 10 / 11th gen to last 10 years. Its clear from the feedback its not going to work out.

So let me change the rules a little. Lets say I build a 2021 pc to the highest spec I can afford and see if that would last 10 years from 2021, i.e. to 2031 without needing any major upgrades.

If I was to attempt this which graphics card would you reccomend? RTX 3080 based or RX 6900 based?

It might be best to give a budget, when you'd be making the purchase, and state any part preferences you have. That way people here can put together a PCPartpicker list / lists that's optimized for those conditions and you can select whichever from among them you like the most.

 

[dgianstefani]

9000 had no max 200/350w thingy.

PDT
65 W

It could exceed a bit the 65w, but never draw higher than less 90w anyway.

Intel needs to be in court, they poluate the world.

You do realise that efficiency is a metric defined by work done/power consumed right?

The 14900K is more efficient than the 9900K despite drawing more power, because it is significantly faster, with 3x the cores. Therefore, the 14900K is better for the environment than the 9900K, because it will spend less time at higher levels of power draw, since the same work will get done faster, and less power in total will be used.

If you care about power draw then just set a limit in the BIOS, it's not hard.

Or just buy a non K CPU.

Like the 14900, or 14900T.

 

[Dr. Dro]

Intel needs one powerplant by house, i would file a complaint in times of ecologigal disasters.

My 9700F was 65w !!!!!!!

Klem, 65W spec CPUs still exist. But just like the ones released nowadays, the PL2 power figure of the i7-9700F is about twice that much. Around 130W ish.

9000 had no max 200/350w thingy.

PDT
65 W

It could exceed a bit the 65w, but never draw higher than less 90w anyway.

Intel needs to be in court, they poluate the world.

They did

The Intel 9th Gen Review: Core i9-9900K, Core i7-9700K and Core i5-9600K Tested

www.anandtech.com

It might be best to give a budget, when you'd be making the purchase, and state any part preferences you have. That way people here can put together a PCPartpicker list / lists that's optimized for those conditions and you can select whichever from among them you like the most.

Problem here is that OP doesn't have a budget at all. It's a dumpster dive-as-you-go sort of build. They plan on starting out with some sort of amalgam/assortment of parts and replacing with the "10 year upgrade" as they go.

 

[cvaldes]

You do realise that efficiency is a metric defined by work done/power consumed right?

The 14900K is more efficient than the 9900K despite drawing more power, because it is significantly faster, with 3x the cores. Therefore, the 14900K is better for the environment than the 9900K, because it will spend less time at higher levels of power draw, since the same work will get done faster, and less power in total will be used.

If you care about power draw then just set a limit in the BIOS, it's not hard.

Or just buy a non K CPU.

Like the 14900, or 14900T.

There are a *LOT* of people online who don't understand the concept of performance-per-watt. So they point at an M3 Apple MacBook Pro, laugh and jeer "It's slower than my 14900K + RTX 4090!"

 

[N/A]

Lets say I build a 2021 pc to the highest spec I can afford and see if that would last 10 years from 2021, i.e. to 2031 without needing any major upgrades.

If I was to attempt this which graphics card would you reccomend? RTX 3080 based or RX 6900 based?

3080 based and one that never participated in mining activities, the 12GB version for the extra 2GB if you can find.
3080 12GB from 2020 is like GTX 980 4GB 2014, surviving on borrowed time.
well 3080 12 is almost as good as 4080 12 / 4070 Ti was if you don't count the frame generation, but who wants that crap anyway
you'll have to set the power limit to 66% power to lower the heat. and replace the thermal pads
swap 10400F for 11400F for almost free, don't get the 11700 yet if you can wait because,
you can always state It's a 2021 PC, never mind when you bought it actually to see it works in 2031
DDR4 maxed at 32GB, NVMe go for any good affordable 2TB /w 5GB/s read/write. Lexar or something.
PSU my personal preference is Gold rated at least, but expensive, platinum is too expensive.

 

[Dr. Dro]

3080 based and one that never participated in mining activities, the 12GB version for the extra 2GB if you can find.
3080 12GB in 2020 is like GTX 980 4GB in 2014, surviving on borrowed time.
well 3080 12 is almost as good as 4080 12 / 4070 Ti was if you don't count the frame generation, but who wants that crap anyway
you'll have to set the power limit to 66% power to lower the heat. and replace the thermal pads
swap 10400F for 11400F for almost free, don't get the 11700 yet if you can wait because,
you can always state It's a 2021 PC, never mind when you bought it actually to see it works in 2031
DDR4 maxed at 32GB, NVMe go for any good affordable 2TB /w 5GB/s read/write. Lexar or something.
PSU my personal preference is Gold rated at least, but expensive, platinum is too expensive.

Well the 12 GB 3080 only came over a year later and DLSS-G is... extremely useful because it actually works, but don't think they're on borrowed time, no. It'll be a long time until 12 GB VRAM is a problem targeting realistic settings.

 

[AMF]

am4 5950xt is coming