Microsoft's Biannual Major Windows 10 Update Cycle to Slow Down

yogurt_21 · Jul 26, 2019

I think most enterprises are fighting through that culture change right now. I mean scheduled releases were put into place because it used to be a wild west and older IT executives remember when things were that way. They're afraid to embrace the change now because they confuse it with the older "push button and pray" release methods of the early 2000's.

Modern tools thus are looked at with distrusting eyes and many arguments happen between younger and older engineers.

I get it, but when you're the guys supposed to be leading the charge like MS, it's bad. Azure cloud has a long way to go to catch AWS but it's growth is still amazing and they're still beating google cloud ffs.

How in the world do some of these older practices still exist when they've developed all kinds of these tools for their own cloud platform?

it's weird.

bug · Jul 26, 2019

yogurt_21 said:
I think most enterprises are fighting through that culture change right now. I mean scheduled releases were put into place because it used to be a wild west and older IT executives remember when things were that way. They're afraid to embrace the change now because they confuse it with the older "push button and pray" release methods of the early 2000's.

Modern tools thus are looked at with distrusting eyes and many arguments happen between younger and older engineers.

I get it, but when you're the guys supposed to be leading the charge like MS, it's bad. Azure cloud has a long way to go to catch AWS but it's growth is still amazing and they're still beating google cloud ffs.

How in the world do some of these older practices still exist when they've developed all kinds of these tools for their own cloud platform?

it's weird.

Do not underestimate the power of an IT admin having a MS certification and refusing to do anything that's not Active Directory.

eidairaman1 · Jul 26, 2019

I may consider reactos after ms if they dont restore Windows to the way W95-7 Gui worked and layout.

matar · Jul 27, 2019

I am still on 1809 it's better for gaming...

TheinsanegamerN · Jul 27, 2019

lynx29 said:
can you link me to a printer from Amazon usa that should work on IPP ubuntu linux? I'm genuinely considering making the move last few months. i think i just might.

also, does AMD or Nvidia support Linux better? gpu wise

In my experience, AMD has an advantage in linux, at least with modern cards. Nvidia doesnt optimize nearly as much for linux as it does windows, so performance is more comparable to card generations when they are no longer optimized for on windows. This can allow AMD to cinch the performance crown surprisingly often. AMD drivers are also baked into linux MESA, so no having to install proprietary drivers. Nvidia also has some oddity issues on linux, such as glitchy, rough scrolling in web browsers and the like, that AMD does not have.

HOWEVER: nvidia drivers are supported day 1 on linux, because they work like windows drivers. Because AMD MESA drivers are updated slowly, slow releases like ubuntu LTS will often not support the latest AMD GPUs. If you tend to buy GPUs near the end of the generation like I do, then this will not be an issue, but if you like newer GPUs, nvidia will be a bit easier to deal with unless you feel comfortable updating MESA yourself.

As for printers, I have had 0 luck with network printer support, it is like slamming my head against a brick wall getting them to work. I know I must be doing something wrong, but IDK.

FordGT90Concept · Jul 27, 2019

yogurt_21 said:
nearly everything is moving to that model. You're either failing to understand what "done" means or you're completely against CI/CD. Either way it's a losing game to fight it. With DevOps and modern tools there is no point to have these monolithic release prone to massive flaws when you can release incrementally with 0% downtime and min to no bugs.

Microsoft is still failing massively at this of course. With Azure growing though there is hope that they'll start seeing what all their customers are doing and begin to mimic. If you need to update a single line of code, do it. Don't wait to pair that change with 3000 others and hope it's all just ok.

I mean QA automation is great and all but seriously it's not a Genie.

Continuous deployment is about reducing risk, not increasing it.

AMD has a similar update cadence and the reason for it is quality assurance and scoping. You have people working on routine updates and you have people working on major updates. Each are QA'd separately with different target release dates. When making major under the hood changes, you don't know how many other things are going to break because of it. That's why the complete package needs to be tested.

I figured the news would be like updates every 9 months instead of 6 months. I'm not sure I see the point of changing to a tick-tock cadence. Anything too big to target 6 months would target 12 months. Now they're talking like big updates could get pushed out a full 18 months if they miss a six month target.

I think the intent is to make the six month update less scary so people don't have reservations about getting it.

lexluthermiester · Jul 27, 2019

Kokorniokos said:
My wish: dark mode everything! Even that old control panel.

I'll go along with this! I use a theme in Windows 7 that does this already, but it would be nice to have a native solution within Windows.

tony359 · Jul 27, 2019

danbert2000 said:
Honestly, this is a much better tactic as there aren't too many features that can't wait 6 months to come out, and people rely on Windows 10 to be stable and update correctly.

Exactly my thought. I see why we now have more frequent major updates but 6 months is silly. They need to find a balance between staying competitive and provide new features but also provide a reliable system to work with. Heck, they've just finally changed the way those monolithic updates were being deployed and we can now finally delay it (up to 3 years). All my computers have always had Group Policy set to NOT download updates unless I say so but how many people have I encountered looking at their laptop with horror when updates are started just before a powerpoint presentation?

Regarding the fixed deadlines, I guess you can never be "ready": I suppose there will be hundreds of projects going on at once on a new release and it would be impossible to have them ALL ready - so it makes sense to me to set a fixed deadline and include/exclude what is ready by then. If the deployment is properly managed, a deadline would not include anything that is not ready. If they made the deadline flexible, a poor management would STILL include untested/unfinished code.

Darmok N Jalad · Jul 27, 2019

I’ve had great luck with the HP Deskjet 8100 for a wireless printer. Works perfectly with iOS, macOS, and Linux. I bought it many years ago though. To give you an idea of how old it is, I bought that model specifically because I could print to it from Surface RT! I think AirPrint support is key.

lemonadesoda · Jul 27, 2019

I,m hoping that windows 10. 2003 will be as good as Win 2003. My favorite. Where the user was in control. Classic!

... and why the rollout schedule change? A: they’ve run out of ideas. Lol

Space Lynx · Jul 28, 2019

lemonadesoda said:
I,m hoping that windows 10. 2003 will be as good as Win 2003. My favorite. Where the user was in control. Classic!

... and why the rollout schedule change? A: they’ve run out of ideas. Lol

yep only so many UI changes you can make before people start to call on your bs. lol

Darmok N Jalad · Jul 28, 2019

I just don’t care for the Win10 GUI. The whole “built for touch” concept makes for larger UI elements than necessary. Also, I know flat is in, but with square everything, it just looks really boring and there’s just not much information density, especially on the UWP apps. I do like the task manager though.

lexluthermiester · Jul 28, 2019

Darmok N Jalad said:
I just don’t care for the Win10 GUI. The whole “built for touch” concept makes for larger UI elements than necessary. Also, I know flat is in, but with square everything, it just looks really boring and there’s just not much information density, especially on the UWP apps. I do like the task manager though.

I think it rather juvenile. It's mildly better than Windows 3, but that's it. Windows 7 and even XP look much better.

bug · Jul 28, 2019

Darmok N Jalad said:
I just don’t care for the Win10 GUI. The whole “built for touch” concept makes for larger UI elements than necessary. Also, I know flat is in, but with square everything, it just looks really boring and there’s just not much information density, especially on the UWP apps. I do like the task manager though.

I don't have a problem with Win10. Win8 on the other hand was a train wreck.
On the other hand, I'm used to KDE and next to that, any other UI looks like a toy. Just don't forget the OS (and its UI) are just the means to an end.

Edit: What do you know, three hands. Now that's multi-tasking

trparky · Jul 28, 2019

About time Microsoft! We’ve only been asking for you guys to slow down for nearly the entire time Windows 10 has existed.

Maybe now we’ll see more people adopt Windows 10 because they’ve slowed down on the big upgrades. That’s one of the biggest complaints people have had regarding Windows 10.

Camm · Jul 29, 2019

If I can manage an Enterprise on a fast release cadence (including security updates in 2 days, and feature updates in 14, and not on LTSB), I have no idea how so many of you can't seem to manage this.

For home users, set security to 1 day, and feature updates to 14 days, and even the chance of a bad patch will be low.

That being said, I do welcome the change. Although I fear we will see further fragmentation of software from Microsoft to compensate (such as Powershell Core still not being in mainline feature release).

ManofGod · Jul 29, 2019

Heck, I was aware of this 2 months ago, where have you guys been?

windwhirl · Jul 29, 2019

ManofGod said:
Heck, I was aware of this 2 months ago, where have you guys been?

Not everyone is on Insider Program

WhateverAnotherFreakingID · Jul 29, 2019

[OT sorry] TIL "biannual" in English can mean both "every 2 years" both "twice a year".

As a not native English speaker I couldn't clearly make sense of the title so I went looking:
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/biannual

Definition of BIANNUAL

occurring twice a year; biennial… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

"Biweekly" and "bimonthly" unequivocally means every 2 weeks/months, but not "biannual", not "every 2" but mainly "twice". Of course using "semiannual" instead would be as much correct and eliminate the ambiguity entirely. But what about the fun then? What about the everyday infinite learning chances?

So I think I'm going to mindmap "Biannual" just shy the shelf where I've placed the pesky Imperial System measure units.

ManofGod · Jul 29, 2019

windwhirl said:
Not everyone is on Insider Program

Well, I am but for this information, I think I saw it on MSPoweruser.com.

System Name	Thought I'd be done with this by now
Processor	i7 11700k 8/16
Motherboard	MSI Z590 Pro Wifi
Cooling	Be Quiet Dark Rock Pro 4, 9x aigo AR12
Memory	32GB GSkill TridentZ Neo DDR4-4000 CL18-22-22-42
Video Card(s)	MSI Ventus 2x Geforce RTX 3070
Storage	1TB MX300 M.2 OS + Games, + cloud mostly
Display(s)	Samsung 40" 4k (TV)
Case	Lian Li PC-011 Dynamic EVO Black
Audio Device(s)	onboard HD -> Yamaha 5.1
Power Supply	EVGA 850 GQ
Mouse	Logitech wireless
Keyboard	same
VR HMD	nah
Software	Windows 10
Benchmark Scores	no one cares anymore lols

Processor	Intel i5-12600k
Motherboard	Asus H670 TUF
Cooling	Arctic Freezer 34
Memory	2x16GB DDR4 3600 G.Skill Ripjaws V
Video Card(s)	EVGA GTX 1060 SC
Storage	500GB Samsung 970 EVO, 500GB Samsung 850 EVO, 1TB Crucial MX300 and 2TB Crucial MX500
Display(s)	Dell U3219Q + HP ZR24w
Case	Raijintek Thetis
Audio Device(s)	Audioquest Dragonfly Red :D
Power Supply	Seasonic 620W M12
Mouse	Logitech G502 Proteus Core
Keyboard	G.Skill KM780R
Software	Arch Linux + Win10

System Name	PCGOD
Processor	AMD FX 8350@ 5.0GHz
Motherboard	Asus TUF 990FX Sabertooth R2 2901 Bios
Cooling	Scythe Ashura, 2×BitFenix 230mm Spectre Pro LED (Blue,Green), 2x BitFenix 140mm Spectre Pro LED
Memory	16 GB Gskill Ripjaws X 2133 (2400 OC, 10-10-12-20-20, 1T, 1.65V)
Video Card(s)	AMD Radeon 290 Sapphire Vapor-X
Storage	Samsung 840 Pro 256GB, WD Velociraptor 1TB
Display(s)	NEC Multisync LCD 1700V (Display Port Adapter)
Case	AeroCool Xpredator Evil Blue Edition
Audio Device(s)	Creative Labs Sound Blaster ZxR
Power Supply	Seasonic 1250 XM2 Series (XP3)
Mouse	Roccat Kone XTD
Keyboard	Roccat Ryos MK Pro
Software	Windows 7 Pro 64

System Name	Matar Extreme PC.
Processor	Intel Core i9-12900KS 5.2GHZ All P-Cores ,4.2GHZ All E-Cores & Ring 4.2GhZ bus speed 100.27
Motherboard	NZXT N5 Z690 Wi-Fi 6E
Cooling	CoolerMaster ML240L V2 AIO with MX6
Memory	4x16 64GB DDR4 3600MHZ CL15-19-19-36-55 G.SKILL Trident Z NEO
Video Card(s)	Nvidia ZOTAC RTX 3080 Ti Trinity + overclocked 100 core 1000 mem. Re-pasted MX6
Storage	WD black 1GB Nvme OS + 1TB 970 Nvme Samsung & 4TB WD Blk 256MB cache 7200RPM
Display(s)	Lenovo 34" Ultra Wide 3440x1440 144hz 1ms G-Snyc
Case	NZXT H510 Black with Cooler Master RGB Fans
Audio Device(s)	Internal , EIFER speakers & EasySMX Wireless Gaming Headset
Power Supply	Aurora R9 850Watts 80+ Gold, I Modded cables for it.
Mouse	Onn RGB Gaming Mouse & Logitech G923 & shifter & E-Break Sim setup.
Keyboard	GOFREETECH RGB Gaming Keyboard, & Xbox 1 X Controller & T-Flight Hotas Joystick
VR HMD	Oculus Rift S
Software	Windows 10 Home 22H2
Benchmark Scores	https://www.youtube.com/user/matttttar/videos

System Name	Skunkworks 3.0
Processor	5800x3d
Motherboard	x570 unify
Cooling	Noctua NH-U12A
Memory	32GB 3600 mhz
Video Card(s)	asrock 6800xt challenger D
Storage	Sabarent rocket 4.0 2TB, MX 500 2TB
Display(s)	Asus 1440p144 27"
Case	Old arse cooler master 932
Power Supply	Corsair 1200w platinum
Mouse	squeak
Keyboard	Some old office thing
Software	Manjaro

Microsoft's Biannual Major Windows 10 Update Cycle to Slow Down

yogurt_21

bug

eidairaman1

The Exiled Airman

matar

TheinsanegamerN

FordGT90Concept

"I go fast!1!11!1!"

lexluthermiester

tony359

Darmok N Jalad

lemonadesoda

Space Lynx

Astronaut

Darmok N Jalad

lexluthermiester

bug

trparky

Camm

ManofGod

windwhirl

WhateverAnotherFreakingID

Definition of BIANNUAL

ManofGod

System Name	BY-2021
Processor	AMD Ryzen 7 5800X (65w eco profile)
Motherboard	MSI B550 Gaming Plus
Cooling	Scythe Mugen (rev 5)
Memory	2 x Kingston HyperX DDR4-3200 32 GiB
Video Card(s)	AMD Radeon RX 7900 XT
Storage	Samsung 980 Pro, Seagate Exos X20 TB 7200 RPM
Display(s)	Nixeus NX-EDG274K (3840x2160@144 DP) + Samsung SyncMaster 906BW (1440x900@60 HDMI-DVI)
Case	Coolermaster HAF 932 w/ USB 3.0 5.25" bay + USB 3.2 (A+C) 3.5" bay
Audio Device(s)	Realtek ALC1150, Micca OriGen+
Power Supply	Enermax Platimax 850w
Mouse	Nixeus REVEL-X
Keyboard	Tesoro Excalibur
Software	Windows 10 Home 64-bit
Benchmark Scores	Faster than the tortoise; slower than the hare.

System Name	Budget Box
Processor	Xeon E5-2667v2
Motherboard	ASUS P9X79 Pro
Cooling	Some cheap tower cooler, I dunno
Memory	32GB 1866-DDR3 ECC
Video Card(s)	XFX RX 5600XT
Storage	WD NVME 1GB
Display(s)	ASUS Pro Art 27"
Case	Antec P7 Neo

System Name	ICE-QUAD // ICE-CRUNCH
Processor	Q6600 // 2x Xeon 5472
Memory	2GB DDR // 8GB FB-DIMM
Video Card(s)	HD3850-AGP // FireGL 3400
Display(s)	2 x Samsung 204Ts = 3200x1200
Audio Device(s)	Audigy 2
Software	Windows Server 2003 R2 as a Workstation now migrated to W10 with regrets.

Processor	7800X3D -25 all core
Motherboard	B650 Steel Legend
Cooling	Frost Commander 140
Video Card(s)	Merc 310 7900 XT @3100 core -.75v
Display(s)	Agon 27" QD-OLED Glossy 240hz 1440p
Case	NZXT H710 (Red/Black)
Audio Device(s)	Asgard 2, Modi 3, HD58X
Power Supply	Corsair RM850x Gold

System Name	My Ryzen 7 7700X Super Computer
Processor	AMD Ryzen 7 7700X
Motherboard	Gigabyte B650 Aorus Elite AX
Cooling	DeepCool AK620 with Arctic Silver 5
Memory	2x16GB G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO DDR5 EXPO (CL30)
Video Card(s)	XFX AMD Radeon RX 7900 GRE
Storage	Samsung 980 EVO 1 TB NVMe SSD (System Drive), Samsung 970 EVO 500 GB NVMe SSD (Game Drive)
Display(s)	Acer Nitro XV272U (DisplayPort) and Acer Nitro XV270U (DisplayPort)
Case	Lian Li LANCOOL II MESH C
Audio Device(s)	On-Board Sound / Sony WH-XB910N Bluetooth Headphones
Power Supply	MSI A850GF
Mouse	Logitech M705
Keyboard	Steelseries
Software	Windows 11 Pro 64-bit
Benchmark Scores	https://valid.x86.fr/liwjs3

System Name	ATHENA
Processor	AMD 7950X
Motherboard	ASUS Crosshair X670E Extreme
Cooling	ASUS ROG Ryujin III 360, 13 x Lian Li P28
Memory	2x32GB Trident Z RGB 6000Mhz CL30
Video Card(s)	ASUS 4090 STRIX
Storage	3 x Kingston Fury 4TB, 4 x Samsung 870 QVO
Display(s)	Acer X38S, Wacom Cintiq Pro 15
Case	Lian Li O11 Dynamic EVO
Audio Device(s)	Topping DX9, Fluid FPX7 Fader Pro, Beyerdynamic T1 G2, Beyerdynamic MMX300
Power Supply	Seasonic PRIME TX-1600
Mouse	Xtrfy MZ1 - Zy' Rail, Logitech MX Vertical, Logitech MX Master 3
Keyboard	Logitech G915 TKL
VR HMD	Oculus Quest 2
Software	Windows 11 + Universal Blue

System Name	System V
Processor	AMD Ryzen 5 3600
Motherboard	Asus Prime X570-P
Cooling	Cooler Master Hyper 212 // a bunch of 120 mm Xigmatek 1500 RPM fans (2 ins, 3 outs)
Memory	2x8GB Ballistix Sport LT 3200 MHz (BLS8G4D32AESCK.M8FE) (CL16-18-18-36)
Video Card(s)	Gigabyte AORUS Radeon RX 580 8 GB
Storage	SHFS37A240G / DT01ACA200 / ST10000VN0008 / ST8000VN004 / SA400S37960G / SNV21000G / NM620 2TB
Display(s)	LG 22MP55 IPS Display
Case	NZXT Source 210
Audio Device(s)	Logitech G430 Headset
Power Supply	Corsair CX650M
Software	Whatever build of Windows 11 is being served in Canary channel at the time.
Benchmark Scores	Corona 1.3: 3120620 r/s Cinebench R20: 3355 FireStrike: 12490 TimeSpy: 4624