Which is the best fan configuration for Lian Li O11 Dynamic XL??

[Wolvyreen]

Hi All,

So I have had my O11 build now for about a month. But one thing that is ALWAYS SO hard to look at is the fans. I bought the Corsair White RGB ML120 Pro's and with my current setup, the bottom fans are intake, side fans are intake and the top (radiator fans) and rear fans are exhaust.

I have found after searching around that this is the same configuration that most people use for this case. However, I find that the backward facing is just killing the aesthetics of the fans. :-(

Has anyone got some suggestions for me? Take a look...

 

[eidairaman1]

 

[JATownes]

I am running an XL as well (under full water) and the fan configuration you are running is best for cooling performance in my experience. Visual aesthetics are "in the eye of the beholder", so if performance is where you want it, swap the fans around and see if it is still acceptable.

JAT

 

[Wolvyreen]

Thanks but the case used in those tests doesn't compare to the Lian Li O11 XL.

Nice video though

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Very nice setup..... you can try with side exhaust but you'll have to experiment with fan rpm to balance it out with the 3 bottom intake and your I'm guessing 6-7 exhaust fans in that configuration. You can always get some QL from corsair if it bothers you too much

 

[Wolvyreen]

Very nice setup..... you can try with side exhaust but you'll have to experiment with fan rpm to balance it out with the 3 bottom intake and your I'm guessing 6-7 exhaust fans in that configuration. You can always get some QL from corsair if it bothers you too much

I considered the QL's but their max RPM's are only 1500rpm

 

[oxrufiioxo]

I considered the QL's but their max RPM's are only 1500rpm

With 9-10 fans I doubt that will matter although I prefer the ML RGB fans they would put in in the same scenario. I cap my fans at 1200 RPM under heavy gaming and my case isn't nearly as good in the airflow department as yours and my temps on my 2080 ti and 9900k are excellent.


I personally think your system looks awesome as is though.

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

I considered the QL's but their max RPM's are only 1500rpm

I'm using them for bottom intake fans, they're nice effective and quite.
I have the non XL version with custom water so I can't compare setups.
But I can say this much ,I have two 360 rads in it at the side and top ,both pushing out of the case so I see the front of the LL120s , in this watery config the air in can still be insufficient to what's pushed out so I have had to add filtering to my pciex area and other parts to minimise dust ingress.
The way you have it on air should be the most effective setup both for cooling and dust control.

Cost has me hostage but I would like to swap my Ll120 at the side of the mobo for QL120s , they look that good from the front and back(my present view)

 

[Wolvyreen]

With 9-10 fans I doubt that will matter although I prefer the ML RGB fans they would put in in the same scenario. I cap my fans at 1200 RPM under heavy gaming and my case isn't nearly as good in the airflow department as yours and my temps on my 2080 ti and 9900k are excellent.


I personally think your system looks awesome as is though.

Thank you Ox. I actually promised some photos and haven't delivered. I'll see if I can send some tomorrow on my build thread.

 

[erocker]

Looks good to me! I have the non-XL but have my fans set the same way... Excluding the rear fan which I don't have.

 

[Wolvyreen]

I just hate the fact that the RGB is so dim because of the direction of the fans and also seeing the rest brackets...

 

[oxrufiioxo]

I just hate the fact that the RGB is so dim because of the direction of the fans and also seeing the rest brackets...

QLs are calling your name......

it would look good in your color setup.... vs the Unicorn vomit going on here lol.

 

[erocker]

I just hate the fact that the RGB is so dim because of the direction of the fans and also seeing the rest brackets...

Meh, looks fine! RGB does look a little dim, have you tried adjusting brightness with iCue? I have the same fans and they're not as dim.

 

[Wolvyreen]

QLs are calling your name......

it would look good in your color setup.... vs the Unicorn vomit going on here lol.
View attachment 144200

DAMN! those fans are nice!!

Meh, looks fine! RGB does look a little dim, have you tried adjusting brightness with iCue? I have the same fans and they're not as dim.

The fans brightness is not adjustable as they are plain white and they don't have their own RGB connector to adjust them. They are not set to voltage but rather PWM which has them full brightness all the time

 

[oxrufiioxo]

DAMN! those fans are nice!!

Yeah, I like the Xmen like fan frame lol.... goes with your Profile pic lol.

 

[Wolvyreen]

Yeah, I like the Xmen like fan frame lol.... goes with your Profile pic lol.

Yh those fans look good no matter which way they face

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Yh those fans look good no matter which way they face

Shame 3 sets of them are over $400 usd.... That's more than what most people spend on their GPU lmao.

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

Yeah, I like the Xmen like fan frame lol.... goes with your Profile pic lol.

What is not as clear is the build quality of the QL's instead of stickers they have metal badges front and back with the Corsair logo and are built well with inbuilt rubber pads and good quality built.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

What is not as clear is the build quality of the QL's instead of stickers they have metal badges front and back with the Corsair logo and are built well with inbuilt rubber pads and good quality built.

I agree, they look very expensive to produce.

 

[John Naylor]

1. The 1st law of water cooling is "never mix metals"... aka eliminate 99% of CLCs from consideration. The second law is "radiator fans always blow in.

Yes you have to let go of that day in 8th grade earth science when we were by chance paying attention when teacher taught us "hot air rises" ... while there is a gentle rise in an indisturbed environment, that axiom does not apply when the air in your case is doing a 100% changeover every 0.5 to 1.5 seconds. This is simple math:

Ambient Air: 23C
Inside Case Air: 28C
Coolant Temp: 33C

Fans move air thru the radiation and the rate of heat removal is proportional to Delta T; so what does the math tell us ?

33 - 23 = 10
33 - 28 = 5

So 23C air will remove 2 x as much heat from the loop as inside the case air. I just picked those numbers to make the math easy, but no matter what happens, inside case air will always be warmer than outside air. The automatic reaction to this statement well what about all the other stuff, why make the other components hotter ?

a) if you are concerned about this products, why don't they have water blocks on them ?
b) Which components are we concerned about ? I see nothing in MoBo (30 watts) , RAM (5 watts) , HD (10 watts) , whatever manuals about the dangers / performance impacts of 28C air .

If I'm wrong ... why the people who design, market, support and try to sell these products advise their customers to install fane]s this way ? Is it really feasible that they don't want to show their products in the best possible light ?

I'm not quite sure of your set up... is this correct

Top = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing Out
Side = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing Out
Front = (3) Fans Blowing In w/ Filters
Bottom = (3) Fans Blowing in W/ Filters
Rear = (1) Fan Blowing Out

Other things to understand :

a) The specs you see on the web site... say 80 cfm at 1.2 SP actually mean:

You will see 80 cfm a@ 0 SP
Yu will see 0 cfm at 1.2 SP

The realty is you will see about 38 - 42 cfm at about 0.6 SP

b) Radiator have a varying effect on air flow depending on the density of the fins. We 'll assume low - medium fpi rads with an insignificant reduction in air flow.

c) Filters have a very significant effect on air flow ... which can range up to 30% when "moderately clogged with dust. Lets say your anal about cleaning and use 80%

Let's call an unrestricted fan (rear) = 1 "Equivalent Fan" (EF)

Top = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing Out = 3 fans = 3.0 EF Out
Side = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing Out = 3 fans = 3.0 EF Out
Front = (3) Fans Blowing In w/ Filters = 3 fans x 80% = 2.4 EF In
Bottom = (3) Fans Blowing in w/ Filters 3 fans x 80% = 2.4 EF In
Rear = (1) Fan Blowing Out = 1 x 100% EF Out

Thats's the equivalent of 7.0 fans blowing out and 4.8 Fans blowing in ... leaving you with about 2.2 worth of fans coming in from unfiltered openings in your case. Looking at your box ... that would be that big wide open grille area adjacent to you GFX card as well as the vented slot covers. Is the PSU backside top or backside bottom mounted ? If it's bottom, you have your 850 watt PSU and 330 watt GFX card exhausting hot air out behind the case out and 90 % of the equivalent fan flow fans worth of negative pressure sucking it right back in.

If ya look at the case web site the diagram they advise appears he best option here:

http://www.lian-li.com/pc-o11-air

Top = (3) Fans Blowing Out = 3 fans x 100% = 3.0 EF Out
Side = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing In w/ Filters = 3 fans x 80% = 2.4 EF In
Front = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing In w/ Filters = 3 fans 80% = 2.4 EF In
Bottom = (3) Fans Blowing in w/ Filters 3 fans x 80% = 24 EF In
Rear = (1) Fan Blowing Out = 1 x EF Out

That's the equivalent of 7.2 fans blowing in and 4.0 Fans blowing out ... leaving you with:

a) strong positive case pressure
b) no hot air and dust being sucked in thru the grille / slot covers and 2.8 EFs worth of air being pushed out
c) Add that 2nd rear fan if ya like.to make it 7.2 in and 5.0 out.

Remember that grille and slot covers are an important part of case air flow design ... you don't need to have a gan pushing out every cfm of air being pushed in...

a) Does your kitchen exhaust fan have a matching intake fan ?
b) Does your attic exhaust fan have a matching intake fan ?
c) Does the window you put in a bedroom at night during summer to circulate in cool night air and a matching fan in the other winwor ? ... Or does blowing air out 1 window ineveitable result in air being sucked in thru the other ?
d) Your engine compartment gas a fan (or 2) bringing air into the engine compartment ... is there another one somewhere to get it our ?

To my view the case manufactuere's diagram is the best option. The Kraken wont allow you to comply with the 1st rule of water cooling, but you can certainly comply with the second

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

1. The 1st law of water cooling is "never mix metals"... aka eliminate 99% of CLCs from consideration. The second law is "radiator fans always blow in.

Yes you have to let go of that day in 8th grade earth science when we were by chance paying attention when teacher taught us "hot air rises" ... while there is a gentle rise in an indisturbed environment, that axiom does not apply when the air in your case is doing a 100% changeover every 0.5 to 1.5 seconds. This is simple math:

Ambient Air: 23C
Inside Case Air: 28C
Coolant Temp: 33C

Fans move air thru the radiation and the rate of heat removal is proportional to Delta T; so what does the math tell us ?

33 - 23 = 10
33 - 28 = 5

So 23C air will remove 2 x as much heat from the loop as inside the case air. I just picked those numbers to make the math easy, but no matter what happens, inside case air will always be warmer than outside air. The automatic reaction to this statement well what about all the other stuff, why make the other components hotter ?

a) if you are concerned about this products, why don't they have water blocks on them ?
b) Which components are we concerned about ? I see nothing in MoBo (30 watts) , RAM (5 watts) , HD (10 watts) , whatever manuals about the dangers / performance impacts of 28C air .

If I'm wrong ... why the people who design, market, support and try to sell these products advise their customers to install fane]s this way ? Is it really feasible that they don't want to show their products in the best possible light ?

View attachment 144201


I'm not quite sure of your set up... is this correct

Top = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing Out
Side = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing Out
Front = (3) Fans Blowing In w/ Filters
Bottom = (3) Fans Blowing in W/ Filters
Rear = (1) Fan Blowing Out

Other things to understand :

a) The specs you see on the web site... say 80 cfm at 1.2 SP actually mean:

You will see 80 cfm a@ 0 SP
Yu will see 0 cfm at 1.2 SP

The realty is you will see about 38 - 42 cfm at about 0.6 SP

b) Radiator have a varying effect on air flow depending on the density of the fins. We 'll assume low - medium fpi rads with an insignificant reduction in air flow.

c) Filters have a very significant effect on air flow ... which can range up to 30% when "moderately clogged with dust. Lets say your anal about cleaning and use 80%

Let's call an unrestricted fan (rear) = 1 "Equivalent Fan" (EF)

Top = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing Out = 3 fans = 3.0 EF Out
Side = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing Out = 3 fans = 3.0 EF Out
Front = (3) Fans Blowing In w/ Filters = 3 fans x 80% = 2.4 EF In
Bottom = (3) Fans Blowing in w/ Filters 3 fans x 80% = 2.4 EF In
Rear = (1) Fan Blowing Out = 1 x 100% EF Out

Thats's the equivalent of 7.0 fans blowing out and 4.8 Fans blowing in ... leaving you with about 2.2 worth of fans coming in from unfiltered openings in your case. Looking at your box ... that would be that big wide open grille area adjacent to you GFX card as well as the vented slot covers. Is the PSU backside top or backside bottom mounted ? If it's bottom, you have your 850 watt PSU and 330 watt GFX card exhausting hot air out behind the case out and 90 % of the equivalent fan flow fans worth of negative pressure sucking it right back in.

If ya look at the case web site the diagram they advise appears he best option here:

http://www.lian-li.com/pc-o11-air

Top = (3) Fans Blowing Out = 3 fans x 100% = 3.0 EF Out
Side = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing In w/ Filters = 3 fans x 80% = 2.4 EF In
Front = (3) Radiator Fans Blowing In w/ Filters = 3 fans 80% = 2.4 EF In
Bottom = (3) Fans Blowing in w/ Filters 3 fans x 80% = 24 EF In
Rear = (1) Fan Blowing Out = 1 x EF Out

That's the equivalent of 7.2 fans blowing in and 4.0 Fans blowing out ... leaving you with:

a) strong positive case pressure
b) no hot air and dust being sucked in thru the grille / slot covers and 2.8 EFs worth of air being pushed out
c) Add that 2nd rear fan if ya like.to make it 7.2 in and 5.0 out.

Remember that grille and slot covers are an important part of case air flow design ... you don't need to have a gan pushing out every cfm of air being pushed in...

a) Does your kitchen exhaust fan have a matching intake fan ?
b) Does your attic exhaust fan have a matching intake fan ?
c) Does the window you put in a bedroom at night during summer to circulate in cool night air and a matching fan in the other winwor ? ... Or does blowing air out 1 window ineveitable result in air being sucked in thru the other ?
d) Your engine compartment gas a fan (or 2) bringing air into the engine compartment ... is there another one somewhere to get it our ?

To my view the case manufactuere's diagram is the best option. The Kraken wont allow you to comply with the 1st rule of water cooling, but you can certainly comply with the second

This case defies those rules since it was built to be easily stripped of it's glass for bench runs and was built that way purposefully so that air if needed is plentiful, my last case was a thermal take Kandalf LCS ,it had a door mounted upgraded 360 rad and my Ek 360 60mm thick at it's front both getting direct ambient air with CPU and GPU blocked, I prefer my setup now And the temps are better.
I realize you know a fair bit and I can actually see your point of view and I can't reasonably argue most of it , it's logical if very wordy.
I think the actual temperature of most other components besides the water cooled parts have the same amount of cold air going across them that they would have had warmed air and all in it's negligible either way ,you can work round issues with a bit of thought after all.

 

[Wolvyreen]

This guy seems to have the exact same issue as me and he explains things pretty well and he settled on a different configuration that supports John Naylors opinion.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

This guy seems to have the exact same issue as me and he explains things pretty well and he settled on a different configuration that supports John Naylors opinion.

The Regular 011 has different thermal properties due to not having a real rear exhaust and being smaller so trying to compare cases isn't really going to do you a whole lot of good.

Best thing to do is experiment yourself.
under typical gaming loads the CPU is going to be pretty cool so whatever configuration you settle on I would do one that favors the GPU.

 

[John Naylor]

This case defies those rules since it was built to be easily stripped of it's glass for bench runs and was built that way purposefully so that air if needed is plentiful, my last case was a thermal take Kandalf LCS ,it had a door mounted upgraded 360 rad and my Ek 360 60mm thick at it's front both getting direct ambient air with CPU and GPU blocked, I prefer my setup now And the temps are better.
I realize you know a fair bit and I can actually see your point of view and I can't reasonably argue most of it , it's logical if very wordy.
I think the actual temperature of most other components besides the water cooled parts have the same amount of cold air going across them that they would have had warmed air and all in it's negligible either way ,you can work round issues with a bit of thought after all.

No case / cooling system defies the laws of thermodynamics, chemistry and mathematics. That's why they are called laws.

1. Galvanic corrosion is basic chemistry. Corrosion inhibitors can delay or reduce galvanic for up 18 - 24 months. But it will happen. We can not avoid any more than we can stop the aging process. If you mix metals of different electrical potential, galvanoic corrosion will occur..... the only thing which we can impact is how fast and how much and that depends on the electrical galvanic potention of the metals involved.

You can find the science, the math and the pictures here.

Galvanic Corrosion Explored

Ahh the joy of mixing metals in a closed water loop…:) While many water coolers have had excellent success with running copper/brass/nickel over the years with plain water, we have seen many…

martinsliquidlab.wordpress.com

https:// www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJnTrXKgVk0
https:// www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=a_r4tWpMHHI&feature=youtu.be&t=8
https:// www.youtube.com/watch?v=HC1kzO_gIp4

I didnt wanan clog the post with big boxes ... so copy the link and delete the spaces after the double slash

2. If you're saying that changing case configuration changes the fact that 23C air cools better than 28C air, I wanna see the math. Cooling is directly proportional to Delta T ... and Delta T is always, and irrefutably large with ambient air than inside a enclosure generating 500, 600, 700 watts of heat.

Should also mention that our test bed is equipped with:

- 3 x 140mm x 45mm thick radiator
- 3x 140mm x 60mm thick radiator
- Twin Pumps
- 300 ml Reservoir
- Temperature probes on inlet and outlet of each radiator (0.1C accuracy)
- Temperature probe for ambient air
- Temperature probe for inside case air
- 6 Channel Temperture Display (0.1C accuracy) Reeven Six Eyes
- (3) Infrared Thermometers
- (16) 1250 rpm 140mm fans

So looking at the front panel display, we are able to examine and record Delta T across a radiator as one varies, fan rpm, pump rpm, flow direction ... push or pull mounting. And it's immediately obvious ....

a) GPUs Radiator Inlet Temp - GPUs Radiator Outlet Temp is a bigger number when fans are blowing 22C outside air across the rads then when blowing 25C air across the rads
b) CPU Radiator Inlet Temp - CPU Radiator Outlet Temp is a bigger number when fans are blowing 22C outside air across the rads then when blowing 25C air across the rads

Taking the glass off presents an imaginary condition .... it's no longer an "enclosure". But again, the image on the manufacturer's web site is there because the folks who designed and build the case believe this presents their case in the best light.

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

No case / cooling system defies the laws of thermodynamics, chemistry and mathematics. That's why they are called laws.

1. Galvanic corrosion is basic chemistry. Corrosion inhibitors can delay or reduce galvanic for up 18 - 24 months. But it will happen. We can not avoid any more than we can stop the aging process. If you mix metals of different electrical potential, galvanoic corrosion will occur..... the only thing which we can impact is how fast and how much and that depends on the electrical galvanic potention of the metals involved.

You can find the science, the math and the pictures here.

Galvanic Corrosion Explored

Ahh the joy of mixing metals in a closed water loop…:) While many water coolers have had excellent success with running copper/brass/nickel over the years with plain water, we have seen many…

martinsliquidlab.wordpress.com

https:// www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJnTrXKgVk0
https:// www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=a_r4tWpMHHI&feature=youtu.be&t=8
https:// www.youtube.com/watch?v=HC1kzO_gIp4

I didnt wanan clog the post with big boxes ... so copy the link and delete the spaces after the double slash

2. If you're saying that changing case configuration changes the fact that 23C air cools better than 28C air, I wanna see the math. Cooling is directly proportional to Delta T ... and Delta T is always, and irrefutably large with ambient air than inside a enclosure generating 500, 600, 700 watts of heat.

Should also mention that our test bed is equipped with:

- 3 x 140mm x 45mm thick radiator
- 3x 140mm x 60mm thick radiator
- Twin Pumps
- 300 ml Reservoir
- Temperature probes on inlet and outlet of each radiator (0.1C accuracy)
- Temperature probe for ambient air
- Temperature probe for inside case air
- 6 Channel Temperture Display (0.1C accuracy) Reeven Six Eyes
- (3) Infrared Thermometers
- (16) 1250 rpm 140mm fans

So looking at the front panel display, we are able to examine and record Delta T across a radiator as one varies, fan rpm, pump rpm, flow direction ... push or pull mounting. And it's immediately obvious ....

a) GPUs Radiator Inlet Temp - GPUs Radiator Outlet Temp is a bigger number when fans are blowing 22C outside air across the rads then when blowing 25C air across the rads
b) CPU Radiator Inlet Temp - CPU Radiator Outlet Temp is a bigger number when fans are blowing 22C outside air across the rads then when blowing 25C air across the rads

Taking the glass off presents an imaginary condition .... it's no longer an "enclosure". But again, the image on the manufacturer's web site is there because the folks who designed and build the case believe this presents their case in the best light.

You realise it's Friday night so I'll just post ,er yes did I disagree no but your dramatising the issue while disregarding my point that this case was designed to be a case AND a test / run bench.

Explain why I shouldn't disregard all you say in retribution or why you are dissatisfied with glass off being mentioned.

Why do you think I chose this case.

Why did you not realize I conceded but said I like and prefer my way , I could have been scientifically lead these last ten years and I would have adequate testing and facts to back me up however I just built and used them,. 24/7-365 @80% load and max clock for ten years happily.

Ie crack on bro, but I'll do as I wish as ever with no need to explain my logic to you.