chrcolukI see they still have kids designing these things.

Ironically my best wifi signal is on a router with internal antennas.

Select few realize what link budget and antenna gain is.
Typically, the bigger the better, but nowadays we have some clever designs for internal antennae that outperform many 'prongs' sticking out of the router. But given the target audience I'd say all is in order.

TechLurkerWhile I'm not thrilled with the ridiculous design, one thing I do like about sticking with ASUS routers is their AI Mesh that does allow repurposing of older (ASUS) routers into mesh nodes in less-used sections of the house (and even yard, using a wired backhaul and directional paddle antennae). They already hide in a fan-vented media cabinet, out of sight, so the looks isn't a dealbreaker.

I'll probably end up waiting for the price to come down and firmware to mature before buying it, like I did for the AX-11000, then finally retire the ancient AC1300 from backyard duties and replace it with the next oldest; the AC2900. Maybe capitalize on the 10GbE to finally pair with a Microtik switch that already has a 10GbE line to a home server. It also times well with my housing area finally getting some fiber internet laid down by AT&T and offering up to 2.5GbE in the near future (their Gigabit Fiber is priced very competitively to the local Cable Gigabit, but is symmetrical).

Kudos on the choice of MT! It's spelled with 2 'K', though.

Be aware that although similar in appearance, routers and switches has totally different internal designs. You need to know very well what do you need in order to get the proper devices for it.

zlobbyKudos on the choice of MT! It's spelled with 2 'K', though.

Be aware that although similar in appearance, routers and switches has totally different internal designs. You need to know very well what do you need in order to get the proper devices for it.

Yeah, I found that out the hard way while diving through MT's wiki guides on configuring a hand-me-down 24 1GbE port + 2 10GbE SFP Router/Switch unit and converting it over to act as just a switch since I already had a router, and converted the current cable modem/router provided by the Internet provider into a pass-through switch only. Their pricy pure 10GbE switch unit cost me a pretty penny, but it's been a great upgrade just for in-house networking. I can now effectively just work off the server computer, and I'm tempted to put my gaming computer in another room and just remote LAN into it that way too.

TechLurkerYeah, I found that out the hard way while diving through MT's wiki guides on configuring a hand-me-down 24 1GbE port + 2 10GbE SFP Router/Switch unit and converting it over to act as just a switch since I already had a router, and converted the current cable modem/router provided by the Internet provider into a pass-through switch only. Their pricy pure 10GbE switch unit cost me a pretty penny, but it's been a great upgrade just for in-house networking. I can now effectively just work off the server computer, and I'm tempted to put my gaming computer in another room and just remote LAN into it that way too.

I guess for typical home uses it's more or less the same. If you start with interface bonding, VLANs, heavy routing, VPN, CAPsMAN, etc. you'd need separate devices.
Some of my UPS-backed Tiks have more than 3 years of uptime. The only downtime was because of SW patching; otherwise they are doing gigabits per second 24/7 without hiccups. I'd like to see an ASUS or a TP-LINK doing this.

NaterWhat I'll never understand... Why "standard" routers have all the antenna, and then mesh systems there isn't one to be found.

Because mesh routers hop from point to point or utilize wireless backhaul via 4x4 MIMO for connection between the 2 or 3 points.

The ones that hop are generally going to be limited in range and speed relatively speaking... Most bottleneck around 500mbps and cannot handle 1gig ISP speeds for max coverage throughout a large home.

Specific units capable of 4x4 WL backhaul will innately offer more coverage at further distances than a single point unit as the connection speed is limited to the 4x4 radios rather than just a central unit + regular 2x2 client. Basic config is dedicated backhaul radio @ 4x4 then 2x2 + 2x2 for 5G and 2.4G connections. You can find high end 4x4+4x4+4x4 MESH unit, but the cost start to really push upward.

Bigger units (like this one) will generally provide EVEN better coverage if configured as a similar mesh setup with 4x4 MIMO WL backhaul. You can't beat physics. Physical antennas are superior to internal ones.

IE: Your cell phone is built for aesthetics, rather than max functionality.

jaszyPhysical antennas are superior to internal ones.

Don't take this as a rule. Bad design of external antenna can gimp it, while a cleverly designed internal one can beat it in gain.

jaszyIE: Your cell phone is built for aesthetics, rather than max functionality.

Albeit true, smartphone antennae are extremely complex. Nowadays you can even send a short message or a small picture from your phone via satellite e.g., iPhone 14 and Galaxy S23 for example!

Imagine doing this in mmWave bands, hundreds of miles away, just with some tiny antennae in your phone!

I'm partial to agree since ASUS themselves have complex internal antenna designs on their mesh units such as ET12, XT12, and GT6. I would argue these units outclass (mesh) competition for performance, per environment.

I guess my main argument is that most basic WIFI hardware or "high end units" favor physical antenna designs as a single point solution with similar 4x4 radios and connecting clients.

An internal design can beat cheap external/physical implementations with entry radios, low end amps, and or underrated power output etc... but I would argue against that on the "high end" spectrum, at least when it comes to ASUS hardware.

IE: Single XT12 may/will perform worse than even a lower end AX86S ($180 currently) as an example (distance). Plenty of factors to account for.

wNotyarDWiFi 7? I can't even get a 6E router around here.

:D it's for enthusiast that has money tree

jaszyI'm partial to agree since ASUS themselves have complex internal antenna designs on their mesh units such as ET12, XT12, and GT6. I would argue these units outclass (mesh) competition for performance, per environment.

I guess my main argument is that most basic WIFI hardware or "high end units" favor physical antenna designs as a single point solution with similar 4x4 radios and connecting clients.

An internal design can beat cheap external/physical implementations with entry radios, low end amps, and or underrated power output etc... but I would argue against that on the "high end" spectrum, at least when it comes to ASUS hardware.

IE: Single XT12 may/will perform worse than even a lower end AX86S ($180 currently) as an example (distance). Plenty of factors to account for.

Couple of things here:
1. All antennae are physical per se, be it internal or external. Antennae arrays are also physical, although each and every individual element in them can be regarded as logical.
2. Mid-tier MT, ubi, Rukus (among others) with internal antennae can and will vastly outperform most (if not all) high-end ASUS units with external antennae.

Although antennae are just a small portion of the entire link budget equation. Here is the whole thing even though it's for a 5G cell in this example. It's absolutely the same for every RF gadget sans the names of the devices.

jaszyBecause mesh routers hop from point to point or utilize wireless backhaul via 4x4 MIMO for connection between the 2 or 3 points.

The ones that hop are generally going to be limited in range and speed relatively speaking... Most bottleneck around 500mbps and cannot handle 1gig ISP speeds for max coverage throughout a large home.

Specific units capable of 4x4 WL backhaul will innately offer more coverage at further distances than a single point unit as the connection speed is limited to the 4x4 radios rather than just a central unit + regular 2x2 client. Basic config is dedicated backhaul radio @ 4x4 then 2x2 + 2x2 for 5G and 2.4G connections. You can find high end 4x4+4x4+4x4 MESH unit, but the cost start to really push upward.

Bigger units (like this one) will generally provide EVEN better coverage if configured as a similar mesh setup with 4x4 MIMO WL backhaul. You can't beat physics. Physical antennas are superior to internal ones.

IE: Your cell phone is built for aesthetics, rather than max functionality.

2023 is the year I think I take the plunge, I've been shopping for new networking hardware + NAS, and I really like the idea of going full 10Gb at a minimum. I fully live with the bottleneck as well, WiFi 6 sucks if you get more than 10' or so from the router. I'm about 40' away thru a wall in the garage and my desktop is sitting at 306/210 Mbps (TP Link WiFi6 Walmart hardware). I can get 1200 Mbps Xfinity internet now (we were capped at 200Mbps for the last decade or so), and I just bought a new cable modem w/ a 2.5Gb port as a starting point. They bumped us to 400Mbps, so here my uber ultra fast WiFi6 buzzword marketing is knee-capping me.

I've always been skeptical of the Mesh system kits, especially with the price. I've been leaning toward the Asus hardware as I can buy once, and then keep adding on as the budget allows, knowing that they're always coming out with new gear that will mesh with last years. I love the idea of the Synology switch(seperate Wifi networks) + NAS as well.

On the flip side QNAP and Ubiquiti seem to have some great values, and it'd be nice to have everything the same brand that plays nice. OCD would kill me to have Asus Router & access points, and a QNAP switch, and Synology NAS, Intel NICs, etc. So frozen in anxiety of a potential buyers remorse. (yet here we have been happy as pigs in shit w/ a $120 Walmart TP Link router for the last few years)

Nater2023 is the year I think I take the plunge, I've been shopping for new networking hardware + NAS, and I really like the idea of going full 10Gb at a minimum. I fully live with the bottleneck as well, WiFi 6 sucks if you get more than 10' or so from the router. I'm about 40' away thru a wall in the garage and my desktop is sitting at 306/210 Mbps (TP Link WiFi6 Walmart hardware). I can get 1200 Mbps Xfinity internet now (we were capped at 200Mbps for the last decade or so), and I just bought a new cable modem w/ a 2.5Gb port as a starting point. They bumped us to 400Mbps, so here my uber ultra fast WiFi6 buzzword marketing is knee-capping me.

I've always been skeptical of the Mesh system kits, especially with the price. I've been leaning toward the Asus hardware as I can buy once, and then keep adding on as the budget allows, knowing that they're always coming out with new gear that will mesh with last years. I love the idea of the Synology switch(seperate Wifi networks) + NAS as well.

On the flip side QNAP and Ubiquiti seem to have some great values, and it'd be nice to have everything the same brand that plays nice. OCD would kill me to have Asus Router & access points, and a QNAP switch, and Synology NAS, Intel NICs, etc. So frozen in anxiety of a potential buyers remorse. (yet here we have been happy as pigs in shit w/ a $120 Walmart TP Link router for the last few years)

QNAP over anything else is consumer space. Well, for NAS at least. I'm not a fan of their networking gear.