AMD Ryzen 7 2700X 3.7 GHz

[cucker tarlson]

Percent utilization is not a perfect representation of CPU resources guys. You are forgetting that. All of you !

And you're forgetting that print screens of a video are as much of a proof of stuttering as this is a print screen proof of telekinesis.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DbewNhjW0AEVkVi?format=jpg

I read your whole post, there are about 3 lines in it and none of it says anything at all about JP.

So now you want me to find the proof in a 4 page thread myself?

You made it up, the burden of proof is not with me, its with you, you proof it to me..

I can't prove anything to a person that either can't or is too lazy to read.
Good thing I don't really have to.

 

[Shatun_Bear]

So, once again, reading comprehension, I'll quote it for you, straight out of the review

Game Tests: 720p
On popular demand from comments over the past several CPU reviews, we are including game tests at 720p (1280x720 pixels) resolution. All games from our CPU test suite are put through 720p using a GTX 1080 graphics card and Ultra settings. This low resolution serves to highlight theoretical CPU performance because games are extremely CPU-limited at this resolution. Of course, nobody buys a PC with a GTX 1080 to game at 720p, but the results are of academic value because a CPU that can't do 144 frames per second at 720p will never reach that mark at higher resolutions either. So these numbers could interest high refresh-rate gaming PC builders with fast 120 Hz and 144 Hz monitors. Our 720p tests hence serve as synthetic tests in that they are not real-world (720p isn't a real-world PC-gaming resolution anymore) even though the game tests themselves are not synthetic (they're real games, not 3D benchmarks).


Its not anyone else's fault but your own that you skip right on to the relative performance summaries, skim over the review conclusion and fail to read the rest and interpret the data properly. But please, don't bother us with your lack of attention and understanding. You have a Youtube full of crappy reviewers that can cater to your shallow demands.

Another option is that you might want to open your eyes a bit and learn something along the way.

Or translate all of what you're saying to 'real world use cases'. How many hardcore gamers do actually use that same CPU for heavy multithreaded workloads? I'd reckon about as many as there are gaming on 720p... For them the relative performance summaries are just about as relevant as for anyone building a workstation. The only way out of this is creating a bench suite that covers the CPUs' limitations in every possible way, so that each reader can extract the data set that is most relevant to his/her personal use case.

Oh, and about gaming on that 8700K at 'normal settings', seen this?

https://www.purepc.pl/procesory/test_procesorow_amd_ryzen_7_2700x_vs_intel_core_i7_8700k?page=0,19

Tell me again you don't want the fattest CPU money can buy when all you care about is FPS. Tell me again cores matter more than clocks in any gaming scenario... We have a 7700K and 8600K literally spitting out the same FPS as 8c16t Ryzens at the *same clock* and the ONLY CPU that pushes over 40 (!) minimum FPS is the one that can push 4.7 Ghz on a single core.

Do us all a favour and calm down. You're embarrassing yourself. You've now made it clear to everyone you're upset that this CPU is closer to CL than you had hoped. Have you just bought yourself an 8700K and are indignant the gaming gap is down to only 10% at worse case scenario for the 2700X?

Also, reading comprehension. You're so fervent over this you forgot to use your own eyes to read the conclusion, which is what we're meant to be talking about here:

"Nevertheless, if you are a 1080p gamer looking to drive your monitor at 144 Hz, Intel is the way to go since the Ryzen 7 2700X won't be able to provide framerates nearly as high."

Lastly, you trawled the internet to find some cherry-picked benches where the gaming performance gap is bigger. Well done that's not going to convince anyone of anything and is rather juvenile. Why would you not use TPU's very own performance summary at 1440p? Because you're in the middle of a tantrum? This is more 'real-world' and it's the most comprehensive written bench suite out there. It shows gaming at that res with a 1080 has a gap of 3.4%!! So sit and stew on that reality if you must:

 

[cucker tarlson]

Lol cause there are other reviews than TPU, they exist, it seems you're much more desperate than him to tell us not to use them. Two different results from two different tests don't even have to exclude one another, are you kidding me ?

Vayra is spot on with saying people need to learn to interpret benches and numbers, and you're proof.

 

[Vayra86]

Do us all a favour and calm down. You're embarrassing yourself. You've now made it clear to everyone you're upset that this CPU is closer to CL than you had hoped. Have you just bought yourself an 8700K and are indignant the gaming gap is down to only 10% at worse case scenario for the 2700X?

Also, reading comprehension. You're so fervent over this you forgot to use your own eyes to read the conclusion, which is what we're meant to be talking about here:

"Nevertheless, if you are a 1080p gamer looking to drive your monitor at 144 Hz, Intel is the way to go since the Ryzen 7 2700X won't be able to provide framerates nearly as high."

Lastly, you trawled the internet to find some cherry-picked benches where the gaming performance gap is bigger. Well done that's not going to convince anyone of anything and is rather juvenile. Why would you not use TPU's very own performance summary at 1440p? Because you're in the middle of a tantrum? This is more 'real-world' and it's the most comprehensive written bench suite out there. It shows gaming at that res with a 1080 has a gap of 3.4%!! So sit and stew on that reality if you must:

With the minor detail that I am not the one disagreeing with this review at all nor its conclusion - I'm in defense of it.

The detail I am not agreeing on, is that difference between an OK CPU for gaming and the optimal one, and the statement that an i3 won't do the job just fine as well, even being a quad core. I will say it again because you obviously missed it: Ryzen is fine for the vast majority of scenario's. And currently the 8600K and 8700K are the optimal choice when it comes to a CPU that has the highest performance in *any* gaming scenario. That's remarkably similar to that italic line you put in there. We came upon this topic because of high refresh rate gaming - and this is where high clocks matter and also that one scenario that Ryzen still has trouble covering well - I did say something as well about relying purely on a relative performance summary earlier, and how it can blind you from these details. You just confirmed it right there... And you even managed to link the wrong summary, because its not 1080p or 720p which you emphasized on, but 1440p thus a GPU limited scenario.

Also, tantrum? Nah mate. I'm trying to show people the things they missed.

 

[intrepid3d]

And you're forgetting that print screens of a video are as much of a proof of stuttering as this is a print screen proof of telekinesis.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DbewNhjW0AEVkVi?format=jpg



I can't prove anything to a person that either can't or is too lazy to read.
Good thing I don't really have to.

You don't know how to read frame timing lines do you?

When someone sends you a screen-shot with a frame times line in it and it looks like a 4 year old doodling that's a graphical or visual representation of stutter, its very common to use such graphs to illustrate stutter in games.

 

[cucker tarlson]

You don't know how to read frame timing lines do you?

When someone sends you a screen-shot with a frame times line in it and it looks like a 4 year old doodling that's a graphical or visual representation of stutter, its very common to use such graphs to illustrate stutter in games.

The frametimes are the numers measured in "ms" kiddo.

 

[intrepid3d]

The frametimes are the numers measured in "ms" kiddo.

Oh wow you have no idea... yes its a measure of frames rendered at a given time interval, in this case MS, if the line is straight and smooth the frame times are consistent.
If the graph line is up and down like a bad heart monitor readout its because the frame times are not consistent, when the frame times are not consistent it manifests as stutter.

 

[cucker tarlson]

Oh wow you have no idea... yes its a measure of frames rendered at a given time interval, in this case MS, if the line is straight and smooth the frame times are consistent.
If the graph line is up and down like a bad heart monitor readout its because the frame times are not consistent, when the frame time are not consistent it manifests as stutter.

There's no graph, you posted static screen shots with no frametime indication other than once again a static number, which is fine by the way, actually even better on intel than amd.

Lol you even highlighted that static frametime value in red !

 

[Vayra86]

There's no graph, you posted static screen shots with no frametime indication other than once again a static number, which is fine by the way, actually even better on intel than amd.

Thick plank is really quite thick.

 

[cucker tarlson]

Thick plank is really quite thick.

Lol he highlighted that static frametime value in red and now calls me on pointing it out that it is a static shot not a graph.

 

[Charcharo]

And you're forgetting that print screens of a video are as much of a proof of stuttering as this is a print screen proof of telekinesis.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DbewNhjW0AEVkVi?format=jpg

I can't prove anything to a person that either can't or is too lazy to read.
Good thing I don't really have to.

Why tell me that though? I know how it works I was on a 4c/4t i5 till early this year.
Stutter did happen at times, but I do think 4c/4t still has use in low end machines. For now. There is nuance to hardware, guys.

 

[intrepid3d]

There's no graph, you posted static screen shots with no frametime indication other than once again a static number, which is fine by the way, actually even better on intel than amd.

Lol you even highlighted that static frametime value in red !

I have highlighted the frame times for you in this, in red now too, the blue line is Intel, that is not just some stutter, that is horrendous.

http://imgur.com/CHmOGdu

 

[cucker tarlson]

Why tell me that though? I know how it works I was on a 4c/4t i5 till early this year.
Stutter did happen at times, but I do think 4c/4t still has use in low end machines. For now. There is nuance to hardware, guys.

That was just banter.
But now I don't know what was the point of calling crap on purepc ? You think GTX 1080 at 1080p is a low-end machine ?

I have highlighted the frame times for you in this, in red now too, the blue line is Intel, that is not just some stutter, that is horrendous.

http://imgur.com/CHmOGdu

So I know what the problem is.
You are communicating on a different wavelenght than other people do, don't you ?

 

[intrepid3d]

That was just banter.
But now I don't know what was the point of calling crap on purepc ? You think GTX 1080 at 1080p is a low-end machine ?


So I know what the problem is.
You are communicating on a different wavelenght than other people do, don't you ?

lol, well at least you have a sense of humor

 

[cucker tarlson]

Dude I told you to lay off that Crysis 3 shot that you've been beating to death for the last couple of days. You're going nowhere with it.
It's not like you have to convince us NOW. Take some time to build your case, and get back to us when you're ready. Okay ?

Are you trying to explain something to us or do you want to ask us for something to be explained to you ? Cause I am not sure at this point. You can do the latter one if you want, you know.

 

[Charcharo]

That was just banter.
But now I don't know what was the point of calling crap on purepc ? You think GTX 1080 at 1080p is a low-end machine ?


So I know what the problem is.
You are communicating on a different wavelenght than other people do, don't you ?

Egh I just ... do not think they do a good job of finding those most stressful parts of a game. At least the ones you can use to stress a CPU/GPU.

 

[Vayra86]

Egh I just ... do not think they do a good job of finding those most stressful parts of a game. At least the ones you can use to stress a CPU/GPU.

As to your comment on the 4c/4t, what CPU was it exactly?

As for PurePC, even though I can't read Polish for shit, their choices in benchmarks to use is ridiculously good, arguably the best on the net right now. Their CPU reviews tell me more than any others I can find.

 

[cucker tarlson]

Egh I just ... do not think they do a good job of finding those most stressful parts of a game. At least the ones you can use to stress a CPU/GPU.

Well, I don't know if I understand you correctly .... CPU/GPU ? The whole point of a CPU test in games is to find a place that is,and I can't emphasize it enough, NOT a GPU heavy place.
They're doing a good job on that.

On another note,but somehow related to this, I can't undestand people like Shatun Bear, who insist you only look on TPU benchmarks when you're on TPU. No one forces you to resort to picking one review only. Not even W1zzard who made it! Reviews for CPUs don't have to exclude each other even if they show different results, and that is pretty friggin obvious.

 

[Charcharo]

Well, I don't know if I understand you correctly .... CPU/GPU ? The whole point of a CPU test in games is to find a place that is,and I can't emphasize it enough, NOT a GPU heavy place.
They're doing a good job on that.

Exactly what I am talking about.

As to your comment on the 4c/4t, what CPU was it exactly?

I had an i5 4460 and i5 4570. Basically the same thing to be frank. I know modern Skylake/Coffee/Kaby ones are faster, but not much faster. It is pretty analogous to a low end Coffee i3 or 7400.

 

[intrepid3d]

Egh I just ... do not think they do a good job of finding those most stressful parts of a game. At least the ones you can use to stress a CPU/GPU.

Same, i certainly think like most reviewers TPU could do a lot better, if lone youtubers can do it and pickup on where 4 core CPU's are saturated.... and a whole lot more besides then i don't see how such an establishment like this can knock out such poorly defined information its to some extent even misleading.

These lone Youtubers are taking over and you can see why.

I'm off for some dinner

 

[Vayra86]

Exactly what I am talking about.




I had an i5 4460 and i5 4570. Basically the same thing to be frank. I know modern Skylake/Coffee/Kaby ones are faster, but not much faster. It is pretty analogous to a low end Coffee i3 or 7400.

Yeah see. I had an i5 3570k and the experience is precisely similar to what you've said about 4c4t. Its really not so much about it being a quad, its the DDR3 and the platform. Skylake @ DDR4 showed a huge jump back in the day and this is often ignored. Even RAM OCs on Haswell and earlier are rewarding these days for gaming.

 

[Charcharo]

Yeah see. I had an i5 3570k and the experience is precisely similar to what you've said about 4c4t. Its really not so much about it being a quad, its the DDR3 and the platform. Skylake @ DDR4 showed a huge jump back in the day and this is often ignored. Even RAM OCs on Haswell and earlier are rewarding these days for gaming.

You have to remember that whilst DDR4 would for sure help, lower end mobos and i5s can not really OC memory like K parts. But I agree it would be better for sure. Just not 1500X better (in this context).

 

[cucker tarlson]

Exactly what I am talking about.




I had an i5 4460 and i5 4570. Basically the same thing to be frank. I know modern Skylake/Coffee/Kaby ones are faster, but not much faster. It is pretty analogous to a low end Coffee i3 or 7400.

They show a lot of gains from faster CPU as well as fast RAM. How exactly are they managing it while picking poor CPU testing places at the same time ?

I'm off for some dinner

Just don't stutter while eating, you'll choke, and we don't want that.

 

[Charcharo]

They show a lot of gains from faster CPU as well as fast RAM. How exactly are they managing it while picking poor CPU testing places at the same time ?

To be 100% certain I would have to test and compare to their results. For example, testing CPU in Metro is best done in the AI Arena with PhysX On (if Redux! as Redux uses multithreaded PhysX). Spawn humans x4 on both sides and see the carnage watching over the two forces fight. Reset the level every time so that the destructible cover is reset too. That is one hell of a CPU workout, IMHO, as the actual arena is sparse on GPU resources. Best tested with a higher end AMD GPU of course, so PhysX is all on the CPU.

 

[trparky]

Can I ask a dumb question here? What clock speed was the 8700K running at when many of these tests were being conducted?