AMD Ryzen Discussion Thread.

[TheLostSwede]

at the end of the day it does not really matter

Indeed. I started a few replies on various related topics and in the end I just dropped it, as it's not worth my time.

 

[xkm1948]

Was looking for RyZen 1900/1900X rumors online, came across a RyZen discussion over chiphell. From what google translate can tell there will be an Intel HEDT level product coming from AMD later this year. It is based on the server grade Napless CPU instead of AM4.

Soon come back, more than salted fish, everyone wallet ready? The salted fish was turned over to the carp jump dragon ...

Are we talking about it? I came to reveal the answer
X399, civilian desktop level, code-named "eel", the standard Intel's X299, and no accident will be released before the X299 listed ~

https://www.chiphell.com/thread-1713261-6-1.html

 

[the54thvoid]

Soon come back, more than salted fish, everyone wallet ready? The salted fish was turned over to the carp jump dragon ...

Dafuq.....

 

[Slizzo]

Was looking for RyZen 1900/1900X rumors online, came across a RyZen discussion over chiphell. From what google translate can tell there will be an Intel HEDT level product coming from AMD later this year. It is based on the server grade Napless CPU instead of AM4.






https://www.chiphell.com/thread-1713261-6-1.html

Well, I mean they did just announce Naples, so I wouldn't be surprised that they would have a consumer product based off of that processor as well.

 

[xkm1948]

Give me a 16core octa channel ryzen 1900x! I would't mind paying $999for something like that.

 

[Mike0409]

Has anyone found any benchmarks with Windows 7 instead of Windows 10? or done any themselves? Windows 10 has the SMT bug that is being worked out, while Windows 7 supposedly doesn't have this issue. Just curious if there were some major differences or if its on par with turning SMT off in Win 10 with 1080p gaming performance.

 

[Tatty_Two]

I think someone posted a link some pages back to a review that focussed on 7.

 

[kruk]

One of the motherboard makers (probably ASUS) has shared why currently there is a shortage of boards and interestingly, that Ryzen 7 was released prematurely:

It’s all about the bad coordination, bad communication, bad support and bad timing to launch this platform in my opinion

In late December, AMD decided to pull in the launch date (it was scheduled to launch in late Q2) and launched it right after Chinese New Year but AMD keep the CPU supply quantity secret from us the whole time.

They also shared some info on BIOS problems:

Also, their BIOS team and engineers were doing terrible jobs on supporting us on the BIOS microcode updates, driver updates, CPU samples for testing

If true, not cool at all ...

In conclusion:

In general, it’s been too long for AMD to launch a new CPU, so they forgot how to do it, so they launched the CPU just like they were launching the graphics card.

Credits LegitReviews, read the full article there.

 

[eidairaman1]

Why does Intel get a pass when they fuck up monumentally like the P67 chipset, but AMD doesn't get the same? That's a load of tosh imho.

You're clearly not old enough to know what you're talking about, AMD has offered very competitive products in the past and they've been far from "bargain basement", in fact, their top-tier products used to cost more than Intel and they also performed vastly better. In fact, Cyrix used to be better than Intel... In this case, the CPU's seem to be plenty fine to me, the issue appear to be the normal problems AMD have, poor chipsets, poor BIOS/UEFI implementations and not enough commitment from their board partners. This is when shit goes south no matter how good your CPU is.

History matters a lot, but mankind doesn't seem to want to learn from it and that's why we keep repeating our mistakes. In this case, Intel keeps getting cocky and so far, they've been taken down a few pegs every few years. I still think it's utter bull that it's somehow ok to give AMD shit, but you can't say a bad thing about Intel, as they're somehow being glorified as this perfect chip maker, which is a load of crap.

Considering the 970 and 990FX chipsets were and still are good.

Yes but the stocks have increased quite well recently, it's not unusual for some investors to cash in, not saying you are wrong...... just sayin.

Buy low, sell high, stock brokers need money at one point or another to pay for debts on stuff.

If a 16 core naples based Cpu comes out that is unlocked fully, i may skip the 1700 and jump on it.

 

[the54thvoid]

Found this from PCPer.

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-and-Windows-10-Scheduler-No-Silver-Bullet

Essentially, the CCX latency is the issue, not how W10 addresses work loads.

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

I think someone posted a link some pages back to a review that focussed on 7.

Found this from PCPer.

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-and-Windows-10-Scheduler-No-Silver-Bullet

Essentially, the CCX latency is the issue, not how W10 addresses work loads.

Changes to the scheduler will definitely help this ,no silver bullet no but given how well RyZen performs with the present scheduler i think given a few months all will be fine.

 

[mroofie]

Found this from PCPer.

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-and-Windows-10-Scheduler-No-Silver-Bullet

Essentially, the CCX latency is the issue, not how W10 addresses work loads.

Windows 7..

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

Found this from PCPer.

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-and-Windows-10-Scheduler-No-Silver-Bullet

Essentially, the CCX latency is the issue, not how W10 addresses work loads.

After finally fully reading your linked article I think they missed something, as they should know.
In a smt core only the primary thread has priority and the most resources, this is the same with Intel and with Intel the scheduler knows this second core is not a fully resourced core and gives it appropriately planned work to do.
While they confirmed threads are being scheduled to different cores fairly correctly with improvement possible by avoiding CCx jumps they didn't check the weighting of each thread.
So with the main pipe(core) fully loaded there isn't a full core left for thread two but that's what it's expecting to see hence bad times.
I can still see some improvement to be had personally.

 

[Hood]

Windows 7..

Windows 7 won't fix this, it's a problem with the basic architecture - no workaround possible. Perhaps a redesign? Ryzen 2.0 should have the workaround built into the chip. This is bad news, because it allows Intel to keep prices high. And Microcenter is already discounting the 1700X by $50 for in-store customers - not unusual for them, what's unusual is the timing (only a week after launch). https://hardforum.com/threads/microcenter-amd-ryzen-1700x-349-99-in-store.1926641/

 

[EarthDog]

Really, thats pretty normal for them at MC honestly. A couple of weeks at msrp and then they drop. They certainly lyndianne's aren't discounting it because of performamce... that makes no sense to me why it would happen at the retail level as they are only shooting themselves in the foot...

 

[HTC]

Windows 7 won't fix this, it's a problem with the basic architecture - no workaround possible. Perhaps a redesign? Ryzen 2.0 should have the workaround built into the chip. This is bad news, because it allows Intel to keep prices high. And Microcenter is already discounting the 1700X by $50 for in-store customers - not unusual for them, what's unusual is the timing (only a week after launch). https://hardforum.com/threads/microcenter-amd-ryzen-1700x-349-99-in-store.1926641/

I think you missed the point: apparently, this sheduling issue is non present @ all in windows 7. This points to it being a windows 10 issue rather then a chip issue.

EDIT

https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/ryzen-strictly-technical.2500572/page-8#post-38775732

These results of total war: warhammer show an increase of 15 FPS in minimum frames when using windows 7 instead of 10. The avg frames are much less affected, though, in this particular game.

 

[mcraygsx]

Really, thats pretty normal for them at MC honestly. A couple of weeks at msrp and then they drop. They certainly lyndianne's aren't discounting it because of performamce... that makes no sense to me why it would happen at the retail level as they are only shooting themselves in the foot...

It is normal MC had sales on 7700K for couple of months now for $299. My local MC even offer $30 discount when bundled with Z270 MB. $50 from newly released Ryzen was from MC alone.

 

[Grings]

1700x's have dropped in price a few places in uk (£389 to 365ish)

and still no x370 boards in stock anywhere, a few retailers overdue since 6th-8th

 

[Hood]

I think you missed the point: apparently, this sheduling issue is non present @ all in windows 7. This points to it being a windows 10 issue rather then a chip issue.

EDIT

https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/ryzen-strictly-technical.2500572/page-8#post-38775732

These results of total war: warhammer show an increase of 15 FPS in minimum frames when using windows 7 instead of 10. The avg frames are much less affected, though, in this particular game.

If you didn't read the PCPer article linked in post #188 in this thread, their tentative conclusion was, there is no issue with the Windows 10 scheduler, the performance drop is caused by latency between CCX units, a diagnosis that's been noted by other sites - https://www.techpowerup.com/231268/amds-ryzen-cache-analyzed-improvements- improveable-ccx-compromises http://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/03/02/amd_ryzen_1700x_cpu_review/6

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

I think they missed something, as so frequently in this thread have you.
In a smt core only the primary thread has priority and the most resources, this is the same with Intel and with Intel the scheduler knows this second core is not a fully resourced core and gives it appropriately planned work to do.
While they confirmed threads are being scheduled to different cores fairly correctly with improvement possible by avoiding CCx jumps they didn't check the weighting of each thread.
So with the main pipe(core) fully loaded there isn't a full core left for thread two but that's what it's expecting to see hence bad times.
I can still see some improvement to be had personally.

Cheap repost edited for hood.

 

[toilet pepper]

Here in the Philippines, only 2 x370 boards are available - msi titanium xpower and aorus gaming 5. I'm waiting on the Crosshair Hero 6 to arrive as it has am3 compatibility. I doubt idcolling would send one to me without any cost.

This is what I was talking about. I dont see any reason why amd changed the mounting holes on these boards.

With the way things are going, the mobos will be availble when r3 and r5 are out.

 

[mcraygsx]

Here in the Philippines, only 2 x370 boards are available - msi titanium xpower and aorus gaming 5. I'm waiting on the Crosshair Hero 6 to arrive as it has am3 compatibility. I doubt idcolling would send one to me without any cost.

This is what I was talking about. I dont see any reason why amd changed the mounting holes on these boards.

With the way things are going, the mobos will be availble when r3 and r5 are out.

That is correct I was able to install Hydro 110i straight out of the box on Crosshair IV Hero. After great experienced with Maximus IX for 7700k, I would buy Hero series any day.

 

[kruk]

Found this from PCPer.

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-and-Windows-10-Scheduler-No-Silver-Bullet

Essentially, the CCX latency is the issue, not how W10 addresses work loads.

The latency might be problematic, but the Windows 10 scheduler also doesn't seem to work as it should:

Instead of keeping the 2 threads on one CCX it sometimes splits them over two CCXs which causes performance problems.

It will be certainly interesting to see how quad core chips will be configured: 2-2 or 4-0 ...

 

[mroofie]

If you didn't read the PCPer article linked in post #188 in this thread, their tentative conclusion was, there is no issue with the Windows 10 scheduler, the performance drop is caused by latency between CCX units, a diagnosis that's been noted by other sites - https://www.techpowerup.com/231268/amds-ryzen-cache-analyzed-improvements- improveable-ccx-compromises http://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/03/02/amd_ryzen_1700x_cpu_review/6

Windows 7 Likes ryzen more so there's definitely an issue... might not be the scheduler but it's definitely os related

 

[HTC]

Windows 7 Likes ryzen more so there's definitely an issue... might not be the scheduler but it's definitely os related

The following 2 videos show the penalty of using both CCXs VS using just 1. The 2nd video also shows that windows 10 randomly assigns cores which may or may not be of the same CCX.

Found this here: https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/ryzen-strictly-technical.2500572/page-21#post-38789965