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NVIDIA GeForce 4XX Series Discussion

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No information source. Unless you find fact in the phrase " IT LOOKS LIKE".
 
People may not like Charlie but ive found that hes been about 80% correct in the past 6 months and lately hes been dead on soo...It could just be him stiring shit up like usual but he could be right and alot of Nvidia fanbois will be upset.
 
Who cares what he says. Everyone should be a little upset with no new Nvidia cards. There needs to be competition, or ATi prices go up (they already are). Either way, it looks like yields are a problem. No, not just for Nvidia either as 40nm ATi cards are few and far between.
 
Wow, still no news of any new Nvidia cards:eek:

Im starting to wonder.... When did they drop the ball :confused:
 
I'm glad other people are recognizing the accuracy of Charlie's reporting, instead of just slamming him for his (very) cynical style - he's got good reason to be, especially when it comes to nvidia with their spin & lies.

He certainly know what he's talking about and that's what helps all of us stay informed and hopefully helps to keep nvidia that little bit on their toes and pull their finger out.

And before anyone accuses me of being an ATI fanboy, I'm currently using nvidia (see specs).
 

FUD in the UK doesnt mean that i think you might get a laugh if you google it.

Yup so they held back again on more details. I just expected that.
Must be the yields the 40nm tech just isnt there yet PROBLY, on paper and design yes but manufacturing the chips seems to be hit and a lot of miss from the measly details we have been given.

Arnt there 40nm CPU? out there?

WTF is going on NVIDIA spill some beans! We need to know what the cards are like and wtf the hold up is. I think they are acting like twats that ATi cant find out what its up to because that could influence card prices and the market in ATi favour.

Good thing about ATi is they have AMD who have all those FABs to make the GPUs in.

Im waiting it out to just see what is available and if Nvidia is overpriced or rubbish i can always swap to ATi or vice versa. The GTX 260 is fine for these days.
 
I'm glad other people are recognizing the accuracy of Charlie's reporting, instead of just slamming him for his (very) cynical style - he's got good reason to be, especially when it comes to nvidia with their spin & lies.

He certainly know what he's talking about and that's what helps all of us stay informed and hopefully helps to keep nvidia that little bit on their toes and pull their finger out.

And before anyone accuses me of being an ATI fanboy, I'm currently using nvidia (see specs).

Nobody would accuse you of being a fanboy, but don't praise Charlie for rabble rousing. He could be a much more intelligent writer, but instead he acts like a zealot for some cause.
 
Nobody would accuse you of being a fanboy, but don't praise Charlie for rabble rousing. He could be a much more intelligent writer, but instead he acts like a zealot for some cause.

I do think his writing is intelligent, otherwise how could he be accurate and insightful?

And yes, he does broadcast his cynicism like a zealot, or a fanatic, I'll give you that. :) Just relax man! :laugh:

Like all of us here, I just want ATI to have some decent competition. £350 for a 5870 is monopoly pricing and it sucks.
 
I wish Nvidia would announce a launch date already, I'm not willing to pay $380+ for a 5870.

When Nvidia Launches GT300 the the 5870's prices will go down.
 
Just relax man! :laugh:

Man I could say the same for your fingers too. They need to take a load off. Previously I stated the opinion that writing fanatically destroys his credibility. Sure you, erocker, and a number of other people with a few braincells to rub together can see that it's not a good time to buy, but since when has the price of ATI cards been the focus of your posts? You started a lot of conversation, but when you chime in it's not about prices/performance but instead about criticisms of the marketing and PR department of NV. OH GOD IT'S A MOCK-UP CARD! HOLY SH!T Charlie made a call that Fermi would be late and he might be right!

I've known people who have good sources of information, but they don't make bold accusations and instead state facts. Despite how good his might be about the GT300/GF100 what has he said about when the card will come out that's been backed up? He's only said it won't come out at X time, and for Y reasons. Expect to see these cards between late Dec and end of Q1? Oh man I remember learning about estimations in elementry school. It was a blast. Most of the time I could guess within 20 beans how many jellies were in the jar. Who cares? For the sake of making it clear, Charlie's factless/fanatic writing makes his credibility zilch, nilch, and squat. This is a criticism of Charlie. If you don't like it then relax your fingers because there will be more responses like this if I feal like I didn't give a calm, clear, and collected response.
 
i too agree that it won't surprise me if what charlie is saying is true. I mean it fits with what we've seen so far, or i guess i should say haven't seen. I mean when before has ATI or Nvidia not mentioned something about their upcoming chip, how great it'll be? esp with ATI controlling the market right now. I mean even when AMD was working on Phenom, they still hyped it up and it was a fail in respect to what the public had expected. ATI is already doing better than Nvidia with 40nm yields, once they get it optimized and more perfected their cards are going to start rolling out much better and in better supply. IMO its almost scary to think that Nvidia is having this big a problem getting Fermi/GT300 going. Maybe this generation delay and issues will change their view on using monolithic design in the future.

I have a question, why does it take 6-8weeks to get silicon back? does it really take that long for to get the chip architecture on a wafer?
 
i'm feel dejavu already it's really like FX day!, come on nvdia give use some competition
 
Once the plans arrive at the fab there are many steps involved in the making of the chip, then testing the chips, then adding them into a card, then testign the card. then shipped back to the R&D lab at NV, testing the cards that passes for clock speeds, voltage requirements, interfereance, etc... a thousand thigns that can go wrong and screw up a good design.


Look at what Intel did with the P4, all the signs pointed for them to keep increasing clock speeds, AMD came though with the more clock efficient Athalon and raped their performance. So they had to go back to the drawing board, found the P3 had the makings with smaller process and tech improvements and with the information about what doesn't work tehy were able to kill the Athalon dynasty in one shot.


NV is in the same spot, as traces get smaller the number of defects per useable area kills yields and useability, lets say for a 280 they had 10% redundancy built in and allowed for recovery of 40% of their yield with defective parts to make a still operational chip. By shrinking the process the physical defect int he chip that used to damage 2% of the chip now damages 4%. A 50% jump in damage, so only two damaged components are allowed per chip, and only in specific areas like the shaders or memory. If they were working with a 10% overbuild, and salvaged 70% of the wafer, and now are facing chips with the same number of defects but with a smaller process they might only be getting a 40-50% yeild from the same wafer.


Either way I await the green camps launch to make my move, unless the 2GB variant hits and is available long enough for me to order.
 
Yeah, 6-8 weeks to see how good the initial yields are.. craploads of testing has to be done on the first chips. I wouldnt underestimate the complexity of those 40nm chips that include 3 billion trannies.

NV has to do DX11 for the first time. ATI already has a bit more experience with DX11-like features such as tessellation, DX10.1, etc.. but Nvidia designed all of their chips with only basic DX10 features. NV deliberately omitted some of those features before the DX10 specifications were finalized and locked-in by Microsoft when Vista was being developed, so DX10 was not as "awesome" as it would have been if it was the way Microsoft intended it to be with tessellation features and stuff (of which ATI complied with).
 
Who knows what it meant when nV released DX10.1 cards. I'm still confused by that move, but they should not be confused with DX11. Some of nV's staff is on the standards committee for DX11... so they should have a good idea how to execute within the parameters.
 
Are there any solid news on when these cards are supposed to be coming out?

Most of the news I find are not exactly news because they're so old or just really vague. Definitely no solid info on when they'll arrive.
 
Are there any solid news on when these cards are supposed to be coming out?

Most of the news I find are not exactly news because they're so old or just really vague. Definitely no solid info on when they'll arrive.

Solid news! Fermi to be released in Q1 2010. For anyone who was planning a green Christmas... think again! Just hold on to your green if you want to go green.

Source: VR-Zone
 
one question, somone mentioned the ati HD5870 being like £350 but i have seen it for £300 in most shops neer me, and also how much did the 4870 cost at the time of release or even the 4870x2? i bet it cost the same as the new cards do yet the new card is at least twice as powerfull as a 4870 and on par or better than a 4870x2 and suports new fetures so i can't see the prob with the price personaly.


as for nvidia i gave up on them years ago but not cause i don't like them its just i always felt ripped of when buying there cards and seeing poor performance, all my cheaper ati cards have out performed any nvidia that is supose to be around the same performace wise.

nvidia might come out with the best card ever made but the price has to be good and it has to suport all new fetures in my opinion because if it don't then what is the point making somthing for DX if it dont fully utilise it.

Still wont buy nvidia again tho even if they do kick ass again or maybe i'm just getting old and don't care anymore.
 
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one question, somone mentioned the ati HD5870 being like £350 but i have seen it for £300 in most shops neer me, and also how much did the 4870 cost at the time of release or even the 4870x2? i bet it cost the same as the new cards do yet the new card is at least twice as powerfull as a 4870 and on par or better than a 4870x2 and suports new fetures so i can't see the prob with the price personaly.


as for nvidia i gave up on them years ago but not cause i don't like them its just i always felt ripped of when buying there cards and seeing poor performance, all my cheaper ati cards have out performed any nvidia that is supose to be around the same performace wise.

nvidia might come out with the best card ever made but the price has to be good and it has to suport all new fetures in my opinion because if it don't then what is the point making somthing for DX if it dont fully utilise it.

Still wont buy nvidia again tho even if they do kick ass again or maybe i'm just getting old and don't care anymore.

Please stay on topic. This thread is about the discussion of the GT300. Not about company policy, marketing strats, or opinions about other GPUs.
 
Solid news! Fermi to be released in Q1 2010. For anyone who was planning a green Christmas... think again! Just hold on to your green if you want to go green.

Source: VR-Zone



The original source for that is Xbit Labs.


According to that, a Q1 2010 release is very hard to achieve.. Most probably it'll be out by early Q2.



This leaves ATI with a 6 month advance.. by then they could come up with a refresh.
 
The original source for that is Xbit Labs.


According to that, a Q1 2010 release is very hard to achieve.. Most probably it'll be out by early Q2.



This leaves ATI with a 6 month advance.. by then they could come up with a refresh.

There's nothing in that article that says Q1 2010 would be hard to achieve.
 
If indeed something goes a little bit off plans - as they often do with chip development - we are looking at Q2 2010.

That would be a ways off but still might be a good time... right around the time we will probbaly see an influx of DX11 game launches. The "i scratch your back you scratch mind kind of tactic"

And ATI was thinking "Well, we will have a Q1 2010 launch too but why don't we crank out what we have, so what if supply doesn't fulfill demand, we will have the jump and by the time they are ready we will have our enthusiast level of GPU's shipped."
 
There's nothing in that article that says Q1 2010 would be hard to achieve.
See the quote in shevanel's post.


That would be a ways off but still might be a good time... right around the time we will probbaly see an influx of DX11 game launches. The "i scratch your back you scratch mind kind of tactic"

And ATI was thinking "Well, we will have a Q1 2010 launch too but why don't we crank out what we have, so what if supply doesn't fulfill demand, we will have the jump and by the time they are ready we will have our enthusiast level of GPU's shipped."

And you are assuming that Fermi will be available in large quantities at launch because...?

The HD5800s aren't that hard to find. Maybe people wont find them at their local retailers, but with a little patiente and some online searching, most will have one after 2 or 3 days.
 
Nvidia Fermi launch slips into January 2010

Oh, great. :rolleyes:
 
See the quote in shevanel's post.




And you are assuming that Fermi will be available in large quantities at launch because...?

The HD5800s aren't that hard to find. Maybe people wont find them at their local retailers, but with a little patiente and some online searching, most will have one after 2 or 3 days.

I never assumed that.
 
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