TSMC 4nm Production Hit By... A Full Quarter Advance?

Raevenlord · Jun 4, 2021

Here's something that has been sorely missing from tech news: good news. It seems that TSMC's development on the 4 nm manufacturing process is running better than anticipated by the company itself, which has prompted for a full quarter advancement for the test production on TSMC's next miniaturization level. Previously scheduled for test production starting on 4Q 2021, TSMC has announced that it has now moved test production to 3Q 2021.

This could mean an equivalent - or perhaps even better - reduction in volume production and time-to-market, but it's anyone's guess at this point. As notably difficult and onerous as semiconductor development is, problems are more likely to appear than not. 4 nm is expected to bring respectable improvements to the PPA equation for semiconductors over 5 nm - however, TSMC still hasn't disclosed expected gains.

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ShurikN · Jun 4, 2021

They had us in the first half, not gonna lie.

Solid State Soul ( SSS ) · Jun 4, 2021

Lets assume we reach 1nm node, whats next after that ?

Wirko · Jun 4, 2021

Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:
Lets assume we reach 1nm node, whats next after that ?

Ecks, wye, zed, alpha, beta, gamma, and so on, until omega. By the time we reach omega, DRAM manufacturers will already run out of alphabets and will be using Chinese characters.

bonehead123 · Jun 4, 2021

Lets assume we reach 1nm node, whats next after that ?

pm (picometer)
zm (zeptometer)
ym (Yoctometer)
PL (Planck length, widely considered to be the smallest measure of distance, equal to about 1.6 x 10-35m.)

then comes No.Sm.TT...... as in No Smaller than this, hehehe

londiste · Jun 4, 2021

N4 is an N5 optimization.
The next full node is N3.

The red spirit · Jun 4, 2021

Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:
Lets assume we reach 1nm node, whats next after that ?

We are nowhere close to 1nm and we are still on double digit nanometers. 7nm, 4nm are just marketing junk.

Real nm if Intel "10nm" process would be like 12nm:

10 nm process - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

TSMC's "7nm" process is closer to 12nm too:

7 nm process - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And from all manufacturers Samsung lies the most about actual nms. Their 5nm process is likely 12-14nm.

Solid State Soul ( SSS ) · Jun 4, 2021

The red spirit said:
We are nowhere close to 1nm and we are still on double digit nanometers. 7nm, 4nm are just marketing junk.

Real nm if Intel "10nm" process would be like 12nm:

10 nm process - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

TSMC's "7nm" process is closer to 12nm too:

7 nm process - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And from all manufacturers Samsung lies the most about actual nms. Their 5nm process is likely 12-14nm.

Hmm, so what does that makes Nvidia's ampere 8nm ?

londiste · Jun 4, 2021

Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:
Hmm, so what does that makes Nvidia's ampere 8nm ?

Samsung's improved 10nm process.

The red spirit · Jun 4, 2021

Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:
Hmm, so what does that makes Nvidia's ampere 8nm ?

Closer to 14 nm

TumbleGeorge · Jun 4, 2021

In all nodes important characteristic is not transistor thickness. But all manufacturers write exactly this number.

Wirko · Jun 4, 2021

It's funny, everyone but TSMC loves and uses the "TSMC 4nm" designation. TSMC are reluctant to use it, they rather call it N4.

Richards · Jun 5, 2021

Fake names

The red spirit said:
Closer to 14 nm

Lies intel is nit in the same league as Samsung

thevoiceofreason · Jun 5, 2021

And half of the capacity will immediately go into smartphone SoCs :mad:

In 2021 Apple+Qualcomm+Broadcom+Mediatek was exactly 50%.

PapaTaipei · Jun 5, 2021

When you realise that every new node are more expensive per transistors and not much efficient, and that they have to disable a lot of them, the gains are debatable.

Imsochobo · Jun 5, 2021

Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:
Hmm, so what does that makes Nvidia's ampere 8nm ?

not that far off tsmc 1st gen 7nm (radeon 7) but some ways away from current 7nm from tsmc.
I'd say on par with intel 10nm ?

The red spirit · Jun 5, 2021

Richards said:
Lies, Intel is not in the same league as Samsung

Any data to back up this claim?

DeathtoGnomes · Jun 5, 2021

God forbid any other manufacturer ever have early results like this, let alone report such things. But, will this lead to early production as well, that is the big Q.

Wirko · Jun 5, 2021

thevoiceofreason said:
In 2021 Apple+Qualcomm+Broadcom+Mediatek was exactly 50%.

Are you writing this to us from the future?

DeathtoGnomes · Jun 5, 2021

Wirko said:
Are you writing this to us from the future?

The magic 8-ball says YES.

dyonoctis · Jun 5, 2021

thevoiceofreason said:
And half of the capacity will immediately go into smartphone SoCs
In 2021 Apple+Qualcomm+Broadcom+Mediatek was exactly 50%.

Iirc, smartphone don't really use "inbetween" nodes

mtcn77 · Jun 5, 2021

PapaTaipei said:
When you realise that every new node are more expensive per transistors and not much efficient, and that they have to disable a lot of them, the gains are debatable.

Omg is this a joke, wow! The transistors are a joke to you? This has got to be pretty unfortunate for TSMC, yippie Intel...

The red spirit said:
And from all manufacturers Samsung lies the most about actual nms.

Scale is junk, the cost is resistance. You pay it in performance if you consider scale the norm.

The red spirit · Jun 5, 2021

mtcn77 said:
Scale is junk, the cost is resistance. You pay it in performance if you consider scale the norm.

Can you speak in English?

mtcn77 · Jun 5, 2021

The red spirit said:
Can you speak in English?

Generally not, I stop and think...

mechtech · Jun 5, 2021

There's money in them silicon wafers......................

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TSMC 4nm Production Hit By... A Full Quarter Advance?

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