Editorial AMD Issues Official Statement on RX Vega 64 Pricing Woes

[EarthDog]

Oh but you are minimizing it...the fact they lied to reviewers and because of that, you have dozens of reviews painting the cards in a particular light when the reality is conclusions could be dramtically different because of price.

Again, wolf in sheepskin is a sheep...??

Oh well, agree to disagree on this.

 

[bug]

Jacked up prices are jacked up prices. Whether it is AMD or retailers behind it , I as a user don't care and don't have control over it anyway , I only get to see the final price tag. If it fits my needs I'll buy it , if it doesn't I wont. For something this basic ,yes , it is blown way out of proportion I am not minimizing anything.

Now if you have any expectations beyond that , then yes it might matter to you.

You're not wrong. Except for some it matters who jacks up prices when they want to vote with their wallets. For those, it's important to know who did what.
Afaict, Nvidia stepped into a gray area with their FE cards and media reacted to that. If AMD truly tried a bait and switch here, the media should react again. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[Vya Domus]

Yeah , AMD , the wolf in sheep's clothing...aka the ones with the least market share. A mighty predator indeed.

 

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Yeah , AMD , the wolf in sheep's clothing...aka the ones with the least market share. A mighty predator indeed.

I hope you're not saying the lesser player can't and won't play dirty when it suits them.

 

[Vya Domus]

I'm just saying it is a tad ridiculous to say that when they are probably making close to nothing on these cards with or without the "pricing scam". Just a personal opinion , AMD's own competitors pulled off arguably much more shadier tactics that netted them much more cash.

 

[EarthDog]

Yeah , AMD , the wolf in sheep's clothing...aka the ones with the least market share. A mighty predator indeed.

Lol, not talking outside of this... just giving an example of what is happening and how its being minimzed...

You are saying it is ok/less of an issue because...
1. Prices are inflated above and beyond...so we cant notice it.
2. Because they arent making profits on it? What does that have to do with anything???

Competitors and their shenanigans arent the issue here... we are talking about amd straight up misleading reviewers and the public intentionally for what amounts to better reviews. You dont think reviews and public perception of the card would be different at +$100???

I hope you're not saying the lesser player can't and won't play dirty when it suits them.

thats exactly what was said...

 

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I'm just saying it is a tad ridiculous to say that when they are probably making close to nothing on these cards with or without the "pricing scam".

I think you missed a few words here. (that = ?)

Just a personal opinion , AMD's own competitors pulled off arguably much more shadier tactics that netted them much more cash.

Charging an arm and a leg when you have no competition is far from "shadier tactics". It's annoying if you're the customer, but it's not shady.

 

[Vya Domus]

Charging an arm and a leg when you have no competition is far from "shadier tactics". It's annoying if you're the customer, but it's not shady.

You are either new around the block , or you choose to ignore all the things the competition did that go beyond just high prices.

thats exactly what was said...

Nope , what I said is that it's a ridiculous way of putting it given the situation , not that it doesn't contain a resemblance of truth. Nothing more. And of course it's my personal opinion.

 

[bug]

You are either new around the block , or you choose to ignore all the things the competition did that go beyond just high prices.

Do tell, please.

 

[Vya Domus]

Do tell, please.

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/story?id=7574976&page=1

https://www.polygon.com/2016/7/28/12315238/nvidia-gtx-970-lawsuit-settlement

These are just the most popular ones mind you.

I am sure you never heard of them though and you're probably going to tell me they are somehow irrelevant.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

I'd like to sue Newegg over their recent part in all this. In short, one of the sale reps actually blamed AMD for the price gouging.

 

[bug]

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/story?id=7574976&page=1

https://www.polygon.com/2016/7/28/12315238/nvidia-gtx-970-lawsuit-settlement

These are just the most popular ones mind you.

I am sure you never heard of them though and you're probably going to tell me they are somehow irrelevant.

They're not irrelevant, but I thought we were discussing Vega and GTX 1070/1080 here.
To sum it up, you don't have a problem with AMD pushing was seems to be a discounted price as MSRP for the initial reviewers, because Intel was fined three years ago and the 970 had an internal limitation nobody noticed was there.

 

[Vya Domus]

They're not irrelevant, but I thought we were discussing Vega and GTX 1070/1080 here.
To sum it up, you don't have a problem with AMD pushing was seems to be a discounted price as MSRP for the initial reviewers, because Intel was fined three years ago and the 970 had an internal limitation nobody noticed was there.

The problem I have is with people turning a blind eye to other shit that companies do , which is what you're doing right now.

And it was you who asked me to tell you what these other companies have done , and you're saying that's not what we're talking about now ?

Nah mate, we are talking about shady practices and AMD is small fish in that regard compared to Intel/Nvidia. And it's not me , commissions around the world came to that conclusion.

This situation is speculative at best , I can see that AMD screwed up big time and that's about it.

Whether they used shady tactics or not , I'll let respective authorities determine that.

Screw up =/= shady tactic

 

[EarthDog]

The problem I have is with people turning a blind eye to other shit that companies do , which is what you're doing right now.

And it was you who asked me to tell you what these other companies have done , and you're saying that's not what we're talking about now ?

Nah mate, we are talking about shady practices and AMD is small fish in that regard compared to Intel/Nvidia. And it's not me , commissions around the world came to that conclusion.

This situation is speculative at best , I can see that AMD screwed up big time and that's about it.

Whether they used shady tactics or not , I'll let respective authorities determine that.

Screw up =/= shady tactic

This isnt about what other companies did. Nvidia got theirs in a 970 thread...but again, this isnt about nvidia or comparing what amd did to what others have done in the past. A straw man argument... not the issue here, the others. Its a deflection tactic...intentional or not.

They screwed up making an expensive card with little margins. They were shady in how they handled pricing with reviewers and the public. Im not sure how you can deny that, honestly.

We dont need to wait for authorities to tell us anything. This isnt something for the authorities in the first place. The action doesnt need to be illegal to be shady. They manipulated results of reviews by not being forthcoming and telling us the launch price was a 'sale'. We/Reviewers passed judgement on the card at the price they gave us. That is shady. Period.

 

[Vya Domus]

The reviews still hold their relevance. The tests and the performance don't change.

I have trust in people to be capable enough to look up prices on their own and not take for granted every conclusion to every review out there. That's what I always do personally.

I understand that as a reviewer you want absolute consistency on the products that you review but we both know that is never guaranteed and it's not the first or the last time something like this will happen. However , to me it looks like you and others are trying to dramatize this issue to an unnecessary degree.

You're saying AMD tried to manipulate the media coverage , to me it looks like they simply failed to to get their products on the market the way they wanted and until there's more information on this matter , I feel like your claim that they tried to "manipulate" reviewers is outlandish and not based on anything concrete.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

The problem I have is with people turning a blind eye to other shit that companies do , which is what you're doing right now.

And it was you who asked me to tell you what these other companies have done , and you're saying that's not what we're talking about now ?

Nah mate, we are talking about shady practices and AMD is small fish in that regard compared to Intel/Nvidia. And it's not me , commissions around the world came to that conclusion.

This situation is speculative at best , I can see that AMD screwed up big time and that's about it.

Whether they used shady tactics or not , I'll let respective authorities determine that.

Screw up =/= shady tactic

I'm more inclined to think that retailer prices are more of a "fuck you" to AMD knowing there are bigger profits to be made.

 

[EarthDog]

The reviews still hold their relevance. The tests and the performance don't change.

I have trust in people to be capable enough to look up prices on their own and not take for granted every conclusion to every review out there. That's what I always do personally.

I understand that as a reviewer you want absolute consistency on the products that you review but we both know that is never guaranteed and it's not the first or the last time something like this will happen. However , to me it looks like you and others are trying to dramatize this issue to an unnecessary degree.

You're saying AMD tried to manipulate the media coverage , to me it looks like they simply failed to to get their products on the market the way they wanted and until there's more information on this matter , I feel like your claim that they tried to "manipulate" reviewers is outlandish and not based on anything concrete.

its not about consistency...

Performamce doesnt change, of course. However the value and buying decisions are also based off price. The card looks a lot better $100 cheaper, im sure you agree. Conclusions in reviews/perception of the card as a whole would have been different had we known what the actual price is.

They failed to get their products on the market the way they wanted??? Not sure i understand. Vya, they gave an price. They said nothing about it being on sale or limited quantities. Then, they came back, after the reviews and said it was a sale price and gave a higher price. Im not trying to make it dramatic. Intentional or not, it changed initial review outcomes in their favor. The card looks good price/performance wise... but with the price upped, that changes considerably with a what, a 25% increase?

 

[bug]

The problem I have is with people turning a blind eye to other shit that companies do , which is what you're doing right now.

And it was you who asked me to tell you what these other companies have done , and you're saying that's not what we're talking about now ?

Nah mate, we are talking about shady practices and AMD is small fish in that regard compared to Intel/Nvidia. And it's not me , commissions around the world came to that conclusion.

This situation is speculative at best , I can see that AMD screwed up big time and that's about it.

Whether they used shady tactics or not , I'll let respective authorities determine that.

Screw up =/= shady tactic

Nobody's turning a blind eye on anything, but there are those of us who like to stay on topic. And the topic is AMD's statement which danced around a straight answer.
If (and this still a big if) AMD really misled reviewers with initial pricing, that's a trend I don't want to see going forward. And I'll speak against it here, in this thread.

 

[Vya Domus]

its not about consistency...
They said nothing about it being on sale or limited quantities. Then, they came back, after the reviews and said it was a sale price and gave a higher price. Im not trying to make it dramatic. Intentional or not, it changed initial review outcomes in their favor. The card looks good price/performance wise... but with the price upped, that changes considerably with a what, a 25% increase?

You say you're bothered because it changed the outcome of reviews but at the same time you say this is not about consistency ? Then what is it about ? I am yet to see an official statement from AMD where they say that was a sale price that's never to be seen again , most of the claims/rumors come form retailers and I'm sorry for not trusting them as much as you do. You are again , in my opinion, basing your conclusion that AMD lied on speculation and FUD.

They failed to get their products on the market the way they wanted??? Not sure i understand.

Yes , that's what I think has happened , they thought they'll be able to sell their cards at those fixed prices and it turned out the retailers couldn't get on the same page as them. Hence a huge disconnect between them and what the retailers are doing.

 

[EarthDog]

We all have our theories I guess...

Of course you want consistency, but that really doesnt have anything to do with it. This is just seemingly dishonest. We were given a price for a limited quanitity of cards and were never told any part of that up front. That is a problem.

This goes away if amd can CONSISTENTLY stock the 399 part...

 

[Vya Domus]

Yes , we have just theories that's the point. To me it looks like a PR disaster , AMD is known for these. But I suggest we should wait a little longer and see what this was truly all about instead of throwing pretty harsh accusations right and left.

 

[EarthDog]

Im really not sure if there is a good explanation for this pricing delivery method...pr disaster is putting it mildly. Bait and switch seems closer to reality... particularly since they said the delays in release were to get stock... and they dont have any on their "399" part...

 

[Vya Domus]

I think it's AMD's/RTG's incompetence at work here.

I really do not believe they actually had malicious intentions with this , they are simply not in the position to pull that off , they have little market share with a handful of people as their fan base , they essentially have no safety net if word gets out they are trying to scam people.

 

[EarthDog]

They knew exactly how it was going down... they told us and retailers....and then the update. They knew how much stock they had and pricing.

Not being told was a kick to the nuts.

I dont know... im dizzy...talked myself in circles.

 

[bug]

I dont know... im dizzy...talked myself in circles.

Yes, but what an impact our little quarrel had on AMD. We showed them. Oh, wait...