"NVIDIA is the Single Worst Company We've Ever Dealt With:" Linus Torvalds

trickson · Jun 18, 2012

What a real professional guy is all I can say!

TheoneandonlyMrK · Jun 18, 2012

trickson said:
I hate smart phones. If you are so dumb as to not know where you are in your own town then get a map! If you are so dependent on a smart phone and app to help you out every day of your life you need to seek some real help and fast!
What is the world coming to when I need to tell my smart phone to remind me to clean up my home? How lazy and stupid are we any way? Really people! so your android phone has a nVidia video card? OH man!

calm thy self,,, its a phone 1st and whatever else 2nd,, i dont use/need maps web books or games, but now and again.

your missing the PAD angle too plus other netportal type devices , tegra telly with lynux back os anyone

.

ocre said:
nvidia wants to protect its technology best it can. They support linux completely with drivers, very stable and good drivers at that. They just havent been generous when it comes to giving away their code. Nvidia would rather give out drivers they made for linux than give away their code to open source. If you think about it, why would nvidia want to give away their secrets? Stuff like optimus gives nvidia a competitive edge, lots of money went into it and people really expect nvidia to give this code away to the open source.

the difference between nvidia and other companies is that nvidia considers itself a software company just as much as it is hardware. They have invested handsomely into their software and have some of the best programmers they can grab up. They think highly of their software and want to protect it. Its their investment.

I dont understand what the issue really is
nvidia has drivers available to anyone who uses Linux. There is no need to try to reverse engineer them in the first place. These guys are making a big fuss and it makes you wonder what the underline reasoning is. What are they really lacking here? Nvidia has every reason to protect their technology.

a reasonable and sensible argument, i think the final lines the one

What are they really lacking here? Nvidia has every reason to protect their technology

yes and also in this case ,every reason to help or come to a reasonable compromise so whats up Nv?

trickson · Jun 18, 2012

theoneandonlymrk said:
calm thy self,,, its a phone 1st and whatever else 2nd,, i dont use/need maps web books or games, but now and again.

your missing the PAD angle too plus other netportal type devices , tegra telly with lynux back os anyone.

Okay. But still if Linux wants to get "IN" this is not how one goes about doing this. nVidia doesn't need some 2 bit OS maker to tell them to F off and flip them the bird that is not how you make friends!

newtekie1 · Jun 18, 2012

faramir said:
Well, you don't appear to be too bright either, in spite of your snide remak. The girl in video mentioned she bought her computer quite some time ago [when Optimus was fresh] and assumed NVidia would come up with support for it eventually [as they had with basic functions of their graphics cards such as displaying picture]. Not an unreasonable expectation from a paying customer to have a product supported in full. Others have listed examples of companies that either care enough to support their products directly (be it with open or closed drivers) or at least volunteer the information needed to others so they can do their work for them, at no cost.

The comment you made reminds me of dumb people tryiong to tell me that - in their opinion - somebody else isn't very smart, while they seem to be pretty thick themselves.

Except nVidia announced the Optimus wouldn't work on anything other than Windows 7(they didn't even build in support for Vista), so her expectations were idiotic. A smart person will not buy hardware with the expectation that support will be added at some point, a smart person buys hardware that is already supported.

And the product she paid for is supported in full, on the OS that came with the hardware. She can't bitch because she changed something and it broke.

TheoneandonlyMrK · Jun 18, 2012

trickson said:
Okay. But still if Linux wants to get "IN" this is not how one goes about doing this. nVidia doesn't need some 2 bit OS maker to tell them to F off and flip them the bird that is not how you make friends!

you have it the wrong way round their Trickson,,, its Nvidia that needs to get more IN to lynux or their bottom line might start to suffer, if they pushed their unique features better and supported it their hardware might impress and sell,, More simples..

trickson said:
For the record I hope to GOD in Heaven that the SUN will blast out a CME so big that it wipes out all this shit! Really I do! I have no use for texting, WTF is that all about any way? You text some one WHY? Send a letter a phone is to TALK to people not tell you to feed the baby! Or take a shit! The problem is this as I see it. Technology has gone just way to far and now we are seeing the results of this as the dumbing down of the people of the world. Most people are so stupid now they need a GPS in there car to go 3 blocks away from there home! I mean COME ON! Grow a brain think for your self learn things from a book! Please GOD send this planet a CME so large the aurora's will be seen in Texas!

a completely unreasonable a relatively senseless waffle by you connected and fapping on a world wide web connected game ready pc :roll:

your only throwin that down cos your pc's old

and you wana claim the insurance payout for a new 1

remixedcat · Jun 18, 2012

trickson said:
No just got the divorce!

For the record I hope to GOD in Heaven that the SUN will blast out a CME so big that it wipes out all this shit! Really I do! I have no use for texting, WTF is that all about any way? You text some one WHY? Send a letter a phone is to TALK to people not tell you to feed the baby! Or take a shit! The problem is this as I see it. Technology has gone just way to far and now we are seeing the results of this as the dumbing down of the people of the world. Most people are so stupid now they need a GPS in there car to go 3 blocks away from there home! I mean COME ON! Grow a brain think for your self learn things from a book! Please GOD send this planet a CME so large the aurora's will be seen in Texas!

if you hate tech then why the fuck are you on a tech forum?

newtekie1 · Jun 18, 2012

theoneandonlymrk said:
you have it the wrong way round their Trickson,,, its Nvidia that needs to get more IN to lynux or their bottom line might start to suffer, if they pushed their unique features better and supported it their hardware might impress and sell,, More simples..

They obviously have made the decision that going after ~1-2% of the market is not worth the development cost, and I can't say I disagree. Especially when you consider that of that 1-2% nVidia is only likely to see about 25%, so they would really be going after about 0.25-0.50% of the market, I can't see that amount making up for the development costs.

TheoneandonlyMrK · Jun 18, 2012

newtekie1 said:
They obviously have made the decision that going after ~1-2%

if you roll in all lynux os based devices, id imagine a higher percentage, and look at physx, good but shit, and no games use it, yet they push desktop cards on its prowess,, and this trick wouldnt work in other markets

deadmansclick · Jun 19, 2012

faramir said:
Well, you don't appear to be too bright either, in spite of your snide remak. The girl in video mentioned she bought her computer quite some time ago [when Optimus was fresh] and assumed NVidia would come up with support for it eventually [as they had with basic functions of their graphics cards such as displaying picture]. Not an unreasonable expectation from a paying customer to have a product supported in full. Others have listed examples of companies that either care enough to support their products directly (be it with open or closed drivers) or at least volunteer the information needed to others so they can do their work for them, at no cost.

The comment you made reminds me of dumb people tryiong to tell me that - in their opinion - somebody else isn't very smart, while they seem to be pretty thick themselves.

I don't really see how you construed that from my comment. I know what the girl in the video said & i was merely pointing out that people i know, that are also very intelligent in their specific computing area will try & argue that macs are a better choice over a pc.

I think that has a parallel to the girl making the comment. She is obviously cleaver enough to program & be at uni but that doesn't stop her making bad choices with the hardware shes uses.

newtekie1 · Jun 19, 2012

theoneandonlymrk said:
if you roll in all lynux os based devices, id imagine a higher percentage, and look at physx, good but shit, and no games use it, yet they push desktop cards on its prowess,, and this trick wouldnt work in other markets

Again, those devices are a totally different category that nVidia is handling totally differently. They've made hardware just for that market segment.

No laptops use Optimus, yet the stupid chick in the video bought one, so you sure that trick won't work in other markets? And there are PhysX games for Android...

ThE_MaD_ShOt · Jun 19, 2012

Dj-ElectriC said:
If you think NVIDIA+linux could be bad... oh just wait to try AMD+linux...

Actually I have had more problem with Nvidia cards under Linux. I have yet to have a problem with a Amd/Ati card.

trickson said:
Hey Linux you want some thing better to work with? Then make a mainstream OS like Windows or SHUT THE FUCK UP!

They do, it's called Ubuntu. And it works great. I have actually though about switching all my rigs over. :toast:

SonDa5 · Jun 19, 2012

My experience with NVIDIA and mobile devices was with Tmobile/LG G2X which had an NVIDIA for processing. The device was terribly unstable and I blame the NVIDIA Tegra 2 chipset for the problem.

jigar2speed · Jun 19, 2012

theoneandonlymrk said:
im no linux fan , ive not a clue how to use it and had the clearly blinkerred view you and nvidia have before, but ive an android phone now so things change and nvidias views on linux need to change, and will, id put my left(rights not leavin me) arm on nvidia backing linux or fadeing from this world,tegra2,3,4,5,8,99,x, denver nuff said.

Huang would no sooner cut his left tatty off then loose mobile Oem contracts, so they will get in line.

I own Optimus 2X, world's first dual core CPU mobile phone (Cynogen mod 9 ICS 4.4 Nova Rom), i know how i am being treated by Nvidia. :mad:

Melvis · Jun 19, 2012

His comment is backed by reason of course, you only get emotion from a reason, so who ever said yes to emotion :slap:

RoutedScripter · Jun 19, 2012

Dj-ElectriC said:
If you think NVIDIA+linux could be bad... oh just wait to try AMD+linux...

naoan said:
Kind of ironic when in the past, ATi is considered a bad match for Linux (and yes it was, experienced ~~one~~ many distro simply not booting because of ATi myself).

It seem to got better these days.

I had Mint Debian running for 3+ months and had no problems, Sapphire Radeon HD5850

newtekie1 said:
NVidia has always had a hands off approach to Linux. I thought it was common knowledge to avoid nVidia if you wanted to run linux and have decent video hardware support. And, IMO, that is a perfectly legitimate stance to have. Yes, it would be nice if they better supported Linux, but honestly why would they? The market share for linux is so small that putting all that development time into proper support likely wouldn't amount to a profit.

And the girl asking the question annoys me. She is smart enough to use linux on a daily basis, but not smart enough to pick hardware that properly supports it? WTF?!

Are you a filthy capitalist ?

entropy13 · Jun 19, 2012

I don't see the problem here. 99.9% of Linux systems over here use integrated graphics anyway, since they're just for word processing, internet browsing, etc.

And there are a lot of Linux systems over here (usually Ubuntu) since they're free and all the donors have to spend on is sending over the hardware here.

DaedalusHelios · Jun 19, 2012

aussiebear said:
What an absolute load of nonsense. You clearly do NOT know the open community and the behaviour of companies it has to tolerate. Linus Torvalds does NOT run a business. He is a project leader for the Linux Kernel. He actually gets paid by other companies in terms of salary and shares. He doesn't lose anything by telling Nvidia to go f**k themselves.

So the brainchild of Linux has nothing to lose by insulting companies that are using a Linux variant as one of their primary platforms? By creating hostility you always have something to lose. Not just those who sign your check effect your business, it is bigger than that. He is the first person you think of when you mention Linux to most people, not just a simple developer. You can't downplay that.

From my understanding from the outside was that Nvidia assisted with open source drivers to the Linux platform.And apparently I am wrong. I also didn't hear about AMD making efforts to help much on the driver side until very recently and was always told the Nvidia drivers were more stable than the AMD/ATi alternative on Linux. You have apparently joined the forum just to say it isn't the case which is fine. But try to show a little respect when you start off. Adults address each other in a mature way(see etiquette).

Not with a fuck you like Torvalds. If there was a single man who would be the face of Linux I would say it would be Torvalds. If he is then seen acting out like a child throwing a fit, then it would hurt his cause. Business is what it is and a healthy relation with as many companies as possible is always best. If you feel otherwise then you obviously don't fit within the business world for making business decisions.

Melvis said:
His comment is backed by reason of course, you only get emotion from a reason, so who ever said yes to emotion

Or your emotion is your reason.... either way it's a poll that was worded badly. :laugh:

btarunr · Jun 19, 2012

ocre said:
nvidia wants to protect its technology best it can. They support linux completely with drivers, very stable and good drivers at that. They just havent been generous when it comes to giving away their code. Nvidia would rather give out drivers they made for linux than give away their code to open source. If you think about it, why would nvidia want to give away their secrets? Stuff like optimus gives nvidia a competitive edge, lots of money went into it and people really expect nvidia to give this code away to the open source.

Again, the issue isn't about the source, it's about the features. NVIDIA can give those features via proprietary drivers, and nobody would complain. Linux ≠ "keep everything open-source."

The problem is NVIDIA doesn't give those features with its proprietary drivers, and doesn't allow open-source driver projects such as Nouveau to try and somehow get things to work, either.

digibucc · Jun 19, 2012

btarunr said:
Again, the issue isn't about the source, it's about the features.

I think this point is just being ignored.

newtekie1 · Jun 19, 2012

btarunr said:
Again, the issue isn't about the source, it's about the features. NVIDIA can give those features via proprietary drivers, and nobody would complain. Linux ≠ "keep everything open-source."

The problem is NVIDIA doesn't give those features with its proprietary drivers, and doesn't allow open-source driver projects such as Nouveau to try and somehow get things to work, either.

That seems totally wrong to me. I don't see nVidia not allowing Nouveau to do anything, just like they aren't stopping people from developing open-source ways to use Optimus. They just aren't giving the people any help. If the people want to spend their time developing open-source ways to get nVidia features working on Linux, nVidia lets them, but nVidia isn't wasting any time doing it themselves because there isn't any money to be made.

TheMailMan78 · Jun 19, 2012

RuskiSnajper said:
Are you a filthy capitalist ?

I am. Very proud of it too. I don't support slavery in any way.

Also NVIDIA is the worst company against my pocket book thats for sure! Damn them! :laugh:

[H]@RD5TUFF · Jun 19, 2012

Given that you also work with AMD I don't see how that's possible . . .

But in all seriousness I take most things Linus Torvalds says with a grain of salt, this is the same man that called his own Kernel "bloated", I respect him a lot, but sometimes he says some things that aren't true or are fueled by emotion rather than fact.

Wile E · Jun 20, 2012

trickson said:
No just got the divorce!

For the record I hope to GOD in Heaven that the SUN will blast out a CME so big that it wipes out all this shit! Really I do! I have no use for texting, WTF is that all about any way? You text some one WHY? Send a letter a phone is to TALK to people not tell you to feed the baby! Or take a shit! The problem is this as I see it. Technology has gone just way to far and now we are seeing the results of this as the dumbing down of the people of the world. Most people are so stupid now they need a GPS in there car to go 3 blocks away from there home! I mean COME ON! Grow a brain think for your self learn things from a book! Please GOD send this planet a CME so large the aurora's will be seen in Texas!

Funny, I read books on my smartphone. I also just use the map app on it and pick my own route (as GPS always seems to route me some fucked up way) so I am essentially reading a map. I have to service a roughly 200mi radius outward from Pittsburgh at my work. Having maps instead would be a complete and utterly useless waste of paper, especially when one little device does any map I want in the world. Oh, plus it plays my music while on the road.

It's a win/win.

SonDa5 said:
My experience with NVIDIA and mobile devices was with Tmobile/LG G2X which had an NVIDIA for processing. The device was terribly unstable and I blame the NVIDIA Tegra 2 chipset for the problem.

Then you would be blaming the wrong thing. My Atrix is unstable too on the stock firmware. Runs like a champ on CM7 though, with no instability at all. Your problems came from LG's code, not the chipset.

SIGSEGV · Jun 20, 2012

i'm not surprising at all, oh nvidia..lmao

digibucc · Jun 20, 2012

newtekie1 said:
nVidia isn't wasting any time doing it themselves because there isn't any money to be made.

see that alone i have an issue with - there is plenty of money to be made you just have to think farther ahead then the next few months.

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"NVIDIA is the Single Worst Company We've Ever Dealt With:" Linus Torvalds

What could have been Linus' thought-process?

His comment is backed by reason.

His comment is backed by emotion.

trickson

OH, I have such a headache

TheoneandonlyMrK

trickson

OH, I have such a headache

newtekie1

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ThE_MaD_ShOt

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Processor	Ryzen 9 7950X3D
Motherboard	MSI PRO B650-S WIFI AM5
Cooling	Corsair H100x, Panaflo's on case
Memory	G.Skill DDR5 Trident 64GB (32GBx2)
Video Card(s)	MSI Gaming Radeon RX 7900 XTX 24GB GDDR6
Storage	4TB Firecuda M.2 2280
Display(s)	32" OLED 4k 240Hz ASUS ROG Swift PG32UCD
Case	CM Cosmos 1000
Audio Device(s)	logitech 5.1 system (midrange quality)
Power Supply	CORSAIR RM1000e 1000watt
Mouse	G400s Logitech, white Razor Mamba
Keyboard	K65 RGB Corsair Tenkeyless Cherry Red MX
VR HMD	Steam Valve Index
Software	Win10 Pro, Win11

System Name	RBMK-1000
Processor	AMD Ryzen 7 5700G
Motherboard	ASUS ROG Strix B450-E Gaming
Cooling	DeepCool Gammax L240 V2
Memory	2x 8GB G.Skill Sniper X
Video Card(s)	Palit GeForce RTX 2080 SUPER GameRock
Storage	Western Digital Black NVMe 512GB
Display(s)	BenQ 1440p 60 Hz 27-inch
Case	Corsair Carbide 100R
Audio Device(s)	ASUS SupremeFX S1220A
Power Supply	Cooler Master MWE Gold 650W
Mouse	ASUS ROG Strix Impact
Keyboard	Gamdias Hermes E2
Software	Windows 11 Pro

System Name	i7-PC / HTPC / iMac
Processor	i7 3820 / Phenom II 940
Motherboard	GIGABYTE G1.ASSASSIN2 / M3A79-T Deluxe
Cooling	Corsair Hydro H100i / Scythe II (HS only)
Memory	G.SKILL Trident X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3 1600mhz / 4GB DDR2 1066 (@800) Corsair Dominator
Video Card(s)	GB Radeon HD 7950s 3GB / GB Radeon HD 7950s 3GB
Storage	2x 80GB Intel X-25, 2x600gb SATA, 1x1tb 5400RPM storage /1x600GB, 3x500GB,1x160,1x120 SATA
Display(s)	1x 27" Yamakasi / Vizio 42" HDTV
Case	Lian Li Lancool PC-K58 / Antec 900
Audio Device(s)	HT Omega Striker 7.1 / Onboard and HDMI from ATi Card
Power Supply	PC Power & Cooling 750W / 610W
Software	Ubuntu / Windows 8.1 Pro / OS X / PHPStorm / Gaming

System Name	TheMailbox 5.0 / The Mailbox 4.5
Processor	RYZEN 1700X / Intel i7 2600k @ 4.2GHz
Motherboard	Fatal1ty X370 Gaming K4 / Gigabyte Z77X-UP5 TH Intel LGA 1155
Cooling	MasterLiquid PRO 280 / Scythe Katana 4
Memory	ADATA RGB 16GB DDR4 2666 16-16-16-39 / G.SKILL Sniper Series 16GB DDR3 1866: 9-9-9-24
Video Card(s)	MSI 1080 "Duke" with 8Gb of RAM. Boost Clock 1847 MHz / ASUS 780ti
Storage	256Gb M4 SSD / 128Gb Agelity 4 SSD , 500Gb WD (7200)
Display(s)	LG 29" Class 21:9 UltraWide® IPS LED Monitor 2560 x 1080 / Dell 27"
Case	Cooler Master MASTERBOX 5t / Cooler Master 922 HAF
Audio Device(s)	Realtek ALC1220 Audio Codec / SupremeFX X-Fi with Bose Companion 2 speakers.
Power Supply	Seasonic FOCUS Plus Series SSR-750PX 750W Platinum / SeaSonic X Series X650 Gold
Mouse	SteelSeries Sensei (RAW) / Logitech G5
Keyboard	Razer BlackWidow / Logitech (Unknown)
Software	Windows 10 Pro (64-bit)
Benchmark Scores	Benching is for bitches.

System Name	The ClusterF**k
Processor	980X @ 4Ghz
Motherboard	Gigabyte GA-EX58-UD5 BIOS F12
Cooling	MCR-320, DDC-1 pump w/Bitspower res top (1/2" fittings), Koolance CPU-360
Memory	3x2GB Mushkin Redlines 1600Mhz 6-8-6-24 1T
Video Card(s)	Evga GTX 580
Storage	Corsair Neutron GTX 240GB, 2xSeagate 320GB RAID0; 2xSeagate 3TB; 2xSamsung 2TB; Samsung 1.5TB
Display(s)	HP LP2475w 24" 1920x1200 IPS
Case	Technofront Bench Station
Audio Device(s)	Auzentech X-Fi Forte into Onkyo SR606 and Polk TSi200's + RM6750
Power Supply	ENERMAX Galaxy EVO EGX1250EWT 1250W
Software	Win7 Ultimate N x64, OSX 10.8.4

System Name	i7-PC / HTPC / iMac
Processor	i7 3820 / Phenom II 940
Motherboard	GIGABYTE G1.ASSASSIN2 / M3A79-T Deluxe
Cooling	Corsair Hydro H100i / Scythe II (HS only)
Memory	G.SKILL Trident X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3 1600mhz / 4GB DDR2 1066 (@800) Corsair Dominator
Video Card(s)	GB Radeon HD 7950s 3GB / GB Radeon HD 7950s 3GB
Storage	2x 80GB Intel X-25, 2x600gb SATA, 1x1tb 5400RPM storage /1x600GB, 3x500GB,1x160,1x120 SATA
Display(s)	1x 27" Yamakasi / Vizio 42" HDTV
Case	Lian Li Lancool PC-K58 / Antec 900
Audio Device(s)	HT Omega Striker 7.1 / Onboard and HDMI from ATi Card
Power Supply	PC Power & Cooling 750W / 610W
Software	Ubuntu / Windows 8.1 Pro / OS X / PHPStorm / Gaming

System Name	White Boy
Processor	Core i7 3770k @4.6 Ghz
Motherboard	ASUS P8Z77-I Deluxe
Cooling	CORSAIR H100
Memory	CORSAIR Vengeance 16GB @ 2177
Video Card(s)	EVGA GTX 680 CLASSIEFIED @ 1250 Core
Storage	2 Samsung 830 256 GB (Raid 0) 1 Hitachi 4 TB
Display(s)	1 Dell 30U11 30"
Case	BIT FENIX Prodigy
Audio Device(s)	none
Power Supply	SeaSonic X750 Gold 750W Modular
Software	Windows Pro 7 64 bit \|\| Ubuntu 64 Bit
Benchmark Scores	2017 Unigine Heaven :: P37239 3D Mark Vantage