AMD Vega Discussion Thread

[RejZoR]

And Why not ?
Same silicon Different SKU often Each Xeon has a direct I7 Counterpart
and certain old Xeons Overclock so well ( X56** Series for example )

The sarcasm man, don't you feel it?

 

[dorsetknob]

The sarcasm man, don't you feel it?

No sorry got my hand down in my skivvys i can feel that

 

[cdawall]

The 5930k was released in the 29th of august 2014 while the FX8350 was released in the 23rd of october 2012. (it doesn't take from the fact that in the TPU review it was not compated to HEDT though)

Fine fx8370 whatever, point is they aren't the same class. I am sure if and when Naples is released for consumers we will see a comparison by tpu between it and Intels HEDT. Maybe if amd wanted the world's perfect comparison they would have released a heavily binned 4.2-4.3ghz ryzen quad core on day zero instead of a stack of low clocked 8 core into a market that wasn't ready for it.

 

[Gasaraki]

That logic always baffled me. If NVIDIA sells something for 700€ and AMD releases product that matches that, in what parallel universe AMD isn't allowed to charge same amount for their product? People always have this weird illusion that just because it's AMD, they have to give stuff away basically for free. But NVIDIA, charge 1200€ away. And they'll ask for more. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

If it'll match GTX 1080Ti, then I'm willing to pay the same price. Or, if they feel comfortable setting the bar a bit lower to attract more customers, then so be it. That's competition and free market. The more there is, the better for us, customers.

If it costed the same why would I buy the AMD product? Just like if Intel had the same performing chip at the same price as AMD, people will buy the familiar one.

 

[Divide Overflow]

From AMD's financial review meeting the other day:
"AMD's "Vega" GPU architecture is on track to launch in Q2"

 

[HD64G]

If it costed the same why would I buy the AMD product? Just like if Intel had the same performing chip at the same price as AMD, people will buy the familiar one.

GPUs have APIs that work very differently for each arch. For example, anyone who will play modern games having Vulcan or DX12 might prefer to game on AMD and whoever needs to play older or modern but not so many future games could coose nVidia. So, even if Vega and 1080Ti could match each other on average having the same price, someone could choose based on the games he 'd prefer to play more in the next few years.

 

[bug]

They even compared 1800X to 6900k in the Ryzen launch event. And then TPU didn't even include a direct competitor chip that costs twice as much, but performs around the same. As much as I love TPU in general and their reviews, they often have weird ways of doing things.

And I personally think all the reviewers are doing AMD injustice with all the dramatization of "uh oh games run worse on Ryzen" thing. Do they really? Apart from a hand full (of a really clumsy carpenter) that actually have a considerable difference, most are insignificant and they run with framerate high enough to be irrelevant. And for the future, core count IS the future. IPC will never increase enough to offset the fact that you can't clock cores to infinity either. Having them at 5GHz is really pushing them hard and 7700K is very close to that. Game studios will simply have to start making games more multicore aware and less dependent on just few threads and those clocked ridiculously high. Unless Intel pulls a magic out of nowhere and gives CPU's a 2x IPC boost. But I find that highly unlikely.

It's not dramatization, it's a matter of covering all bases.

Because, conversely, who really benefits from 16 threads at home? Nobody does video transcoding, 3D rendering or serves millions of HTTP requests around the clock.
When the performance is(or isn't) there, it's a review's job to highlight it.

 

[RejZoR]

It matters. That would be like comparing RX Vega to GTX 1070 only, not even bothering to compare it to anything else. Because someone decided so for no real reason. or excluding Titan cards from "gaming" reviews because they are meant for developers and not gamers. And yet people still buy them for gaming. How is Ryzen 1800X any different? Some people just buy them because they want to. Do I need 12 threads? Probably not. But I wanted them. Do you need a BMW M4 with 400 horse power? Probably not. But you wanted it, so you got it. That's why.

 

[ShurikN]

If it costed the same why would I buy the AMD product? Just like if Intel had the same performing chip at the same price as AMD, people will buy the familiar one.

If they cost the same what is pushing you to buy nV and/or Intel

 

[RejZoR]

Fanboyism usually. That's my experience. What pushes me usually are the extra features one offers. AMD has a huge edge with extra goodies like superior looking Crimson control panel, Wattman, Chill feature, Frame limiter and few other goodies like FreeSync. Only thing NVIDIA really has a serious edge is Adaptive V-Sync and Fast V-Sync modes that are super useful. It can also be something as silly as the X factor. GDDR5X on top tier Pascals or HBM2 on Vega...

 

[OneMoar]

more memory bandwidth doesn't make up for a crappy core gcn is crap at pretty much everything in the 'traditional' dx11 style pipeline
and thats how people are still coding, write the game engine let the gpu/driver figure out how to make it go fast

 

[xkm1948]

Fanboyism usually. That's my experience. What pushes me usually are the extra features one offers. AMD has a huge edge with extra goodies like superior looking Crimson control panel, Wattman, Chill feature, Frame limiter and few other goodies like FreeSync. Only thing NVIDIA really has a serious edge is Adaptive V-Sync and Fast V-Sync modes that are super useful. It can also be something as silly as the X factor. GDDR5X on top tier Pascals or HBM2 on Vega...

superior looking Crimson control panel,Wattman
Well, sort of. However recent Crimson drivers has caused some problems among 390 owners. Specifically broken Wattman for 390 VRAM overclocking.

Chill feature
Tried it in both TF2 and Fallout4. Hate it. The drop in frame rate to ~40 is quite easily to pick up by human eyes. And the lag resulted from bouncing between low FPS and high FPS makes me want to vomit. So in short, cool feature on paper, bad experience in real life. I find the Target Frame Control a way better tool than this Chill.

Honestly man, as a long time ATi GPU owner and user, I must say they are great at "promising" features in their powerpoint slides. Implementation though is usually seriously lacked.

Take the ZeroCore feature for example. It was promised to be an energy saving feature on AMD's FuryX GPU. As shown over here:

Green LED indicates that the card will in ultra energy saving mode, like browsing websites or word processing. Guess what? It never worked! Apparently AMD only tried to enable this on Windows 7 for the old Catalyst Control Center. After moving on to Windows 10 they just conveniently ignored this completely. I shoot them ~20 emails as well as posting on their forum for this feature to be added back in Crimson drivers and they never responded.

This is just one small example of their lack of software support. I don't mind their FineWine, but I do want to have the features they promised to work.

 

[Xzibit]

The GPU Tach was Tachy. That was before the GPU RGB craze too.

They still have it, on the ES VEGA when it was demoing Doom at 60-70 FPS @ 4K it only had 3 lights on for load

 

[xkm1948]

The GPU Tach was Tachy. That was before the GPU RGB craze too.

They still have it, on the ES VEGA when it was demoing Doom at 60-70 FPS @ 4K it only had 3 lights on for load

In case you didn't pay attention. I was talking about the green LED ZeroCore feature instead of the load based tachmeter.

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

superior looking Crimson control panel,Wattman
Well, sort of. However recent Crimson drivers has caused some problems among 390 owners. Specifically broken Wattman for 390 VRAM overclocking.

Chill feature
Tried it in both TF2 and Fallout4. Hate it. The drop in frame rate to ~40 is quite easily to pick up by human eyes. And the lag resulted from bouncing between low FPS and high FPS makes me want to vomit. So in short, cool feature on paper, bad experience in real life. I find the Target Frame Control a way better tool than this Chill.

Honestly man, as a long time ATi GPU owner and user, I must say they are great at "promising" features in their powerpoint slides. Implementation though is usually seriously lacked.

Take the ZeroCore feature for example. It was promised to be an energy saving feature on AMD's FuryX GPU. As shown over here:

Green LED indicates that the card will in ultra energy saving mode, like browsing websites or word processing. Guess what? It never worked! Apparently AMD only tried to enable this on Windows 7 for the old Catalyst Control Center. After moving on to Windows 10 they just conveniently ignored this completely. I shoot them ~20 emails as well as posting on their forum for this feature to be added back in Crimson drivers and they never responded.

This is just one small example of their lack of software support. I don't mind their FineWine, but I do want to have the features they promised to work.

My my you blather on ,you own a fury yet now you care about r9 390 compatibility, shit man every tech company has issues with every product , see the columns in this fair land for many an intel nvidia and amd feck up there's lists and lists for all your kit , and mine yet it works still ,stop crying about bollocks ,feckin power save mode moaning on tpu , what have we come to mine are never in rest.

 

[Xzibit]

In case you didn't pay attention. I was talking about the green LED ZeroCore feature instead of the load based tachmeter.

I was. You said ZeroCore was to be a Fury feature so I stopped there. ZeroCore has been around longer than Fury. I took your gripe to be with the LED light which maybe you have bad luck and its not turning on for you

 

[xkm1948]

I was. You said ZeroCore was to be a Fury feature so I stopped there. ZeroCore has been around longer than Fury. I took your gripe to be with the LED light which maybe you have bad luck and its not turning on for you

Nope. The green led indicator was for all fury owners.

It seems really hard for some people to resist the urge to curse and attack. Not you Xzibit, the one above you. Being civil and keep discussion on matter is hard i guess.

 

[happy medium]

Something tells me that Guru 3d article was correct about Vega.

"AMD's Stock Plummets, Worst Single-Day Drop In More Than A Decade"

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-stock-ryzen-cpu-share,34314.html

 

[xkm1948]

Something tells me that Guru 3d article was correct about Vega.

"AMD's Stock Plummets, Worst Single-Day Drop In More Than A Decade"

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-stock-ryzen-cpu-share,34314.html

This is different. Q1 did not take into consideration of RyZen.

For AMD, RyZen is definitely more important right now. As it supports a whole ecosystem of related product.

 

[Divide Overflow]

Something tells me that Guru 3d article was correct about Vega.

So you're saying that hundreds of thousands of investors have insider performance information on an unreleased product and since their stock price has had a correction Vega must be a dud? It's not that the market could be reacting to the recently announced 2017 fiscal year Q1 results?

 

[RejZoR]

@xkm1948
Chill feature allows you to set lower and higher limit. You can limit the bottom FPS to 60fps and top to what you r monitor refresh is if you have 144Hz (so, 144 FPS).

 

[xkm1948]

@xkm1948
Chill feature allows you to set lower and higher limit. You can limit the bottom FPS to 60fps and top to what you r monitor refresh is if you have 144Hz (so, 144 FPS).

For people with FreeSync monitor it may be a good feature, like you said, let it float from 60~100+

For people without FreeSync monitor it really doesn't do much. I would rather just cap FPS at 58~59 to avoid the VSync lag as well as tearing when FPS is over 60.

 

[RejZoR]

Well, I'll be able to test it if I buy RX Vega

 

[xkm1948]

Well, I'll be able to test it if I buy RX Vega

People want what they dont have. You bought 980Ti and I bought FuryX. Somehow we are both yawning for GPU from the opposite camp.

I know Nvidia treats its old gen GPU not so kindly, but grass isnt that greener over AMD's side.

 

[Assimilator]

People want what they dont have. You bought 980Ti and I bought FuryX. Somehow we are both yawning for GPU from the opposite camp.

I know Nvidia treats its old gen GPU not so kindly, but grass isnt that greener over AMD's side.

Why don't you two just swap GPUs?