Milestones

[garyinhere]

It's not called anger when you call something by it's name. With this new system how many will actually see five starts on there badge... you, maybe two others! From my perspective this undermines the fundamentals of a reward system. Which was put in place to keep people crunching. HONESTLY this turns me off completely! Rewarding 1~5 out of however many active members we have is a complete 180 of a true reward system! I'm not gonna quit crunching but this crap has me questioning the leadership of the team. MOST don't even have 4 quads to crunch in the first place which = demotivation in my opinion!

 

[Athlon2K15]

@ ION

you know he has a good point...you dont deserve a badge

 

[AlienIsGOD]

OoO... Hey the main badge is still there, and thats what matters. Stars are just fluffy stuff that looks nice. As long as you crunch for the team does it really matter how many stars are above ur name?

 

[[Ion]]

I fully understand that, but most can't get the crazy folder badge either. The requirement for 5 stars was originally going to be 15k, I talked with CP and managed to get it lowered to 12k to make it so that more members would qualify

I understand that most don't have 4 quads, normally, I'd have probably 3 stars, which is IMO fine, I'd be happy with that knowing that I'm helping

 

[garyinhere]

OoO... Hey the main badge is still there, and thats what matters. Stars are just fluffy stuff that looks nice. As long as you crunch for the team does it really matter how many stars are above ur name?

The badge itself is implemented as a reward. The stars are Suposed to show "dedication"... to remove yourself from badge chasers. I work my a$$ off to keep MY 4 machines running stable and crunching 24/7. So if it don't matter to you , you really don't need to interupt

 

[garyinhere]

I fully understand that, but most can't get the crazy folder badge either. The requirement for 5 stars was originally going to be 15k, I talked with CP and managed to get it lowered to 12k to make it so that more members would qualify

I understand that most don't have 4 quads, normally, I'd have probably 3 stars, which is IMO fine, I'd be happy with that knowing that I'm helping

I think a few psychology books should be read before "our leadership" determines how to reward people... cause this is bass ackwards!

 

[[Ion]]

I think a few psychology books should be read before "our leadership" determines how to reward people... cause this is bass ackwards!

What are you getting at with this statement??

Oh, and Alien, I agree totally

 

[garyinhere]

If you don't understand what I said PM me....

and if you don't think the stars matter, take them off so it doesn't make people question whether or not we are on the right team!

 

[garyinhere]

A reward system should have a reachable goal. Use a bell curve on active members average points per day and base the star system off numbers, not off of numbers just plucked from someone's butt. I mean, we work on projects for science so why wouldn't we apply some methodology to a True reward system... the way it's set up it only rewards 1 percent as far as i can tell and that in my opinion will make people leave the team. Don't get me wrong, i enjoy this team and the time/energy that i have donated to it and wcg but this new star system has really got me wondering about how things are being ran.

 

[[Ion]]

IMO, considering we don't actually 'get' anything for our donations, this is fine. Yes, 4 & 5 stars are hard to get, but that's the point. If we made it really easy, they wouldn't mean anything. I don't expect most users to have more than 2 or 3 stars, 4+ stars are just for those who have significant resources at their disposal (such as Mindweaver, KieX, mjkmike, and myself). Having high requirements makes the last 2 stars extra-special, and it shows an extra level of dedication/donation.

 

[theonedub]

5 stars on the WCG badge is not equivalent to getting the crazy folder badge. 25k PPD is a whole lot more manageable than 12k PPD BOINC if you go by what hardware is accessible by the majority of people on the forum.

Lets not get this thread derailed though. If there is legitimate concern (again) maybe we should make a new thread and keep it as civil as possible.

 

[garyinhere]

IMO, considering we don't actually 'get' anything for our donations, this is fine. Yes, 4 & 5 stars are hard to get, but that's the point. If we made it really easy, they wouldn't mean anything. I don't expect most users to have more than 2 or 3 stars, 4+ stars are just for those who have significant resources at their disposal (such as Mindweaver, KieX, mjkmike, and myself). Having high requirements makes the last 2 stars extra-special, and it shows an extra level of dedication/donation.

So you've named 4 out of how many crunchers? I expected a robotic response and expected you to ignore my valid points so far! "they don't really matter" then take them off. But, they are there to reward right. Why not make it fair? This conversation seem VERY familiar to one we had a while ago with if you were doing what's right by putting the schools computers in your name which are funded on the federal level and local tax level was right or not!

 

[PVTCaboose1337]

So you've named 4 out of how many crunchers? I expected a robotic response and expected you to ignore my valid points so far! "they don't really matter" then take them off. But, they are there to reward right. Why not make it fair? This conversation seem VERY familiar to one we had a while ago with if you were doing what's right by putting the schools computers in your name which are funded on the federal level and local tax level was right or not!

Gary and I are working on a correct mathematical implementation on the proposed new star system. This will be proved with mathematics and graphs.

 

[theonedub]

Just think of what you need for each badge-

For Crazy Folder you could do 2 i7s, a single i7 and a mid range GPU, or two mid range GPUs and still pull 25kPPD (just three quick examples)

on the other hand for 5 star WCG you need 3+ i7s or an entire computer lab and then some

I said the requirements were prohibitively high when CP first put them up. I have no problem with making them harder to get, but I think the way it is now is pretty ridiculous. No one needs to tell me its not the badge that counts, I know that- go tell the badge chasers ;p.

Make a thread, include a poll, let the people who actually crunch decide. Yeah its not a big deal, but its something that can be easily changed, so why not?

Oh, if you guys want to try and make some new way to determine badges keep this in mind: the metric you use needs to be easily pulled from FreeDC. We had a great idea to use runtime/day, but you can't track that on FreeDC so in the bin it went.

 

[[Ion]]

Gary and I are working on a correct mathematical implementation on the proposed new star system. This will be proved with mathematics and graphs.

If you don't mind me asking, what does this consist of?

Just think of what you need for each badge-

For Crazy Folder you could do 2 i7s, a single i7 and a mid range GPU, or two mid range GPUs and still pull 25kPPD (just three quick examples)

on the other hand for 5 star WCG you need 3+ i7s or an entire computer lab and then some

I said the requirements were prohibitively high when CP first put them up. I have no problem with making them harder to get, but I think the way it is now is pretty ridiculous. No one needs to tell me its not the badge that counts, I know that- go tell the badge chasers ;p.

Make a thread, include a poll, let the people who actually crunch decide. Yeah its not a big deal, but its something that can be easily changed, so why not?

Oh, if you guys want to try and make some new way to determine badges keep this in mind: the metric you use needs to be easily pulled from FreeDC. We had a great idea to use runtime/day, but you can't track that on FreeDC so in the bin it went.

That certainly is a point. It would take 20 of the Pentium Dual Core systems to qualify for the 5 stars in WCG--although, it would take the same 20 to get a Crazy Folder badge as well. I've always thought the Crazy Folder badge a bit low, but that's not for discussion here.

I'm completely happy with the current badges, they aren't perfect, but we're never going to find something that everyone likes, and these are good enough

 

[PVTCaboose1337]

If you don't mind me asking, what does this consist of?


That certainly is a point. It would take 20 of the Pentium Dual Core systems to qualify for the 5 stars in WCG--although, it would take the same 20 to get a Crazy Folder badge as well. I've always thought the Crazy Folder badge a bit low, but that's not for discussion here.

I'm completely happy with the current badges, they aren't perfect, but we're never going to find something that everyone likes, and these are good enough

I am going to do math and use graphs and come up with a mathematical function to determine a reasonable PPD for each star.

 

[garyinhere]

a new thread will be started for this so this one can stay on topic

 

[[Ion]]

Aha, cool

I still think that Star 5 should be reserved for just the top-4 or top-5 by PPD, just to signify something extra

 

[Athlon2K15]

only if you are in fact using your own cpu's and not raping your schools cpu power. Thats like me going to best buy and making all there rigs crunch

 

[theonedub]

Aha, cool

I still think that Star 5 should be reserved for just the top-4 or top-5 by PPD, just to signify something extra

I would love to see you sing the same tune if you didnt have your school's lab and were still scrambling just to find outlets to plug in what you did own.

 

[[Ion]]

I would love to see you sing the same tune if you didnt have your school's lab and were still scrambling just to find outlets to plug in what you did own.

OK

I'm still going to stand behind my earlier statement that there should be something for just the top-few. After all, we aren't getting anything for the stars, so who does it hurt?

 

[garyinhere]

Aha, cool

I still think that Star 5 should be reserved for just the top-4 or top-5 by PPD, just to signify something extra

I know you want the last word but, like i said a thread is being made lets keep this one on topic

 

[theonedub]

OK

I'm still going to stand behind my earlier statement that there should be something for just the top-few. After all, we aren't getting anything for the stars, so who does it hurt?

It doesn't hurt anyone, which is the point. Its not going to hurt anyone to make the requirements more realistic. I don't think it makes any one any less 'special' if more people have 5 stars

 

[[Ion]]

Agreed, I'm fine with seeing the requirements for that being lowered to ~10k or so, in order to get more people in, but if it was diluted down to 5k or so I'd be disappointed

 

[theonedub]

I want to see the math PVT and Gary come up with. It seems logical to calculate the requirements rather than arbitrarily setting numbers by what sounds good to some person(s).