msi B250M - BD ProcHot and VR Thermal (Core + Ring)

[ScyberMhaster]

Good day!

These are my system specs:

• MSI B250M Mortar Arctic
• i7-7700 (Cooled by ID-Cooling AuraFlow X240 RGB)
• 16GB DDR4 3000 MHz T-Force Delta RGB
• ADATA XPG 256GB NVM.e
• Galax GeForce GTX 1060 6GB
• FSP Hydro G 750W 80+ Gold (Fully Modular with Extension Cables)

Yesterday morning, I tried to open my computer and I noticed so much lag. So I restarted it, but still, so lag. I opened the Task Manager and saw that the CPU capped at 0.79 GHz with 22% Utilization, regardless of load. The Power Management configured on my OS was in Balanced Mode. So I changed it to High Performance Mode, but still, capped. I have tried these methods already:

• Updated / Rollback the BIOS from A.60 (Latest) to A.00 (Initial / Oldest)
• Fixed the CPU Ratio to 36-41.
• Disabled Intel Adaptive Thermal Monitoring, C States, Enhanced Intel SpeedStep Technology
• Reseat the Processor - No bent pins.
• Replaced the Thermal Paste of the Processor and the Chipset.
• Replaced the Thermal Pads of the VRM Heat Sinks.
• Removed the GPU, so Intel Graphics will work.
• Reseat the CMOS Battery, for 10 minutes.
• Updated the drivers in Windows 10 - Intel Management Engine and AHCI Controllers.
• Reseat the ID-Cooling AIO Pump to the Processor.

But, all these do not change anything, still capped at 0.80 GHz. There is an instance, wherein it goes back to normal to 4.00 GHz, but it is just a matter of seconds or minutes, then capped again to 0.80 GHz. I downloaded the ThrottleStop program, and saw BD PROCHOT / VR THERMAL on CORE / VR THERMAL on RING. Opened HWInfo64, and saw that RING: VR Thermal = No. But when I unchecked the BD PROCHOT in ThrottleStop, the RING: VR Thermal in HWInfo64 will go to Yes.

Now, I left the ThrottleStop program opened. But the speed does not go above 3.6 GHz, which as far as I know, can go around 4.0 GHz. I have set the Clock to 39T > 40T > 41T, but nothing happened. So I am stuck at 3.60 GHz now.

 

[unclewebb]

@ScyberMhaster - If you are seeing a VR THERMAL message in Limit Reasons, usually that means you need better cooling on your voltage regulators. Do you get these messages when idle or when loaded?

Limit Reasons does not work correctly when running HWiNFO so use one program or the other to monitor the throttling flags.

But the speed does not go above 3.6 GHz

If your voltage regulators are overheating then your CPU is going to throttle so it will not run at its full rated speed. You did not post any pictures of ThrottleStop so that is my best guess. If a voltage regulator is cooked, it might send out a continuous throttling signal. Try pointing a fan towards the voltage regulators around the CPU socket. Maybe you will get lucky and this error will go away.

With a 7th Gen CPU, I would use ThrottleStop to enabled Speed Shift Technology. Post some pics if you are planning to use ThrottleStop long term to work around this problem.

Replaced the Thermal Pads of the VRM Heat Sinks.

Are you 100% sure that you did this correctly? Sometimes people will use different pads with different thicknesses compared to the original pads. This can screw up the contact pressure and cause overheating.

Your board was likely designed with a CPU air cooler in mind. These coolers blow air towards the voltage regulators. Switching to an AIO is good for the CPU temps but can cause a problem with the voltage regulators getting much hotter than they should. A separate fan might be necessary.

 

[ScyberMhaster]

@ScyberMhaster - If you are seeing a VR THERMAL message in Limit Reasons, usually that means you need better cooling on your voltage regulators. Do you get these messages when idle or when loaded?

Limit Reasons does not work correctly when running HWiNFO so use one program or the other to monitor the throttling flags.


If your voltage regulators are overheating then your CPU is going to throttle so it will not run at its full rated speed. You did not post any pictures of ThrottleStop so that is my best guess. If a voltage regulator is cooked, it might send out a continuous throttling signal. Try pointing a fan towards the voltage regulators around the CPU socket. Maybe you will get lucky and this error will go away.

With a 7th Gen CPU, I would use ThrottleStop to enabled Speed Shift Technology. Post some pics if you are planning to use ThrottleStop long term to work around this problem.


Are you 100% sure that you did this correctly? Sometimes people will use different pads with different thicknesses compared to the original pads. This can screw up the contact pressure and cause overheating.

Your board was likely designed with a CPU air cooler in mind. These coolers blow air towards the voltage regulators. Switching to an AIO is good for the CPU temps but can cause a problem with the voltage regulators getting much hotter than they should. A separate fan might be necessary.

Hi sir! Thanks for the reply. Here is the screenshot of the throttlestop with BD PROCHOT ON:

And not:

Here sir are the screenshots of HWInfo:

The CPU Temp I get here sir because of BD PROCHOT OFF and running PUBG.

With regards sir to the VRM HeatSinks, I applied with the same thickness of thermal pads sir, as I measured it correctly.

Recently sir, a minute after I start the computer, I get around 4.1 GHz, no throttling, but afterwards, it goes back to 0.79 GHz, idle or in load, makes the computer not usable enough.

 

[unclewebb]

When BD PROCHOT is cleared, it is telling the CPU to ignore an external sensor. Likely a temperature sensor somewhere on the motherboard. It is OK to do this if a sensor is broken. In your case, when you do this, your voltage regulators start overheating. You need to fix that problem. Mount a fan inside your case so it blows air towards your voltage regulators. The motherboard cooling in this area looks decent but without direct air flow, they might be getting too hot.

If extra air flow does not solve this problem then one of the voltage regulators is likely damaged. You will need to get another motherboard.

 

[ScyberMhaster]

When BD PROCHOT is cleared, it is telling the CPU to ignore an external sensor. Likely a temperature sensor somewhere on the motherboard. It is OK to do this if a sensor is broken. In your case, when you do this, your voltage regulators start overheating. You need to fix that problem. Mount a fan inside your case so it blows air towards your voltage regulators. The motherboard cooling in this area looks decent but without direct air flow, they might be getting too hot.

If extra air flow does not solve this problem then one of the voltage regulators is likely damaged. You will need to get another motherboard.

When I uncheck sir the BD PROCHOT, the BD PROCHOT in Limit Reasons turns Yellow, and the VR Thermal in RING, sometimes turns yellow, maybe a second, but on the CORE, its constantly on red.

I already put an industrial fan towards the side of the case sir. Still, no improvement.

Now, the BD PROCHOT turns somewhat yellow and red.

When BD PROCHOT is cleared, it is telling the CPU to ignore an external sensor. Likely a temperature sensor somewhere on the motherboard. It is OK to do this if a sensor is broken. In your case, when you do this, your voltage regulators start overheating. You need to fix that problem. Mount a fan inside your case so it blows air towards your voltage regulators. The motherboard cooling in this area looks decent but without direct air flow, they might be getting too hot.

If extra air flow does not solve this problem then one of the voltage regulators is likely damaged. You will need to get another motherboard.

Sir, is it safe to assume that the problem lies with the MOSFETS? Or with the PWM Controller of the MOSFETS?

 

[unclewebb]

I already put an industrial fan towards the side of the case

The side of the case is not the problem. You need more airflow directed towards the CPU socket and the voltage regulators.

When you are using an AIO, there is no airflow towards these components so temperatures will go up and up.

 

[ScyberMhaster]

The side of the case is not the problem. You need more airflow directed towards the CPU socket and the voltage regulators.

View attachment 178748

When you are using an AIO, there is no airflow towards these components so temperatures will go up and up.

Yes sir, what I have done is opened up the side panel and align an industrial fan towards the processor sir.

Sir, may I ask if disabling BD PROCHOT, disables the Turbo also of the processor? It seems that I'm stuck at 3.60 GHz.

 

[unclewebb]

if disabling BD PROCHOT, disables the Turbo

No. These two are separate.

Your CPU is not using any turbo boost because your Voltage Regulators are reporting that they are too hot. They are either too hot for real or a sensor has gone bad and they think they are too hot. Either way, the CPU is going to throttle to try and help fix this problem.

If you installed the heatsinks correctly and if you are blowing lots of cool air towards where I suggested then it looks like your motherboard is damaged. It will need to be replaced. Surprisingly, the 7700 CPUs still sell for a decent price on EBay. Might want to consider selling it and buy a new board and CPU.

 

[ScyberMhaster]

No. These two are separate.

Your CPU is not using any turbo boost because your Voltage Regulators are reporting that they are too hot. They are either too hot for real or a sensor has gone bad and they think they are too hot. Either way, the CPU is going to throttle to try and help fix this problem.

If you installed the heatsinks correctly and if you are blowing lots of cool air towards where I suggested then it looks like your motherboard is damaged. It will need to be replaced. Surprisingly, the 7700 CPUs still sell for a decent price on EBay. Might want to consider selling it and buy a new board and CPU.

It's weird sir, when I choose Power Saver, sometimes the BD PROCHOT and VR THERMAL flags gone.

It seems that I need a new motherboard. Hehe

Thank you so much sir for answering all my queries!

It's weird sir, when I choose Power Saver, sometimes the BD PROCHOT and VR THERMAL flags gone.

It seems that I need a new motherboard. Hehe

Thank you so much sir for answering all my queries!

Sir, I will be trying to revert back the original Intel fan. Sir, just a clarification, are the VRMs or MOSFETs with the heatsinks in my motherboard are getting hotter? Not the black boxes near the processor?

 

[unclewebb]

just a clarification

I have to be honest. I am not 100% sure. When you switch to an AIO cooler on some motherboards, there is no longer any airflow around the CPU socket. Temperatures of some component close by will soar and trigger a VR THERMAL warning message in Limit Reasons.

If you have pointed a fan in this area and this message does not go away, switching back to an air cooler might not solve the problem.

 

[ScyberMhaster]

I have to be honest. I am not 100% sure. When you switch to an AIO cooler on some motherboards, there is no longer any airflow around the CPU socket. Temperatures of some component close by will soar and trigger a VR THERMAL warning message in Limit Reasons.

If you have pointed a fan in this area and this message does not go away, switching back to an air cooler might not solve the problem.

Hi sir. I'll be trying the Intel Stock Cooler. But I already bought a new motherboard (ECS B250H4-M20), for this is the only available motherboard here in our area that supports my i7-7700 and has M.2 NVM.e slot. Sir, I am anxious, should I refrain from using AIO and switch back to Stock Intel Cooler with my new motherboard? The VRMs don't have heatsinks, just plainly exposed.

With ASUS H110M-D and ECS B250H4-M20, I have chosen the ECS, am I with the right pick? Hehe.

 

[unclewebb]

the right pick?

It is impossible for me to know what will work and what will not. Some VRMs do not get that hot so they do not need active cooling with a fan. If you have problems with your AIO cooler, you will have to switch to the Intel cooler. At least now you know what to look for when you are using ThrottleStop Limit Reasons.

 

[ScyberMhaster]

It is impossible for me to know what will work and what will not. Some VRMs do not get that hot so they do not need active cooling with a fan. If you have problems with your AIO cooler, you will have to switch to the Intel cooler. At least now you know what to look for when you are using ThrottleStop Limit Reasons.

Thank you so much sir for the knowledge! Hehe. It's hard for me to give up my build, as I am now a student again. Hehe.

Sir, the red ones are the VRM MOSFETs which, assumingly get hot?

Or the Boxes labeled R30?

 

[unclewebb]

assumingly get hot

I always assume that any IC on a motherboard that is close to the CPU socket is going to get hot. If you are curious, put your thumb on these little boxes and get a feeling, literally, how hot these devices get.

Assemble your computer and check to see if there are any throttling problems. No use worrying about things until you have a throttling problem.

 

[ScyberMhaster]

I always assume that any IC on a motherboard that is close to the CPU socket is going to get hot. If you are curious, put your thumb on these little boxes and get a feeling, literally, how hot these devices get.

Assemble your computer and check to see if there are any throttling problems. No use worrying about things until you have a throttling problem.

Sir my last last last question, hehe. Is this issue fixable with microsoldering and/or changing components?

 

[ScyberMhaster]

Hi sir! Just an update. Hehe. I think I have narrowed down the problem with this motherboard. If I am not mistaken, it is because of the NTC Thermistor on the VRMs.

This is from the left side, as I measured it via a Multimeter, its resistance stuck at 11-12 K/M Ohms to O.L., I can't remember, but showing constant value even if I applied heat from a hair blower.

On the top side, I measured it, and it is in constant with 62 K/M Ohms, then when I apply heat, it goes down to 50 then around 40. After removing heat, it goes back again to 60+.

 

[unclewebb]

NTC Thermistor on the VRMs

It will be very interesting if you find a way to restore your motherboard. We live in a disposable society. Most people do not have the time or the tools to repair motherboards.

 

[ScyberMhaster]

Update:

Already changed the NTC Thermistor with a Resistor (98k Ohms), and R2 (0.5M Ohms) from the Schematics (PWM Controller) to attain constant 75k Ohms on the Thermistor part. Waiting for the caseless tray to arrive, so I can test this. Hehe.

 

[ScyberMhaster]

UPDATE (12/22/2020 - 12:18 AM)

Alive and Kicking! The motherboard now runs normal again. i7-7700 @ 3.60 and i5-7400 @ 3.00 GHz.

Replaced: R2 (Now 500k Ohms) and Rntc (Now 98k Ohms).
Also changed thermal pads for both VRM heatsinks, for there is no more temperature sensor found at the bottom VRMs.

 

[unclewebb]

Alive and Kicking!

It is a Christmas miracle. I thought you were going to have to toss it in the bin.

No more VR THERMAL lighting up in red?

 

[ScyberMhaster]

It is a Christmas miracle. I thought you were going to have to toss it in the bin.

That's also what I thought sir. But it works! Hehe.

No more VR THERMAL lighting up in red?

No more sir. The CPUs are doing good and Turbo Boost kicks in.