Global Warming & Climate Change Discussion

[FordGT90Concept]

33% of the power in USA still comes coal...61% in China...

 

[123zorn]

And here we go down the rabbit hole.

Why is one discounting the peer review process?
Why is it 'news' that peer review (as most processes) may need improvement?
Why is it 'news' that journals have different processes that may not be consistent?
Why is it 'news' that some papers may not meet certain standards of rigor after the above is considered?
Why is it 'news' that some work may not be well done?

Discounting peer review and throwing peer review out as a problem is an attempt to discredit scientific discourse. This is spreading FUD, not evidence, not critique, not substantive. This is pretty clearly an attack on the FINDINGS, not via the scientific process nor via evidence based discussion, but nearly solely based on FUD. I will draw the logical conclusion that it is a denier/skeptic outlook that is driving this directed attack (and yes it is an attack) to discredit an entire body of scientific evidence by throwing doubt upon the process while choosing to be silent about the actual conclusions that may be appropriately drawn from the entire body of research. Now the process may have some flaws for some of the papers, that is why there are repeated and repeated and repeated looks and tests and multiple lines of questions and multiple instigators that validate this body of research.

Perhaps I should ask,

Why is it NOT news that there is little evidence contrary to anthropomorphic climate change?
Why is it that science and evidence is being sold as products of political conspiracy/controversy?
Why is it that the financial backing of such studies of non-anthropomorphic climate change is via industry?

Balance is the key. Saying we don't know implies more uncertainty than is supported by the evidence. A more balanced and appropriate statement of 'the preponderance of evidence is that there is anthropomorphic climate change that could be mitigated through concerted and consolidated policies' would meet the bill.

Climate change is happening. Period. At least a part of it is caused by human activity. Period. Arguing over peer review processes is purely an attempt to not address the identified problem.

To say that one cannot advocate for moving from coal to a more efficient and effective (when all costs are considered) fuel seems to indicate that evidence will not sway your belief. Natural gas is more efficient, a primary reason for the decline of coal is the low price for each BTU of energy, especially when the pollution and particulate impacts of coal are considered. Coal is declining, and should decline given the alternatives, propping it up will be ineffective and would contribute to economic inefficiencies. This is not a Clinton/Obama deal (saying that it was a Clinton deal has strong implications regarding your ability to separate the political from that which is evidence based), coal was a declining industry when fracking ramped, natural gas deposits were opened up, and energy costs took a nosedive. Should BTU costs treble, then coal may once again rise as a low priced BTU alternative, but until then it is unlikely.

Now if your argument is that known anthropomorphic climate change has been politicized inappropriately, I will agree entirely and ask why you posted and supported a FUD article with a seemly sole purpose of avoiding discussion of the problem that should be discussed.

 

[AphexDreamer]

I haven't looked at any of these papers so I have no idea what they say. For all I know, those 12 papers may have just discovered that something else couldn't explain the change in observed temperature. In its own way, it could confirm the majority.

I like how you are appealing to the I don't know when plenty of people have reviewed the papers and drawn conclusions. If you don't know then why do you make a claim?

 

[R-T-B]

33% of the power in USA still comes coal...61% in China...

And plunging rapidly in the USA, you might note. That was kind of his point.

 

[AphexDreamer]

And plunging rapidly in the USA, you might note. That was kind of his point.

That's ok, let him keep saying that till the last percent.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

And plunging rapidly in the USA, you might note.

Because natural gas (##GT where GT is Gas Turbine) is cheaper (at least in the USA).

That's economics making the decision for electric providers, not climate change.

 

[Ahhzz]

And plunging rapidly in the USA, you might note. That was kind of his point.

yeah, that's about to change....

 

[qubit]

Here's one for the climate change deniers to waive about as "proof" it's not happening.

Stay warm, guys: newly released NASA images show the brutal polar vortex that's descended upon North America this week, and is predicted to bring record low temperatures to the US and Canada.

The data was captured by the Atmospheric Infrared Sounder (AIRS) instrument on board NASA's Aqua satellite, and it shows the air temperature around 5,500 metres or 18,000 feet above the ground, which is currently as low as –40 degrees Celsius (–40 Fahrenheit).

http://www.sciencealert.com/it-s-official-the-polar-vortex-is-back-with-a-vengeance

 

[john_]

I am not a scientist to say with certainty no, but it does look like the weather is changing. In Athens we see less and less snow every new year and in my mother's village that it is about 70 kilometers north from Athens, lemon and orange trees are growing much more easily and produce much more fruits compared to the past.

 

[qubit]

lemon and orange trees are growing much more easily and produce much more fruits compared to the past.

Nice to see something good associated with global warming for once.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

CNN put up a website focused on the 6th mass extinction event that has begun:
http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2016/12/specials/vanishing/

TL;DR:
1. Climate Change (loss of coral reefs)
2. Agriculture (so much land is claimed for humans to live on, for livestock, and for crop production, the amount left to nature is dwindling)
3. Wildlife Crime (poaching and capturing wild animals for sale as pets)
4. Pollution (plastic ending up in oceans...and animals)
5. Disease (especially killing amphibians)

 

[the54thvoid]

CNN put up a website focused on the 6th mass extinction event that has begun:
http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2016/12/specials/vanishing/

TL;DR:
1. Climate Change (loss of coral reefs)
2. Agriculture (so much land is claimed for humans to live on, for livestock, and for crop production, the amount left to nature is dwindling)
3. Wildlife Crime (poaching and capturing wild animals for sale as pets)
4. Pollution (plastic ending up in oceans...and animals)
5. Disease (especially killing amphibians)

We'll need to adapt to these changes. Already squid numbers and jellyfish blooms are happening more often. Changes in ocean temps lead to other animals flourishing as others die off (thanks dinosaurs!).

But, I don't like squid and jellyfish..... bleugh.

 

[R-T-B]

5. Disease (especially killing amphibians)

Stay away from me!

 

[CAPSLOCKSTUCK]

The Japanese trawl for jellyfish off the Welsh coast..........i provided data after i found one of their tracking devices on a beach......

 

[Tatty_Two]

The Japanese trawl for jellyfish off the Welsh coast..........i provided data after i found one of their tracking devices on a beach......

That must cost them something in Diesel, probably the most expensive jellyfish on the planet, no wonder we have global warming!

 

[CAPSLOCKSTUCK]

The research being undertaken was to do with global warming and how it affects oceans and the movement of water.

Apparently jellyfish cant think for themselves as to where they travel and are a good indicator of change.

Lots of UK produced fish and shellfish end up in Japan, mostly by air freight.

 

[Tatty_Two]

The research being undertaken was to do with global warming and how it affects oceans and the movement of water.

Apparently jellyfish cant think for themselves as to where they travel and are a good indicator of change.

Lots of UK produced fish and shellfish end up in Japan, mostly by air freight.

Clearly not otherwise they would not be living off the coast of Wales!

 

[CAPSLOCKSTUCK]

You,ve got to be bloody hungry to eat jellyfish.
Just the thought of it turns my stomach.

Sardines are a common catch round here recently and there are a lot more whales, porpoise and dolphins seen off the coast.

 

[R-T-B]

and there are a lot more whales, porpoise and dolphins seen off the coast.

Don't try fishing for those though, or Steve Irwin's ghost will haunt you for life.

 

[CAPSLOCKSTUCK]

Basking shark (the big buggers with massive mouths) are often caught.
Warmer waters bring more krill along with the predators that eat them.

Come whale watching in Wales .!!

 

[R-T-B]

Basking shark (the big buggers with massive mouths) are often caught.
Warmer waters bring more krill along with the predators that eat them.

Come whale watching in Wales .!!

I've been whale watching here in the Pacific Northwest. They are smelly things when they exhale... and that's as nice as I can put it.

 

[dorsetknob]

Come whale watching in Wales .!!

NO !!!!! Sorry I've Seen the local women ( )

 

[R-T-B]

NO !!!!! Sorry I've Seen the local women

I could do something really mean right now, but I won't.

I'll just giggle.

 

[CAPSLOCKSTUCK]

Bastards....

Im telling Wendy on you lot.

 

[dorsetknob]

Bastards....

Im telling Wendy on you lot.