NVIDIA: RTX 30-series Shortages Partly Caused by Insufficient Wafer, Substrate and Component Supply

[quadibloc]

AMD did manage to meet demand for its Ryzen 3000 series processors based on 7nm technology.
So while there is heavy demand right now given the significant improvements in the Ryzen 5000 CPUs and even larger improvements in video cards from both AMD and Nvidia, it's reasonable to expect there will be light at the end of the tunnel.
Otherwise... can you imagine Intel ad copy that might read like this:

Processors... or Promises?
While other companies are sellilng 7nm "pie in the sky", Intel can supply your needs now with processors built on proven 14nm technology!

They laughed when Intel offered a thermoelectric cooler to enable their processors to exceed the single-core performance of AMD processors for gaming, but if the supply problem isn't corrected, Intel could have the last laugh.

 

[Caring1]

Nvidia - Sorry not sorry.
*rolls around in cash*

 

[mouacyk]

Nvidia - Sorry not sorry.
*rolls around in cash*

If only they would meet demand, then they would be SINKING in money rather than merely rolling around in it.

If I were Jensen, I'd be in a fever cashing in my leather jackets to fund more fabs.

 

[RandallFlagg]

AMD did manage to meet demand for its Ryzen 3000 series processors based on 7nm technology.
So while there is heavy demand right now given the significant improvements in the Ryzen 5000 CPUs and even larger improvements in video cards from both AMD and Nvidia, it's reasonable to expect there will be light at the end of the tunnel.
Otherwise... can you imagine Intel ad copy that might read like this:

Processors... or Promises?
While other companies are sellilng 7nm "pie in the sky", Intel can supply your needs now with processors built on proven 14nm technology!

They laughed when Intel offered a thermoelectric cooler to enable their processors to exceed the single-core performance of AMD processors for gaming, but if the supply problem isn't corrected, Intel could have the last laugh.

I've kind of been saying this for a while, and totally agree.

There are a lot of indicators that AMD may not have any broad supply of either Zen 3 or 68XX chips until Q2. They reportedly slated 80% of their 7nm allocation from TSMC for XBox and Playstation, with ~120,000 wafers to those and only ~20,000 to Zen 3 / 68XX. So that will definitely affect supply in Q1, at least to start.

However, both XBox and Playstation are also sold out, and AMD has contracts with those behemoths to deliver. What if they have to allocate 80% to them again in Q1? I mean, we are almost there, they have to already be talking about filling volume orders next year.

And Q1, we can expect to see lower end high-volume SKUs from Nvidia, and quite possibly some Intel GPUs. Not to mention high power Tiger Lake 6/8 core laptops and Rocket Lake.

Maybe AMD will become some kind of specialty high end / high cost low volume x86 shop, like Ferrari to Intel's Chevy. How ironic that would be.

 

[Diverge]

Not sure why anyone is bashing any company with the current state of things. Nvidia admitted they are having supply problems. Sony is building PS5's with all different parts, since the are having supply issues... Supposedly there are variations of the fans they use, and some are super loud. Can't buy the new Xbox, can't buy the new Playstation, can't buy the latest AMD cpu's, can't buy the latest Nvidia and AMD gpu's. Soon you won't be able top buy toilet paper gain (I have 150+ rolls, a 3080 FE, 3090 FE, both retail pricing at launch ;p)... If you aren't persistent, crafty, and lucky, you can't buy anything in demand these days - unless you're rich and can afford to overpay.

 

[Minus Infinity]

Moore's Law is dead posted just this about supply issues well over a month ago. Samsung's yields aren't great and Nvidia will be rushing out 7nm updated versions from TSMC next year.

 

[Fluffmeister]

Moore's Law is dead posted just this about supply issues well over a month ago. Samsung's yields aren't great and Nvidia will be rushing out 7nm updated versions from TSMC next year.

Sounds good, they might still beat AMD's 6800 series to market at this rate.

 

[ShurikN]

"Insufficient wafers and components"

 

[watzupken]

Not sure why anyone is bashing any company with the current state of things. Nvidia admitted they are having supply problems. Sony is building PS5's with all different parts, since the are having supply issues... Supposedly there are variations of the fans they use, and some are super loud. Can't buy the new Xbox, can't buy the new Playstation, can't buy the latest AMD cpu's, can't buy the latest Nvidia and AMD gpu's. Soon you won't be able top buy toilet paper gain (I have 150+ rolls, a 3080 FE, 3090 FE, both retail pricing at launch ;p)... If you aren't persistent, crafty, and lucky, you can't buy anything in demand these days - unless you're rich and can afford to overpay.

I think you are confused between the Sony fan issue and Nvidia's supply issue. Sony like any other companies will source parts from multiple suppliers as long as it does not impact performance consistency. This is to reduce dependency on just one supply, and in this case, for the fan. In case the supplier plays punk or goes bust, the likes of Sony will not be scrambling to look for another fan supplier.

 

[Prima.Vera]

I don't understand why people think there is a deliberate move here from Nvidia to 'keep GPUs away from the DIY market'.

It doesn't make sense. First they pre-empt a Navi launch and now they don't want to sell? What kind of asylum logic is this?

We've heard the scalper story, now the miner story and the OEM story, as if there is some grand conspiracy to keep GPUs away from general gaming market share. If I were a shareholder I'd be scratching my head hearing that train of thought. Or just shrug and move on.

In the end Nvidia is just another company getting in line to get its stuff produced, and the line is crowded.

Calm down and read again the posts. Nobody thinks that. However most of the people knows that nGreedia lied about the availability of their products. The 3000 series was a paper lunch only and it still is

 

[watzupken]

Moore's Law is dead posted just this about supply issues well over a month ago. Samsung's yields aren't great and Nvidia will be rushing out 7nm updated versions from TSMC next year.

I think that depends on how much capacity they manage to secure from TSMC. Rushing from one mature fab to another is a risk, not to mention TSMC may not be able to solve their supply issues instantly. My take is that you likely won't see 7nm Nvidia GPU for retail until 2022. This is also consistent with Nvidia's recent trend of utilizing half node improvements for their new GPUs.

 

[wolf]

The 3000 series was a paper lunch only and it still is

It is by definition not a paper launch. The 6800 series launch has been even worse for availability (so far, they have an opportunity to turn it around), and that's technically not a paper launch either, both products were in the hands of consumers day 1.

I'm not saying they're both without their fair share of frustrating issues, but neither are paper launches, period.

 

[RandallFlagg]

It is by definition not a paper launch. The 6800 series launch has been even worse for availability (so far, they have an opportunity to turn it around), and that's technically not a paper launch either, both products were in the hands of consumers day 1.

I'm not saying they're both without their fair share of frustrating issues, but neither are paper launches, period.

Having "some" product does not prevent a launch from being paper.

I think the next month will show that Nvidia was not a paper launch, evidenced by the fact that their cards are already showing on Steam's hardware survey with about the same percentage of users ranking as an AMD 5700. <--Link

I also think that the next month will show that both Zen 3 and 68XX were in fact paper launches with no significant supply.

The facts already bear this out for those that want to look, *tons* of OEM prebuilts come with 3XXX cards, yet I've literally seen none with 68XX cards. Meanwhile Zen 3 has not one major OEM using that chip.


paper launch
A release of a product, especially a computer component, in extremely limited quantities, making it very difficult for consumers to get their hands on. The purpose of this is generally for a company to be able to say "we have the fastest chip", before they can actually produce large numbers of them.

 

[wolf]

paper launch
A release of a product, especially a computer component, in extremely limited quantities, making it very difficult for consumers to get their hands on. The purpose of this is generally for a company to be able to say "we have the fastest chip", before they can actually produce large numbers of them.

I search this quote and get a definition from Urban dictionary... lol

Having "some" product does not prevent a launch from being paper.

By the proper definition, it seems that it does.

We've seen real paper launches in the past, where products are announced and perhaps to reviewers, but consumers literally cannot buy them whatsoever, in any quantity at all for potentially months. Supply might be low, especially compared against demand, but the cards are constantly being resupplied and sold to consumers, as you say even the latest steam survey shows that they're out in the wild in not-insignificant numbers.

RTX3000 is not a paper launch. It is many maaany things, but a paper launch it is not.

 

[RandallFlagg]

I search this quote and get a definition from Urban dictionary... lol

We've seen real paper launches in the past, where products are given to reviewers and consumers literally cannot buy them whatsoever, in any quantity at all for potentially months. Supply might be low, especially compared against demand, but the cards are constantly being resupplied and sold to consumers, even the latest steam survey shows that they're out in the wild in not-insignificant numbers.

RTX3000 is not a paper launch.

Those are definitely paper launches (zero product), but Intel did paper launches with supply when they launched Broadwell. Chips were made. Just not many.

Check it out, 5775C from 2015 whips a 10600K and R5 3600 from 2019-2020 :

 

[r9]

I don't understand why people think there is a deliberate move here from Nvidia to 'keep GPUs away from the DIY market'.

It doesn't make sense. First they pre-empt a Navi launch and now they don't want to sell? What kind of asylum logic is this?

We've heard the scalper story, now the miner story and the OEM story, as if there is some grand conspiracy to keep GPUs away from general gaming market share. If I were a shareholder I'd be scratching my head hearing that train of thought. Or just shrug and move on.

In the end Nvidia is just another company getting in line to get its stuff produced, and the line is crowded.

It's very obvious what's happening why we have silicon shortages ... all silicone is used to make chips that will be injected with the covid vaccines so they can control us! And I almost forgot 5g was necessary to support all those chips. Now you know people!

 

[yotano211]

Yep, lots of problems in many places.

nvidia is so hot for profit they can't even hold back from selling Ampere cards to upgrading miners. They reported that they sold for approx $175 million to miners.

Also graphic card manufacturers now reportedly allocating 3080 stock to build their own branded gaming PC's like MSI creating extreme scarcity before xmas.

Some retailer are using the scarcity to push prices to almost scalping levels before xmas specially now after AMD's totally failed release of the 6800 series.

nvidia also stop selling their FE cards in the rest of the world except US creating even more scarcity and higher prices in many regions.

Many large retailers are taking to much orders of 3080 with out having any confirmed delivery's creating very long queue. Because ordering is open this way lots of people put in orders at many different retailers trying to get cards creating even longer inflated queues. Then when these people start getting delivery's they scalp the extra cards just because they can make money. So the scarcity is also creating new scalpers, people that would not normally scalp starts scalping making the problem with scalping even worse.

+more +more +more ............

Those $175 millions only makes up a very small part of how much they sold. The miners taking all GPUs is old.
Its fun watching people blame all the miners for taking up maybe 5% of gpu's.

 

[laszlo]

in the end is all about this..."spend their money on NVIDIA's latest products "

both nv&amd rushed the launches without sufficient stock and the debate over this is pointless as won't change anything...

 

[Vya Domus]

The facts already bear this out for those that want to look, *tons* of OEM prebuilts come with 3XXX cards, yet I've literally seen none with 68XX cards. Meanwhile Zen 3 has not one major OEM using that chip.

Will any of you also mention the fact that 3000 series has been released 3-4 months ago ? You do a very good job pretending it's the same situation in both cases when it's not, one product line was released way long ago.

 

[sutyi]

Yeah... when you are selling basically 90% of the produced GPUs / Cards off to the crypto market then it makes "shortages" for the DIY segment.

Friend of mine waited over a month for his pre-ordered 3090 and received 1 out 13 cards that the distributor got from ASUS...

 

[Sovsefanden]

Had my 3080 for almost 8 weeks now, so yeah, it's possible. I know 4 others IRL that uses 3080 and 3070, 3 out of 4 has recieved their cards.
Also got a 3070 for my living room PC, recieved it the day after release. Both bought for MSRP.

The demand is high combined with supply issues. Many PC gamers are gearing up for Cyberpunk, skipped 2000 series, wants to play because of COVID19 etc. ALOT IS GOING ON RIGHT NOW.

AMD can't deliver either, actually they are doing even worse. A friend of mine bought 6800XT instantly on release and got a delivery date in MARCH 2021... AMD had close to ZERO cards available on 6800 series launch.. Went STRAIGHT to "sold out" when the buy button finally appeared Many sites even list "notify" instead of buy -.-

When a shop wont even take pre-orders, you know the cards are not even close.

 

[lepudruk]

The fact is that each of us judges by his own experiences. In my case, the only GPU from Ampere serie that was easily accesible in my country was 3060 Ti. For other cards there is a saying that they are less frequent then a Yetti (who is supposed to be seen somehow). I was about to buy myself RTX 3080 for Cyberpunk 2077 release but it turned out simply impossible. Each of 4 big retailers in my country has constant "Unavailable" product status and a queue of orders longer then a Chineese Wall. There is a small chance to buy from a scalper and pay twice the market price. So, for me calling it "paper", "virtual" or other launch is just a play with semantics. For an average Joe the Ampere cards are simply unavailable period. Who should we blame? Covid, retailers? I don't think so.

 

[Sovsefanden]

The fact is that each of us judges by his own experiences. In my case, the only GPU from Ampere serie that was easily accesible in my country was 3060 Ti. For other cards there is a saying that they are less frequent then a Yetti (who is supposed to be seen somehow). I was about to buy myself RTX 3080 for Cyberpunk 2077 release but it turned out simply impossible. Each of 4 big retailers in my country has constant "Unavailable" product status and a queue of orders longer then a Chineese Wall. There is a small chance to buy from a scalper and pay twice the market price. So, for me calling it "paper", "virtual" or other launch is just a play with semantics. For an average Joe the Ampere cards are simply unavailable period. Who should we blame? Covid, retailers? I don't think so.

Yeah it depends on luck I guess and where you are from.

However it seems that some custom cards are ALOT MORE POPULAR, like Asus 3080 TUF. Literally has THOUSANDS of customers waiting in line, meanwhile lesser popular cards like Gigabyte EAGLE (to mention one) barely has any. Some of these cards are even in stock sometimes, for hours.

My ASUS TUF OC 3080 was ordered on releaseday, within 1 minute post release. And recieved it the following week.

Most people I know who WAITED for release to order instantly, have recieved their cards. People that waited till afternoon or days after, are still waiting.

Nvidia fulfilled like 10% of orders worldwide. Low yes, but AMD probably is on 0.5% with 6800 series..

 

[Tomorrow]

Here in Estonia (Eastern-Northern Europe) there has been stock available. The most i have seen was 55 units of 3070 ja 3080 were able to be ordered.
The problem is ofcourse prices. Here are the lowest prices in € from one of the biggest retailers in our country that i have seen. These are/were for cards one can/could order and delivery is/was reasonable at 3-7 workdays:

3060Ti: 529€
3070: 789€
3080: 1159€
3090: 1849€

Basicly everything except 3090 has shifted up by one price class. 3070 costs what 3080 should cost and 3080 costs what 2080Ti used to cost. Both 3060Ti and 3090 also have a hefty markup applied to them compared to MSRP.

AMD's 6800 series is nonexistant in here. Nothing even at higher prices. No preorders. Nothing. The best i have seen was one user who got 6800XT from our nothern neigbours Finland at MSRP from amd.com. 1 person. There are some 3070, 3080 and 3090 users here but except for a few lucky one who got FE from scan.co.uk at MSRP the rest only got the AIB models by paying the prices listed above.

AMD 5000 series CPU's seem to be more available. 30+ people got 5600X at launch day for almost MSRP (325€ vs 299€ MSRP) and there has been some 5900X stock sold at 550€. Currently tho 5800X is nowhere to be seen. 5900X costs 670€ and 5950X was at 979€ when it was briefly available at one point.

Still the CPU side seems to be faring better as every week there is stock coming in at reasonable prices. Tho fully enabled 8 core CCD models like the 5800X and 5950X seem to be in much shorter supply than partially disabled 6c CCD models like 5600X and 5900X.

 

[Sovsefanden]

Same in Germany and EU in general. AMD 6800 nowhere to be found but Nvidia 3000 series can be found.

Many stores even REMOVED AMD 6800 series GPU's from their site again. This is not something I have seen before. The supply must be terrible / non-existing. I think many will be waiting for months and months for these cards.

I wonder if TSMC/AMD prioritize console chips. They might have to deliver a certain amount to Microsoft/Sony before 2021 or something. And have to lower or even stop Ryzen 5000 and Radeon 6000 production.